UPDATE A FEW HOURS LATER:  I WILL KEEP THESE.  THE FITMENT IS A MINOR ISSUE WHEN WALKING DOWN HILL.  Only because the fabric that is in between your toes gives and lets your foot slide slightly forward walking down hill.  On the V trails, they have a good sturdy fabric that will not allow your foot to slide.  Speaking of the fabric, it is a little warm.  There isn't a lot of ventilation, so these are hotter than the V trail runners.

As the title says this is my third pair of these shoes.  They fit fairly comfortably, with the exception that my large too doesn't feel like it has quite enough room, while the other toes are swimming...  The shoe could use more of a curve so that the little toe slots have a less gradual change in side, and to make the big toe box slightly longer.

I am considering sending these back.. As long as it doesn't rub my big toe I will be fine. I don't expect the soul to stretch, so I guess I have to walk in them and see.  I can't remember if my first pair seemed small at first on the big toe or not.  I wore those shoes long after the soul got holes in them.

The second pair I bought, the ones I will try to show in a picture, where ones that are wool lined, and I bought them to wear in winter along with wool toe socks.  Those I ordered one size bigger because I read they fit a little tighter and that I knew I was going to wear them with toe socks.

THE AMAZON SHOE SIZE GUIDE SAYS THAT THIS SIZE THAT I BOUGHT (41) ARE FOR SHOE SIZE 8.5 TO 9, BUT IF YOU COMMONLY WEAR A SIZE 9 MENS, YOU BETTER ORDER THE NEXT SIZE UP, WHICH ARE 42.  I wear an 8.5 shoe and often a 9 hiking boot, and my toe is almost to the end, and with a 9 shoe size, I think they would definitely rub...  You may also consider the 41 if you wear an 8 mens.

Otherwise they are comfortable,  They are warmer than my V trail warmers, but they fit like a glove, with the index finger possibly almost too short..
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