[speaker001:] er er the the sort of way in which we're going to recover the
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] the figure.
[Russell:] Yeah. The way we're going to recover it first is on that
[speaker001:] Right but
[Russell:] So I want to I want to work out what's involved there, I'll go at something like twenty per cent, so it'll come out about twenty pound fifty something
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] like that. I'll go in at first, I'll see how much that's gonna be which is about seven hundred pounds.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] And I'll work that into the five per cent and it may reduce the erm period of time to five months say or four
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] months but I'll work it out
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] and I'll say to him, right, okay, we'll give you the five per cent r reduction for only eight months of the year. Yeah?
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] But this bearing goes up to this price. And in ef
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] in effect what you're doing is helping us out with the cost that we incurred in getting it and the help that we've done you.
[speaker001:] Right right.
[Russell:] I've got the price of that product up and also get him his reduction after a period of time.
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] When you're when you're talking about what it's cost us to get him those bearings
[Russell:] Right.
[speaker001:] er the figure is well over a thousand pounds.
[Russell:] Right.
[speaker001:] This simple bit is the overtime.
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] The overtime that we worked is about thirty five hours at six pounds an hour. We had three additional setups
[Russell:] Mhm.
[speaker001:] Er those were only the setups o as a result of breaking something else down and putting this bearing on.
[Russell:] yeah.
[speaker001:] It had nothing to do with s with the the setups involved in splitting the batch
[Russell:] right.
[speaker001:] Okay?
[Russell:] Okay.
[speaker001:] So so you've got there three a at erm
[Russell:] Three
[speaker001:] Three seven an Yeah, seven and a half hours. Two and a half hours for setup at twenty eight pounds an hour.
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] Right so you've got a you've got another hundred and fifty quid there or so
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] at least.
[Russell:] A hundred innit yeah.
[speaker001:] [clears throat] So then then you've got the thing that is not measured which we can't measure is the disrupti the the cost of the disruption to all the other customers who who's batches have been put back
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] as a result.
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] And now that is immeasurable
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] but it costs.
[Russell:] Yeah mm.
[speaker001:] And and so erm and if you double the figure that you've got there
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] you may be getting somewhere near.
[Russell:] Mm. Yeah okay
[speaker001:] So so [clears throat]
[Russell:] twelve hundred quid.
[speaker001:] So a thousand twelve hundred quid is the sort of is the sort of minimum figure you
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] should be talking about.
[Russell:] Right.
[speaker001:] Er and when he says well h how the hell do you make that up? Well I'll give you the easy bit,
[Russell:] That's manufacturing, he's not daft.
[speaker001:] [clears throat]
[Russell:] He'll know
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] it's gonna cost something like that.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] So yeah, fine.
[speaker001:] Erm and
[Russell:] Yeah, I just want to get the emphasis back onto that one first, and the products, we accepted it and we've got to live with it at some point in time, but the longer I can put that off, the better. But the majority of the advantage I make, I want to be put into the.
[speaker001:] I I would yes I would suggest that when you when you do this five per cent thing... erm make your make your
[Russell:] Even if it's three per cent
[speaker001:] make your price adjustment. Make your price adjustment soon.
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] Make it now
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] and say well we'll hold that for five months but then we'll go back to the
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Yeah we'll restrict it instead of going into the full year
[Russell:] Instead of to the higher price for the end of the year we'll
[speaker001:] Well instead of doing it
[Russell:] might say well just do it the end of the year. I'll see what I can get from him, yeah.
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] Yeah alright.
[speaker001:] And and er we've then contributed to his cost down
[Russell:] Mhm.
[speaker001:] because over all his situation will be better.
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] And er we'll have given it him I mean on his on his total cost he'll be down.
[Russell:] Yeah. Right.
[speaker001:] And we'll have given him a clue for how to budget for next year as well.
[Russell:] The E R C one er for this extra ceramic, that is separate, I've got to do that as export so leave that with me. Okay that that is out
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] that is out the equation it's er one thing I've got to haggle with Graham on.
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] That will be. I won't get an instant reaction. Well I will but it maybe not that er.
[speaker001:] This is erm the the ceramic cage
[Russell:] ceramic balls.
[speaker001:] Right this is a new thing for experimental work that we're doing for them is it?
[Russell:] Er well it's not a new thing, we've be we've been making ceramic ball bearings for a while
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] we've have a E R C for about six months now. Er we've come to the end of some of the trials. They want to run one up to see what the maximum speed is, well of course that's gonna destroy it.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] So but they want to do cooking trials as well, actual cooking trials
[speaker001:] They Cincinnati.
[Russell:] Yes. at Cincinnati in the new development shop.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] So what we've got is another set put through. Now you're talking about five hundred quid for the set of three bearings. So I'm saying to Graham, come on, we're helping you, you are helping us obviously, I'm not gonna deny the fact you're helping us with our research. Yeah?
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] But er you know
[speaker001:] We've gotta have a sensible price with them.
