77934
1.「精霊の力を封印できる **だなんて**
規格外の能力、持っているのはこの世にあなた一人だけよ。ーーそのあなたが嫌だと言うのだもの。もうどうしようもないじゃない」

2.「む……そうか。そうだな。シドーから鳶一折紙の匂いがする **だなんて**
、私はどうしてしまったのだろか。シドーがあの女をおぶったりでもしない限り、匂いが付く **だなんて** ありえないというのに」

Hi. I’m reading a novel and I’ve come across these two examples. I’m
interested in the bold parts. Are the bold parts used to bring up something
unexpected or surprising? If so, can we omit だ and just say なんて in those
examples?

But according to this [link](http://maggiesensei.com/2010/04/08/requested-
lesson-%E3%80%8C%E3%82%82%E3%82%93%E3%81%8B%E3%80%8D%E3%80%8C%E3%82%82%E3%82%93%E3%81%A0%E3%80%8D%E3%80%8C%E3%81%A0%E3%81%AA%E3%82%93%E3%81%A6%E3%80%8Dmonkamondadanante/),
there is such a rule as follows:

> (2) To bring up something unexpected or to re-quote what you have found out
> with surprise.
>
> Although there is a slight nuance difference, なんて ( = nante) and だなんて ( =
> danante) are exchangeable in many cases.（Usually we use だなんて ( = danante)
> when we quote what someone has said and we use なんて ( = nanate) to refer just
> the fact you have found out. )

In my examples, according to the context, だなんてs aren’t quoting what someone
said but just refer to an expected or surprising fact. So does it mean this
rule is invalid and we don’t need to obey it? Or the examples are just the
exceptions to the rule? I’m confused by the difference between だなんて and なんて.
Please shed some light on it.
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-06-10T07:47:35.810
77933
2021-04-20T19:22:28.187
2021-04-20T19:22:28.187
30454
36662
question
grammar auxiliaries
Is there really any difference between だなんて and なんて?
This type of だ has been asked several times:

  * [~たいだとか why is there a だ here?](https://japanese.stackexchange.com/q/60014/5010)
  * [Is 「３人いるだと」 grammatical?](https://japanese.stackexchange.com/q/5693/5010)
  * [Usage (correctness) of だと after verbs](https://japanese.stackexchange.com/q/15057/5010)

だ in your examples are optional, but I feel they are still "quotative" in that
they are used to repeat (often with a negative/dubious overtone) something
that has been already brought up in the context. (That is, they have been at
least thinking or talking about sealing the power of spirits or the smell of a
woman.) This does not mean the clause before だ has to be exactly the same as
what someone said.

**EDIT:** Still, there may be cases where だなんて is used for something that is
mentioned for the first time (eg ラーメンがこんなに美味しいだなんて知りませんでした!). And the
borderline of "quotative" and "non-quotative" is admittedly somewhat blurry in
your examples... Maggie sensei says なんて and だなんて are _usually_ interchangeable
and だなんて is _usually_ used for quoting, and I think that is true.
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-06-10T08:53:15.757
77934
2020-06-10T09:39:22.960
2020-06-10T09:39:22.960
5010
5010
77933
answer