 There are some exceptions on the left about ambition, the post-work school or the degrowth school. What do you think of them? How do they fit into your critique? Degrowth, we need to get out of a world which is hyper-competitive and driven by a narrow vision of what progress really means, a kind of techno vision of what progress means. I agree with that. But we're talking about a planet of billions of people, and degrowth seems to me to be an impossible way