 And he told me afterward, he said, you know, I brought her because I wanted her to convert to the Catholic Church. If she goes to this debate, it's going to be great. She's going to convert. And she told me later that she had the same reason for saying, yes, let's go, because she thought, OK, this is the opportunity for Doug and all of his Catholic stuff to come crashing down ideologically. And then he'll become Catholic.