[speaker001:] well how do you feel about trial by jury
[speaker002:] I feel very uncomfortable with trials by juries recently uh
[speaker001:] in what way
[speaker002:] in that it seems to me they're swayed more by emotion than uh by evidence that's presented I have uh very little regard for the law that's presently practiced
[speaker001:] I mean do you do you feel they're they're swayed more toward are you talking about with criminal or civil suits
[speaker002:] I was thinking primarily criminal cases
[speaker001:] um-hum so you think that I mean that the stereotypical bleeding heart juries where they feel sorry
[speaker002:] yes um-hum that's a concern of mine uh I would feel more comfortable in many cases I think with judges uh you know doing the sentencing
[speaker001:] um-hum the other thing the other thing that really bothers me about that is I think you know that a judge can be uh I like the idea of juries of your peers um in that
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] you you you you you get more first of all you get more than one person making the decision making a decision and second of all you get a wide variety of background so that
[speaker002:] yeah my question I guess is are they really your peers
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] uh
[speaker001:] I'd agree that that's that's definitely a problem
[speaker002:] uh too often I think they're not and uh when you you when you are
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] selecting a jury and you're doing it partially if if not entirely on the basis of which color representation you have
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] you know that's a matter of concern to me too uh I think that uh in such cases uh they're not really looking for unbiased people but rather for biased
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] uh now I happen to know several judges and there's one that I'd feel uncomfortable but has doing sentencing without the jury I'd feel a little bit uneasy about but the other two I feel uh would give either
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] you know the the plaintiff or the defendant the the full benefit of the law
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] and I guess that's what I am concerned with
[speaker001:] yeah I I guess I I definitely agree with you but sentencing the well what I don't like about uh sentencing juries doing the sentencing in that
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] I think it becomes a lot less the the the the same crime gets unequal sentences
[speaker002:] this is very true
[speaker001:] I uh I I think there is more of an ability of you know you know selecting selecting selecting a jury two two different juries that would most of the time come up with the same idea the same idea versus you know whether he is guilty or innocent
[speaker002:] um-hum um-hum
[speaker001:] but I think I think that there'd that there'd be a large variation in in trying to gauge the the severity of the crime and an appropriate punishment and and have that that measure stick across the board
[speaker002:] yeah and you do see such uneven uneven sentencing uh you know evidence of it in the newspapers and such I mean
[speaker001:] um-hum um-hum
[speaker002:] where uh it would appear that the crimes were very similar but one individual got twenty five years and the other one was sentenced to life for something
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] uh
[speaker001:] of course a lot of that's also the the ability of of the defendant to uh get a good lawyer
[speaker002:] isn't that the truth
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] there are times when is it uh oh goodness my mind's gone blank it uh Othello you know where he says kill all the lawyers every now and then one is tempted to feel that way
[speaker001:] um-hum yeah I agree
[speaker002:] but I it's taken me a long time to understand that uh lawyers are concerned with the law and not with justice as we think of
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] you know amateur as novices tend to think that uh attorneys care about justice
[speaker001:] um-hum oh yeah I I agree with it yeah they and they'll admit to you that they cannot don't have the benefit of being able to you know of of of letting allowing themselves to believe their client client innocent or guilty it's more of the game plan of how do they convince the judge or jury
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] through argument that the
[speaker002:] and they're very effective too uh even I've been involved slightly slightly in a case where I know the person is guilty but uh his attorneys gotten him off
[speaker001:] um-hum um-hum um-hum
[speaker002:] uh the city has dropped their charges against him because their the attorney has presented enough evidence of doubt to convince the judge so I don't know
[speaker001:] yeah uh yeah this is a little bit of the subject but one one thing that I that I really dislike uh also that's that's new is the uh is that I have heard that there are federal sentences