[speaker001:] Well, we, uh, taxes, everyone thinks taxes are too high I'm sure. But, uh, I think we do get quite a good value for the tax dollars we spend in most cases. What do you think?
[speaker002:] Uh, yeah, I, I think so. I, I'm, uh, I think I'm, I think I'm, uh, a little out of the ordinary in that, that I, I, uh, I think I'm more worried about the deficit, the national deficit than, than, uh, a lot of other people are and think that we need to, we need to either raise our taxes or, or cutback on something and I don't know what to cutback on to,
[speaker001:] [LAUGHTER] At this stage it's hard, to tell.
[speaker002:] to get, to get that, to get that settled. And, and, uh,
[speaker001:] [Throat clearing].
[speaker002:] and, uh, I know I'm a real, a real, uh, out of it in terms of taxes so I'm no-, I'm, uh, think that the, we really ought to seriously consider what an income tax might do that, uh, for Texas and, and,
[speaker001:] Well, at this stage I think we've taxed property almost to the limit because,
[speaker002:] Yeah. I think so.
[speaker001:] like the, the property taxes on the homes have reached the point that it's precluding people from being able to own a home because of the cost of the taxes on them.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] I know I live in Richardson
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] and it's up over two thousand dollars a year for taxes on my house.
[speaker002:] Yeah, yeah.
[speaker001:] But now we're getting public services, the schools, the hospitals and if it weren't for the taxes we're putting in there, uh, look what the schools could cost you.
[speaker002:] Yeah, yeah. Yeah, now I'm, uh, uh, oh, I, we'd, when we moved to R-, Richardson, one of the reasons we chose it was for the, uh, for the schools. And, and realizing that that, that, that quality of schools might well have higher taxes than other places but that we were willing to, uh, to go for that,
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] because we supported the,
[speaker001:] Then again the, the community college system here is excellent for the dollar spent, and the public,
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] colleges also, the tuition has got to be among the lowest in the country. Uh,
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] one of the, uh, I believe, I don't know which one it is, uh, down there whether it's Hobby or, uh, [lipsmack] the other ex-governor down there that are proposing doubling the tuition. Well if you double the tuition, it would still be considerably less than the public school tuition in most other states.
[speaker002:] Yeah, I think that's right.
[speaker001:] Yeah. That would provide, uh, possibly some relief there to utilize some of the property taxes for other things, see.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] The so-called sin taxes on liquor and the cigarettes and such as that generate a considerable amount, but I p-, eventually I think you may tax people out of smoking even.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER].
[speaker001:] [LAUGHTER].
[speaker002:] [Noise] I, I don't, I don't know about that, I, [LAUGHTER] I,
[speaker001:] Yeah [LAUGHTER]. Well, I quit ten years ago so [LAUGHTER] I,
[speaker002:] I see. Okay. No, uh,
[speaker001:] I couldn't afford to start again [LAUGHTER].
[speaker002:] Yeah, well, that, that, that would be true. That would be true. But,
[speaker001:] I know, uh, my children would give up eating before they gave up their cigarettes I think.
[speaker002:] Huh.
[speaker001:] But all the various taxing authorities that come through, I think the one tax I resent the most though is the additional sales tax for DART which is probably never going to be in existence in my lifetime.
[speaker002:] Yeah, and, and even if it is, isn't going to, uh, uh, provide you with any, any services in that it's not doing to provide a route from your, your home to a business, for instance, you know.
[speaker001:] Well, this, this is a thing I think it's like, uh, back east. You had to start your public transportation when you started your cities. You can't come in afterward and really be successful or economical at it. If we had been like a Chicago or a New York City or Philadelphia or someone like that,
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] and had a public transportation system starting in the horse and buggy days
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] and when land was cheap and, uh, construction costs were cheap, you could afford it. But now,
[speaker002:] And,
[speaker001:] digging tunnels under Central Expressway and things like that becomes cost prohibitive.
[speaker002:] Yeah, and the other thing is that when it, when it's, the public transportation is established that early on then, then the business, uh, business and residential patterns develop to take advantage of that.
[speaker001:] Absolutely.
[speaker002:] Whereas in, in, uh, in Dallas here we've, we've got, uh, those patterns were well established before, before we really tried to, tried to do the DART. And, uh, for instance all the, all the, the, uh, office buildings and stuff that are out here in, in, uh, north Dallas as opposed to downtown, uh, to try to, to try to provide efficient transportation from everywhere around the, the metroplex to, to, uh, both those centers of, of business plus everything else that's scattered around here and there as opposed to having a concentrated business area.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] You know, like New York does, yeah.
[speaker001:] Yeah, just take like in Chicago where the people depend on the public transportation system to get them everywhere.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] New York and some,
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] people don't even own a car and know how to drive a car.
[speaker002:] Right, right.
[speaker001:] Someone made the analogy, uh, with Texans as being like the old cowboys and their horse. An old cowboy would jump on his horse to go across the street. Well, most Texans will jump in their car to drive across the street.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] And I'm just as guilty as anyone else.
[speaker002:] Oh, yeah. Yeah.
[speaker001:] I drive to work every day by myself, uh, without even, even any thought of car pooling.
[speaker002:] Yeah, right.
[speaker001:] [Very faint] And, uh, most people are that way.
[speaker002:] Yep.
[speaker001:] Because they're used to not having public transportation.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] So, but I,
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] here again I think I resented where they were collecting the sales tax for five years before they turned a spade of dirt.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] So and doing all these studies and the things we saw about them traveling to San Francisco to see whether they wanted ten foot wide or twelve foot wide cars or something.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER].
[speaker001:] [LAUGHTER] I felt that was a little, uh, wasteful use of the tax dollars that we were paying, you know.
[speaker002:] A little bit much. Oh, yeah. Yep. Yep. Oh, the c-,
[speaker001:] Well, that's about all I can say at this time.
[speaker002:] Yeah, I th-, I think so, I think that will probably do it, so.
[speaker001:] Okay, it's been real nice talking with you.
[speaker002:] Good enough.
[speaker001:] Bye.
[speaker002:] Bye.