Recommendation to direct City Attorney to draft an ordinance temporarily banning the sale of flavored vapor products in the City of Long Beach.
Ocean carries. Thank you. Now we're doing item 30. Item 30 Communications from Councilwoman Price. Councilwoman Mango Vice Mayor Andrew's recommendation to direct city attorney to draft an ordinance temporary banning the sale of flavor vapor products in the city of Long Beach. Thank you. Councilwoman Pryce. Thank you. I want to thank those who have signed on to this item with me, and I want to share my thoughts with you about why I brought this item. Tonight's discussion is about safety and health. Across the country, we are seeing truly concerning health impacts related to e-cigarettes and vaping. The CDC is reporting over 800 cases of lung injuries directly connected to vaping and e-cigarettes. And there have also tragically been 12 deaths. No one picks up an e-cigarette for the first time, expecting that it will rapidly injure their lungs and land them in the emergency room. And even more, no one expects to be killed by using these products either. For adults, these products are often marketed as a safer way of consuming tobacco, nicotine and and can help stop smoking. That is true, however, with serious and pressing pulmonary injuries being experienced across the country due to the mechanisms of vaping, we need to look more closely at these products to ensure that we are protecting consumers. Additionally, we have seen teen nicotine addiction increasing rapidly and connected with vaping e-cigarettes. This is heavily connected with the marketing of vape products to teens throughout, mimicking candies and sugary fruit flavors. So in light of the urgent health issues being seen nationwide and right here in the city of Long Beach, where we had two reported incidents involving pulmonary injuries, as well as the need to do more to reduce youth nicotine addiction. Enacting a temporary ban narrowly tailored to target flavored nicotine vaping products would allow the city to play a role in safeguarding our youth and protecting the general public. What is being proposed tonight is the sale of flavored vaping products. I know that there are many who feel the city should do more. I know that there are those who have asked us to to institute a permanent ban tonight. And I know that there are those who have asked us to institute a full ban on all vaping products. And I understand that. But I think at this juncture, it's important for us to study the impacts and find out what safeguards are happening at the state and national level that can help protect consumers. Anyone using e-cigarettes to quit smoking and break themselves of a nicotine addiction under our temporary ban would still be able to access the products. It would just not be the flavor of cotton candy. With this policy, we both take a prudent step to address a health concern that is nationwide, while also seeking to make a bigger impact on reducing teen access to vaping based nicotine. Cities, counties and states all across the country are making major strides to confront this issue. And it is time that the city of Long Beach did the same to protect our residents until we have more information regarding the health impacts. Tonight we found we received word that the county of L.A. instituted a ban on flavored vape products. We know that the state of Michigan has banned it. The state of New York, the state of Massachusetts, the city of L.A. has not yet instituted their ban, but their city attorney has indicated very publicly that banned a ban should be in place for flavored tobacco products. And I know that's something that's on their radar. San Mateo County has instituted a ban on flavored tobacco. San Jose has instituted a ban on flavored, flavored tobacco products. And I believe it's time for the city of Long Beach to do the same. I know that our health department has also been involved and engaged in this conversation. They are here this evening. I know that Kelly Collopy, our director of our health department, is here, and I'd like to invite her up at some point to talk about some of the impacts and concerns that the city health department has observed and . Share with us a little bit some of their concerns in regards to how we can protect our our city residents and consumers. It's comfy. Good evening, council members and Honorable Mayor. Thank you for the opportunity to provide some information around this topic. So we do know that generally that flavored tobacco products are the gateway to further smoking and other sort of other sort of tobacco usage. It is one of the things that we've been focusing on. When you look at the injury cases that we that have happened nationally, 40% of them or I'm sorry, 22% of them have occurred among those who are 18 to 21 and 16% are occurring for those under the age of 18. In Long Beach, we do have a restriction for anyone under the age of 21 for any tobacco product. Vaping is included in that process. So when we're looking nationally at the under 18 to the 21 year old, we would want to be making sure that we're paying close attention to that population as we're looking forward. Again, the flavored tobacco products, including vaping and non vaping, are the key entranceway. And as we're looking at the L.A. County that was just passed, they are looking at all flavored tobacco and vaping products, not just the vaping piece in terms of in terms of the vape technology of your e-cigarettes. It is not yet been determined what is causing. So they have not yet found a single agent. They're looking at vitamin E, but they're looking at so many other ways they are finding it, those coming from the streets, but also coming from the places that they're being sold in in different in different agencies. The city of Long Beach has 13 vape only stores within the city. That is that. And then on top of that, there's another 490 that sell that are licensed to sell tobacco and vape products across the city. So I just wanted to give you a feel for that for those numbers. We support as the health department this this ban. And I'm free to answer any questions after that. Thank you. Thank you, Councilman Price. And anything else to add? Nothing further from. Thank you, Councilman Mongo. Thank you. I appreciate those who have reached out to our office on this very important item. I appreciate our health directors thorough report related to the cases that have come forward. I think it's important for us to look into whether or not those that are being impacted are utilizing the FDA approved vape cartridges. I think that one of the things that this allows us to do is it allows us to take a pause for us to take a moment and a step back to ensure that we're being prudent in the way in which we establish parameters to protect youth health. We don't want to drive individuals to the online or illicit market. We want to be careful and appropriate in our action to ensure the greatest health impact. I think that one of the other things that I would like to see is an education component. We have a very strong green education component to our marijuana program. I think it would be appropriate for us to explore how to do that. I'd also be very interested in the recommendations that come back to this council restricting the places that you can get certified vape products from. Over 500 locations to maybe a more controlled environment similar to just the vape shops where we would be able to do greater education and control. And so for those reasons, I'm very supportive of moving in that direction, and I'm open to listening to the community who has already started a great conversation around the protections we need for our youth and health and my colleagues. Thank you. Thank you. Councilmember Richardson. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. And thank you, Councilwoman Price, for bringing this forward. I followed the the conversation on tobacco free Long Beach for a number of years of an ongoing discussion for over ten years in the city. And as new technology like vape pens come online. The conversation. The education outreach typically is delayed. You might. And during that gap from when a new thing comes online and when the foundations and the health world respond to it, a lot of mistruths come out during that time. A lot of people in the community truly feel that vaping is healthier than smoking. Direct cigaret. It's not true. It's not true whatsoever. Whatsoever. In fact, it could be more dangerous because you can't regulate the amount of the dose. Difficult to regulate the amount of dose. And all vaping pens are not created equally. So in that regard, I completely support this. And I would say what L.A. County did today. I just read the article. They banned all flavored tobacco, including Vape. I don't see a scenario where I'm going to say if is market cotton candy, like you said, is marketed at youth. I don't care if it's vape or if it's tobacco. Cotton candy, tobacco is a bad thing. I remember we were kids. We got an ice cream truck. They would have candy shaped like cigarets. Right? You blow it and little powder comes out. It's the same thing. So I'm okay if we want to go a bit further and say, Hey, when we instituted this moratorium, staff evaluate getting rid of these things completely because frankly, it's just the right thing to do. So that. Are you down for that? This is for flavored vape products, but I think absolutely we should be following the research and hopefully the Health Department can weigh in with a recommendation. I think that's very, very good. So I'll submit that to you as a friendly. But this is a great item. Thank you so much. Thank you. Councilmember Councilwoman Mongo. Actually, she just went. Councilman Austin. Thank you. And I. To support this this item wholeheartedly. I think as e-cigarettes are very commonly used, particularly among high school high school students and middle school students. So