These are great. Would be good for people with thick ankles as they have an 80's, kinda slouchy look on me. I have average ankles and calves. Sturdy, well-made, beautiful leather. Bought them in black in a 9, I am an 8.5. I think I would have been ok at an 8.5, but I find these very comfortable. Heel is solid and easy to walk in. The black color is a slightly weathered black, like a velvet black, almost deep grey. Not a shiny, deep black, just so you know.