[speaker001:] I guess we are just to discuss trials and and punishment if it's to be given by the judge or not did you did you catch your explanation of that okay
[speaker002:] yes I did it's it's uh the uh the uh maybe I'm a hard liner but I think that there should be some preset penalties in criminal cases rather than uh degrees of sentencing
[speaker001:] you mean the crimes or the punishment should fit the crime
[speaker002:] right right uh again having participated in jury duty myself I know I know how such a diverse group of
[speaker001:] okay yes I did also
[speaker002:] people get together the different backgrounds different ideas that sometimes you can have one person or two that can hold up what I consider the proper sentencing of the person person
[speaker001:] right could you hang on one minute Jim thank you
[speaker002:] yes ma'am
[speaker001:] I am so sorry to keep you on hold are you at work okay I am too
[speaker002:] no problem yes yeah um I think what you have is the way the
[speaker001:] um
[speaker002:] the justice system works is they bend over backwards trying to protect the guilty so many things in their back pardon yes I know
[speaker001:] oh it's insane it's insane
[speaker002:] my wife participated in a jury trial several years back wherein the individual after it was over and they had came up with the maximum sentence
[speaker001:] yes yes
[speaker002:] in the jury form they found out that uh the gentleman involved had a long history of the same type offense which was theft of uh property
[speaker001:] right uh-huh oh yes
[speaker002:] and yet the district the attorney for the prosecution could not enter these uh the good man's background into it it was like this was a first time offender
[speaker001:] yes
[speaker002:] whereas uh I think that's those that should be in jail should be in jail
[speaker001:] it seems huh that's correct and there's too much leniency there's too much uh um underhanded uh things going on that the public are not aware of
[speaker002:] yeah
[speaker001:] and it seems as though we are uh giving the criminal the benefit more than the victim the victim has been victimized twice not only by the perpetrator of the crime but also the courts that try to do the justice
[speaker002:] well I think this is one of the reasons that also that attorneys have such a a unsavory reputation shall we say
[speaker001:] I do not have any I don't have an ounce in my body of credibility toward the the judicial system in the United States
[speaker002:] yeah well what you got is the situation wherein uh if you ever get in trouble you want to hire the smartest crookedest lawyer you can find
[speaker001:] isn't that terrible
[speaker002:] and uh that's not the idea it's the idea is not to get the guy off of the crime that he committed but to punish him for the crime he committed
[speaker001:] well to punish him for the crime but also to try and reeducate the man's thinking
[speaker002:] yeah
[speaker001:] to get him out of that uh uh criminal mind that he has and to direct him into a more productive life
[speaker002:] yeah well we have uh a situation again that I am familiar with where uh the son of an acquaintance of mine was killed while trying to stop a robbery
[speaker001:] um oh yes how sad
[speaker002:] and the person that killed him was a young woman who had left the house with full intent to commit crimes carrying a gun in her purse
[speaker001:] uh-huh
[speaker002:] and anyway it'd get to the she was sentenced to jail but then due to technicalities she was going to be out of jail within eighteen months after she was sentenced
[speaker001:] oh
[speaker002:] of course it took eighteen months for the thing the trial to happen so
[speaker001:] right
[speaker002:] then uh there was a letter writing campaign that went in and the parole board received approximately a thousand letters protesting putting this person back on the street within eighteen months after killing someone and uh fortunately it worked they uh eliminated they corrected the technicality and the person now will have to serve three to four years of the seven or eight they were sentenced to
[speaker001:] well if yes if enough of the public responded to uh the direct the uh parties that are involved and if enough they will listen to the voice of the people I have found that out that if enough people respond and rise up against the injustices being done something is going to change
[speaker002:] right
[speaker001:] people have to be involved
[speaker002:] this is it and most people don't take the time
[speaker001:] yeah that's right
[speaker002:] and again the only reason I took the time is because I was personally acquainted with these people I'm just as guilty as the rest in that respect
[speaker001:] that's right you were yes uh but and I'm not making an excuse but we our priorities are a bit backward
[speaker002:] oh yes well they again the and I'm not knocking the civil rights program or anything like that but we've gone overboard to uh protect persons from being having their civil rights violated to the point where the person that is damaged is not protected it's again the victim gets worse punishment then the person that commits the crimes
[speaker001:] that's correct yeah yeah
[speaker002:] yeah  okay I think we're both in agreement on this subject
[speaker001:] well I am too I mean I I just can't I you know I served on a jury for a lady that was having a mental problem and we found her not guilty because the lady obviously was not in their right mind so if the person is not in the right mind I mean they had to uh put her away
[speaker002:] yeah
[speaker001:] but for her own safety and for because she didn't know what she was doing and we couldn't we just dismissed the case you know and and she was uh taken care of by the proper
[speaker002:] yeah
[speaker001:] facility
[speaker002:] yeah well another side of the coin that with our justice system there are a lot of frivolous cases that go to court there are a lot of things that could be settled out of court
[speaker001:] yes that's true
[speaker002:] which uh or should never have gone to court and then the amazing thing of course is how uh some cases can come to trial in thirty days and others it takes eighteen months