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I am familiar with the set phrase 「言われてみれば」 as a way to say "Now that you say
that", but as I examine the phrase further, the phrase structure strikes me as
strange. The 〜てみる conjugation is commonly used to say "to try doing
something", but what meaning does it give when used with passive verb form;
"to try being done" does not make much sense to me.

Maybe one might argue that 「言われてみれば」 is a set phrase so I should just accept
it as such, but when I googled around I found that while many verbs yielded
zero results when I tried to find their [passive]てみれば forms, there are some
verbs, mostly related to speech, that can use this form:

  * 本当に好きだったと聞かれてみれば、本当に愛してたと答えられる。 

  * 違う病院に行く、ご事情を話されてみれば良いと思います。

But there are also some verbs that are not related to speech:

  * 愛されて壊されてみれば (song lyric)

  * お前が轢かれてみれば分かるから、お前で実験してみろよ。

So, in general what meaning does this form give to the original verbs, and in
what kinds of scenarios is it used for?
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2011-08-18T05:56:59.317
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2011-12-29T05:55:30.270
2011-12-29T05:55:30.270
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question
usage verbs meaning conjugations て-form
Usage and meaning of [passive verb]-てみれば
We can process this confusing construction if we first realize that "try" is
(more often than not, I would say,) a poor substitution for the ～てみる form.
This is because "try" conjures up the connotation of "attempt", which implies
a possibility of failure. For this particular meaning, the ～ようとする form is more
suitable.

A better explanation of ～てみる, then, is that it shows that the speaker's (or
actor's) attention is directed toward the effects or result of completing the
action. 食べてみる is literally to "eat and see": to first eat, and then see what
effect that has (i.e. whether you enjoy the taste or not). 市役所に行ってみる is to go
to City Hall and see what the result of going is (perhaps to see if they can
answer some questions you have). We always have two actions: the primary, and
みる, which deals with observation upon completing the primary action.

By extension:

> 言われてみれば… If I were to focus my attention on the effects (recollections,
> changes in mental state) of having been told that…

As is often the case, the literal translation fails to come across with the
same succinctness as the original, which is why phrases such as "Now that you
mention it…" are used instead. But although the primary verb is passive, the
phrase still fits into the ～てみる construction as described above.
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2011-08-18T16:07:24.553
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2011-08-18T16:07:24.553
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answer