 So it's devastating in terms of what we call recruitment into forests. The understory of a typical forest are just young canopy trees that are waiting for a big tree to die and then they grow up. But we don't have the young trees anymore because the deer have eaten them all. So if we persist with overpopulation of deer for a couple more decades, we're going to lose our forest. That's what it boils down to. So what do we do? We also have what we call the Bambi effect.