[speaker001:] Well, this is a good subject, isn't it?
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] [Clicking] It's, it's something that you can really talk about.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Um, I don't know what we're going to do about it, but,
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] but it's certainly something that has a lot of things to talk about. Um, you know, when they say the Middle East,
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] it's such a big area and there's so many different problems there. Uh, what do you want to concentrate on.
[speaker002:] It doesn't matter to me.
[speaker001:] Well, uh, I'll tell you something, um, I, I have a sister-in-law from Israel,
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] and, and they're really quite, uh, arrogant about it all. They, they believe that they, they belong there and they've belonged there forever, and, the Palestinians and the Arabs are, uh, more or less, they, they consider them second class.
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] So, they're really quite arrogant about it. I don't, uh, I don't know if that contributes to the problem.
[speaker002:] Well how did they feel about the, uh, the United States interven-, intervening [barking] with Patriot missiles, did, did they,
[speaker001:] Oh, uh, I'm, I'm sure this is the one time that the Israelis are really happy to have their big brothers, the Americans,
[speaker002:] Uh-huh [barking].
[speaker001:] but, I didn't really talk about that with her. She, um, um, my sister-in-law now lives in, um, Switzerland.
[speaker002:] Oh.
[speaker001:] But, um, when they were living in Israel, it was, it was, the, the Palestinians, they, they come in an, and they're, they're nothing but really servants for them, and they really treat them like second class citizens. They, they don't really want them around but they like them around because they do all the menial labor and such.
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] But they, they really do, they look down on them. And, I don't know, being, I, I live in, uh, Vermont and being up here we pretty much treat everybody, you know, as someone that has merit, even if they're poor, or if they're Hispanic or if they're black. We give everybody pretty much the benefit of a doubt because we don't see all the crime and, all the hurt in the big cities, you know.
[speaker002:] [Barking] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] I-, if I lived in Washington, D C I think I'd have a different attitude about Black people because I've heard that it, it, the, they're terrible, you know, it's just like it's a dog eat dog world. And here, you know, all, all my black friends are professionals and they're, they don't, you know, they don't go out and abuse drugs and they, they send their kids to school and they, they, they uh, you know really encourage them to go to college and stuff.
[speaker002:] [Barking] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] So it's just a different world.
[speaker002:] Well I live in San Antonio and fifty percent of the population is minority.
[speaker001:] Oh, um, I talked to someone about San Antonio,
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] and, um, they said that they, they have, you have quite the problem with, uh, the ghettos, I don't know, do they call it the barrio down there.
[speaker002:] That's the barrios but i-, it's, it's I don't think it's any different of a problem than any other major city. It's just Hispanics here instead of Blacks.
[speaker001:] Yeah, but I heard that sa-, San Antonio, unlike like, like a city like San Diego it se-, it just has a really bad problem.
[speaker002:] I grew up outside of Houston and I don't think, uh, as far as gang violence and things, I don't think it's any worse here than in Houston.
[speaker001:] Yeah, like say Houston. Now I would, now me not even knowing anything about Houston, I would think that it's a pretty calm city.
[speaker002:] Houston is not at all.
[speaker001:] No, huh, there's a lot of crime?
[speaker002:] Yes there's quite a bit of crime.
[speaker001:] Oh, my, um, yeah, like I, wer-, we're so protected up here, it's, it's really strange. I mean our red light district, I mean, uh, you could go walking around down there and pretty much not fear for your life, you know,
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] and we're just so protected. But, it's, it's, over in the Mid East, especially Israel, it's just like Israelis have a like a totalitarian system, when it comes to the Palestinians. You know, the Israelis can do anything they want but when it comes to Palestinians, if they're out in the street at night, it's, it's really looked on as odd. Um, usually they're, they're bussed in to the, the, um, Jewish neighborhoods, and the Jewish cities and then at night they're bussed out to the occupied territories.
[speaker002:] Huh.
[speaker001:] So they don't have that. But, uh, what do you think about the mess that's, we've created in Iraq?
