[speaker001:] okay Pat can you tell me uh what actually they want what everyday occurrences are
[speaker002:] define everyday occurrences
[speaker001:] right or do you have
[speaker002:] every time you use a credit card every time you log in to a computer terminal particularly where you have access to a network to a network
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] anybody can with the right kind of skill and tools get very much involved in those things which are on your system that you don't particularly want exposed that's why we have such security measures for our corporate information yeah if you absolutely
[speaker001:] that's a point um um actually um uh using credit cards the information that the person that you give it to
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] has of uh available to them is very limited that's to just your name I guess um you don't have to tell where you live you don't have to put your phone number down some people uh ask you for it but you're not required to give that information
[speaker002:] that's right when was the last time that you used a credit card that they didn't ask for your driver's license as well
[speaker001:] oh very very few up here yeah yeah they just don't they don't ask for a driver's license um
[speaker002:] really um well most of our checks are even printed with our address our social even our driver's license numbers are printed on there
[speaker001:] yeah see my
[speaker002:] because they require that
[speaker001:] yeah my checks are it's just my wife
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] and my name no address
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] so it's just names on the check so no one can you know I mean they can I suppose with a little leg work if they wanted to
[speaker002:] um-hum um-hum
[speaker001:] but the average person's not going to do that anyhow
[speaker002:] right but we're talking about people who are interested in invading your privacy people who have a reason to do that
[speaker001:] okay
[speaker002:] people who are interested in building data bases of information about your financial background your educational background
[speaker001:] um
[speaker002:] uh one of the biggest fraud scams that I've heard of recently is people who have access to such information and they find out who's a widow and what she's worth and then they present themselves to her as a uh a rich suitor
[speaker001:] oh okay that's yeah I
[speaker002:] and bilk her out of anything that she has those are
[speaker001:] I've read articles about that but people have to be pretty gullible um either that or or especially widows um
[speaker002:] um-hum um-hum um-hum there are very vulnerable people though older people are very vulnerable to such things and they tend to to
[speaker001:] old people right right and and some people some of the older people today uh their husband's handled all the finances so now they find themselves left out in the cold and they're really really not savvy as far as it comes to finances to handling their own personal affairs
[speaker002:] um-hum uh well on the other hand how can you be savvy with so much out there today there are so many clever scams and and many of them are computer based and they're based on information that's available
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] in the public realm
[speaker001:] I'm I'm still not convinced that they can get you if you're if you're aware first of all you never should give your your uh credit card numbers over the phone to anyone
[speaker002:] um-hum that's right
[speaker001:] which is which is kind of basic
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] um they people may generate lists are if you subscribe to a magazine I guess they sell lists of names to other people but they'll send you junk mail usually
[speaker002:] um-hum um-hum that's right um-hum
[speaker001:] um and you can stop that easy enough just go to the post office and just have your name taken off
[speaker002:] um-hum did you have you registered for a conference recently
[speaker001:] uh yes I have
[speaker002:] okay did they ask for your fax number
[speaker001:] no they did not
[speaker002:] okay I registered my people for several conferences in the past six months and they'll ask for your telephone number and they'll also ask for a fax number you would think on the surface that that is for rapidly sending you confirmation of your registration or your hotel or something like that not at all those fax phone number lists are being sold in exactly the same way your street address numbers are sold and you now get solicitations brought over your fax
[speaker001:] right
[speaker002:] and you don't expect it from that source therefore you're not as uh
[speaker001:] yeah but that's uh
[speaker002:] you know you're not as leery
[speaker001:] isn't doesn't corporate have a didn't they put a stop on that
[speaker002:] uh some some cases but that it it exists is what I'm saying those avenues exist
[speaker001:] yeah right yes they do exist and if someone wants to really find out about you I suppose if they wanted to go to all that trouble they could
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] uh
[speaker002:] I heard a story not long ago this guy saw a really attractive young woman and he said hey I'd like to know this girl more so he wrote down her license plate number and he called a friend in motor vehicles and got her address and her telephone number and then he called a friend that he had in the credit bureau and he got her financial standing
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] okay from that he also got her social security number and certain social security information is uh a matter of is it is accessible if you know somebody in the government so before it was over with he knew that she was divorced she had two children what school they went to what her average income was he knew that she'd gotten a boat in the divorce because he was able to get those public records
[speaker001:] right
[speaker002:] he knew all about her
