 Anytime. Thanks so much for having me. That's Patrick T. Brown. He's a fellow at the Ethics and Public Policy Center. Check them out at eppc.org. When we come back, let's talk a little bit more about that. The chaplet's probably about 13 minutes away. But I was really thinking about how immoral, like slavery, this issue is. And yet there's a great bedimming of the intellect, a great blindness, great hardening of the heart. Because at the very root of this,