[speaker001:] do you have any personal feelings on on uh the subject
[speaker002:] well uh capital punishment's a hard thing but uh there've been several there've been several things that have happened where I felt like if I had been involved in it I would have had to to go along with with that being the punishment given to to the people
[speaker001:] um-hum um-hum
[speaker002:] there have been some things you know I mean there's things done that are just
[speaker001:] so outrageous I know I know
[speaker002:] yeah that I I don't know how I don't really think there's any other way to deal with it
[speaker001:] right well I I guess my concern is what we're reading especially in Texas right now with them letting out the people out of jail as soon as they're out of prison when they do and then having them go right back and the day they get out they're back in crime and and especially when they're assaulting people and then killing people I mean the man that killed those three sheriff
[speaker002:] yeah I think that that that that's a really
[speaker001:] deputies he is out free walking the street I have a real problem with that
[speaker002:] yeah if it's a if it it presents a clear and present danger I mean it
[speaker001:] I think so
[speaker002:] but it's something that's really hard to deal with the way that our justice system is right now is basically set up in lawyers and and anybody will tell you that uh it is set up right now all the laws protect the criminal they're the ones with the rights
[speaker001:] right right
[speaker002:] they have the right to uh you know I think I watched something last week um
[speaker001:] well
[speaker002:] that evict uh I'm sorry the accused has the right to a speedy trial but the victim does not have the right doesn't have the same
[speaker001:] doesn't have the right
[speaker002:] doesn't have the same the same uh emphasis on those things as far as they're concerned so now the accused can can ask for delays and extensions and what do they call whatever they call them you know
[speaker001:] right right right and meanwhile the witnesses move and die and and and and and they and there's no one to face them
[speaker002:] exactly uh-huh uh-huh exactly a continuance continuance they can get continuances on for years before a a thing ever comes to trial and that makes the victim suffer more
[speaker001:] right right well they can't get any if the judge is going to have any award to the victim it just puts off their collecting it
[speaker002:] the yeah that too
[speaker001:] it's it's really bad it uh I
[speaker002:] um I think that uh you know that there needs to be a way that you know once someone has gone through you know a trial a trial I don't know how to fix it I mean it just seems like there there should be a limit on how many appeals can be made you know when someone has been
[speaker001:] um-hum um-hum um-hum a a time limit too don't let it drag on for fifteen years
[speaker002:] has uh yeah when someone has well even when someone has been convicted and I mean it's just so so abundantly clear that they did it
[speaker001:] right
[speaker002:] that appealing you know and continuing to appeal like four or five or six times to have convictions overturned and then they have to be retried and all that it's such a waste of time and energy and money and it just that's what keeps that's what's keeping all the the you know the the criminals in a position of being able to be released all the time like this
[speaker001:] right uh do you feel like there's any certain type of crime that this should be the result this should be consequences of is capital punishment or or are are there some murders that committed that you think that leniency should be shown
[speaker002:] oh well I guess there's extenuating circumstances to anything like that um you know like I could I could see uh a first time offender being you know maybe in in a in a robbery situation trying to hold up a a store and getting scared and you know firing a gun and accidently killing someone okay I could see that that might be a situation where uh the person could be rehabilitated but I think just out and out murder and I'm talking about uh
[speaker001:] um-hum um-hum
[speaker002:] cutting people up
[speaker001:] okay
[speaker002:] you know where there's shown to be pathological tendencies where this person has done it over and over again in a serial fashion or whatever
[speaker001:] right
[speaker002:] that those kinds of things and any any kind of violent assault rape included
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] needs to be addressed in in in that context
[speaker001:] hm and and how do you feel about murders of law officers or fire people or something that are because they have had them they have had them killed when they've
[speaker002:] well that bothers me that that bothers me a great deal I had a friend who was a police officer who was killed in the line of duty
[speaker001:] um um um
[speaker002:] and the thing that was the worst about it is that these that uh two of these individuals were uh well all of the individuals involved were very young one was technically a minor and so he was sent back to Mexico he was an illegal alien the other two had lived here they had graduated from high school here and they had told their teachers that
[speaker001:] oh
[speaker002:] that I mean repeatedly uh during high school they had told their teachers that they were going to be that they were going to to graduate from high school and kill cops
[speaker001:] that was their goal oh
[speaker002:] that was what they had told their teachers and so that's what they did and uh they were they were given I think oh absolutely
[speaker001:] that would be premeditated  uh
[speaker002:] he stopped them for a routine traffic violation and they uh several several things happened that night but they they beat him up and took his gun and shot him
[speaker001:] they killed him um um um
[speaker002:] with it and it was it was really terrible I mean uh I'd seen him like three or days before that
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] we'd we've gone out uh with with he and his wife and that was really really disturbing
[speaker001:] uh-huh
[speaker002:] you know that that happened and that these people you know in the in the course of the trial you know came up with with all these you know things about well you know they were disadvantaged and all this stuff well nobody's that disadvantaged
[speaker001:] no well that's right there's no reason for murder no I do not care if you're poor or if you're rich or if you're ugly or if you're prejudice or uh what there that that's just beyond the
[speaker002:] and there's just no reason I mean no  yeah I think so too and that's uh so I I do I do feel strongly about
[speaker001:] I think this giving excuses is pretty prevalent uh uh you I work in the school district and the all these kids they've they've got an excuse for everything and I can see it continuing on when they're adults
[speaker002:] yeah
[speaker001:] I just it's just a a a bad habit uh uh kids have got to learn from the time they're real little there's no excuse for for being bad or making bad choices deliberately or anything it's
[speaker002:] yeah
[speaker001:] it's it's uh I I I sometimes think if if I were on a jury and and had to make the decision could I and I like to think I could if like you if if especially especially especially violent
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] crime where it's a serial type killer or where maybe a a child a child has been deliberately killed or
[speaker002:] the thing that even though juries sometimes make the decisions and still the people nothing ever happens to them
[speaker001:] right
[speaker002:] you know they stay in jail they get of f time for good behavior and stuff and they get released and they go right back and do it again
[speaker001:] uh-huh