we have a responsibility as a city council to to look into this. And I'm very fortunate to have had a young intern working with me who's been keeping me up to speed and and and kind of drilling the importance of of educating parents, but also young people on the importance of understanding of e-cigarettes and the oils that are unregulated at this point. And we often don't know what's right, what's inside of these vaping products we need to catch up with. And I think that the public health needs to catch up with what's going on. And this is one of those situations or scenarios where the technology is kind of gotten ahead of government in a lot of ways. And so I applaud the other cities and states that are that are looking into this. If you haven't had an opportunity to check out Dr. Sanjay Gupta's special, I saw that this this past weekend. It was very eye opening on the the the real uncertainties, particularly surrounding vaping. I did have one question. We we're talking about a temporary ban. What would it include? We understand that it includes unflavored tobacco as well as vaping products. But would that include also menthol as well? Well, I'd. Be open to that amendment. I could throw that in there as well. As a as a friendly. Because it is a flavored tobacco. Mm hmm. And and and it is a also. And I'll just say that this is a very personal issue to me. My mother passed away four years ago from lung cancer. She was a chronic smoker all of her life. She tried to quit on many occasions and was addicted to nicotine. And so if we can avoid people from that outcome, we have a responsibility to do it. And I'm happy to to the moral support to this this item. Thank you. Thank you, Councilman. Councilmember Pierce. Thank you. I want to thank my colleague for bringing this forward. I'd like to to understand a little bit from our health department, also your education program around cannabis. Really, I feel like if we're going to even if it's a temporary ban, I mean, I think from hearing our council colleagues, that would eventually lead to a permanent ban and understanding the education program we've done with cannabis, are there opportunities for us to include this in that education program as well? Absolutely. They've been operating the green light bulb cannabis education program and we will continue to do that and also highlight the impacts from vaping. As part of that, we can also, through our tobacco education program, continue the conversations around vaping and other tobacco products that were not be flavored. Now I know that from my family member that quit smoking, he smoked for 20 years and there was a one 800 number on a bus by our house. And he kept driving by, driving by it. And one day he called the one 800 number and he got help. He called the number and he had a counselor on the line that he could call 24 hours a day any time you wanted to pick up a cigaret. And he quit after 20 years cold turkey after trying patches and everything else. And so I think that those education programs as outreach opportunities are really key. I know that our youth often. You know, whether it's cigarets, whether it's vaping. I'm from Texas. It was dip cherry flavored, you know, so any flavored products? I'm very supportive of taking those out because that is the way that that folks come into this. I'd like to hear from the city attorney just you know, I know the county just did this. How that. I'd like to hear a report on the county ban and to see if that goes as far as Long Beach would like or if we want to extend it to even more tobacco products. So. I'm not prepared tonight to give you. That maybe. To will get that and do a memo to you and the mayor and the council on the county ban. And if this passes this evening on the proposed ordinance for Long Beach and how that would be similar to the county ban. Thank you. That's what I'd like. Again, I appreciate this. It's the right step. Thank you, Councilman Ringa. I want to thank Councilmember Price for bringing this forward. Yes. We want to get a little bit of a clarification. This is the recommendation is to draft an ordinance temporarily banning the sale of flavored reaper products. That correct. Temporarily. I just want to get the the clear. I have not heard what temporary is yet, but yes, but it does include flavored tobacco, including vape products and also including menthol are my notes so far. Thank my customers that up as well because I was going to bring up about tobacco and menthol as well. And I'm glad that that part of this is going to be during the temporary ban. Is there going to be a study presented or researched or you're going to be doing a coming back with an ordinance that we . Evaluate and approve. I'm just trying to get a handle on what? What is it we're doing here tonight? That's a great question. The the the ordinance, as I understand it, we're being asked to create would be a temporary ban, whether that's one year, 18 months, whatever that the council decides that would be, at which point it would sunset, unless there's further action by the council, if that's the desire of the council, or it could do a permanent ban. Total ban forever. But you know that. That's also an option. And you could come back at a later date and always rescind that if you have additional information and wish to change that. So those are options are on the table. See my copy. If I recall correctly, we had a tackle, a tobacco prevention and education program at one time at the health department. Is that still there or has the funding sunsetted on that? No, we have a we have significant funding around tobacco education. And we have a team of people who is who was working on that. And we have a number of different efforts. We're currently working to fill all the positions for that program, but we have the capacity to run a very strong education, tobacco education program around these issues. I'm also thinking about it, tobacco enforcement. I mean, we're looking at a ban of a vaping and tobacco product, the flavored tobacco products. I think that would be important that we also have a strong enforcement component to this as well. The environmental health. They do enforcement, at least in terms of underage sales when it comes to that piece. So we are out there consistently doing enforcement around that and we know how many people we state organizations who sell to underage under age 21 for all tobacco products. All tobacco that including of the. E-Cigarettes and vapes. Okay. That's all I have. Thank you. I strongly support this. Thank you, Councilmember. Super now. Thank you. I'd like to yield my position to Councilman Price, and then if you can come back to me. And so. Woman Price. Thank you. So I'm hearing a lot of support for this item, which I love. And to me, this is the kind of debate and engagement I love to have on council, because as we're hearing one another talk or we're talking about policies and where we all stand on it, and I love it. It's very authentic and organic. I want to put it out there to hear from my colleagues. I actually would like to go a step further and make this a permanent ban on flavored products. And I don't know what my my colleagues think about that. I want to hear from you about that. But. I won't amend the motion. I won't amend the motion at this point because I want to hear from everyone. But I think at the very least, in regards to how long will this temporary ban last, I will say until further notice. And the city would have to bring the item back in order to provide the research and lift the ban. The other thing that we didn't talk about is how long would we give the businesses to be able to comply with this policy and take these items off their shelves and have an opportunity to redo their marketing so that their cotton candy products are not the top selling products in their store. So maybe we can give them 30 days, which is what I know some of the other local jurisdictions have done. So as part of this motion, we would give them 30 days to be able to adapt to it. But I also want to hear my colleagues thoughts on making it permanent now. The motion on the floor is for the temporary ban until further notice, at which time we would come back and end the ban if we wanted to do that or modify it at that point. Thank you, Councilwoman. Councilman Mongo. Actually, we want to go back to Councilmember Super now. Okay. Thank you. I have to apologize. I just received a report like 13 pages, and it's a little late to the party, so I haven't had a chance to study it. But what strikes me is that the news on this is late breaking, to say the least. Here's a report from the CDC as of yesterday that they admit that bootlegged THC products are likely to blame. So that type of stuff for Kelly Collopy. I didn't bring these folks with me. So for Kelly, I really sympathize with your position that you're getting this information. You know, as we speak. And so it's so tough to sort this out. And then I wanted to follow up on Councilwoman Mango's point about I guess I would call it unintended consequences that if you put in a ban of this type, are you going to drive folks to the black market where there is zero regulation? And to that, I think maybe if we could proactively come up with a formula here that might work, and that is if we have. Those numbers were staggering, by the way. 13 vape shops versus nearly 500 outlets. So if you banned that everywhere but the vape shops where you could regulate everything, keep an eye on it. Is that a possible term? I want to put that out there. That would that would give people an outlet other than the black market. I think. I think if if if they are I assume we have the regulation in place already for these shops. Also, Kelly had mentioned that the oils and vitamin E and I know very little about this topic, but if they shops were restricted to water soluble only, would that be an improvement over the oils that seem to be causing a problem? So