[Russell:] Gotta be reasonable with it. So I need some help on that. We're giving him wh If he gives me three or four hundred quid.
[speaker001:] You've given him one set already have you? Or we've used one set at E R C.
[Russell:] Well and we've used it for Well answer is yes but I'm you know, it's making sure you get the business. You know, come on. If we're gonna be partners it's gotta be equal not er
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] So anyway yeah, I I've gotta do that with Graham. Er right okay no problem with that. Right, Steve has offered two per cent, whereas before nothing. Yeah... er last year the budget was thirty K at thirty seven per cent and we actually did forty K at thirty seven per cent. And there is another five and a half K to come in from now that's closed. So there's a bit more business
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] drifting in. So we've got potentially forty five. With that being such a low figure this year, tends to be quite cyclical.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] You know, one year's quite low, thirty five, forty thousand, next year sixty five. Yeah you tend to get that
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] spread. So next year I think is potentially hoping that it's gonna come. Whether the recession knocks it back a bit I don't know. But er there is potential for fifty K plus at reasonable margins seven per cent. So... you know he's offered two per cent and they're not giving it out to many people. The only reason he's giving it to us is cos he's thinks that we didn't have an increase last year. He's forgotten that we did but [LAUGHTER] I'm not gonna tell him that [].
[speaker001:] Er
[Russell:] If w if we we did get an
[speaker001:] Right well
[Russell:] increase last year. Actually.
[speaker001:] Well I think
[Russell:] If he knew that he'd turn round and say get lost.
[speaker001:] I think I think what you what you need to do is to push him
[Russell:] Right.
[speaker001:] If h er how much nego er what what's the situation at the moment, you said three per cent have you? You're gonna go in at th you went for four?
[Russell:] I I I went for four. I went for four he said he said zilch. So I said, well come on you've gotta be reasonable with me so I spoke to him last week and he says, look you didn't have one last year so I'll give you two.
[speaker001:] [clears throat]
[Russell:] And he says it's more than I've given the others because they did have an increase. He'd forgotten that we did have an increase. The only problem is
[speaker001:] Well
[Russell:] precision market at the minute is are playing silly buggers. have given me a a bit of grief because the they're on a very similar price level now to us.
[speaker001:] Mhm.
[Russell:] Because they're being supported by. But are coming in they're quoting three or four per cent underneath. Er at they're ten per cent underneath and historically, a couple of years ago, you're talking two or three times the price, their prices at one period, probably about the mid to late eighties, doubled and trebled in price.
[speaker001:] Who's marketing?
[Russell:] It's it's er their part of aren't they.
[speaker001:] That's what I was thinking.
[Russell:] Yeah. But their prices now
[speaker001:] Are are they being are they being marketed by?
[Russell:] No it's who've called in to yeah Andy. He's e he's now you know. So I've got a
[speaker001:] Well
[Russell:] problem with them. Er in so much as I mean I must admit with these increases, I appreciate your need to get the extra profits and I'm looking at the ones where I think we can push them to get a bit more. But there are others where you know I'm e I'm very reluctant to to get involved. I mean
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] for example.
[speaker001:] Well
[Russell:] We budgeted twenty K at sixty two per cent margin, we're actually eighteen at sixty five per cent margin. Now you can't screw people like that.
[speaker001:] No. And let's just let's just go
[Russell:] And they have really
[speaker001:] back to.
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Er how many part numbers do we sell to?
[Russell:] Sorry?
[speaker001:] How many part numbers do we sell to?
[Russell:] Er about twelve. Plus standard bearings as well on top of that.
[speaker001:] Right. Erm can you push him up on the standard bearings?
[Russell:] Very doubtful. Er the group will buy European rubbish if they have to.
[speaker001:] Right. Erm can we can you as part of the discussion, can you start off by saying well thank you very much for the call that you gave me last week but erm erm there's there's just a couple of sizes I'd like to talk talk to you about.
[Russell:] Mhm. What try and get it back on some.
[speaker001:] And try and squeeze a few back a bit further. Yes?
[Russell:] Okay. Yeah. Aha. Yeah. I'll have a look
[speaker001:] See
[Russell:] I'll have a product. The problem is I can't say that at the minute cos I haven't got my print done. I'm having a yearly detailed print done of last year,
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] John was just running it for me now so I'll pick it up on the way home tonight. You see but I've had to have this run
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] for other reasons, I E the industrial stock.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] put the onus back on me now to say what of that stock we want to keep before they throw it away.
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] Yeah? So I've had to have this print run of detailed customer parts by quantity for ninety three.
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] Yeah unfortunately I've not been able to have it done yet. Other people have been jumping in and getting print left right and centre
[speaker001:] Right but but but that's coming tonight that?
[Russell:] That's coming to then I can start to look in more detail
[speaker001:] Right well I I mean I think that that's the way to that's the way to try and squeeze Yeah yeah
[Russell:] try and get a few on others take on
[speaker001:] Well yes what what you've got to try and do is to divide and rule.
