 from hunters and so they can sometimes try and get to birds first and you know rob your dog of that duck take it back to a tent and they're very unsuccessful at resuscitating ducks often because if you have a duck that can be caught by a human it wasn't going to make it and so really what they're doing is they're just robbing hunters of meat that could be utilized and a lot of it gets wasted this has to affect hunting in general you know i'm sure that the numbers of hunters have declined because of these activities haven't it