 If people don't know what we're talking about, if you've seen the movie Patton, there's a famous scene, I don't know if it's apocryphal or not, where Patton has a soldier drive him out to the ruins of Carthage because after the Romans beat them, they plowed, Scipio what, plowed the fields and sowed salt in them? Yeah, and, you know, killed or enslaved everybody. And, uh...