[Russell:] Get the overall number up.
[speaker001:] Yeah?
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Get the overall number up by erm by er focusing on a few
[Russell:] Okay.
[speaker001:] and and I mean, obviously to begin with you don't give away on anything.
[Russell:] No no.
[speaker001:] Erm and er that's that's the way Er Tom.... Okay thank you. [break in recording] Je ne comprends pas.
[Russell:] Exactly yeah.
[speaker001:] Right so you're gonna try and divide him and rule him.
[Russell:] Right.
[speaker001:] Just
[Russell:] I've just had a a quick word with Maureen, this is another thing that's come up. On the industrial side, I mentioned to Steve last year at the end of last year saying, look it's coming up to. Then I'd be looking after you for both products and what I want to do is have a look at all the standard bearings you take to see if there is potential for a supply.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] What he's done is stuffed an order through for a six three O eight.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] At like half price, less than, erm a six three O seven that we supply already, because it's the price. [LAUGHTER] So I knew this would come up but I didn't realize he'd be jumping onto the bandwagon that quick.
[speaker001:] So that the six three O eight was a product that had supplied?
[Russell:] had supplied yeah at about four pound eighty I think the price is.
[speaker001:] Yeah well of course
[Russell:] The six three O seven we supply at about nine pounds. So I've got a problem.
[speaker001:] So why did he come to why did he come to for the six three O seven.
[Russell:] Because it was one that we were doing with in conjunction with an E P three bearing. Special B J seven thousand. Or E X P
[speaker001:] What and they were matched in some way?
[Russell:] Well no we had a matched pair of a pair of precision E P bearings radials at the front. I mean they use a pair of radials
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] together.
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] Erm and because they like to keep the same manufacturer on one shaft if they could, they took out six three O seven for the back end.
[speaker001:] Well of course part of
[Russell:] ask for an E P three supply it.
[speaker001:] part of part of the erm part of that issue says that of course all the prices that he's got. Tho they've all gone up eight per cent. Because prices have gone up eight per cent across the board.
[Russell:] Right.
[speaker001:] So so the price as was before
[Russell:] Doesn't exist it's
[speaker001:] is no longer valid.
[Russell:] Right.
[speaker001:] Now erm we will have to look at the situation with regard to the er all the other ones and we'll do an analysis, what are the volumes and so on and what other what other popular metric bearings
[Russell:] We've got an opportunity to Right.
[speaker001:] Are you buying from anybody else because can we do a deal on the whole lot?
[Russell:] Right that's what I was trying to get
[speaker001:] Yeah. Erm
[Russell:] You see I've got the prob I mean my initial reaction is I mean I I've got no strong feeling to say we've got to supply product the stuff it's cheaper, we make more money, sod it. Erm
[speaker001:] Well of course even the product is product.
[Russell:] No yeah when it is our product it's a D five if it's, it's D six if it's. But erm I don't care which is what it is
[speaker001:] No.
[Russell:] to be honest.
[speaker001:] No.
[Russell:] Erm but er I have the problem with trying to balance up which way to go. I mean obviously I'd like to sell it all at price levels but there's get away with that.
[speaker001:] Of course you w of course you would Of course you would and it may be that what you will have to say is, Well look, erm I gave you the four per cent on the on the precision types and that that really has to stay, but by the time we by the time we've done all the analysis on the er on the popular metrics, it will work out that it is is is only two per cent.
[Russell:] Right okay
[speaker001:] Because of because of the because of the erm er ups and downs that's all. So I
[Russell:] Yeah. Leave that with me I'll I'll get in contact with Steve and I'll try and get this list sorted.
[speaker001:] Where you can be a bit where you think you've got a technical issue to sell,
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] which is on the precision ones,
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] erm even if it's slightly over engineered,
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] try and push it.
[Russell:] Yeah okay.
[speaker001:] Where where you know that he can go out to the market for a popular metric bearing and and slaughter the old price
[Russell:] Yeah yeah.
[speaker001:] then you've got you've got to beware.
[Russell:] Yeah sure.
[speaker001:] But but don't give it away for nothing.
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] the thing the thing that you've got to avoid is getting into a situation where you've where where you you say to him, Oh well okay two per cent, and then he comes back to you and says, but what about this six three O eight.
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] And what about the six three
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] O seven? come on fellas the six three O seven's gotta be cheaper than the six three O eight.
[Russell:] Yeah yeah.
[speaker001:] Erm and and you get yourself into a into a hole.
[Russell:] Mm mm.
[speaker001:] So I I think you've got to open it up by separating the two bits of business, the bit that's special
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] And and that's that's going four per cent. The bit which of course basically going eight per cent.
[Russell:] Right.
[speaker001:] But if if you end up with all the popular metric business at somewhere around the sort of equivalent price level, margin level that you've got that business at,
[Russell:] Mhm.
[speaker001:] then... you stand a chance in being able to show him nothing more than two per cent.
[Russell:] Right.
[speaker001:] Do you see what I'm getting at?
