[speaker001:] hello hi
[speaker002:] hello hi I'm Sally
[speaker001:] I'm Jerry Crow
[speaker002:] nice to meet you
[speaker001:] and I uh made a mistake I went ahead and punched one so we're on
[speaker002:] oh okay all righty
[speaker001:] okay the trial by jury
[speaker002:] yes
[speaker001:] uh my thinking on the uh uh unanimous decision I think they should only I think they ought to change that to only in death penalties that it be a unanimous unanimous I think in the others they ought to have
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] not a majority but say three fourths or something like that
[speaker002:] uh-huh uh-huh
[speaker001:] because too many times they get hung up
[speaker002:] yes and then there's a mistrial right
[speaker001:] and there's a mistrial
[speaker002:] uh-huh yeah I agree with that I really do I you know there're two kind sides to everything and and I you know I was I've never been on a jury I've been interviewed a couple of times but never got picked and um
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] I just really have mixed feelings about it because you know I I'm not sure that I'm for the death penalty and yet when I think if something happened to one of the members of my family if somebody you know killed them or brutally beat them or whatever I uh and killed them I I don't know that I would could be able to say that
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] so you know it's I have mixed feelings so if if I were to ever serve on a jury I would have to be honest about that I'm not sure that I could give somebody the death penalty
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] and and so I'm not you know I agree with you I think that uh that um a majority for uh you know a less severe case would be okay but I think for a death penalty it would be have to be everybody
[speaker001:] yeah and uh I'm not so sure that well a it would cost a lot more but I'm not so sure that life in life without parole is not the stiffer penalty penalty than the death penalty
[speaker002:] I agree uh-huh
[speaker001:] but
[speaker002:] I've always said that I you know I I think that would be the stiffer penalty but we have such a problem with over crowding right now that
[speaker001:] yeah yeah plus it uh it would cost the taxpayers quite a bit more money
[speaker002:] exactly exactly and and yet on the other hand you I feel so badly when I see people
[speaker001:] and uh
[speaker002:] when I read about people in the paper that have gotten out when they've raped somebody or beat somebody or aggravated assault or whatever and they're out in you know a few weeks or a month or
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] I think that's criminal because most most chances are they'll do it again but they have to let them out in order to make room for other people
[speaker001:] make room for others
[speaker002:] and if you they also mentioned about a judge you know doing the verdict well
[speaker001:] yep
[speaker002:] I had an experience with that because my I have a brother-in-law that was um did made a mistake and he uh was working as a financial planner planner and they the the company he was working for did a few things that was against the law and the Internal Revenue found you know found out and prosecuted them and he ended up going to jail and he's a wonderful man and the bottom line was that he was greedy he money and all that stuff but when when he went to jail I saw the the side that I had never seen before because we would go and visit him and the judge was the one that was not lenient with him he really throw threw the book at him even though he was he had so many character witnesses and so many people that that came forth for him and he was tough and so sometimes probably the judge might be a little bit more severe severe than the jury would
[speaker001:] yeah yeah I that's the problem I have with judge giving sentence
[speaker002:] because don't
[speaker001:] is that there's not consistency
[speaker002:] exactly
[speaker001:] uh it varies even from state to state and even within state
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] because I remember I was watching uh I think it was either Hard Copy or Current Affairs one of those programs last night
[speaker002:] uh-huh uh-huh uh-huh
[speaker001:] and this poor uh immigrant had bought some land and had cleared the land there was uh uh uh fill there people had use thrown old tires and junk and everything else in the land
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] and they prosecuted this guy and fined him like two hundred and fifty thousand dollars or something like that for disturbing water lands
[speaker002:] oh oh my word
[speaker001:] and he cleaned it up it was even cleaner than when he bought it
[speaker002:] isn't that awful
[speaker001:] and it's just you know ridiculous and uh
[speaker002:] yeah and you know I also feel like if a judge has has the last say I I don't care what job you're in you know what social service type job I'm a teacher after a while unless you really watch it you begin become hardened to people's problems and they don't quite mean as much to you you detached yourself from them and I think that might happen with judges too
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] I think that they they wouldn't be too lenient with certain people because they're they're so hardened to the fact that you know there's a reason why all this happened and they don't want to hear the story anymore they just want them to you know go to jail or be punished
[speaker001:] yeah yeah
[speaker002:] so I agree with you I'm not too sure I would like to have a judge be the sole you know delegate of uh of a a sentence
