 and Jonathan Alder over at Case Western, Adler, Jonathan Adler at Case Western. But when Erwin was hired at UCI as the dean of the UCI Law School, he was promptly fired when there was a blowback, and the two people who defended him and I believe got him his job back were named Hugh Hewitt and John Eastman. That is not known to anyone, and Erwin has basically abandoned John Eastman. You haven't. I can't defend John because I have a conflict.