[speaker001:] Capital punishment, uh, I guess, out in California is, has had a lot of, uh, a lot of, you know, discourse in the paper. Uh, apparently, you know, there's, they haven't, uh, executed anybody since nineteen sixty-seven, I believe.
[speaker002:] [Clicking] [rustling] Uh, yeah. That's, that's as far back as I can remember [LAUGHTER]. Well, that's before
[speaker001:] Yeah, they,
[speaker002:] my time actually.
[speaker001:] Well, I, we were, we, uh, we just started, we lived in Redwood City when we were out there.
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] And, uh, and we found that, uh [throat clearing] you know, it was a very liberal kind of community. But the, uh, I, I really feel that, that the law enforcement community, uh, you know, puts these people behind bars and then they, they, uh, uh, you know, lawyers, these lawyer groups get together and they, uh, they, I think, extend beyond the normal, uh, appeal process. Uh, you know, and just drag these, this guy, uh, his, his, uh, ultimate, uh, demise out for ten or fifteen years. Uh, and I, I think that, uh, that there's something that has to be changed in the system to, to do that. I think capital punishment, uh, uh, was or probably stringent enough but I think the appeal process is really getting in the way.
[speaker002:] [Music] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] Do, do you feel as though there should be, uh, [throat clearing] more, uh, was or, or more, uh, you might say transgressions that would be enforceable by, uh, by, uh, uh, capital punishment?
[speaker002:] Well I think that currently the way the law stands isn't so much that the laws are enforceable or not, it's more they're not enforcing the death penalty itself. It's at that point where they're saying like here you're, you're going on death row but you'll stay there for twenty years.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] And nothing is being done about it. Uh, the laws exist and are frequently upheld in, in, uh, in Appeals Court just because of technicalities [swallowing] and because of maybe small little holes that their defending attorney can find. And it's, it's really getting out of hand in many states.
[speaker001:] Well, [throat clearing] the term technicality. The law enforcement community,
[speaker002:] [Rustling].
[speaker001:] uh, uh, you know, has to, has to separate the difference between somebody who is being set up in which, uh, grievous [mispronounced] acts are done to, uh, to, you know, to get somebody into a, a situation where they're going to be guilty of, of a crime.
[speaker002:] [Noise].
[speaker001:] Or whether, uh, an-, and whether the rights of that individual are been, have been, you know, impuned. Uh, but [throat clearing] or whether there's just, you know, a policeman has just made a, uh, [NOISE] a, you know, a non, a noncritical error, though be it not the right way to do it but, but, you know, the, the merits of the case in terms of, you know,
[speaker002:] [Talking.]
[speaker001:] the guy was a law breaker, as being supportive. Now, I, I'm, a-, a-, at this juncture I, you know, I'm, I'm not sure, you know, what constitutes a, a technicality. You know, that, that's what all c-, these, these hearings are about and that's what all these, you know, court cases are about. I mean our, uh, our, our glorious, uh, you know, mayor here in Washington is six days away from getting out of, out of the can and, uh, [throat clearing] you know, he, he tried to appeal his conviction. Uh, and, you know, it didn't work. But be that as it may, everybody who got enough money will pump the appeal process dry. Uh, in, in the old days, you know, and say round about times of battle of Hastings, you know, and the villages if you were a transgressor, they, they either, you know, drove you out in the woods or you became a ward of somebody and he, you were his slave. And if he didn't like what you did, he killed you.
[speaker002:] [Noise].
[speaker001:] And that has, that's pretty effective. Uh, you know, it's not good for civil rights, I guess, but it's pretty effective in that, you know, you've got to get along in the community and if you don't you'll perish. Either by the hand of your, your, your master or by being pushed out in the woods. So, I, I, I mean as, as man has gotten more complicated so all of the, uh, imaginations to, uh, you know, protect him from, from being, uh, dumped on by, uh, civilian authority in, in so-, in criminal actions, especially, you know, murder cases and that sort of thing.
[speaker002:] Well, it seems like [cough], well it, it seems as if in the past typically [talking] there have been a lot of cases of people being wrongly tried or wrongly punished, and the whole idea behind the current criminal process system [swallowing] is to protect those who actually didn't the crimes, albeit it seems that we are failing in that, in that ultimate goal because there are times when people who are guilty are getting off. Um, for instance, um there's a case a few years back where, uh, [swallowing] someone, uh, someone who's being convicted for, was under a tri-, was going to trial for murder, was let off because of a technicality in that. The of-, the arresting officer, uh, did not read the defendant their rights.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] And where his,
[speaker001:] [Throat clearing].
[speaker002:] old evidence was there, the witnesses were there, the, everything was conclusively pointing to this individual yet [music],