[Russell:] Yeah yeah yeah I know that.
[speaker001:] But you've actually got you've manoeuvred him there in such a way that he might be prepared to accept that.
[Russell:] Yeah fine okay. Right, so I'll get in contact with him and we'll sort that then. Erm is one... they've been in a very similar position to in so much as competition's forced them to cost down dramatically I mean
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] you're talking a third more. They get all they get promised orders right up until a month before switch on time and then it goes. And they really do have problems with getting customers to promise an order for up the line and keep it.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] Competition turn around's gonna chop another ten per cent off. Erm and the fact that we're making over sixty per cent margin i is good business for us in such Okay it's only twenty K, but potentially longer term when the recovery comes, they're gonna be
[speaker001:] Spindle bearings?
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Only spindle bearings?
[Russell:] Er no it's for er screw support bearings and spindle bearings. There are some S F T twenties and stuff like that as well but those don't show in these figures you see. I've gotta look at them separately cos I haven't got the industrial yet.
[speaker001:] Erm right. So
[Russell:] But but basically we s we screw 'em. And we've got you know that is actually a lot lower than it used to be because we [LAUGHTER] they actually caught us charging them three hundred and fifty quid for a bearing that we're now charging them two hundred and fifty quid for. [] So you can imagine what margin that used to be. I mean we're talking eighty per cent. Yeah you start to feel a little uncomfortable. Especially knowing what are always in there, Stuart's always on the door cos he lives in Keighley. Yeah he lives round the corner. Yeah he's well in there, but not got the business by er trading off. But it's a good technical business to have for other people as well to know about. We deal with, we deal with names, they're all names to be connected with.
[speaker001:] Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah What what have you said to at the moment.
[Russell:] Er all I've said is, Yes I understand your position, I'll go away and talk to Tom about it.
[speaker001:] R Right, have you have you given him a figure have you put a figure on the table at all?
[Russell:] No I said four four from the letter and it's been left at that.
[speaker001:] It's four from the letter?
[Russell:] It's four from the letter I haven't reduced anything yet.
[speaker001:] So he he he's got four.
[Russell:] All he's said is nothing.
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] I must admit I'm in that
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] one particularly with the margins on I'm reluctant to
[speaker001:] What's his payment terms? Thirty days normal?
[Russell:] thirty days yeah.
[speaker001:] Right. Erm is there anything else that you might be able to get out of him if you concede?
[Russell:] Not really. Erm
[speaker001:] Is there any other business that
[Russell:] Not really no
[speaker001:] What do you do where does he get his screws from?
[Russell:] hydrostatic. Er, We can't compete. can't touch them. Never
[speaker001:] Can we not?
[Russell:] No our buying cost's higher than 's selling price sometimes.. Very difficult.
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] have their quality problems, that's where you can score over but the prices are very very low and tend to pick them up. I I quoted for a rolled screw once, yeah and my buying price from I'm talking about a year and half ago, was higher than 's quoted price for a ground bore screw. [LAUGHTER] It was just so
[speaker001:] Yeah. Mm.
[Russell:] have a problem all of their own and I don't intend to drag that into it. I'm I'm happier to stand away and 's going in on Friday.
[speaker001:] Mhm.
[Russell:] I'm happier to stand back and let him do his bit and I'll do my bit, as long as we're talking to each other.
[speaker001:] Yeah as long as we know what the other's doing.
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] But they're prepared to let it stand as the prices are at the moment cos they're under pressure.
[speaker001:] Ah.
[Russell:] With their own problems, this supply and what have you.
[speaker001:] Ah.
[Russell:] Apparently if click on one particular size that they can get it from, that could wipe out 's business cos as soon as they click one size, then 'll be in and wipe the floor with them. That's the impression I'm getting and and they're and they're tending to back off. Not to invite the er... the monitoring in effect, the comparison. Now with and me it's a different ball game.
[speaker001:] Well.
[Russell:] We we have this split Oh okay. first What do you think, I'll do the in a minute, that's on the list so.
[speaker001:] Well I think I th I think you may may find yourself having to er er give way.
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] There. Erm you've got to put up a show
[Russell:] Oh yeah yeah.
[speaker001:] and again... er if you can
[Russell:] If I get something on one of them to s to look as though I've
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] fought for it.
[speaker001:] Yes.
[Russell:] Yeah and I have to walk away from the others.
[speaker001:] Yeah yeah and I mean you can you you've got to use the negotiating technique of come on fella you know I'm gonna get I'm gonna get chewed over if I don't
[Russell:] Oh yeah don't worry I do. [LAUGHTER]
[speaker001:] come away with something.
[Russell:] I've already told him I'm gonna get my arse kicked cos I haven't for eight you see. That's my
[speaker001:] Yes.
[Russell:] There's my strong point straight away.
[speaker001:] Yes.
[Russell:] Get a bit of sympathy cos I've been asked for eight by you.
[speaker001:] That's right.
