[speaker001:] Hi, what do you do with your credit cards?
[speaker002:] Oh [LAUGHTER].
[speaker001:] [LAUGHTER].
[speaker002:] Well, my husband and I have gotten into some, some problems with credit cards. We don't handle them very well [LAUGHTER].
[speaker001:] [LAUGHTER].
[speaker002:] We, we tend to run them up to the maximum and then ask for more.
[speaker001:] Oh, jeez.
[speaker002:] They, they're, they're really bad for us. Um, matter of fact, we've gotten rid of all of our credit cards except for a MasterCard and a Visa,
[speaker001:] [LAUGHTER].
[speaker002:] and we pretty much keep those maxed out.
[speaker001:] Oh, I was going to say that, that sounds like, like pretty many. But I see what you meant, you had them for each of the individual stores.
[speaker002:] Yeah, we had cre-, I had probably twenty credit cards
[speaker001:] Uh-huh, uh-huh.
[speaker002:] for, I had, I had an American Express, American Express Gold, an Optima, all the different department stores, um, two Visas, two MasterCards [LAUGHTER].
[speaker001:] Oh, gee.
[speaker002:] I mean, I had, any time anybody would, you know, send me an application, you know, preapproved or whatever, I went, I took it, and it really ended up getting us in some real serious trouble.
[speaker001:] Oh, sure.
[speaker002:] Um, because, see, the more credit cards you have, the more people offer them to you.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh, uh-huh.
[speaker002:] And the more you use them, the more they send them to you.
[speaker001:] But each of these had an annual fee also, right.
[speaker002:] Exactly. The American Express was probably the worst, um, because with the Gold card, I can't remember how much it was because I didn't even have it very long before I gave it up
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] but I know the Green card was like thirty-five, forty- five dollars a year.
[speaker001:] Yeah, forty five. Right, uh, [LAUGHTER] I,
[speaker002:] Which was a lot, because I mean, you had to pay it in full every month.
[speaker001:] Exactly, you know, I, that's it, I really resented the fact that they were charging me for cards, so I sent back all of mine, except the ones that were free.
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] And, um, then, then I also limited it to one of each, one MasterCard and one Visa, and here, most of the stores will accept those, and actually I then got a Discover card since they pay you back.
[speaker002:] Uh-huh, yeah, I had a Discover, and that was one of the ones in the group that I ended up, um, closing. Um, it really wasn't my choice, though. I mean, I ended up having, I ended up actually losing my credit cards.
[speaker001:] Oh.
[speaker002:] Um, I ended up going through a credit counseling service
[speaker001:] Uh-huh, uh-huh.
[speaker002:] um, because my husband and I just don't handle credit very well
[speaker001:] Uh-huh, yeah.
[speaker002:] and, um, when, when you do that, they automatically, once you start with their service, they close your accounts out.
[speaker001:] Oh, I see.
[speaker002:] So, I'm still paying on all these accounts, but my accounts are closed.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] So, and I would prefer to keep it that way. Once we, once we're paid off
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] um, I would prefer just to have one MasterCard and one Visa and that's it.
[speaker001:] Yeah, yeah. Actually I pay off my cards every month. Only once in my life have I not paid.
[speaker002:] I think that's a really good way to handle it, because that way, if you, if you paid off every month, you never have to worry about, well, how much do I have to pay these guys, you know, this month, you know. This, you buy what you can afford. I mean
[speaker001:] Right.
[speaker002:] if you handle it just like you would like a check or cash
[speaker001:] Uh-huh, uh-huh.
[speaker002:] it's a lot easier to keep it in check.
[speaker001:] Well, and also in a sense, they're giving you a loan for a month so that
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] you know, if I were smarter, I would have that same amount in savings and get the interest, which I don't
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] do, but, but yeah, the, the thought of adding, you know, X percent to, to the price of what I buy,
[speaker002:] Yeah, and I,
[speaker001:] I just, I can't accept.
[speaker002:] and I think at this, at this point in time with the economy the way it is, I think that, um, it's going to get even worse. Um, I'm, I'm glad that we're starting to pay our debts off, now, um, you know, we, only we started this last year
[speaker001:] Uh-huh, uh-huh.
[speaker002:] and we probably still have about another year to go
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] before we're completely out of the hole. But I think this, they way the whole economy is going right now, it's just not good to be in debt.
[speaker001:] That's right, that's right. Yeah, yeah, that, I would, that would be a very scary feeling for me to know that I was, you know, juggling payments to different people
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] I guess because I never experienced it. And it's not, because you know, I'm rich or anything, it's just, a mental concept that I have.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Yeah, that I just.
[speaker002:] Well, when you, when you're getting rid of the whole credit card cycle, and if you really get into the mind set, I got really good at juggling money and basically robbing Peter to pay Paul, and it was scary, because I was so good at it.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh, uh-huh.
