 This is Live Wire Radio. We're talking to Jane Marie. Her book is Selling the Dream, the Billion Dollar Industry, Bankrupting Americans. It's about the multilevel marketing world. Was there ever like kind of a good old days of this? Like maybe before the Internet, before it was so like now it feels very desperate and very high pressure for the people. But was there ever a time when it was just kind of like, I don't know, about brownie?