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Why does this sentence:

> 冬休みは家族でイタリアやイギリスへ行きました。

have `で` there instead of `と`?

Wouldn't "with family" be `家族と`?
CC BY-SA 3.0
2017-03-21T09:53:41.620
44708
2018-11-18T14:08:06.213
9990
question
particle-と particle-で
Why does 冬休みは家族でイタリアやイギリスへ行きました。 have で instead of と?
家族で should be taken as "as a family" rather than "with family"

(Both と and で could be used, though IMHO, 家族で implies that all family members
were present whereas 家族と implies you only went with some/maybe all family
members.)
CC BY-SA 4.0
2017-03-21T10:17:24.727
44709
2018-11-18T14:08:06.213
2018-11-18T14:08:06.213
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answer
Both 家族で and 家族と are correct.

で can sometimes mark an organization/group which makes some action, as if it
were a subject.

It's the third definition [on
デジタル大辞泉](http://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/jn/148951/meaning/m0u/%E3%81%A7/).

> 動作・作用を行う主体となる組織・団体を表す。「政府側―検討中だ」「気象庁―光化学スモッグ警報を発令した」

[東京外国語大学言語モジュール](http://www.coelang.tufs.ac.jp/mt/ja/gmod/courses/c01/lesson14/step2/explanation/053.html)
treats this as an extension of で as a location marker, as follows:

> 10 場所を表わす用法の拡張として、主語を場所風に表わすときに用いることがあります。
>
>   * 警察 **で** 事件を調べています。
>   * クラス **で** 旅行に出かけました。
>   * その仕事は自分 **で** やります。
>

This question is also related:

  * [で used for abstract location?](https://japanese.stackexchange.com/q/2494/5010)

I think it's also possible to think of this as an extension of 1人で, みんなで, 全員で,
etc.
CC BY-SA 3.0
2017-03-21T12:19:26.537
44711
2017-03-21T12:19:26.537
2017-04-13T12:43:44.863
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5010
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answer