 in single-digit years, but I also believe that a major operation would be something that may be in the late 20s, early 30s, depending on opportunities, which we can talk about more. It's not just about capabilities and intentions. Those are clear. It's also about opportunity. We can define that later. We will come back after the break. I'll continue talking with Admiral Mike Studeman. I encourage you to go get his book, Might of the Chain. I've linked it at my ex-account. Stay tuned.