[speaker001:] okay so what are your opinion on it
[speaker002:] well let me preface it I'm a I was a staff officer in Vietnam in sixty nine and seventy
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] and I'm in active reserve now so uh I'm probably not going to have the opinion you think I would have
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] um it's it was an interesting in that I think that he gave the American people some uh uh a sense of the fact that that uh wars are really run by politicians
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] uh I are you old enough to remember the war
[speaker001:] not not much I'm twenty eight so no I really don't remember anything about it I guess I was about ten when it ended right
[speaker002:] yeah uh
[speaker001:] I was born in sixty two so when did it end
[speaker002:] well December seventy two was when uh we bombed North Vietnam and and they released the prisoners in early seventy three so that that time frame
[speaker001:] yeah so I was ten and I don't remember a lot about anything at that time in my life very much in great detail
[speaker002:] I think the the significant thing is is today did did you uh did you see Barbara Walters interview with Schwartzkopf
[speaker001:] no I didn't
[speaker002:] well they
[speaker001:] but I I did read the book I have do have I have six years of college so I did read and study about the Vietnam War though so I am pretty familiar you know I'm more familiar with it than
[speaker002:] well what what's your perspective on it
[speaker001:] mine I think uh I think that there was a lot of rebellion in our nation and that I think it was the right thing to do to try and not to take away to you know just leave their freedoms there and to you know get rid of some of the atrocities that were going on I don't I don't know I don't really I'm tired of pacifist though see on the other hand I'm a pacifist I'm really struggling with it I'm a pacifist physical pacifist I'm a Christian and I believe that the real warfare is not with Saddam Hussein or the North Vietnamese but it's in spiritual kingdoms and that the real warfare is done you know in your prayer closet on your knees so in a way in a sense I'm a pacifist but I'm really not you know what I'm saying
[speaker002:] yes
[speaker001:] I don't think just lay back and not do anything I think lets go to war but let's go to war praying and let's go to war for that way so
[speaker002:] well well the difficulty I have is that uh are we our neighbor's keepers
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] and this is what I find particularly difficult in that uh if we see injustice and whether it's in a uh you know Chicago or uh or or Dallas I I think if we see it you know we see John Wiley Wiley Price hollering injustice I think that's wrong now the question is is was there injustice in Vietnam or was there injustice in Iraq and Kuwait
[speaker001:] um-hum um-hum  um-hum
[speaker002:] the difficult I point is is to where do we step in and and I think that we
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] that's that's the part I have difficulty and the the other part is that the the when when your when your when you're looking at Vietnam and you say well is fifty eight thousand lives worth it and I don't know that anything is worth fifty eight thousand lives
[speaker001:] um-hum still have a problem with uh you know I haven't come to an absolute conclusion on my opinion on this but and I know other Christians would disagree with me my husband and I are kind of not even in agreement on this but we don't fight over it or anything but you know how can you know the Bible says bless your enemies and bless those that curse you and it's like be gentle unto all men apt to teach patient kind so it's like how can you I don't know for me I don't know you know I can't say that I agree with Vietnam because how can you be gentle unto all men and and then shoot them
[speaker002:] well the other issue is is is how do you allow uh how how do you allow injustice just like the the policeman in in Los Angeles
[speaker001:] you so um-hum
[speaker002:] how could how could could you stand there and watch them beat that guy if your brother or your sister were being beaten
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] by the authorities do we step in well in some cases we would and I I think that's what makes it so difficult
[speaker001:] yeah it is a difficult thing but then vengeance is mine sayeth the Lord and I will pay so I think God ultimately in charge of what goes on in I know like Mao Tse Chung in China he did all these terrible things and they were terrible and he's gonna be accountable for them and but if you look back you say wait a minute while he was in power he built roads he tore down all the temples he he unified the Chinese language it was impossible for missionaries to do accomplish anything in China
[speaker002:] but
[speaker001:] because of all that and so even in North and South Vietnam I bet you'd see the same thing and that now he build roads so then he'd open and then he dropped dead twenty five years premature he just dropped dead and so something good did come out of that in that now you see what I mean it's like now
[speaker002:] yeah but but the other the other difficulty is is that it's just if if you take the admonition to to feed my sheep
[speaker001:] uh-huh
[speaker002:] and the question is who are my sheep and the idea do we go out and feed these people when they're hungry
[speaker001:] well bless your enemies if your enemy is hungry feed him if he if he needs your asks for your shirt give him your coat also so if the the the the South Vietnamese they asked us to help them right