I have more questions and answers here, but I'm just throwing it all out there. Thank you. Thank you. Did you miss coffee? Did you want to answer some of those questions? So vitamin E is one of the things that they think may be part of it, but they haven't. It's not the core of every of of every time someone has shown up. So, like, I wouldn't I wouldn't look so much at whether it's water or oils or what it is because there's a really a mix. So I think those are one that's one of the things we are seeing impacts both well, predominantly they're seeing them on the streets. They are also, you know, they're seeing at least 25% of the cases coming from those that are coming from vape shops. And so, you know, are through sort of standard mechanisms to access. So it's making sure that, well, you know, it's it's still not clear. There's not well, there may be more of some and not of others. That's still not completely clear what it is and where it's coming through. There are also, you know, in terms of the FDA and approved, there's many things that are not approved about vape, even though they're being sold in different stores. So there's not a lot of regulation. So it's hard to know exactly what we're looking at there. Can I follow up to that real quickly? And so if I can summarize what you're saying, is that in the interest of caution, you're supporting the ban at this time. Yes. Councilmember Mongo. Thank you. So what I would like to do is I am open to expanding to a more permanent ban. One of my thoughts would be if we could funnel tobacco users to just the 13 vape shops. So doing a permanent ban citywide on the for 90 those for nine. Do you have also other sources of revenues? Those are gas stations, liquor stores, other things like that where they would not go out of business. Then we work on a aggressive campaign for the vape shops to help us pull people away from tobacco. Because I will tell you, I still have three members of my family to smoke and one shoes. And so there are still actually four members. I forgot I have an in-law as well who are also choose. So I have four members of my family who still are addicted to tobacco. And so we do want to find places in Long Beach for those people to see the one 800 No Butts campaign and other things. And if we could all hone them into a funnel of perhaps those 13, I'm not sure. Again, I wasn't prepared on what direction to go, but to at least get them those resources because what we don't want to do is just have them step over the border. And I know that not every council member here is a border district, but in the fifth district I'm a border district, so I border Lakewood, Hawaiian Gardens , Cypress, Los Alamitos, Rossmore. I could go on and on. And there are all these other places that those resources are available just over the line in a 7-Eleven. And so what I would love to do is find a resource here, a search here, since every councilmember has gotten to speak. Before we really get into the details on the item, would you be open to going to public comment and then coming back to the real. I'm going to allow Councilmember Pearce to speak next. We will have two councilmembers cued up. We have Councilmember Pearce and Richardson, and then we can go to public comment. Great. So those would be my comments. I would like to see an aggressive campaign like the No Butts campaign of the past, because I think there are just still too many people that are addicted to tobacco. Thank you. I wanted to queue up to say that I support a full ban upon hearing your comments. Councilmember among its I hear we always we want to be supportive of small businesses, but when it's something like lung cancer and our kids getting their hands on things, we have to put the lives of our constituents and their children first. Well, I mean, that's I understood that you said you wanted to ban the hundreds of them that sell the product, but keep open the actual vape shops that. I think that I care about the health of our community, so much so that I also don't want us to lose the opportunity to provide a public outreach campaign right here in our own city. So so people do not get help getting off of a vape or cigarets at a vape shop. They get that help through our health department. They get that help whether it's in a grocery store at or a bus stop ad. And so I support a full ban. I'd like to see us get get there. And I know, Charlie, this is the first day that we've had this. I would like to ask if if our health department before our city attorney's office comes back with an ordinance but that our city health department do a small presentation. So we really have some of those numbers in front of us. I hope that the city attorney's office will continue to draft that item, but that we at least have some context that we know how far we want that item to go whenever that comes back in front of us. That's something that our health department could do. What sort of numbers we would be looking for. I guess I want to better understand the number of of users that that have been impacted and have an understanding about some of these claims, whether it's oils, whether it's water. Does it really matter? Just I mean, we're all kind of working without that information, without shared information on that. We can do that. One other number I want to share that 61% of our high school e-cigarette users are buying in that big shops. 61% are buying at baby shops. 61%. Wow. Wow. And high school users are buying or buying them in vape shops. So just as we're thinking about the youth portion of this. Well, we know that that sometimes we have laws on the books and those laws are not adhered to. I mean, I was buying Cigarets when I was 12, going into a store buying Cigarets when I was 12. We have to make sure that they're not there for kids to walk in and buy. And so I fully support a full ban. I support being as aggressive is as this council is willing to go. But I do think that we need a little bit more information from our health department and some clear direction if it's a full ban, if that's the direction that the maker of the motion would like to go . Thank you. All right, Councilmember Richardson. Thank you, Councilmember. So, Councilwoman Price, I want to address you wanted some feedback. Here's what I see here. So we've attempted bans in the past. Plastic bag bans, Styrofoam bans. And we should probably stick to the process to folks. Now we start with an immediate minute order, you know, a moratorium. And give staff time to shape a policy that works, that requires outreach. That should be a part of it. But the man goes into effect today. This conversation about a full ban or a temporary ban, any given Tuesday, anything could be temporary. There is no full ban versus temporary. The other thing I'll say is if we just slam this on. You know, Councilwoman Mongo mentioned the border districts. We border Lakewood, Bellflower, Paramount, Compton. Our markets still don't comply with the plastic bag ban. Restaurants probably aren't ever going to comply with the Styrofoam ban. Reality is the reality is if we want this to work, I think we should put forward we should ask staff how long it takes to shape a policy. Put the minute order in place now which the ban goes into effect immediately or as soon as the audience comes back. And then we take time and shape it, because there's opportunities also that we may not may not be represented here. For example, opportunities to codify education, to put noticing on businesses and other things and through their different audiences. So the conversation on and so youth flavored flavor tobacco targets, youth, right, menthol. There's the conversation that targets African-American communities. Those are very different, distinct conversations that have come up in other areas that have brought this up. And what we don't want to do while we're excited about this motion is go out and shape the policy without doing the work. And so I support the direction we're heading. But I would just say let's give those put the burden on staff to go figure this thing out and bring us a quality policy. That's what I would recommend. All right. I'm going to ask for public comment. And as you coming up, I'll just give my quick comments on that as well. I do think this is like many other policies that that we have embarked upon. I think we'll be getting a lot of direction from Sacramento, which what might render a lot of the time that we're putting forward. But I'd like to come forward Kim Kirkman, Carlos Jeffrey Luciano and Corliss Lee to start. You have 90 seconds. Yes, I'm good. Hi. My name is Kim Markman. I have three kids, a college student, high school student. And a middle aged student. I am actively. Involved with the Wilson PTSA and the Long Beach PTA and other foundations. I am here to support the proposal at hand. However, you guys all want to do it. I'm. I support it. I don't care how you word it. I support it. Today I am wearing my parent hat. I can't wear my PTA hat today because, you know, once again, we're a body that has to vote on on supporting it. I have concerns and I have had concerns for probably since they started selling the e-cigarettes and the flavoring. I've read many articles. My husband keeps sending me articles. Articles and concerns that are coming to light. The first 2 to 6 are alarming to me. The National Youth Tobacco Survey. Quoted on the Wall Street Journal. And the safe to say B Corp, I saw the exact same quote today. It's 1.7 million high school students used e-cigarettes in the last 30 days. 90% of adults addicted to a. Substance started. Before age 18. And I know that goes substances abroad because I, I often talk to my kids about this. One pack of cigarets is equivalent to one joule. And I know I saw on the Internet today. That Governor Newsom. Signed an executive order to. Confront the youth vaping. Epidemic. The Wilson PTSA. Board, which I am the president of and many of my peers. Have