[speaker001:] right I just uh like you say I just I just hear too many cases of of somebody committing a small or a a minor crime and getting a much stiffer penalty penalty than someone else that commits a major crime and gets off lightly
[speaker002:] yeah and especially and I hate to say this but especially if he's a minority or she's a minority
[speaker001:] right right
[speaker002:] uh people have a tendency to automatically sentence people that are Black or or Mexican or any kind of an immigrant before they've even heard
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] and that's sad that oh sad commentary on our times but it happens
[speaker001:] and uh also they didn't say anything to talk about it but uh the rich people can hire the the uh top notch lawyers
[speaker002:] right
[speaker001:] and the poor folk is more or less at the court's mercy
[speaker002:] exactly and and the rich people get off the hook
[speaker001:] right
[speaker002:] it's really is sad but have you ever served on a trial on a jury
[speaker001:] but I guess I  madam ma'am
[speaker002:] have you ever served on a jury
[speaker001:] I've got uh I got a summons before but I never got selected I was like you I spent all day down at the courthouse sitting there
[speaker002:] yeah but didn't get selected
[speaker001:] and didn't get selected
[speaker002:] um-hum well I always thought that it would be real interesting but
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] one the one one of the ones that I was came down for was had to do with um drunken driving and um you know I don't think I could be partial in a case like that I just I just uh feel like that that you just shouldn't drink and drive and and I
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] I could not be lenient at all and they asked me a couple of questions and I think you know they came to the conclusion I couldn't you know I would I'd probably throw the book at a person that that harmed somebody drinking and driving so
[speaker001:] yeah yeah the only one I I got uh not selected but as a as a uh perspective jury member was uh a uh rear end collision
[speaker002:] row uh-huh
[speaker001:] and of course I guess there was probably thirty people or forty people there and they called them down
[speaker002:] uh-huh
[speaker001:] and they asked if anybody had been ever rear ended to hold their hand up and I had and uh I think they
[speaker002:] right away they
[speaker001:] right away they said well this guy won't give a uh
[speaker002:] yeah
[speaker001:] won't will be partial
[speaker002:] yeah I'm sure that's true I'm sure that's true well and it's the law is is very tricky and and we all come from different backgrounds and we come from different experiences and so we bring to that jury different perspectives which in a way is good because if we all thought the same way a person that was uh possibly innocent or possibly not as guilty as you know as as uh you might think would you know get the book thrown at them or whatever because we're all we all feel the same way but I know that I have some friends that have been on juries that have been deadlocked and it's no fun I mean because
[speaker001:] yeah yeah I wouldn't want to be sequestered sequestered for a week and be locked up in a hotel or a motel or hotel or whatever
[speaker002:] no that's right and especially hard on the people that are not along going along with the majority because the the other jurors get so angry because they want to go on with their life they want to get out of there
[speaker001:] right
[speaker002:] and if you don't truly believe what you think and stick to your guns it can be awful uncomfortable
[speaker001:] right
[speaker002:] so
[speaker001:] and uh I guess uh I'm fortunately in working for Texas Instruments should you get hung on a jury you do get get your normal pay yeah
[speaker002:] oh is that right oh that's good
[speaker001:] so uh
[speaker002:] yes same with I'm a teacher and and we do too
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] so which is great is great
[speaker001:] it would be hard on a person that uh if he did not get that pay to get locked up for two or three weeks on a hung jury and be out the time on the jury plus missing his pay check
[speaker002:] oh wouldn't that be awful yeah that would be terrible
[speaker001:] yeah but I guess I guess it's like like a lot of other things in in states uh it's not perfect but it's better than anything else is
[speaker002:] exactly yeah
[speaker001:] that's out there
[speaker002:] you're right you're right and we just kind of have to to go along with it and do the best job we can if we're called it is a duty a lot of people I know try to get out of jury duty when they're you know and I would never do that because I feel like hey we live in a country
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] where we have this you know privilege and I would never that's my duty to be as a citizen of the United States and if I got called I'd do it but some people don't feel that way
[speaker001:] right  yeah  yeah all you got to do is read in the paper every once in a while and see where somebody went down to Mexico and had a car accident and got thrown in jail and spent two or three years there
[speaker002:] oh gosh isn't that awful that'd be awful um yeah we're lucky to live in the United States there's no doubt about it
[speaker001:] yeah  yeah but uh
[speaker002:] but let's see I really don't have anything else to say about jury and
[speaker001:] I I believe I'm about uh exhausted my
[speaker002:] okay well it was good to talk to you all right
[speaker001:] okay you too and you have a good day bye-bye
[speaker002:] you too bye-bye