 the hostage families and the victims of the attacks. But his politics, his read of what is happening is really, you know, completely defined by that in a way that permits no conditions, as he says. Ben, let's hear a bit of your conversation with him about this. To do those kinds of awful, terrible kinds of things. And they film that. Yeah. And what part of the human soul does that, where does that come from? Yeah. That does those kinds of things. And