 And so that started me on a learning journey. Pat had a very different heartbreaking entry into this learning journey of we've misunderstood what's happening. And because we have misunderstood it as a society, we have responded in ways that have exacerbated the harm and not actually helped reduce harm, but made it worse. And then when we see even more harm, we do more of the things that aren't working because we think maybe that will fix it.