[speaker002:] I think it's unfortunate, uh, as far as the Kurds are concerned, it, [pause] I thi-,
[speaker001:] It's just what do you do for them, you want to do something for them, but you don't want to get so directly involved that you're occupying the, the country.
[speaker002:] Yeah, yeah, we can't get involved in their civil war, um, unfortunately, but we've kind of driven these people out.
[speaker001:] To do it, yeah, but you see President Bush is telling them rebel, you know, uh, uprise. And that's what they did and now they're like asking him for help and he's like, no we can't get involved. What my husband had very strong feelings, he, uh, agreed with, um, the General Schwartzkopf, he said, um, he should have let, Bush should have let him finish his job.
[speaker002:] Sure.
[speaker001:] He should, he should have let them, um, corner the Republican Guards,
[speaker002:] Well I think the war ended too soon.
[speaker001:] Yeah, exactly, that's what everyone says.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] E-, everyone I talk to, they says, you know, it's real easy to say that.
[speaker002:] We, we didn't damage enough of their arsenal. We damaged most of it but we, we should have gotten, made sure we got everything.
[speaker001:] Yeah, I don't think the higher ups were thinking about wh-, what this guy's going to do with the rest of his war machine. They're going, oh, well it's not going to hurt us so we're just going to let them go, but really we didn't think about the people that he was going, tr-, and I mean, he, he's just,
[speaker002:] Unfortunately though, the, the original goal of the mission was to drive them out of Kuwait. And once that was accomplished [pause] it,
[speaker001:] They, yeah, they, they did, they stuck right to their goals,
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] and right, what they were going to say. And the American people, when this first started, they were even reluctant to let them do that.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] So they were, they were playing it very safe, but, you know, it, an ounce what do they say, an ounce of hind sight is worth, whatever.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Th-, they, I don't know, they, it, Schwartz-, Schwartzkopf knew what had to be done and it's too bad that he just didn't have the ability just to do it, to you know, the, uh, the go ahead to do it.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Because he had the fu-, he knew what was going to happen, more than any of us. Because I didn't realize that, um, *slash error: utt3 and 4 as one it was going to make such a mess. I mean I feel really sorry for these people, these people are middle class people, just like us. Can you imagine if someone started bombing your neighborhood,
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] and you knew this, these people are going to come and if you were in your house they were going to take you and beat you. Of course, you're going, just going pick everything up that you can carry and you're going to run.
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] And it, it's just too bad that we couldn't see that.
[speaker002:] I just have a feeling that the military involvement isn't over yet. That I, I still feel like there's more to come. I don't think this whole issue is settled as far as we're concerned.
[speaker001:] Well you know what I was hoping? I was hoping Iran was going to take a very, um, dramatic stand and invade, you know, and then like Iran's the big bad guy, you know, but, really, if, if they were going to save people's lives,
[speaker002:] They've got sixty or so of Iraq's planes.
[speaker001:] Yeah, I know, it's like they were using them as friends when we were having the conflict but, I, I, you know, I almost swear, I'm kind of disappointed with the Iranians, why they didn't go save, I mean, I don't know if the Kurdish, I know the Shiites are their people.
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] But, I don't know, I think they have a bond with the, the Kurds.
[speaker002:] There are some Kurds living in Iran.
[speaker001:] Yeah, I, I think they should have just done more, uh, and maybe if the world could have given them some type of aid. It's, it's just so complicated.
[speaker002:] I was real surprised that Israel stayed out of it as, as much as they did.
[speaker001:] Oh, yeah, well, you, knowing them, they're very, um, oh, I don't know, almost compare them to a very egotistical man.
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] You're damn right, I'm going to protect my family, you know, so, I, I was amazed too. I was really, I was really, um, proud of them, though, that they stayed out of it. But,
[speaker002:] Yeah, it and from, from what I can tell if they had gotten into it, it would have started a whole new war.
[speaker001:] Oh yeah, I was, I that part scared me. That, that, um, the Egyptians would pull out and I just saw atomic bomb,