high. Schoolers are concerned enough that we. Are hiring a professional company, this cyber safety cop, to come in and him. Am I done? Thank you. Yes, I'm sorry. You can. Darn it. I was. So close in. School. Oh, you did great. Oh, good. Thank you, Carlos. After. Carlos is Jeffrey Luciano. How are you doing? Thanks. Thanks for listening to us. Actually, I'm here representing the shops and every shop owner and I understand this is an issue that we have to address and everything have started with, you know, the youth trying to get all these baked cigarets and different stores. And we understand that what they do, they always try to get it anywhere, but no other beach shops. Usually our beach shops are run by the owners. We have all these licenses that we have to obtain in order to sell these devices and to sell these e-liquids. No, we not allowed any people under age to walk into our vape shops because we will lose our business now if there is a ban. I will say that you will can the 13 shops that there is in Long Beach so you can update some data about what's going on because otherwise futures will be followers on these and just follow where other cities are doing. And we don't we can do something with this. We can actually get a device or age verification that we already have talk about. So the every to everybody that comes through our stores will be verified. So we won't even take fake IDs because, you know, that's something that sometimes people can control. And then if you ban this, you will creating a black market. That's what's going to happen. People is going to go out of the city. You will close the shops. And then I think it's better if we allow only certain shops so you can obtain the data. Thank you, sir. You guys appreciate it. Thank you. Mr. Luciano. Geoffrey Luciano. Good evening, councilman. Thank you very much for your time. And, you know, speaking on this agenda and hearing me out, you know, I've been using electronic cigarets for ten years. I used to be a smoker prior to that for many years. And I quit using flavored nicotine. And all my customers, all my customers, which are 21 and over adults, they use flavored nicotine to quit smoking. And they're very concerned. Uh, you know, we all know that flavored nicotine has been in existence for about a decade. And this recent epidemic is a recent occurrence. And based on Kdka's report, 7770 7% of the of the epidemic involve THC or else 16% involve nicotine products. The recent occurrence has raised many eyebrows in Long Beach and action needs to be taken. I believe in preventable measures. Yet I urge the city council, the city attorney, to work with electronic cigaret retailers in forming alternatives to the prohibition of flavored products with the highest regard to prevention of use, access and curve, any potential harm and misuse of e-cigs. Speaking to many constituents in Long Beach, the underlying fear that this total restriction on flavors. Of flavored e-cigs will perpetuate parasitic. Thank you, sir. Bootleggers releasing harmful products into this market in turn, resulting in risking unimaginable consequences. Let's work together and reach an outcome of providing a harm reduction for all. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Carelessly after careless, we have Neil. Neil Hanson. I totally support what you're doing here today. And and I thought the discussion was really good. And I don't have a particular answer in this because I think when you ban something, in some ways you make it more desirable, especially for kids. You know, I think they'll probably go after it one way or another if they want to. But I do believe that the education part of it is probably the most important. So whatever we can do to get out to the schools and make sure that everyone understands the dangers that go with it. I love those old commercials where they had that woman with the cigaret in her neck. I mean, when you see the end game of of tobacco, it's not pretty. But I would say that I would favor raising the price. You know, if you're trying to get it away from kids, make it so that it's not economically feasible for them. Thank you. Mr. Neil Hanson and then John Seaburg. Hello. And thank you. My name is Nils Hands. And. And I own an electric bike store and a vape store, both in Long Beach. For over six years, I've helped thousands. Quit smoking to lead a healthier life. And I got to tell you, it feels pretty amazing. I, too, was a long time smoker who stumbled upon vaping in its earlier stages. Prior to my discovery, I suffered at least four times a year with bronchitis, believing I was allergic to. Everything since I was always congested. Before quitting, Cigarets realized that those were the source of my illnesses. However, we're not here to listen to. Me talk about how vaping saved my life. We're talking about how to keep it away from kids. As a father of three, one of them a teenager. I'll be the first to tell you. I educate and with my wife, educate our kids to not smoke. To not vape, ever. They don't need it. Keeping kids healthy is a concern for all of us. And as someone who sells the products, I feel I have an. Even greater responsibility. Therefore, I would like to present to the Council a list of. Responsible and I believe, ultimately effective regulations that would have even a stronger, more positive impact than an outright ban. A ban would only send kids and people back to cigarets. Black market type products. First, we must limit and license the locations where these products can be found. To my findings, there's over about 600 tobacco. Licenses in the city of Long Beach and only eight vape shops. I believe that only vape shops should sell vape products. Next, we need to limit the amount of nicotine. Nicotine is a huge driver for these kids. They're looking for a buzz. We don't carry Jewel at my store. My store, we see over 70 to 120 people a day. We don't carry JUUL. We don't sell it. We don't believe in that high nicotine stuff. That's what kids are going after. They're going after the bus. Thank you, sir. Flavors for everybody. Please submit your list to the to the clerk, and we will. I gave you guys all folders today. So thank you. Take a look. John Seaburg. After John Shane Simpson. Podium for short people. My name's Shaun Seaborg. I have been a vapor for 11 years. 11 years? I have zero nicotine. I have never been a nicotine vapor in any shape or form of way, never smoked cigarets never gave up care about tobacco products in general. I however I have I have however, been using a great product and zero nicotine flavor to basically nebulizer albuterol sulfate. Now albuterol sulfate comes in a nebulizer for people with asthma or breathing problems and you can mix it. And basically it's activations which are the same as the active agents that are in Egypt's with the exception of nicotine. But I do believe that there is a serious issue here with your products in general. You're talking about a nicotine product that is within 50% or I'm sorry, 50 milligrams in nicotine when most vapes in general and most nicotine products are between zero and six milligrams at 50 milligrams, you're talking about a high, not a pleasant one. And it's never fun. I mean, it's what the kids are chasing after and it's not something that we need to really take a look at. Now, as far as kids getting it, most shops that I visit, there's never any kids in there. Rarely do kids ever even come in. But you will see advertising for Jewel on the front door of an AMPM, front door of a Chevron, front door of a 7-Eleven. And, you know, in my experience, it's those places where kids are also getting their vapes from that and online retailers. And both of those need to be seriously checked by not only the parents who are kind of being lazy and not proactive, but also by the council yourselves. Thank you so much. Thank you. Through Simpson and then after Mr. Simpson and Travis Anthony. Hi, my name is Shane Simpson. I'm with I'm a vape shop owner myself real quick we do it that vape shops this is this month alone fake IDs that were confiscated over the course of 38. There's 42 IDs here. The teenagers are to walk in and purchase nicotine products illegally. We use a third party age verification. These are purchased on a website called ID Guard. You can shop teens can buy five ads for $100. PayPal only. Stand by. But we we've caught them. And I'd like to submit this to staff to review them. You can scan and police department can also scan them. They all fall foul of the bar code authentication. We checked the barcode to verify that it's a real I.D. or not, not the magnetic strip. Many experts are very easy to forge. I recommend a 2% or 2.5% nicotine cap. We did independent research survey with 2500 youth in the Southern California area, and they're all looking for 50 to 70% milligram. They are not interested in 36 adult smokers, 86% use that. The CDC, DC data from the NTSB report of 2018, less than 7% of teens use flavors. Fruit. Less than 5% use meant I actually have the NYS 2018 report I can show you guys. Break it down. I want to work with the city to craft responsible progressive legislation. I think Long Beach could be the model for eliminating youth use and protecting adult access. Thank you. Thank you. Then Travis Anthony and then Nick and McGwire. Hello. My name is Travis Anthony. I own vapor land in Long Beach on the east side of Long Beach. Do you guys have a hard. Decision to make and duty to do. We get it. We've been paying attention for the last six years. There is 23 shops in 2013 or 14. I think there's down to eight. Pretty much spread over 52 miles of Long Beach. So it's not like we're all in one spot. We just want to give it give us an opportunity, because I know that nobody wants kids to smoke. I smoked at 1112. I didn't have a choice, but I found it either way. So last year I started a tobacco retail education team. I met with education. City enforcement, presented a bunch of