 And Howie, when he was 14 years old, wrote a letter to my father, who was working at WHN Radio at that time, and Howie started the Marv Albert Fan Club at the age of 14. And he would call him on the phone and he would give him advice. And Howie had him on the show the other night, you know, how many years later? 55, 60 years later. And they were talking about those days when they used to have those chats.