[Russell:] And I've already put a letter out saying four, so I've had me arse kicked already.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] So I'm on the defensive so he's you know he's
[speaker001:] Right so erm i if you can end up with two or if you can end up with I mean it may be more helpful for him if he gets if he gets a a a no increase on one size and an increase on the other. And and actually
[Russell:] out if him on a weaker size I will do, but
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] with it being a higher margin I'm very loathe to er rock the cart.
[speaker001:] What's he doing in the way of development?
[Russell:] Er Chris they don't they tend to I think it's like a lot of people in the U K I mean you've got in the machine tools side but like on the on the side, They use use hydrostatics. So they they run on the oil you know like our H C F machines do on the shop floor. Erm but... they're in a position on a lot of the things, like they use our precision P n P two bearings in their dressers.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] You know and things like that and bearings well the P three as we call then support bearings. So you know th they're using the most accurate bearing they can for what they use it for. Er on the spindle side, you know, it's gonna stay the way of the hydrostatics cos of the damping ab capabilities of it so There's not... it's not an area where
[speaker001:] New machines coming along? New ideas?
[Russell:] They tend to be variations on a theme. Cam grinders, they're not gonna change a lot. Reciprocating wheel, cams. things like that.
[speaker001:] Right right.
[Russell:] So get the opportunity for
[speaker001:] Tom... Thank you.... Hello Dietrich.... Right... Yes.... Aha.... Right. Right... That figures.... That figures.... Right.... Okay yeah. Erm we'll we'll be erm er we'll be we'll be going for ten. And and I'll er I'll let you know if anything else if anything else comes out of that. Okay and that sh we should have in the next day or two. Good thanks a lot Dietrich. Bye.... So erm yes with with with er erm er you you need to encourage them to er think development.
[Russell:] The problem is with that, the way they developed has gone towards the hydrostatics.
[speaker001:] Yes.
[Russell:] The problem with development on their machines is I can see it going away from normal bearings.
[speaker001:] Right to?
[Russell:] So so in a way, they're looking at the levels we're at now is an accurate level using a high price item. I'd be loathe to push them any f tilt them into a position where they say, Well you know could we use for the dresser. You know what I mean?
[speaker001:] Well Yeah but Yeah but there's there's erm th there's a pay-off between cost and accuracy and that's the thing isn't there. Erm what a erm have they have they thought about how they're going to get the costs down within their machines?
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] And if so, what are they you know what are they doing about it?
[Russell:] Right.
[speaker001:] Could we could we set up a a a conversation on that on that subject because we might
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] we might be able to help we might be able to generate some ideas between us
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] which will help them
[Russell:] Okay yeah yeah.
[speaker001:] You know so that's something that you can give
[Russell:] Yeah as a service part of the relationship yeah yeah.
[speaker001:] erm as a a part of the service. Erm to to emphasize the fact that erm in principle we are we are committed to providing our customers with a service that enables them to be more competitive. But we've got to get them to understand that that doesn't mean to say that our prices will always be the lowest.
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] It means to say that if we have the right relationship between us and our customers, we get in a design stage
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] and and we can help them with our bearing experience
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] engineering bearing experience, we can help them choose a bearing which will enable them to be more competitive.
[Russell:] Mm yeah okay yeah.
[speaker001:] So I mean that's the sort of atmosphere that we we've got to try and
[Russell:] Yeah I know
[speaker001:] try and generate.
[Russell:] Yeah I mean I'm not being cynical but that's very easy to say.
[speaker001:] It is.
[Russell:] Anyway.
[speaker001:] It's easier it's a great deal easier to say than to do. But but what you're trying to create in the guy is a bit of a warm feeling
[Russell:] Yeah yeah. Loyalty is a good thing.
[speaker001:] And and erm
[Russell:] But it only goes so far.
[speaker001:] Yeah er er there there is a there is a there is a world of difference between saying those words and giving giving your opposite number a w a warm feeling
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] and actually doing anything achieving anything.
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] But I mean, one of the things that we've got on with at the moment is that we've been saying for ages, you've got to get your you've got to get us involved at design stage.
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] And they've done absolutely bugger all about it. So what have they done? They've designed in a bearing which which which is stupidly expensive.
[Russell:] Mhm.
[speaker001:] And if they'd started thinking about it at design stage, we could have suggested them another bearing that would do the job and be a lot cheaper.
[Russell:] Mhm.
[speaker001:] So but they they've missed it it's too late
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] that's the that's the problem. Once you've actually designed the piece,
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] you can't go back. Tom... Oh hello Arthur, good afternoon to you.... Yes.... Yes.... Yes.... I signed three times.... I'll get him to re retransmit it to you. I expect it probably got erm er stuck in the machine or something. Yeah okay Arthur. See you tomorrow. Bye. [shouting] Kim? []
[speaker003:] [shouting] She's not here. []
[speaker001:] Er C Carol could you could you organize page two... of Kim's three page fax
[speaker003:] Three page fax.