[speaker002:] And I thought, this is not right. I mean, this has got to stop, because eventually it'd end up catching up at, catching up with me and it hit me in the face.
[speaker001:] Right, right.
[speaker002:] Um.
[speaker001:] But it sounds like, you know, you, you learned from it and you're coming out of it all right.
[speaker002:] I, yeah, I have, I've learned a lot from it.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] I've learned that credit cards are extremely dangerous in my hand
[speaker001:] Uh-huh, uh-huh.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER] and my husband's too, because he's, he's the same way I am.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] I don't, I don't think that, well, when we buy on credit we just don't have a concept of how much money we're spending
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] until the bill comes in.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] And then all of a sudden you look at the bill and you go, Oh my gosh, I spent this much.
[speaker001:] But now, the fact that you still have two cards, are you, do you use them, more judiciously?
[speaker002:] Yeah, we pretty much use them for emergency type things like transmission fell out on our car
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] and that paid for a new transmission
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] um, and, and things like that. Um, and we try not to use them for
[speaker001:] Purchases.
[speaker002:] incidental type things, like, you know, gas and stuff like that.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh, uh-huh [LAUGHTER]. Clothing, sales.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Sales I find are a pain.
[speaker002:] Yeah. I've, I've gotten, I've gotten a lot more away from, from credit cards, and I pay by check a lot more now.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh, uh-huh. Well, it sounds good, you know. Like I said, it sounds like you're, you've really got it under control.
[speaker002:] I, I admire you for having, having that mind set for not, not even getting, you know, past the thirty days, I would, that's ideally the where, where I would like to be.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh, uh-huh. Yeah, and like I said, once, once it, it happened I couldn't because my son's tuition came due, and I guess I had, you know, not really counted on it quite at that point
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] but, um, yeah, I didn't like it at all. I was very uncomfortable. So,
[speaker002:] I can imagine.
[speaker001:] You know, and, and I mean, it was, I thought a lot, sixty dollars interest or something for, for just a couple of months, and I'm going
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] jeez, that's outrageous, but in, in, you know, retrospect it wasn't all that much, I mean a lot of people pay a lot more and
[speaker002:] Oh, yeah.
[speaker001:] and, you know, but still, I mean, I figured I didn't need those items if it cost me sixty dollars more to have them.
[speaker002:] Uh-huh. Think about what you can buy for sixty dollars.
[speaker001:] Exactly [LAUGHTER]. Groceries for a week.
[speaker002:] Yeah, yeah.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] I, I think about all, all the money that, that we've spent on interest
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] on all of our credit cards, and it's just incredible.
[speaker001:] But now did you use to not feel so badly because you could take it off your income tax?
[speaker002:] We've never been able to take it off our income tax. I'm, I'm fairly newly married. I've only been married less than two years
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] and before that, I never owned a home or anything, so I never had any deductions.
[speaker001:] Right, right.
[speaker002:] So, really, it was always just money
[speaker001:] Thrown away.
[speaker002:] thrown away.
[speaker001:] Yeah, jeez.
[speaker002:] And I never really thought about it because,
[speaker001:] You were good at it [LAUGHTER].
[speaker002:] Yeah, I was so good at it that it just kind of got stuck in the back of my mind and just never
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] um, became a real problem until all of a sudden it came an insurmountable problem.
[speaker001:] Yeah. I suspect that, you know, thinking about it and looking at my friends and the number of credit cards that they use and, you know, the amount that I know they buy, I guess probably a lot of them are in a similar situation, and, you know, just don't talk about it.
[speaker002:] Yeah. Most, most people don't like to talk about money. They feel uncomfortable, I think.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh, uh-huh,
[speaker002:] You know,
[speaker001:] very personal.
[speaker002:] for a lot of people it is very personal.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh, yeah, and especially if you, if you don't feel you're handling it quite right
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] or that somebody might make fun of you or that it would be,
[speaker002:] But I think the, the average American is probably pretty heavily in debt. Not, not including like a mortgage. A mortgage is an understandable debt
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] because that's, you have, you have to have a roof over your head.
[speaker001:] Right.
[speaker002:] And I would much rather own my own home than, than be renting it like we're doing. I mean, we're basically, you know, kind of throwing seven hundred dollars a month away.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh, uh-huh.
[speaker002:] We're renting a house.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] But, you know, right now with the way our credit card situation is, there's nobody in the world that's going to give us a mortgage on a house.
[speaker001:] Right, right. But, but, once I suppose you, you prove yourself by paying this off next year
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] you'll be in very good shape.
[speaker002:] Yeah. It's, it's going to, it's going to take quite a while.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] Hopefully within five years we'll be in our own home.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] But, um, I'm not really counting on it real soon.