[speaker001:] yeah you could do that if you really wanted to
[speaker002:] and he introduced yeah he introduced himself to her he said I think our kids went to school together at such and such school she I don't really remember that
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] and I mean you know he was relying on her not remembering or
[speaker001:] right yeah
[speaker002:] or not being willing to admit that she didn't remember him and just moved right in on her
[speaker001:] yeah yeah that's and you can do that anyone can do anything that's public record whether it's divorce or anything like that um whether you purchase a home that's all that's all public record
[speaker002:] sure um-hum um-hum um-hum that's right
[speaker001:] um what they do with that information people are really um go out and do it I suppose somebody does the leg work and they generate a list
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] um uh it's uh I think lists are generated from lists now
[speaker002:] um-hum that's true I'm still getting lists from many many years ago
[speaker001:] and right
[speaker002:] or getting junk mail from a list that had to have been made years ago
[speaker001:] yeah we had uh we've got a an account at Sears Roebuck
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] and we had moved from one town to another town and they've got our address listed now with with double towns in it and I've trie d and tried and tried to get it off but you just can't get it so
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] since then we've gotten solicitations from other people listing both towns so I know damn well that Sears has sold their list of names out to somebody else
[speaker002:] um-hum of course
[speaker001:] but there isn't anything you can do about that
[speaker002:] no you can't stop them from selling your lists although some of them really are honorable organizations and they will say if you prefer us not to put your name on a mailing list then we will not
[speaker001:] right some of the some of the charities now will will do that if you chose choose not to have your your name
[speaker002:] um-hum um-hum
[speaker001:] put on a list and I I do that you know we have our charities that we give to and then we say yes no just don't
[speaker002:] um-hum um-hum
[speaker001:] because you do it and then you're on everybody's charity list
[speaker002:] um-hum and you have to really do some research or you do not find out who is legitimate and who is not and sometimes finding out who is legitimate and who is not is more difficult than finding out public information about people
[speaker001:] that's right that's exactly right uh most of the funds that a lot of these organizations collect
[speaker002:] um-hum um-hum
[speaker001:] go to fund the organization I mean very very
[speaker002:] absolutely
[speaker001:] little of the funds get out to do uh anything worthwhile
[speaker002:] that's right
[speaker001:] um it all started with the government the government started keeping tabs on you and whether they
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] those list that Internal Revenue has whether they leak out to the public or not I'm really not sure maybe in some cases they have in the past uh once a list is out it's out forever
[speaker002:] oh yeah you bet you bet and with computer technology now look how spooky it is for how accessible these things are
[speaker001:] yeah but the bulk of it probably ninety seven to ninety eight percent of all those lists are going just for solicitations um some people maybe are using them for ulterior motives I'm not really sure
[speaker002:] um-hum um-hum
[speaker001:] but the bulk of them is and it's junk mail and you can you can you can get off those junk mail lists you just tell the post office
[speaker002:] um-hum um-hum um-hum
[speaker001:] so that will limit that amount of stuff
[speaker002:] sure
[speaker001:] I read uh I read and article where this this man uh sent sent to everything they could possibly get and he was getting reams and reams of paper all kinds of periodicals and magazines and letters and notifications and what he was doing with them he was storing them up and he was using them for fuel
[speaker002:] um-hum um-hum way to go neat
[speaker001:] during the winter time
[speaker002:] that's great
[speaker001:] what I do is on all the credit card solicitations
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] if they have a return envelope with it I write across the face of it no thank you your rates are too high and I mail it back to them
[speaker002:] um-hum um-hum um-hum
[speaker001:] because now they have to pay the postage so now it's costing them something to do that
[speaker002:] yeah they don't put as many of those prepaid envelopes in there anymore
[speaker001:] they don't
[speaker002:] not as many as I've seen in the past
[speaker001:] oh up here they do well they're still doing it well it's just like up here we don't there's very very few times I've had to show my driver's license for to use a credit card
[speaker002:] um um-hum yeah
[speaker001:] uh and I'm not sure why you know why it's so prevalent down there and maybe it will catch up up here
[speaker002:] um that's possible I really don't understand that either but my stars some of it sometimes it's very difficult now the gasoline credit cards require your license plate number as opposed to your drivers license
[speaker001:] yeah we've got the
[speaker002:] although some of them have a blank on there for it they don't generally enforce using it
[speaker001:] we've got the ones you just stick your card in the pump
[speaker002:] um I've not seen one of those
[speaker001:] yeah so whatever you whatever brand that you buy you just drive up to the pump you put your credit card in it and then it says you know please commence pumping and then when you pump then when you're through
[speaker002:] um-hum um-hum
[speaker001:] you put the nozzle back and it says do you want a receipt and if you can push yes if you want one and if you don't want one you push no