[speaker001:] Yeah he he's sent back er three pages of a fax that he'd received. And it looks as though it's picked up the middle page.
[speaker003:] Okay, to where?
[speaker001:] To Edgeware.
[speaker003:] To Edgeware..
[speaker001:] Air about airfreight.
[speaker003:] About airfreight okay.
[speaker001:] There's one page missing.
[speaker003:] Right okay.
[Russell:] Right okay... She'd offered two straight away so I'm gonna try and get some more out of her. I take it that is a special bearing, I know she's had people look at it, I'm gonna try and suss out how far she's got down that line as to having another source but I don't think she has. The price we sell that at is quite low. Really.
[speaker001:] Yeah?
[Russell:] But we have budgeted it for eighty five K at thirty six per cent and we achieved a hundred and three at thirty eight.
[speaker001:] Right, so er you certainly don't want to be giving in at at two per cent unless the volume we're sure's gonna be higher again this year.
[Russell:] Right, she's just put another o order on for about erm a big order. So she says they usually put schedules on for fourteen month for the next ten months, twelve months.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] So the order's on so I've got to try and argue the toss with her
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] erm we budgeted at fifteen K at forty three per cent, we did twenty two but only at thirty six per cent cos the product mix changed.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] Yeah. They sold off their small tools division where we sold some bearings to them. Which we made good margins on. That's the W D S small parts now. Standard parts
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] size. six three O six, six six three O two er fours. Erm... I've had a word with Kevin and he does recognize the fact that we've got to get something. But he this was a week and a half ago and he said, give me a couple of weeks, I want to have a look at the figures and the mix and have a think about it and I'll come back to you. But he does want to get something sorted before the end of January. So I'll see what he's got to say.
[speaker001:] Right, see what he's gonna say erm
[Russell:] That is one where we. Er there's not a great value in sales, as I say, twenty two K. But then again how values how valuable is valuable? I don't you know. To me twenty two K
[speaker001:] Twenty two K twenty two K's worth having.
[Russell:] At thirty six per cent margin.
[speaker001:] Certainly. Yeah.
[Russell:] So you know, I mean that's that's the er... So I'll see what Kevin comes back to me with first.
[speaker001:] Mm.
[Russell:] ...
[speaker001:] Where are we at with?
[Russell:] Pain in the backside. I spoke to today when I was over there just after lunch. He's as confused as I am, are an account that you can ne we're never bottom of We used to have a very good relationship through a guy called Ray.
[speaker001:] Mhm I knew him.
[Russell:] The problem is
[speaker001:] Liked his golf.
[Russell:] Right the problem is, it was er like a guy called er... Norman at. They got so close to him and knew him so well that nothing else mattered. When he actually retired it left er
[speaker001:] A complete hole.
[Russell:] Yeah yeah I mean, and cert
[speaker001:] And we had the wrong contacts with the wrong people.
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] At the wrong time. And I said to peter
[Russell:] guess who picked up the account just after that?
[speaker001:] I said I said to Peter and David, back in nineteen ninety one, I said we've got a big problem. Oh don't worry about it, Ray'll see us right. And bloody hell, six months later, Ray retires and we are left
[Russell:] in nineteen ninety two,
[speaker001:] Right but but
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] clearly we I mean we're just not
[Russell:] We had a very bad time with Ken, the buyer at first.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] At one point he said David was joking too much and I was too flippant. Yeah he did have a good go at us through Shane. Erm but it wo oh it was j [whispering] He's such a wanker. [] Honest [LAUGHTER] I mean [] everybody we talk to who knows him yeah, he really is erm the rep's a bit of skirt, he's well in. Apparently. The the scheduler, Pauline I can't make her out, she seems to be fairly u straight, organized but it had got to the situation where I mean I didn't like it but it happened, we were supplying six months of product and then was supplying six months.
[speaker001:] Mm.
[Russell:] There were two sizes, seven O two O and seven O one O which is used on the. A pair each end. That we were a joint suppliers of. With the seven two O five bearings on the ball screw, the lead screw, which were the seven stroke nines that we used to supply, single source, that's where the big bulk of our business came from and er er a standard E P seven at the other end. A pair of seven two O fives.
[speaker001:] Mm.
[Russell:] Which was joint source. Fortunately one of the good points about losing the seven stroke nine business is that Pauline transferred some of the stock of that seven stroke nine bearing on to the other end. Cos they were replacing it with a radial, they're transferred that stock onto the other end product number. And it's carried over our list, so we've actually picked up the seven two O five now as single source. Which is okay, that's a nice bit about it. The problem is we're still j joint source on the other two. And that's I I had a quick er look through last year's sales and and laid out in fact I went through item deliveries and worked them into the months
[speaker001:] Mm.
