 And my boss in the city, I was a draftsman, and he taught me how to survey. So I was a surveyor. I mean, not licensed or anything, but I knew how to do it. And so they sent me to Detroit for an interview with a full colonel, who was at that time, I didn't realize it, but he's with the Corps of Engineers with the Detroit District. And so I interviewed with him, and the sergeant that sent me down there, he said, we got this program you can come in as a spec four. And I said, ooh, that sounds good.