[speaker001:] [Throat clearing] Well, I haven't heard anything about the proposal myself, but, uh,
[speaker002:] No, I haven't either.
[speaker001:] Uh, I don't know if its their proposal or one that's being seriously kicked around. I've, I've always felt for a long time that I, I think that all young kids ought to do a stint, uh, primarily in the military.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Uh.
[speaker002:] Most countries require that now, they
[speaker001:] Yeah, yeah.
[speaker002:] you know, they have, uh, it mandatory for, for the, the uh
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] at least the young men, I don't know about the young women, I don't know if they have to serve in the military,
[speaker001:] Yeah, a lot, yeah, well, you take Israel
[speaker002:] too.
[speaker001:] I mean, everybody does.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] I don't think it's a bad idea, teaches, teaches a lot. I mean, I went in the service when I was eighteen,
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] And, uh, stayed in for ten years.
[speaker002:] Is that right?
[speaker001:] Yeah, uh, did a lot of growing up.
[speaker002:] I bet.
[speaker001:] [LAUGHTER].
[speaker002:] You have to.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] Yeah, my father had been in the military. I didn't do it myself. My father had and that's, uh, how he put himself through school basically.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] He came from a poor immigrant family, and he didn't have a chance to, uh, you know, the family wasn't wealthy, so he had to do something to,
[speaker001:] Do it himself.
[speaker002:] put himself through school, and he did. And he was very successful.
[speaker001:] Well, my parents wanted to send me to college, and I was dead set against it [breathing].
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER].
[speaker001:] You know, I had wanderlust, you know.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] And I got in, and after, after wasting the first six years, partying and everything else, I decided, uh-huh, time to settle down and do something. So I started to work on my education.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Course my job was such that I didn't, I couldn't do it as much as I wanted
[speaker002:] Uh-huh.
[speaker001:] and still I ended up going two semesters when I got out just to get my degree.
[speaker002:] That's pretty good.
[speaker001:] But, I've been in school ever since [breathing].
[speaker002:] That's good.
[speaker001:] [LAUGHTER] Yeah, I guess.
[speaker002:] Yeah, that's, uh, I don't know. There's other kinds of service to the country that could be done, you know,
[speaker001:] Yeah, I mean if you don't like,
[speaker002:] I mean, working in the national parks,
[speaker001:] Sure.
[speaker002:] Uh, working, clean up the roadsides
[speaker001:] Exactly.
[speaker002:] I mean, I've always felt that people on welfare should be required to spend at least part of their time, *why no slash?
[speaker001:] Oh yeah, absol-,
[speaker002:] not all the time because that takes away from their opportunity to look for a job, but [beep] [three times] at least some of their time to look for, to go out and clean up the roads.
[speaker001:] Absolutely.
[speaker002:] You know, I mean,
[speaker001:] All these, all this money that we're throwing away to pay people to go out and do things when we're paying all these welfare recipients, and if they're able-bodied people, I don't see any problem at all with having them go out there and, and, if nothing else, get a group of them together and take them around to old folks
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] places and let them cut the yards, paint the houses.
[speaker002:] Yeah, we'd learn service to other people
[speaker001:] Sure, sure.
[speaker002:] in this country.
[speaker001:] So I'm, get something out of that money.
[speaker002:] Country would benefit,
[speaker001:] Yeah I've,
[speaker002:] I mean, uh,
[speaker001:] yeah, yeah, my next door neighbor when I was growing up, worked for the unemployment division, and his sole job was just tracking down people who were getting benefits and able-bodied and,
[speaker002:] That right.
[speaker001:] Yeah, and he, he had all kinds of horror stories. You know, these guys go down there and get their unemployment checks, and, back, back in those days they also use to give [beep] you, [beep] uh, booklets good for, uh, [beep] clothing and gas, and things like this [beep].
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] They [beep] get all this stuff together [beep] and sit down and have poker games
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] you know, and I'm, I jus-, I have a hard time dealing with that.
