[speaker001:] here we go okay um have you ever been involved in any trials
[speaker002:] I sure was Two years ago I spent some Fourth of July to Labor Day on a jury that was uh a change of venue from Columbus Ohio for aggravated uh murder and kidnapping
[speaker001:] wow
[speaker002:] yeah it was quite a session that disrupted disrupted my whole summer of course
[speaker001:] sounds like it
[speaker002:] five days a week but it was an absolutely fascinating experience
[speaker001:] oh it sounds like it I haven't had any actual real life experience but uh my father-in-law's been involved in uh several trials including uh a couple of murders and uh you know talking to other people who have been there and so I don't have any real experience with trials but I do you know I I've I took a little business law in in college and and I've you know try to keep abreast of things but uh
[speaker002:] uh-huh
[speaker001:] hm I think that the uh trial by jury is is a great idea at it's inception back two hundred years ago hm right now though it's it's so difficult because there's so few courts to to get anything really done as you know you spent you know a whole summer on one trial
[speaker002:] uh-huh
[speaker001:] and it's just that I think they're just tying up the um whole judicial process um there's a lot of things they could do to uh make things easier and uh you know like uh the suggestion that uh maybe the uh a judge should be the one who decides on what the sentence should be rather than the jury
[speaker002:] uh-huh well I think that there are many cases where uh the judges probably do make the decision rather than the jury Our situation was somewhat different uh in view of the fact that uh we haven't we were a landmark case it was the first time in the state of Ohio that um D N A testing was entered as evidence
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] and they were being the judge was being especially careful that everything was done correctly so there couldn't be a a mistrial of any kind uh the uh
[speaker001:] uh-huh
[speaker002:] uh the interesting thing was the tremendous selection of jury process uh that we experienced That took one full week uh to get forty three people qualified to sit on the jury And then it was a matter of the selection of uh twelve people after that actually it was fourteen because we had two alternates
[speaker001:] jeez
[speaker002:] and the judge was extremely concerned for our welfare if we were well if we were comfortable and uh things of that nature which made us feel good
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] uh and we were sequestered but the makeup of the jury uh was truly a cross section of uh you might say a cross section of a country there was one other person besides myself we were the only ones that had ever been to college hm one was a former student of mine a few years before who was out of work
[speaker001:] uh-huh
[speaker002:] uh two others were ones who had never finished high school and were out looking for jobs yet um a couple of them were housewives who had never worked and then some are people who did work
[speaker001:] gee
[speaker002:] so we had quite a cross section of black white and women and men
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] and uh it uh it was interesting just to listen to the rationale uh being proposed and the logic of some of the people uh it was also extremely difficult to stay awake sometimes because there was so many witnesses and we were not allowed to take any notes of any kind uh and I thought that that was a failing because uh from the standpoint that it was difficult to try to remember everything and and yet the judge said well um if you're taking notes you're missing something
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] and he was right there also but uh uh certainly um I think it depends upon how the judge handles the case
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] and if the criminal chooses to have a uh three panel judge uh a three judge panel I should say I think he can have that rather than trial by jury
[speaker001:] um-hum yes yes I agree uh would surprise me that uh when I was in Texas I had the uh displeasure of getting a uh traffic ticket
[speaker002:] uh-huh
[speaker001:] and um I went to court and you can even get a trial by jury for a traffic ticket
[speaker002:] you're kidding
[speaker001:] no and I thought my God talk about tying up things for for
[speaker002:] yes and money
[speaker001:] yes I mean that's extremely expensive I mean the first thing you had to do when you came before the judge was waive your right to a jury trial I'm like God this is ridiculous
[speaker002:] yeah yeah I do think that that uh I do think the jury system works but I'd I also feel as you said that the original concept of the jury as it was originally setup uh back uh in a hundred years ago was fine but that it needs to be more refined for today's standard of living and the the uh level of education of them of so many people now
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] uh by the same token we had um uh some people who wanted to had vacations planned and one man in particular had reservations made plane tickets made everything and the judge called and had it all canceled so he could get his money back and then he wasn't selected on the jury
[speaker001:] oh my God
[speaker002:] and then another young fellow had to meet with the judge and the prosecutor and the defense attorneys on three different occasions before he was finally excused from the jury because his wife was about to have twins and they had he had to go through all of that if in three days to get excused from that jury to be with his wife on the birth of the twins and uh you know some of it just seemed rather extreme
[speaker001:] yes I I think they can probably come up with some ways to insure that uh you know people would get a fair trial and not have to go through this process
[speaker002:] yes right
[speaker001:] I mean some things are just so cut and dry um in the in you know the the level of evidence that they come up with now I mean you know when you start thinking about well they've got videotape and
[speaker002:] uh-huh
[speaker001:] and audio tapes and they've they've got you know they've got ways to nail people to the point where they they really shouldn't even be going to trial
[speaker002:] right well I guess he'd have to be careful whether with entrapment or some of those things
[speaker001:] yes
[speaker002:] but uh I don't I assume you have seen on television recently as probably the whole country has the beating of the man in Los Angeles
[speaker001:] that was horrible
[speaker002:] isn't that terrible And uh you know and that certainly uh cannot be said to be uh something that happens everywhere
[speaker001:] that it
[speaker002:] but the fact that it can happen that it probably does happen in many places it's it's horrendous and it's just a stroke of luck that someone was able to get it on tape and then uh to listen to the tape recording uh at the police station of the whole conversation afterwards
[speaker001:] yeah yes I know I mean I only heard portions of that but it's absolutely terrible and you know if you beat a dog like that they'll put you in jail
[speaker002:] yeah absolutely well we just had a case uh
[speaker001:] you know
[speaker002:] like up at the end of last year where one police officer it was on a drug raid uh was trying to extra extricate um a confession or information from a drug dealer and did so by placing a hot a hot iron on his chest his bare chest burned him
[speaker001:] jeez
[speaker002:] they wound up paying him uh the officer of course was fired but they paid the defendant uh three hundred thousand dollars or something to drop the lawsuit and then last week someone shot and killed the former policeman so uh as some of those things uh are absolutely horrendous and we do need an all an overhaul and we just need more discipline country wide it would then we'd need it on that yeah
[speaker001:] uh yes I I believe that too
[speaker002:] well it's been very nice talking with you
[speaker001:] well it's been nice talking with you
[speaker002:] yes and uh good luck on on some other calls
[speaker001:] okay thank you you do the same bye-bye
[speaker002:] uh-huh bye-bye