restrictions. I didn't really get far with it. I didn't know how to how to go about getting any further. So the eight shops have come together and we presented you guys very restrictive, very regulated forms like you've been hearing lowering nicotine. Lowering consumption, doing the Peel System's roots, age verification. It can't be sold without it. And that's pretty much all we're asking for is don't make everybody go to Lakewood, to these other vape shops. They're going to get rich overnight. We're going to go out of business. And there's there's other ways than just making everybody go black market. What we want to communicate with you, I don't think a lot of you guys know about the products. That's why I started last year trying to educate somewhere. We. Thank you. Thank you very much. Big. And then after Nick, we have Bill blow it. Hello. My name is Nicholas Almaguer and I run a local bait shop. I have worked there for about. Five or six years. I have personally helped. Over a thousand people quit smoking. I have cried. With people on a regular basis when they quit smoking 3 to 4 packs of cigarets a day. I have had. People come in who smoke 3 to 4 packs. Of cigarets a day and we got them to quit on the spot and never touch another cigaret again. That is why I do this. Yes, I am looking at losing my job. Yes, my boss is looking at losing his business. My friends are looking into going bankrupt because of this. And the thing that I care about the most is my customers. They are not just our customers. They are friends and family. I have been known personally to have my customers come over and have barbecues for them. Support them, turn into a community type event where we are supporting each other, quitting smoking. That is the thing that I think a lot of people don't understand about this industry. I think that is what makes it a truly special community. These people encompass ex-smokers. They hate big tobacco innately. And I think there's a common misconception that we. Are big tobacco. We go out of our way to avoid big tobacco, and it is really the main thing that we're against. So I helped. Prepare those folders that you received earlier and those folders contain. Responsible regulations that we believe you guys should put into effect in order to prevent this without hurting other constituents. Thank you. Thank you so much. Bill. Then after bill, we have lance brooks. Good afternoon. This bill baldinger coalition for smoke free long beach. I want i'm not here to. Convince you tonight. I'm here to congratulate you. Taking up this strong measure that you're considering today on. It's a bold move and. You have a lot of support in the community. You've received that support. You've seen this coming into your offices today. And we congratulate you for for. Thinking of the health of the residents of Long Beach. Just want to say a few words about some of the comments we heard. There is no safe smoking. There's no safe vaping. There's no safe secondhand smoke. These things are just not true. Al. Mr. Austin, when you spoke about your family, it struck me. I lost my father and all my uncles, frontline servicemen in World War Two who never saw. Their grandchildren because of tobacco. And I don't want another generation to go through. What? My family went through and years went through and we need to put a stop to it. This is a great first step. There is a lot more to do, but we need to keep children safe, number one. The other considerations are important, but not as important as that. Thank you. Did ice caps keep Travis Anthony? Nick Almaguer. I apologize. I think the last time I was similar. Last name? Bill Blow. It's okay. Okay. Who was that? Bill Ball. Vega. Sorry about that. Hi. My name is Bill Bloat, and I, uh, I own a home in the fourth district, and I own Smuggler's Success, which is also in the fourth district. It's a. Vape shop we started in 2012. And, you know, I did it to try to help save lives. And there seems to be a lot of. Misconception about is vaping healthy, is it healthier? And it depends on who you ask, I guess these days, because. You get mixed signals from everyone you know. In the UK. Doctors are recommending it and. Here they're not. So it's something that obviously needs more. Education, more research. And hopefully you guys. Look at what we've sent you guys for regulating. We would like to be able to self. Regulate and really make sure. That they're not getting in the hands of children and that we're not selling, you know, 35. To 60 milligram nicotine in things like jewels. And small devices that can be hidden very well. I have two kids that go to high school in Long Beach and. You know, they see the jewels, too, and they tell me about it. Meanwhile, my two children. I've never tried vaping, so thank you. Thank you so much. What a color romance books. And after the dance we have tonight complete. Her name's Lance Brooks, and I work at Smuggler Success, a vape shop in Long Beach. I've heard a lot of interesting things here tonight, but one of the things that I've heard is the amount of products are purchased from vape shops. I just think it's inaccurate. I think it's information here that's not true. Accurate of smoke, vaping. Different than smoking. And I think we've heard some good ideas on how to help our citizens be more responsible and use it as a tool except for enjoyment. Rather than for the kids to get hold of it. I think there are easier ways to for the children not to get a hold of it. I don't think vape shops in what they call C stores where they're getting it. We just don't have 16 year olds that walk through our store and buy jewels. That just doesn't happen. We had a couple. Incidents when we've had the health department come and do stings and we just didn't sell to them just because to them we always heard we we know our customers very, very well. 90% of customers we know by name. And we know we're selling, too. So I think if we. Can look at some of these ideas and be drafting together, I think it would be effective to help our citizens, help the youth, help the adults. I think education is a. Huge, huge, huge part of helping this and. Stopping this. And I hope that we can kind of come to something that would. Work best for everyone. Thank you. Thank you. Mr. Sunak MP. He's not here. Ashley Salazar in my notorious. Hello. Good evening. I work for Brian L.A., which. Is a organization that focuses on air. Quality and lung health issues. And I'm a health educator focusing. On educating. Parents and teachers and students about vaping and e-cigarette. Use. So for the last year, I've been doing parent workshops all over Los. Angeles County, and teachers and administrators. And parents are overwhelmed by what they see. These presentations just really give an insight to the problem. Students tell me that they go to the restrooms and it is so common for them to see their classmates vape and smoke. And young people choose to vape for many reasons, including peer pressure, availability of flavors. And the youth and vape culture surrounding it. Even though flavors are just one part of this big issue, it is a concerning one. There are thousands of flavors available, and these flavors. Are often targeted as at. Youth. Frito-Lay supports the city of Long Beach and. Tackling the teenage vaping epidemic to protect our youth. However, we do not believe a flavor ban will solve this problem if it is not supplemented by an educational component for parents, teachers, students and the community as a whole. Flavors is just one part of this problem. We think Long Beach for. Understanding that this. Vaping issue is a big problem and taking steps to study this issue in order to come up with a solution. Thank you. Thank you so much, Lionel Trias and then Matt Morton. Council members. For the time. Allowed me to speak today. My name is Lionel Triest. I'm 35 years old and I no longer smoke. I beat the vapor for six and a half years and I have a daughter. My daughter means everything to me. My daughter means absolutely everything to me. And I am doing everything that I can to provide for her, which means working in this industry. I used to work in the medical field, hurt my back. I wanted to use my mind. Baby mama was pregnant. My grandma was dying of cancer. And I had to make a decision. I told her on her deathbed that I am going to change lives to get people to stop smoking. She said, I know you can do it. I wanted you to be in the medical field, but I know this is what your heart is telling you. My family didn't approve that at first, but they soon later to realize that I had changed. I have grown up. I became a man being in this industry. Please don't take this away. I know that we're adults here that can make good decisions and better decisions for our kids. I believe that flavors help adults such as myself to make things better, a better life for the rest of us in the future. I'm not going to go any further and more than what I need to say, but please reconsider what some of my colleagues here have been talking about, about better. Let's do a better legislative for a better Long Beach for baby. Thank you. Sir. Thank you. Matt Morton. After that, we have Chris Sherwin. Hi. Resident of Long Beach. Don't really have a skin and either side of the game. I don't own a shop and whatever. I haven't had a real cigaret in over a year thanks to e-cigarettes. National Institute of Health in the United Kingdom has proven that e-cigarette vape only has 5% of the toxicity of a regular cigaret. And my own doctor says my lungs are better. I can taste food. It's fantastic. Unfortunately, right after this meeting started, CNN reported that two more deaths have happened because of vaping related issues. However, they also both of them were not nicotine products. They were under ground, counterfeit THC and CBD cartridges. The Institute of Health in the state of Virginia found that all of their products that they tested from legal legal shops. Came