 And I thought, well, Mengelberg, of course, because I love Mengelberg. He's a hero of mine, Mengelberg. He's a musical hero. He's not a personal hero. He's not a hero as a human being. And we could go into that, but we won't. But as a musician, his ideals and his methods are the kind of music making that I most admire in a musician. Bold originality, tight control over his forces.