 well i had heard of you since you know i was in college uh fpu was actually taught at the church i was going to so i was familiar with ramsey um but we didn't really actually get into it until we got married i had picked up the book the total money makeover i read it and we had talked about it she listened to the audio book and um from then on we um i took out that personal loan for the business that was really the the i've had it moment it's like i felt like we went back to