back with none of these contaminants. Sacramento just published a thing. They grabbed 13 legitimate products, 13 counterfeit black market products. Ten of the 13 had the vitamin E acetate. That is a cutting agent that goes into the counterfeit products that when heated, becomes cybernetic. That's our problem. I have apple watermelon in my pocket right now. I love it. Flavors are for everyone. Banning flavors on a kneejerk reaction like this for something else. Is a problem when you have a fantastic community that's willing to help. Listen to the community, please. Thank you. Chris Sherwin. And I have to correct Christine Simpson. Good evening, members of council. My name is Chris Sherwin. I'm with the Campaign for Tobacco-Free Kids. I want to congratulate you for your attention to this very important issue. What we've seen is a growing momentum in California and across the country of communities doing just what you're considering tonight. And that is a full and permanent ban on the sale of all flavored tobacco products. E-cigarettes and all other flavored tobacco products. Flavors and tobacco have no place together. We are very concerned about the the recent epidemic of respiratory illnesses. But let's take it back, step back and look at the bigger picture. We have seen a 135% increase in youth e-cigarette use in the last two years. This is recent federal data. This is the tide that we are most concerned about. And the FDA is the agency that oversees whether a device is approved or not as a cessation product. No e-cigarette has been even submitted to the FDA or as a cessation product and therefore has not been approved as a cessation product. What we are now seeing are thousands and we're up to 5 million youth nationally have used an e-cigarette product. We're hearing about it from parents. We're hearing about it from teachers. In addition, over 50% of youth smokers use menthol cigarets. There are over 250 flavors of cigar flavors now, and cigars are now more popular among high school boys than Cigarets. So I encourage you to do a full, comprehensive prohibition on all flavored tobacco products across the city. Thank you very much. Shane Simpson. All right. Thank you. Okay. Kevin Price. After cave in is Taylor Thompson. Hello, Mayor. And council members. My name is Karen. Price and I'm in sixth grade. I'm here in support of. Item 32 temporarily banned vaping. Products. Being in sixth grade means I'm one step closer to becoming a teenager. With Vape kids are. Tricked into buying it because they think it is like. Candy. As scary as this is, here is a rush to become cool with vape as an option. This is kids number one choice. It is. This is not just for middle schoolers. But for kids and teens and all because it is. Bad for our kids health and kids may get addicted. It is your job to protect it. Because the. Vaping companies care more about their money than your health. I know. I know. If you vote yes, some will not be happy. But sometimes. Sometimes the right decision is the hardest to make. So I'm asking. You for for you to help. Me and my community and make. The right choice tonight. Vote yes. Thank you. Next is Taylor Thompson. Yes. Then we have Jessica Quintana. Hello. My name is Taylor Thompson. I have been working in the vaping industry for over six years now. I work in an open system type of product. I'll give you an example. I work for a company called Save Your Vape. We manufacture this product. It's a blueberry lime flavor. There's been a lot of studies proving that flavors do help people unflavored products that you guys are proposing. None of us want to. That's not appealing to us. It's not something we enjoy. And a tobacco flavored product would taste like a cigaret what we're trying to avoid. Right? So that's kind of the problem there. But I want to kind of show you an example of a dual really easily edible, right? I put this in my pocket, vape it. This is what I make. These are my two devices. They're over $200 for these. I don't think any kid's going to walk into a shop and be able to afford that. If I could show it to you, too, you would see there's a lot of cloud production with this. There's barely any. The milligram on this is 50 milligram, the milligram on this is six milligram. My mom quit smoking cigarets because of vaping. It changed and saved her life. She breathes easier. I was. I was raised with asthma because of her. I don't have it any longer, so I get a little emotional because this ban is just unfortunately so wrong. You guys are making the right call with this one. Unfortunately, we don't want our kids to vape, but this will drive tobacco back in power. This is this is the future here. This is we are not big tobacco. We don't want to be big tobacco. And we definitely, certainly don't want our children vaping. But this is not the way and we want to work with you guys. Just tell us how, you know on a real level, but I appreciate it. Thank you for your comments. After jessica, we have Lauren Labar. Good evening. Council members. Thank you so much. Councilman Austin. Jessica Quintana, executive director of Center Cha. We probably see over 10,000 youth each year. It's interesting that folks came up here and said that youth don't get access or can't buy these products, but they get them very easily. And so I've worked in tobacco control prior to working with Central Cha for over seven years. And so, you know, folks were afraid of the ban back then. Oh, if we ban Cigarets in the bars, the bars are going to shut down. Well, they're thriving. If we ban smoking in the parks, you know, nobody's going to be, you know, hanging out at the parks or, you know, smoking in the park areas. We no longer have smoking in the parks. We got rid of the the the nice billboards in tobacco that was, you know, advertising to youth and communities of color. They're no longer in magazines. The magazine company said they were going to go out of business if you took the advertisements away from the tobacco industry. They're still in business. What I can tell you is these kind of flavored and all these gimmicks that come from the tobacco industry are, number one, trying to target our youth . And so how they use their vehicles through, you know, vapes and vape shops and other stores, whether that be the markets, the supermarkets, the 7-Eleven. Long Beach has always been a Ford city, working in tobacco control for many years, and especially reducing youth access. Everybody remembers when you can get the pack of Cigarets off the self-service display. That's no longer the liquor store said they were going to go out of business if that happened. Well, guess what? They did it. Thank you. So folks have a responsibility to our children and the public health and the safety of our youth. The ban is the correct thing to do. Thank you so much. Next up is lowering the bar. Name. William Bowe digga. O. Hello. Tonight. My name's Lauren Lavoie. I'm 27 years old. I'm a former smoker. I've been working in the E-Liquid industry for eight years now. I started smoking Cigarets when I was 12 and was not able to get off them until I found vape. I tried everything. I tried lozenges, patches. I heard you say the health department is helping people get out of smoking and if that was the case, vaping would have taken off the way that it did. That's just the reality of it. In regard to the recent illnesses and deaths, I've heard it said before, but the CDC has come out officially and said that 84% of those were admitted to using THC products illegal as illicit drugs off the black market. And they assume. That is actually a. Higher amount and less amount of a vapers because they don't trust that people are actually being elusive to what they're using. I think a more effective way of cracking down on that would be to go after the illegal cannabis market. If that seems like too big of a task, I don't know what would happen. If there was a black market. E-Cigarette market. We are a passionate industry. We want to stay alive and like we're not selling to kids. Looks like I'm. Running out of time. We do have a lot of options. Only selling 21 over establishments like bars. Same thing with vaping. Require a scanner for any e-cigarette. Purchase. Including delivery of online. Purchases. And a lot of the kids are getting them online and and everything like that. So nicotine nicotine restrictions on levels licensing and pull our license if we if we fail. At any of your tests. Thank you so much. Thank you. That stuff is Gina Payne, you know. Good evening. My name is Dr. Gina Peony. I'm a retired professor from Cal State, Long Beach and Public Health. I've been an advocate of public health for decades. I'd like to address the fallacy that vaping is harm reduction. We're finding that it is not. The current epidemic is indicating that vaping has an acute toxicity. You cannot compare this to the chronic toxicity of tobacco. So don't fall into that fallacy. The second thing is that in public health, we have a history of moving forward for prevention before we know the actual cause. We have a history of doing that. John Snow took the handle off the pump and stopped the epidemic before we could see cholera in the microscope. We could prevent AIDS before we knew the cause was HIV. This is another opportunity of prevention. You don't have to wait to find out the exact cause. So I also am a mother of two daughters that graduated from Milliken. My youngest daughter told me she graduated in 2014 and she said it was easier to get vapes than Cigarets. She was offered them all the time. Thank you. Thank you so much. That concludes our public comment. We're going to take it back behind the rail for the council. Next up is council member Mungo. Thank you. I really want to appreciate the amount of public comment. I know that this was a US Council agenda item created by council members. So you didn't get included in an outreach process yet? I agree with Councilmember Richardson that we really need