[speaker002:] What I hear one time, I think it was on Paul Harvey's, {F uh, radio segment, } that he said that if the money that goes into welfare each year was to be given directly to the people without all the middle people in the government bureaucracy, each person would receive like forty-five thousand dollars.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] I mean, I was astounded. I don't even make that.
[speaker001:] No, I know. I, you, you think about, you think about the layer of bureaucracy between the money and the recipient,
[speaker002:] Yeah, and somebody's taking that away.
[speaker001:] and, and there's probably, there's easily probably six or seven times that amount being spent on the bureaucracy.
[speaker002:] Yeah, no doubt.
[speaker001:] You know, it's, it's, it's totally ridiculous, and now, I, I, I, uh, started out when I first got in graduate school I was going into public administration, and, uh, quite honestly I just got so fed up with it I just couldn't stand it any more.
[speaker002:] Is that right,
[speaker001:] Yeah, I mean, this is the kind of thing you look at.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] You sit there and when you're writing up budgets, you wonder, okay, how much money do we need. Well, you need X number dollars for the recipients but you need X number dollars to administer the program. Well just ridiculous.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] This is ridiculous.
[speaker002:] It's sad.
[speaker001:] It is, it's pathetic. I mean, there's got to be a different way. There's got to be a better way. But it'll never happen. I mean, these
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] these people out here getting that money are big voting blocks.
[speaker002:] Yeah. What would happen if the required young people to do service to the country, what should they get in return, I wonder. Like, uh,
[speaker001:] I think, I think there ought to be some kind of assistance as far as, uh, and I would limit it strictly to something like tuition assistance.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Give an incentive.
[speaker002:] Educational or vocational training or something.
[speaker001:] Yeah. Something that's going to help them along the way.
[speaker002:] And they'll help the country eventually, too,
[speaker001:] Sure, I mean,
[speaker002:] because rather than having a bunch of uneducated people we can have educated people,
[speaker001:] Well, this, I mean
[speaker002:] and that's only going to help.
[speaker001:] I mean, look at the statistics, I mean, it's sad. One in five Americans can't read
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] adults, that is, can't even read. And, and we've got the lowest rates of the civilized countries in science and math.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] I mean, what are we, what are we becoming? We're becoming a service country.
[speaker002:] As opposed to what we were twenty years ago.
[speaker001:] Yeah, we were an industrial giant, and now we're no-, we're not going to do it because everybody is beating us at the game. We taught them how to do it, and they, they did it better than we do.
[speaker002:] Yeah [LAUGHTER].
[speaker001:] Simple as that.
[speaker002:] because they have the ambition, I guess.
[speaker001:] yeah, simple as that.
[speaker002:] Yeah, which is good for them, but on the other hand, we kind of lose out.
[speaker001:] Yeah, it's terrible for us.
[speaker002:] I think that if, uh, young people had service to the country might give them more ambition.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] Because they learn that serving other people is a good thing.
[speaker001:] Yeah, and, and it can be good for them, too.
[speaker002:] Yeah, oh yeah.
[speaker001:] I mean, even, even the greedy kids that we've got now...
[speaker002:] Oh god, you go to the mall and you see, you know, fourteen year old kids flaunting money, because the parents give them money to go down and play video games all night, you know
[speaker001:] I know.
[speaker002:] for what.
[speaker001:] I know.
[speaker002:] Give me the money and I'll, I'll teach them something good [LAUGHTER].
[speaker001:] Well, you know, you know why they do it is so they can get them out of the house.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Yeah, uh, that's my other complaint. Parents aren't parents any more.
[speaker002:] No. They've, they've relinquished their parenting.
[speaker001:] Yeah. One of the other subjects is do you think the public school systems are in trouble?
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Well, as a substitute teacher for a year, I, I can say yes.
[speaker002:] Yeah, I mean, I talked with somebody else about that another time, and, you know, when I's in graduate school working on my master's degree in math, I was, uh, teaching as part of my, part of the program. And I just love teaching. That was a lot, that's probably the most fun I had. And, uh, it helped me out because I learned
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] things and learned how to do things differently.