[Russell:] to get to see when we dropped off. And you could see all ours coming up to about erm May time bang, then the gap. Obviously when was supplying. And it went to seven months because they did have a downturn in the business so it pushed the quantities back a bit.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] Erm so it went to seven months and then you could see us switch back on time and we switched back on in about November. So I thought, oh that's great, we've got the business through till April. Pauline rings up last week, sent me a fax er with the schedule on and there was the seven O one Os were missing off it so I rang up and said, you know, we've not got any schedule on these two bearings Pauline. Oh I've just sent the fax to for a hundred pairs. I said Well I thought we were supplying now, it was our turn to have the half year. Oh dear I'm sorry, I'll give you the other hundred from for February. Well [LAUGHTER] thanks Pauline but you've cost me how nay thousand pounds worth of business. And to be honest they I I'm whether they're stringing us along or not I don't know. exactly the same position on. He can't make them out, he doesn't know how to handle them. And I must admit with Ken, Ken is is least to blame because he just puts the orders on, Pauline is the one who schedules it, but the scheduling is just the swannee. And trying to tie Pauline down.
[speaker001:] And how often does the schedule happen?
[Russell:] It comes out every fortnight. I mean we might have an order three hundred but if they don't need any it just shows zero so we're we're stuck. The problem is
[speaker001:] Mm.
[Russell:] I always said to them I would much prefer to supply fifty per cent of the monthly usage, spread it out throughout the year. Have half the business with every month. So if they get twenty pairs, we get twenty pairs. If they get ten we get ten. Every month.
[speaker001:] Yeah yeah.
[Russell:] Because the six month period that you get which is is reflected is coming th through now,
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] lose contact with really where you are with them. Suddenly they come on cos they don't give as much notice, they're a pain in the bum.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] We try and keep a bit of stock up front so we don't annoy them you know, so we've got something to react with.
[speaker001:] Yeah yeah.
[Russell:] But it catches us with our pants down and they go back to and blame us for it. But
[speaker001:] Certainly
[Russell:] you lose your control over the schedule. By the time it comes for us to switch it on, they could say, right we want twenty pairs a month at this size, don't know what they're using. Because it's been that long keeping an eye on them that they could be supplying half the business on our time with and then a hundred per cent the rest of the time.
[speaker001:] Mm.
[Russell:] And it's difficult to t tr track it.
[speaker001:] Can you can you try and er erm make some er plea for erm factory stab on the basis of factory stability.
[Russell:] I have done.
[speaker001:] But that erm that we'd actually like so many per month and that that enables us to plan the factory.
[Russell:] Yeah I I did it with Pauline, she she actually didn't mind doing it at one point before Christmas but it hasn't come about and as she said, won't change it, it won't happen. I think we're stuck with it now. This half year supply business which I don't like at all. And the fact that are four per cent cheaper than us and as soon as I mention and increase he says, well if it's dual source we've been told to look at the cheapest source of supply as single source. And then you told me, well are saying eight per cent. Something like that?
[speaker001:] Er I think I think probably they they're going up a little bit later so
[Russell:] Right right
[speaker001:] so basically what what will happen is that they put this order on because they're cheaper at the moment and the next one we shall be cheaper.
[Russell:] We'll be if we get our four per cent
[speaker001:] If we get our four per cent and they get eight per cent.
[Russell:] Mm. But
[speaker001:] Then then then er then we'll be on a par.
[Russell:] Do you know that 'll put it up that much?
[speaker001:] Yes.
[Russell:] Sure? Well not are they asking for it? but have they got it? Because my one fear is saying, yes we need four per cent thinking that are gonna go for eight, ten or whatever to put us on a par
[speaker001:] Well
[Russell:] and go in for five
[speaker001:] Well if
[Russell:] and they're still under us and then they don't create the problem
[speaker001:] Oh no no no no but if the situation is such that er you what you say is that is the s the six months has now started has it?
[Russell:] No no not yet, officially
[speaker001:] Not yet.
[Russell:] but what she did, she sent the fax to them and ordered a hundred pairs. It was only when I rang her up to chase up what had happened to the she says, oh dear I've sent it to the wrong one.. I can't say, you stupid [LAUGHTER] cow. Yeah you know [] you think I put the phone down
[speaker001:] But a hundred pairs for how long? H
[Russell:] That's a couple of well actually what it is the there was a hundred ninety and er then we had er she says but I want the hundred off you in February which was This was at the just bef just after Christmas. So you're talking a month yeah, but you see, they may take a hundred in one go and then leave it a month or so.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] Yeah or two months. I it they're the drop they're take it in isn't the exact requirement.
[speaker001:] Well if
[Russell:] schedule goes like this anyway.
[speaker001:] If you if you need to do something about it, then er in order to secure that order for a hundred, then sell them at the old price.
[Russell:] Mm. Oh I've don that that's alright I mean she's given us
[speaker001:] Yeah. And
[Russell:] the order for them now, we've got the fax.
[speaker001:] Oh we have got it.
[Russell:] Oh yeah got the fax we've got
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] I wasn't.
[speaker001:] Oh right okay.
[Russell:] The problem I've got is is er... I know what I want to do and you told me what are doing, so from that I have a good picture of what how I should approach it. But that is everybody being fair.