to move down that pathway. I would like to. Propose that we make the ban effective January one. That would give us three months, 90 days for people to sell what's on their shelves and so on and so forth. I think that it should be limited to non-veg shops, but citywide we should ban the sale of all flavored vape and jewel and any violations of any sales of these products could result in in loss of your licenses. And I don't know what licenses we have control over in those because I don't know everyone that sells them. 490 is a very high number, and so I'd like to learn more about that at the vape shops. I'd like to require 21 and over signage, tobacco use warnings, limit of nicotine for sale to the 2.5%. Require an ID check. I don't know if it's legal. If they catch someone with a false ID, if they could be required to hand over the stack of false IDs collected to the city. I don't know if we'd want to get involved in that or not. I'd be looking for a recommendation from our health director on that because I think that. If there is no process where kids get stopped. From this and their parents don't know. What then? It just continues to go on. They go to alternative sources. And then I'd like to work on a collaborative with the vape shops where they provide us data. What are the zip codes of individuals buying vape? What vape products are sold to? What zip codes? I think that goes to Councilmember Richardson's point. And then I'm completely open to an a full ban if we find any violation. And the way that that would happen is if there's only currently eight vape shops. The moment one of you sells to an under 21, you're gone. That's it. So eight violations and we have a citywide ban. I appreciate that many other cities and counties have come forward with ideas. And one of the things I love about being on the Long Beach City Council is we're not all of those other cities. I think that this is a huge opportunity for us to stand apart from the rest. For us to implement a very aggressive campaign, moving people towards and away from tobacco. I mentioned to Councilmember Richardson, I surveyed my four family members that smoke. Two of them are nicotine and one of them is wintergreen. Flavor. The wintergreen is chew. And so these are adults that I would like to see move towards vape and then eventually towards nothing. But right now, I don't see them quitting any time soon. And I know they've one person's tried it multiple times, multiple, multiple times. And the failure is is very trying. Two of them have young children and have both tried to quit when their children were around because they didn't want to have spittoons around their house. I see people vaping and driving. I will tell you, I met Trevor when he brought his vape shop to the fifth District. And I will tell you, I met with the landlord. I was afraid. I didn't think that it was a good location. I definitely put up a lot of barriers because I had serious concerns about the youth. What he has demonstrated is to be a successful art conscious, environmentally conscious, and really an advocate for adult use only and getting off of nicotine. Because when I was in high school, everyone went to this one individual who, by the way, still lives in the fifth District and everyone would buy Cigarets from him. Everyone, he wore a trench coat. He'd open it up. You could buy a pack of cigarets you could buy. I'm not joking. He lives in Lakewood Village to this day and he you could buy a cigaret for $10. And so I don't want to be there. I really feel we need to get rid of the jewels. And then I also searched Amazon for 1999. I can have mango flavored vape delivered to my house tomorrow. If I order within 3 hours, it'll be there tomorrow. And so I really hope that the council and my colleague, Councilman Price, will consider the fact that there's only eight vape shops. And if we work with them over the next 60 days to come up with a plan that we really could come up with something better than any of the other bands we've ever seen, with the goal of reporting numbers of how many individuals you've pulled off of cigarets and tobacco, because I think that there's a future in finding a solution. So with that, I'm open to continuing to hear the items of my colleagues. Thank you, Councilmember Super. Thank you. I have a statement to read from Vice Mayor Andrews, if you'll bear with me here. This is from Dee Andrews. I believe that it's important that the city council act to protect the health of Long Beach citizens in light of the nationwide health impacts of e-cigs and other flavored vapor products that have recently been in the news media. As a part time educator at the high school level. I have to say that any proactive measures we can take to protect youth are very much worth it. Teenagers already think they know it all without the added pressure of industry tactics that use flavor and other attractive methods to make a profit. As adults, we make a choice on what we purchase and consume. Teenagers who may not have access to products do not need an extra layer of unhealthy products. I hope this matter is taken seriously as deaths are increasing, and we must work proactively with businesses getting the word out that these products are not safe and not a safe alternative to cigarets. We are doing this for a healthy Long Beach. Sincerely, Dee Andrews. I thank you, Councilmember. Councilwoman Price. Okay. So just a couple of thoughts. First of all, I want to thank Vice Mayor Andrews. He did sign on to this item and I want to thank him for his support and for those comments. I know he's not here tonight, but he's been very engaged in this discussion. I don't accept the I guess there are friendly amendments. I don't accept, expect, accept them and I'll say why, at least not in their entirety. We're talking about a public health issue where people are dying. People are actually dying. I understand we want to be business friendly, trust me. Let me repeat. Let me. Let me just make sure Councilman Price has the floor. Thank you. When pressed. Continue. So while I want to support our businesses and do everything we can to work with them, let me just say we are the only city that's offering a mitigated temporary ban while we figure out some policies that will be long term implemented. Every other city and county and state has proposed a full, permanent ban. We are trying to approach this from a mitigated standpoint by saying let's get these products off the shelves as soon as possible because they are killing people. They are actually killing people. And we have a duty as we have a fiduciary duty, we have a duty in every way to protect our consumers and our youth. And I cannot say that we are going to wait three months and keep these items on the shelf while we continue to see negative impacts to the youth. We've already had two incidents of pulmonary injuries in the city of Long Beach. What if one of those was a death? One of the one of those was the death of a of a young child. So we're talking about a temporary ban that gives us an opportunity to work with the businesses. Absolutely. We want to work with the businesses. And Jessica, I love your points. When we talk to every time we talk about a ban, people say, oh, this is going to cause everyone to go to the black market. We had that conversation with marijuana. And you know what? The number one complaint we're getting with marijuana now is that there's too much competition from the illegal dispensaries. The whole reason we enacted legislation and to legitimize it in the city of Long Beach is so that we wouldn't have a black market. And yet the number one complaint we're getting now from the legitimate business owners is that there is a thriving black market. And so I don't think a ban is going to cause any of these businesses to go out. I really don't. We're talking about a temporary ban. Look, I own a small business. If there was a national data tomorrow that said the product that my store offers is killing people. I would stop and pause and I would think, okay, maybe I need to think about the future of my industry because fighting a temporary ban today is not going to change the fact that there is a mechanism associated with vaping that is causing pulmonary injuries. That mechanism needs to be studied. This is not a traditional class one or Class two medical device that gets FDA clinical trials. So we're just starting to learn more and more about this industry as a result of deaths. And I don't want those deaths to be Long Beach deaths. So I'm asking my colleagues, I submitted this item. We've been working on it for four months. Up until tonight. I did not expect or know for many of my colleagues that they wanted to somehow exempt vape shops from this 60% of the sales according to our data. Of Youth comes from products sold in vape shops. So while I appreciate our eight businesses are checking IDs and I think that's wonderful. 