[speaker001:] okay I think the first thing they said I've written this down so it would is it possible do you think it's possible to have honesty in government or an honest government
[speaker002:] okay you're asking what my opinion about whether it's possible to have honesty in government well I suspect that it is possible uh I think it probably
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] is more likely if you have a small government unit where everybody knows everybody
[speaker001:] right that's a good point
[speaker002:] but um other than that I think maybe it just depends on how you define honesty
[speaker001:] that's an interesting yeah that's interesting I had read something one time and it was just applying to governments in general it was written many years ago it said that is impossible to have a completely honest system of government because people who choose government for their positions are power seekers and I thought that was interesting it wasn't just talking about our government it was just government in general from times past you know on and
[speaker002:] um-hum so they're saying that government officials would tend to be power seekers but
[speaker001:] right and that would be a next question to ask how many do you think are in there for public for but because they wanna be of service to us or are they in there for their own gains and personally I feel it's probably there's probably some of each
[speaker002:] right yeah but I think maybe a lot of them um say the more honest ones who are still looking out for themselves it may be more a matter of not what can I steal while I'm in office but how many friends can I make while I'm in office and you know how good a name can I make for myself and so forth
[speaker001:] um-hum yeah
[speaker002:] so I guess it would be like anything else the president of General Motors probably has the same
[speaker001:] yeah oh yeah and they talked uh the other let's see third question was how much how much self-serving for their own gains do you think goes on then they that's hard to answer I'm sure there's a lot but I agree with you there's a lot in business I think that's just I think that's very normal
[speaker002:] I think I'm
[speaker001:] that we should not expect I mean I think we put too much on politicians we expect them to only be there to serve us you know
[speaker002:] I think a little more honesty in campaigns would be more to the point if you knew what you were getting when you voted uh yeah
[speaker001:] yeah  that's a problem isn't it it's interesting because I'm taking a Texas government class right now and one of the things I always realize it's so easy to blame them to blame a lot of times I think it's our own fault they lie to us because we don't wanna hear the truth and if
[speaker002:] yeah they say you get the government you deserve
[speaker001:] if they tell us the truth we don't elect them and
[speaker002:] um-hum
[speaker001:] especially with all this front cover stuff coming up here lately about people's past and I don't know why anybody would wanna get under that scrutiny anymore
[speaker002:] it's hard to imagine
[speaker001:] because it's I think it's gotten just careless well we're not talking about issues we're talking about somebody's personal life and and we're getting away from what we ought to be looking at
[speaker002:] yeah and it almost seems like in order to avoid uh some of this scandal you would have to have the kind of life that you would only find in a say in the Bobsy Twins or something like that
[speaker001:] right you know I also think it'd be funny if we could know know everything about the people that were in there and threw them out I don't think there would be too many left you know
[speaker002:] so you're taking a government course at what at the university
[speaker001:] um-hum uh at uh it's TCJC Texas Tarrant County Junior College yeah and it's really it's really enjoyable I like it
[speaker002:] oh okay
[speaker001:] and they also you know ask can we eliminate do you think we could make laws to eliminate all corruption and I don't think we can make laws to eliminate anything anyplace totally
[speaker002:] you can make laws against corruption but that doesn't eliminate it does it
[speaker001:] yeah but that doesn't mean I don't think making laws will stop it I mean I don't know how many laws you'd have to have I mean you know
[speaker002:] well they've got laws against cannibalism cannibalism but that didn't stop that guy in Milwaukee did it
[speaker001:] no sure didn't did it so no I think you can legislate but I think there's no way that you'd eliminated all by legislating and we'd end up with so many more laws that you know I mean I just think that's human nature that you're gonna have corruption in government in business personal life I mean you know
[speaker002:] actually I think other countries may have it worse uh the Japanese government is always having a some kind of a scandal usually involving the Prime Minister or people very close to him it's so uh
[speaker001:] right yeah yeah I still believe I get very fed up with government sometimes but when I think about where I'd wanna go you know this is still the best or I can
[speaker002:] yeah I've been around to a few other countries and I uh I I have not found one yet that I would rather live in I think uh
[speaker001:] yeah yeah at it's worst I think we've got the best