[speaker001:] Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] And when, uh, when come time to get out of school, I thought, Boy, I'd like to teach. But you know, for, for what.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] You know, I don't want to live in a little one bedroom apartment the rest of my life.
[speaker001:] Exactly.
[speaker002:] I mean, that, that's a sad thing to think, and that's kind of selfish on my part, and I admit that,
[speaker001:] Well, in a way it is, but you have to look out for yourself
[speaker002:] Yeah, that's right.
[speaker001:] you know, I mean, that's some-, and when we pay garbage men more than we pay teachers,
[speaker002:] That's wrong.
[speaker001:] Yeah, gosh, I mean,
[speaker002:] I'm not saying that garbage men should be paid less, I saying teachers should be paid more.
[speaker001:] No, I mean yeah. They do an absolutely necessary job, I mean, I, I have a great deal of admiration for these people who can go out there and do that.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] But, uh, I mean, there's, there's a sense of priorities here, too.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] You know, we need, what's more important, picking up the garbage or educating our kids.
[speaker002:] Yeah [LAUGHTER]. They both have their place.
[speaker001:] Yeah, they, they, sure.
[speaker002:] But, you know, when it gets right down to it,
[speaker001:] I mean, one's import-, I mean, on the other hand, I mean, you take a garbage man in New York City starts out at twenty-six thousand dollars.
[speaker002:] That's pretty good.
[speaker001:] Well I bet you there's a whole bunch of homeless people up there who would take that job for thirteen thousand dollars a year.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] I mean, my other pet peeve is unions.
[speaker002:] Yeah, oh yeah.
[speaker001:] You know, it's just, it's, it's ridiculous the way unions have gone. There was a time when unions were needed.
[speaker002:] And they served a good function.
[speaker001:] And they served a good function, but there are enough laws on the books now that unions are outdated, and they're only there to perpetuate their own, their own power structure.
[speaker002:] I remember, the company my dad worked for, the people there went on strike against the management. It was a steel manufacturing place, and they, uh, this was during a time when the import steel was so cheap, and they were having a hard time. And they told the strikers there, look, we need you to come back and get this stuff done. Or else we're going to be out of business. And they wouldn't come back, so they went bankrupt.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] And, and they all lost their jobs.
[speaker001:] Sure, and, and
[speaker002:] And it's like, you know.
[speaker001:] and that's really what happened to the steel industry in this country.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] So many times, I mean, you had the, uh, the coal miners and steel workers going out at the same time. And, well, that took care of that industry
[speaker002:] That's right.
[speaker001:] and, and, then, and I'll tell you, Detroit worked awfully hard on, on stopping car manufacturing in this country.
[speaker002:] And they're trying to do that now with the imports.
[speaker001:] Yeah, I mean, you know, we've never caught up, and I don't think we ever will.
[speaker002:] It'll be a tough road, though.
[speaker001:] Yeah, I mean, here it is, and we've got, we've got to go into partnership with the Japanese to build cars.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] You know [LAUGHTER]. And they only did it because they, I guess they were embarrassed
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] that they're so good at it [LAUGHTER].
[speaker002:] That's about right.
[speaker001:] [LAUGHTER] Gosh. Yeah, well, back to the original subject, yeah, I think youngsters ought to go out and do some public service, I don't care what kind it is.
[speaker002:] It teaches them pride in their country.
[speaker001:] Yeah, and pride in themselves, too.
[speaker002:] That's right.
[speaker001:] They could, they could, I mean, you could organize something just within your community.
[speaker002:] Yeah,
[speaker001:] same old thing. I mean,
[speaker002:] that's right. That's like Eagle Scouts.
[speaker001:] Sure. Uh-huh.
[speaker002:] And that's a great idea.
[speaker001:] I think they ought to take them and, I don't know, just have sort of like a, a, a manpower pool and say Okay, look, we need somebody...