 to the guilty verdict of Trump. But again, Debs, I break with a lot of my colleagues on the right who just say this is nothing but a boon for Trump. There are positive aspects. He's obviously fundraised massively off of it. There are certainly people who are getting motivated about it. But let's not forget that there are also independents, undecided people who are the holy grail of this election right now. To them, I think this conviction matters, and I think it's a challenge for us, one we can overcome, but it's a challenge. That's why I have you on.