[speaker002:] no you start
[speaker001:] okay what are the benefits well I I mean I don't even consider like salary a real benefit it just it's kind of a like a side thing I'm really here for you know working with lots of creative people is what I really like about my job um-hum
[speaker002:] well I think that I'm self-employed and work in radio and uh for me really I don't have to be terribly concerned about uh benefits outside because I own my own company but uh the worst problem that I think uh out here is affecting people and I think would be the most positive job benefit is job security these days
[speaker001:] that's true yeah yeah you don't you don't want to have worry about it you know if if you're worried you don't work as well
[speaker002:] yeah it's well it it's a real problem out here because uh you know it's hard to imagine that you know ten years ago I can remember where we really you know somebody would work for a local company here like Kodak or Xerox which are based here and uh they'd have that job for life and you really didn't have to worry too much about that but ever since this Reagan Bush thing
[speaker001:] I know
[speaker002:] every single time there's you know the the first thing they do is they fire employees whenever there's a problem with the uh uh economy economy and clear out the employees and we're losing more and more jobs and uh
[speaker001:] and it just gets worse then people don't don't spend any money
[speaker002:] yeah it's it's a real that's probably the biggest thing that I think people are looking for I uh put some things up in the Comp Dcom Telecom thing regularly about uh job security with the uh AT&T employees and
[speaker001:] right yeah I just I just noticed that yeah
[speaker002:] the Communication Workers of America and I'm watching as that progresses more and more and it seems to me that we're seeing a real problem with job security being the number one focus it's no longer a question of salary or or perks it it's just basic security to have that job
[speaker001:] yeah I know I know exactly how you feel but I I also don't know you know how how can we get people to change it I mean it it kind of it kind of requires you know a company taking a risk and they don't want to do that
[speaker002:] well I in  well I think maybe some incentives on the part of the government to retain employees uh versus downsizing really why we're seeing that kind of downsizing is because of the uh increasing power of shareholders in the corporations of the country
[speaker001:] that's true
[speaker002:] whenever there's a uh problem with uh the economy or the stock value you know the first thing the stockholders want to see is well decrease costs which means cut employees
[speaker001:] I know I mean our CEO is is you know quite frankly stated that you know we're we're here to make stockholders happy and that's not why I'm working here
[speaker002:] yeah California is really starting to feel the effects I think of the uh downturn
[speaker001:] oh definitely
[speaker002:] you know you guys have been pretty insulated uh for some of the past ones it it hasn't hit as bad as it has out in the northeast here Rochester's luckily is a technology moving city I mean we have a lot of telecommunications and the like out here but
[speaker001:] right
[speaker002:] Buffalo and Pittsburgh and cities around here that were into mechanical and engineering and things like that steel mills they're all gone they're all in Mexico now
[speaker001:] yeah we're we're just kind of like losing and it it just seems to be a snowball effect I mean you know we keep losing more
[speaker002:] well Cupertino seems to be one of the every single software company ever sees always sees Cupertino you know so you guys at least don't have those kinds of you know the only problem software seems to be still a US strength versus hardware
[speaker001:] right and it
[speaker002:] but you know the again in the future we're going to see the same type of thing even in more white collar work where we're going to have job security I think being the biggest focus
[speaker001:] yeah it's things things aren't that secure in software right now either I think it's it's kind of a cutthroat I'm also a I'm also a hardware manufacturer I'm at Apple so it's like you know we we notice our product just becoming a commodity and that's really bad
[speaker002:] well I heard Apple was remaking themselves into a consumer electronics company
[speaker001:] we're trying and if it works that's that'd be great for us but what about you know the rest of the industry
[speaker002:] yeah well the hardware you know HDTV if we can keep control of that that looks like something that we could have good strengths on and there would be a lot of new jobs created
[speaker001:] yeah although although we we go on that subject I I because I looked at HDTV uh but I I don't like standards that are on it's still still on a fixed resolution which means it'll be eventually outdated also
[speaker002:] um-hum well we I'm a home satellite dish owner and we have these arguments all the time about standards because of the video cipher of the scrambling system
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] in place and there's two separate arguments over whether we want should have an industry standard which many people can build equipment towards or whether we want to have a uh system where
[speaker001:] everybody's separate
[speaker002:] yeah it's it's a real serious serious problem in a situation of