[speaker001:] I've uh I've well I've had I used to have the opinion that there was that there really wasn't any more crime in America in the cities anyway than there was in previous centuries uh before uh simply because the reason there seems to be so much was the fact that the police now had advanced uh reporting methods with computers and other devices
[speaker002:] compile more statistics
[speaker001:] that's right and those statistics in turn got them bigger budgets
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] however I have been persuaded lately I guess simply by the uh overwhelming data that seems to be available that there is indeed a lot more violent crime
[speaker002:] more especially where you are you in Washington DC or Washington state
[speaker001:] well yeah no I am in I am in Washington D C
[speaker002:] yeah yeah I was going to say
[speaker001:] actually it you know I do a lot of business here and I come here quite often and and that again is a is a sort of media perception there's some absolutely lovely and marvelous and peaceful areas in Washington
[speaker002:] oh yeah
[speaker001:] regardless of the racial makeup but it's it's these real uh there's pockets of violence that is so violent that they uh
[speaker002:] it just really grabs your attention it just makes the whole place seem like that
[speaker001:] yeah right now just to focus on that a minute I guess uh um when um previous secretary of uh educate Bennett I think his name was became the drug czar uh for uh uh President Bush he was going to focus on it
[speaker002:] yeah
[speaker001:] on this area and do something about it and I see that even he was met without with with little success even though the entire I guess a a quite a bit of money and and other uh planning efforts went into that
[speaker002:] what do you what do you think is is causing all this because it seems that there there even though crime though though I think it is increasing in number it sure does seem to be increasing in intensity and violence too
[speaker001:] well yes well I uh I have three theories about it you know three things I have one theory and it's by two things one I I believe that this is a function of uh the violence that young people see on television and in the movies
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] and I am not just talking about you know uh role models of uh of tough guys and gangsters and things like that I'm I'm not even I'm not even convinced that maybe things like uh football hockey and the the and and you know the the and even baseball games now where the everything is settled with a fight you know the the immediate need to show some sort of violence to settle the uh the argument and and then I I am an advocate of hand gun control to some degree so I think that particularly I I was reading the other day about uh Corpus Christi Texas which has the highest I think it's Corpus Corpus Christi that had the highest rates per hand gun death in America
[speaker002:] hum
[speaker001:] uh per capita I mean the Saturday night special stuff so that that's what I think about it that's some of the things I think about it plus uh
[speaker002:] yeah I I haven't seen that but uh yeah
[speaker001:] I know what are your views
[speaker002:] well yeah I tend to agree with you with you know it seems anymore uh a movie can not be considered good unless there's just some some sort of violence or something in it and and along with that you know and then you start making a movie and
[speaker001:] yes
[speaker002:] it it has no there's no call for something violent but so they just throw something in there just to say they have it
[speaker001:] exactly well that's that's that's the impression I get yeah
[speaker002:] yeah
[speaker001:] and I and I imagine it's it you know it just feeds upon itself when when we have this sort of violence in society people want to it conditions people to it and uh you have to emphasize it has to be even uh magnified to attract people's attention I guess to have them spend money on something like that and I am sure that it does form role models for young for young men and young women and
[speaker002:] yeah you become callous yeah yeah
[speaker001:] uh I mean I I read now where where you know women are arrested young women are arrested fighting with knives over over whatever whatever reason which is kind of unheard of when I was young now I do not want to sound like an old fart but but that that's what it seems that those things happened before
[speaker002:] um
[speaker001:] it didn't happen in that manner before television and I I I I have to think that that it has some influence on it
[speaker002:] yeah I listening to a radio talk show today at lunch time uh Rush Limbaugh I do not know if you listen to him or not he's on AM but uh there there's a fellow that had called in and was
[speaker001:] but yeah no
[speaker002:] lamenting about the uh that there was a interview done on the assistant chief of police for Los Angeles the guy under Gates and they were just really coming down on him because of
[speaker001:] oh yes
[speaker002:] some of the things he was just some of the things that he believed in some of his morals for instance uh they asked him if he spanked his kids and he said you bet I believe in discipline and people I I I I guess they confuse confused discipline with punishment
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] you know and just it seems anymore that uh if if you have
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] you know this type of a moral stance that people come down on you it's like you know hey everybody has to be free to do their own thing and I disagree and I think that's really contributing to this high rate of crime
[speaker001:] yes yes well I mean I I guess so what I wanted to say and I stopped uh I do not know I got diverted was uh that uh there's so much there's so much of a return from prison to prison that the rehabilitation programs seem to be a failure and and that is not emphasized I recognize there's there's over crowding problems and and since we have decided to put everybody in jail that commits a crime now that that's complicated the entire process what I also think is that
[speaker002:] yeah
[speaker001:] I I guess it's the reflection of of the society where where we have so much more mobility and less attachment to uh you know it does not seem to be any responsibility to the community where you where you live or I do not mean responsibility attachment and responsibility I guess I mean any sort of
[speaker002:] well nobody feels responsibility to do something it's like oh boy I wish they would stop doing that yeah
[speaker001:] yes that's right that yeah I I do not know how that's I do not think it's done by uh the changes come simply by statutory nature I do not know what it really will take
[speaker002:] hum
[speaker001:] huh and I do not know if I have solutions except except to you know I am sort of a a an advocate of of uh of letting people of having free speech and I guess to curb uh television uh the violence on television and in the movies would be contrary to my beliefs in that however there does seem to be a right now in verbalizing it does seem to be a higher need for something of that sort
[speaker002:] yeah yeah and then how many
[speaker001:] and the sacrifice isn't that great
[speaker002:] how how many studies have to be done to show that there is a link between you know what you see and how you I mean what you see affects how you think and therefore what you do
[speaker001:] yeah yes yes I think I think that's correct
[speaker002:] and and yes but you know as soon as you start uh
[speaker001:] well Texas has uh Texas has uh has always struck me I mean I I I have lived in and out of Texas both in the service and and uh uh short business stints and it seems to me they are a pretty pretty tough law and order state but but yet that does not seem to have effected the amount of violent right in the state just citing that you know
[speaker002:] yeah uh unfortunately you man got a lot of the uh some well a lot of it can be contributed to the the the racial differences I mean just you know we are so close to the border with Mexico we've got a lot of that influence
[speaker001:] yeah yeah