[speaker002:] but
[speaker001:] is that right
[speaker002:] yes uh they did the I think the the biggest difficulty is is that when your at an agrarian economy like South Vietnam was that in reality uh the the poor farmer poor rice farmer was going to pay taxes
[speaker001:] um-hum um-hum
[speaker002:] and the question is who was he going to pay it to
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] uh the Communists or the uh alleged Democrats uh democratic form of government and I
[speaker001:] uh-huh
[speaker002:] I think that's I think I think uh that's a little was a difficult part there and and I we didn't understand the culture we couldn't uh we had uh we had a a young lady that was fourteen that worked in our in the unit I was commander of that appeared to be eight or nine years old and and the people looked like children I mean you couldn't imagine that one would would would conceal a bomb and
[speaker001:] um-hum yeah
[speaker002:] and and do these kind of things I think culturally it really destroyed a lot of the people that that went over and saw these people you just couldn't believe that they would that they would be mean and and and drop bombs and kill people and then we would turn around and and napalm them you know if
[speaker001:] um-hum um-hum
[speaker002:] and I think there was a lot of a lot of tearing of emotions and I think that if anything that when Schwartzkopf he was saying the idea that we learned we learned we learned a lot from Vietnam
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] now it was it was it was in general bad but and I don't know the problem is now I'm I'm concerned a little bit that that now that the Gulf War is on that we're going to think it was a good war and it was okay
[speaker001:] yeah
[speaker002:] to go beat up on people and I think that I think we need to a little more justice at home I'm not sure how we get that whether there's a connection there but
[speaker001:] yeah but then again yeah I'd say it is wrong to invade Kuwait and I'm not saying President Bush made the wrong decision I think I'm lacking in my
[speaker002:] in any event
[speaker001:] I don't think I can come to a complete conclusion on how I feel about the Vietnam War because I'm going to interpret that through the Bible and I've kind of always I have been a Christian five years and I've kind of avoided that t hat those the war things and how God approaches that because I think its just now coming up to where I really feel like I need to come you know need to decide what I feel
[speaker002:] well the difficulty is is if you look in the Old Testament and and the numbers of places that uh the Lord went out and just simply struck down and that was part of the problem when they went into the Promised Land that they that they uh they didn't destroy everybody and that that's
[speaker001:] right right they left a woman and a child or the cat the sheep yeah
[speaker002:] and and that that you know and you I think that's one of those things when we get to Heaven we're going to ask God
[speaker001:] I know
[speaker002:] why did you do it that way
[speaker001:] but then again though Jesus the grace pushes you beyond the law you know what I'm saying like so he didn't just say don't kill your don't kill your enemies but don't only don't kill them bless them you know and so therefore when we have an enemy come against us I really feel like but I really feel like I know I do feel this strongly that when if we had someone come and attack us the best way to handle it would be to bless them and humbly go to their other king or the other ruler and say what have we done to offend you what can we do to rectify this situation and that God would move in that sovereignly and he would get the glory though no king no Bush wouldn't
[speaker002:] what do you
[speaker001:] because it wouldn't make any sense you know what I'm saying it'd look absolutely ridiculously stupid but it would work out because
[speaker002:] yeah
[speaker001:] if you follow the scriptural principals it's going to work out because those are that's the best way to do it you know but the thing is is that then God gets the glory not a president not a king and I think that's a problem for a lot of politicians is they want the glory
[speaker002:] well and I I and even at the even at the local level when somebody's assaulted
[speaker001:] um-hum
[speaker002:] what do you do turn the other cheek
[speaker001:] no well I believe personally I hope I this is where everyone always says my husband always goes through that I go yeah for one if someone broke in my house I would pray that I would have this faith to to to take authority over that and I know people that have done that I mean I know that there have been people who have had people break in their homes and just say I bind you in Jesus name your I just and rebuke any enemy because I believe it's a spiritual war that's going on and it's not normal for someone to come into someone elses home illegally that's not normal there's something going on there and that I would have discernment by the Holy Spirit to be able to pray over that do you see what I mean and then the same in Vietnam you would you wouldn't handle Vietnam the same way you would handle uh Saddam Hussein
[speaker002:] yeah
[speaker001:] but I just I have a problem with all the killing but I'm not a new ager I don't believe means that I am not for one world government I'm not for all these new age things I I don't have a problem with uh national identity and I'm an American and having different nations and all of this but I am concerned about the killing that went on there because I just feel like God has a better way to handle it than that and