60% of the youth are purchasing their products in vape shops. That could be completely bogus information. I don't know. But we work with our health department and we rely on them regularly to form opinions and conclusions and policies on behalf of the city . That's our job to do. So with all due respect to Councilwoman Mongeau and I have tremendous respect for her. If this was any other industry where the product was killing people, we would say, let's stop, let's pause and let's take a look at it. And you know what? We have worked very closely with our businesses in Long Beach to shape policy so that it's well-intentioned and thorough. And I'm open to doing that with the vape shops. I'm not saying that we should have a permanent ban tonight, although I would support that. But the item that I drafted is let's take an immediate pause because people are dying. People are literally dying. We have a duty to take a pause and mitigate that. Will people still get. I can't control what people buy on Amazon. Absolutely. But we can control what people buy in Long Beach. I'm not here to control what people buy on Amazon. That's that's not within the purview of our jurisdiction. This item is meant to address what people buy in Long Beach. So I'm asking for my colleagues support on this item. I think some of the item some of the suggestions tonight by my colleagues were amazing in terms of working with the companies, trying to develop comprehensive policies. Education and outreach is huge. I'm the one that brought the education and outreach item to council for cannabis, and I think we could do a similar thing. But this item is not about getting people to stop. Smoking or not be addicted to nicotine. This item is because. The. Products are being ingested through a mechanism. That is deficient on research right now. And the products are causing pulmonary injuries to people. It is a public health emergency. This item isn't about let's work with people and help them not be addicted to tobacco. That's a great conversation. It's a wonderful conversation. Someone should bring an item to talk about that if they want. But my item tonight is about the public health issue of people dying as a result of the mechanism of vapes which are sold in vape shops and they're sold in convenience stores. So thank you. Next up, we have councilmember pearce. I i support the statements made by councilmember price. I hope that we can get the report from our health department to kind of open up our eyes to the facts about this so that we we have those before us. I support a ban as soon as we can while we explore that and understand more the impacts. But absolutely, people are dying. We have to act fast. Thank you. Thank you. Council member Supernormal. I'm going to speak for myself now. I've completed my duties to the vice mayor. And first, I want to thank Kim Kirkman from Wilson PTA for speaking here tonight. Kim, I'm sorry we didn't get you through your entire conversation there, but I also have a pipeline in to Wilson High School for information. And that just made me think that as far as some type of ordnance is crafted, any way we can reach out to the school district and get them involved in this, in crafting this, I just think we have to have a larger conversation there because I think everyone in this room wants to protect the youth. The only question is how we get there. And then I think for the comments that Council Member Richardson made, I think maybe Councilman Price and you are on the same page. It just wasn't really articulated that way that this is a temporary ban, then get it sorted out. Okay. So, yeah, we're on. Okay. So I think that's where we are now. I just want to thank everyone for spending some time with us here tonight. I'm the biggest proponent of streamline council meetings, but sometimes it takes this type of process and this is the beginning of conversation. So I think it's going to be very fruitful in the long run. So thank you. Thank you. And I'd like to also just remind the council we have five minute limits under our new rules. And I know are some some of our constituents are paying attention and clocking us. Councilmember Mongo. Thank you. I just don't want to be misquoted. And I know council member Price doesn't want to be misquoted either. I'm not here trying to stick up for any small business over any other small business. What I'm saying is, and I think maybe some of our council officers and I can identify a person calls our office and says X is happening. And it's it caused this accident, which then means you need to change the stop sign. But when you go back and look at the data, perhaps it wasn't what we perceived. And so, again, when I signed on to the item, because I am supportive of a ban, I did that with the caveat from my chief to yours that I want to craft something more comprehensive, because I don't know a lot about Vape. I don't know a lot about the industry. And I'd read conflicting reports that the CDC doesn't necessarily think that it's from FDA approved cartridges. And so what I don't want to do is punish and ban an industry that has not actually caused any deaths. And I think it's very inappropriate across the state for us to continue to blame people without the information. Specifically, do we believe there's correlation, perhaps? I don't know. But 80% related to THC? I think that there's a bigger issue at play that we need to address as well. And I'm not trying to bring my own item or step on your item. That's not my intent at all. I just also don't want at least a partner that's been in my district as a good vape shop. Not to mention there's a not so great vape shop on the border of my district in Lakewood that does sell to youth. I don't want to funnel kids there because that particular vape shop, which is going to be next to the new marijuana dispensary, is not a great partner and is not a part of the plan. And so for the hope that we could all work together to find a solution. I was hoping for that to be the case. So what I will state is I will be supportive today, but I hope that the Health Department can come back very quickly and find a way that we can also utilize this as a public health campaign. And I think that I see the news media here today, and I hope that you'll report this as a city who's really working hard to know the facts behind the deaths, to ensure that we are making the right bands so that we can protect our youth. Because every single person up here, including myself, is first and foremost looking at the health of our youth and ensuring that we're not pushing them from one thing to another. I'm not going to get into a whole nother conversation today, but like soda and then juices that have too much sugar. And it's a it's a it's a bigger item overall that we as a policy body get to discuss. And I was being very genuine to your request to have a genuine conversation. And when I heard from individuals who are much more knowledgeable about Vape than I am, I really feel like they were being genuine. When you bring forward a stack of ideas like that, I think to myself, being a police officer, what mechanisms do I have to get at youth to stop breaking the law? And I will tell you time and time again, it's their parents. It is getting their parents involved and collecting those IDs. You're not currently getting to the parents. How do we do that? What does that look like? How do we bring them in? Is there any kind of. Appropriate level of peer pressure that we can provide and how do we encourage that? I don't know what those answers are. We've only had ten days to discuss this item. It has been on a bigger level. I have watched the county supervisor meeting and other meetings throughout the region, but I just don't know that we can say that we aren't. We are still not banning non flavored THC. And so I'd like to amend the item to include banning dual and non flavored THC vape cartridges. If you'd like that friendly. No, I don't accept the friendly. Okay. So Councilmember Turanga. Okay. So we've gone. We'll circle what appears to be here. And just and this I had and we went from a temporary to a permanent. And I think we're back to temporary territory where we. Well, where I think we are is we have a motion on the floor to ban all flavored tobacco products and vape products, including the menthol flavor. 30 days to the audience would give 30 days to come into compliance with the ban. The ban would be temporary until further action by the City Council. And prior to bringing back the ordinance for Council's consideration, the Health Department would have a presentation to the City Council. Remember prices that you're understanding of the motion. Like. Before we go to a vote, I'd like to just a point of clarification as well. How long is this ban going to be in place? Until further action by the city council. Okay. So do we have any idea when. When we'll be able to? Because I want to. Yeah. I'd like to be able to understand that we're going to be forming a policy and that we will have a process where we're outreaching with the public. Um. Sure. So why don't we stakeholders? Why don't we include, as part of this motion that our health department can reach out to the vape? Yeah. Businesses in the city and start working on some education and outreach options similar to what we did with our cannabis industries. And then also, I know that many council members here are involved in researching what's going on around the country. But certainly if our health department could take the lead and if there's anything new that's discovered regarding health impacts or if there's any specific danger zones that were made aware of as a result of some of the research , I know that for the deaths are conducting a lot of autopsies and it's actually a big issue is the mechanism of the vape and how the product breaks down into the lungs. And so hopefully we can follow that research so that when the item comes back and perhaps health department can issue ATF to all of us, that talks about those outreach efforts and the updates in policy and health impacts that they're watching. This is a trend that I imagine our health department will be following closely. So I think I would defer to them to bring it back when they feel they have enough for us to move forward on something. Think that clarifies things a little bit better for me personally. Are you okay, Mr. City Attorney? Okay. Hearing that this collopy is okay. We didn't ask her. I don't know if that's feasible. Yes, of course. It will be. I mean, we have been tracking on it. We'll be able to provide the data and we'll we'll issue a two from four on the outreach plan with our folks at Timeline. Thank you. Thank you. And I'd also like to just encourage us to work with some of the community organizations that do education around this issue. I think all of us as council members can can really help reach our school age children and help our parents as well. With that members, please cast your vote. Ocean carry.