[speaker002:] I'm ready okay
[speaker001:] you have an opinion about civil stuff
[speaker002:] well you know when to me when you're talking about juries there's there's two types of juries you've got the civil juries and then you've got the criminal juries now the criminal juries
[speaker001:] right
[speaker002:] my understanding of those where a person has done some crime and you're trying to determine that they need to go to jail or not and then if he does for how long the civil jury does it matter of
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] you owe me some money or you think that I owe you some money and we can't get it resolved so we go to the jury and we're ask we're gonna ask that jury to uh make a decision as to who owes who and for how much
[speaker001:] yes
[speaker002:] I'm sorry I have a problem with that
[speaker001:] oh I do too
[speaker002:] because first of all I'm a working person and I need to get paid for my day of work and if the our juries only pay us seven dollars and fifty cents for a full day of work I think it's wrong that two people have a dispute they had a little car wreck and maybe one owes the other guy five hundred dollars or a thousand dollars whatnot and they're going to call me away from work for seven dollars and fifty cents to make a decision as to who owes who and how much to me that is what we pay our judges to do
[speaker001:] okay you're you're you're self-employed so you're not
[speaker002:] I am self-employed that's right
[speaker001:] reimbursed by anyone
[speaker002:] I'm not going to be reimbursed by no one
[speaker001:] okay uh yeah that that's interesting point I I I'm not an enthusiast for juries particularly and I think especially in in civil cases I doubt doubt the effectiveness of it I hadn't thought about it from terms of the cost point of view to providing the jury I think we may be the only major country today that still uses juries in civil trials
[speaker002:] you know that one I've never heard of but that you may be right I was I wish I'd you know I've I've never heard that before
[speaker001:] I'm pretty sure Britain has has uh given up juries in civil cases
[speaker002:] but I mean isn't isn't that what we have the elected officials who supposedly is unbiased who can't aren't they supposed to have a head on their shoulders to make these decisions
[speaker001:] well probably judges would be the people you decision about whether to use juries or decision
[speaker002:] no decision as to whether or not as far as civil's concerned
[speaker001:] I mean I I I think it would be better to have them have judges trained professionals deciding such things
[speaker002:] true
[speaker001:] um I don't know there's any Constitutional way to do that other than to change the Constitution
[speaker002:] you're probably right but it that's still my as far as I'm concerned I just think it's wrong to use a jury for the civil matters now you can talk about criminal matters
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] uh I've got no problem with that one because you know here you're talking about uh has a person fit into society has he followed the rules of society I've I've got no problem at all with using your peers quote quote and helping to make decisions although we'd have problems as to who qualifies to be on that uh jury and I think some of the the manipulative rules that they use to say that all the rich and famous cannot be on a jury but all the poor dregs can be you know it doesn't it doesn't make sense
[speaker001:] uh no I don't think I guess different states have different rules on that
[speaker002:] well it it it what amount to if you're if you're rich if you got money
[speaker001:] I
[speaker002:] and your really high on society somehow another you're going come up with a one of these excuse that the the the judge gonna say yeah you're excused you don't have to be here but if you are some poor old uh blue collar worker who you know uh just trying to eke out a living and uh I work from eight to five and you know for some reason he's not gonna find an excuse to get out and so we typically find our juries made up of some of the dumbest people rather than the smarter people
[speaker001:] this is because because of not who initially comes in but who's selected out of the panel uh okay certainly both sides
[speaker002:] right
[speaker001:] pick criteria by which they wanna wanna judge juries and and uh veto lots of those and I suspect that uh well see likely to get off that way although it it'll vary
[speaker002:] true
[speaker001:] um I mean I guess traditionally juries are supposed to do findings of fact as opposed to findings of law and deciding
[speaker002:] but then they but then they also have to make the decision as to how long that person should serve
[speaker001:] well that that varies by state and locality as to whether the
[speaker002:] okay and and there most juries don't even know what the hell they even talking about
[speaker001:] uh there is a little basis for comparison
[speaker002:] and then when you get someone who says okay this person should be convicted for thirty years two years later they're on probation because the jury doesn't know and in in the state of Texas I don't think you are allowed uh the jury's not allowed to be told how soon that person would be off on probation only thing that they can do is determine how long they should be put in jail not knowing what the rest of the rule is which I think is unfair
[speaker001:] well I guess I feel much more comfortable with with judges either