 Correct, and the conversion that they did was no different than taking a distribution out of it because instead of taking the money and putting it into their pocket, they just took the money and moved it over to a rub. And they're taxable. And therein lies the rub. I mean, the bottom line of this is that the only reason why there's a required minimum distribution is not because the government's worried about you getting your $30,000. They're worried about getting paid.