 maybe 10 to 12 people that visited the Amityville house 28 days after George and Kathy Lutz left. George Lutz, you've got to remember this, George, that people say, oh, that was a hoax. That was a hoax. No, it wasn't a hoax. George Lutz was a very serious, stoic kind of a guy. He was a former Marine. He was a black belt in karate.