 Well, you talked about the divide between jazz... Modern jazz and traditional jazz. It was a greater divide for me with classical. When I was at Loyola back then, they didn't encourage cross-pollination. If you were a classical guy, they didn't want me to have a jazz combo at the same time. So I got a late start in learning how to play without reading music. In fact, my first gig ever, my first performance ever with Panorama was...