 think in the back of all of our heads when we were learning our instruments when we were kids it was always a kind of that pipe dream that you'd love to do it but would you ever get the chance to and yeah it took a long time to figure out what sound we wanted or what kind of music we wanted to make what we wanted it to mean and I think we're just lucky that we found each other when we did and were able to figure that out obviously there was a lot of failed projects or other projects and lots of solo stuff and you know genres that we explored but