[speaker001:] Yeah if Now but th if I've understood you correctly, there's going to be a few months when we don't actually supply anything.
[Russell:] We should be getting at least to March all supplied from us now for the next three or four months it should all be from us.
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] But what's gonna happen is, these little mistakes are happening and are picking it up. Oh dear, sorry, made a mistake, yes?
[speaker001:] Mm.
[Russell:] Er
[speaker001:] Mm.
[Russell:] How do I cope with that. But
[speaker001:] You can't the most difficult situation in in our job is coping with an incompetent buyer or scheduler.
[Russell:] I don't think it's incompetent.... That's the problem
[speaker001:] Well
[Russell:] if she was I could accept it. But she isn't. That's why I'm more suspicious than annoyed. You see what I mean. And happening to know that the r the rep's a bit of skirt, that Ken loves
[speaker001:] Mm.
[Russell:] Yeah I'm I'm I don't know how to And I'm not gonna go and say come on Ken. You know you have to draw the line at how far you can go but I'm f I'm worried about this account definitely. Because I can't I honestly have got a I don't know what's happening. And unfortunately unless can guarantee I mean what what what I would like to know is what they're gonna charge the what they're charging them now and what they're gonna charge them. So we can suit our prices to get. Because if you think about it, this is a w this is a danger we may suffer without actually being able to to get up. Yeah.
[speaker001:] Mm.
[Russell:] I'm not saying they would, but what I'm saying is if say we're four per cent behind and Ken won't give me the exact price
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] it's three four five-ish per cent yeah, and that isn't gonna be on e the same on every product so
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] but say it's four per cent on every size, and I want four, yeah, so I put me four, that's eight per cent above a bit above.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] And go for eight, fine and now I'm on a level playing field.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] But is he fifty P in front of me or fifty P behind, Cos then Ken turns
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] round and says right, cos you've both had an increase, I'm gonna go for the cheapest one. And we've blown it.
[speaker001:] That is that is always a danger.
[Russell:] Yes.
[speaker001:] Erm and and erm er yes that that that is that is a danger, what we have to try and remember although it's no great comfort to you, is that overall, the prize is tremendous
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] in er I mean even if if get their prices up eight per cent and are still under us,
[Russell:] Mm they've done
[speaker001:] then
[Russell:] brilliantly haven't they.
[speaker001:] you know, well they've done brilliantly but the market we've b between us we've got a good for the market.
[Russell:] entire market price even though it cost us the business at this point in time.
[speaker001:] Right. And and there's always the chance of getting it back at a later stage er but the whole market will have moved up a level.
[Russell:] Yeah but I don't want to lose seventy grand's worth of business.
[speaker001:] No now what are the what are the items that that are still being bought as precision items?
[Russell:] There's er three sizes now, that we're down to, the seven O one O, the seven O two O which are the drum bearings and then the seven two O five which is the lead screw bearing.
[speaker001:] Seven two O five.
[Russell:] Yeah. And they're all P
[speaker001:] And
[Russell:] P fours.
[speaker001:] They're all P fours with
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] what sort of things I mean they're singles?
[Russell:] They're pairs.
[speaker001:] They're pairs?
[Russell:] Yeah....
[speaker001:] They're pairs of P five.
[Russell:] P s P four.
[speaker001:] P four?
[Russell:] Yeah E P seven this was. Standard normal precision. The seven stroke nine which is what we call a P three, yeah it's not but
[speaker001:] Yeah yeah.
[Russell:] we've settled on P three, erm the seven two O five one is the one that's been designed out.
[speaker001:] This seven two O five that's I've written down here.
[Russell:] Yeah that's a P four.
[speaker001:] .
[Russell:] That's one end of the lead screw.
[speaker001:] Right so these ones all stay.
[Russell:] Yeah they're they're the present sizes now we're talking about.
[speaker001:] Right. And what prices have we got on those?
[Russell:] Hang on. I'll go and get the price is you want it.
[speaker001:] Yeah get the get get me the prices on those will you. [break in recording]
[Russell:] ...
[speaker001:] You need an extra pair of hands.
[Russell:] These are what I've got on the disks you see. the pricing of it.... If I can find it.... [break in recording] The seven two O fives, twenty six pounds.
[speaker001:] That's pair as well is it?
[Russell:] That's pair yeah.
[speaker001:] Twenty?
[Russell:] Twenty six.
[speaker001:] Twenty six, yeah.
[Russell:] The seven O two Os are a hundred and nine.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] The seven O one Os are twenty nine pounds thirty....
[speaker001:] Golly.
[Russell:] That's it.
[speaker001:] So... that seems to be an extraordinary lack of difference, between a seven two O five and seven O one O.
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] A mere three pounds.
[Russell:] Three pound thirty. Just historically how the prices have been
[speaker001:] Yeah. Right [yawning] these are ninety three prices are they []?
[Russell:] They are ninety three prices yeah.
[speaker001:] And... er at the moment you've asked for four per cent.
[Russell:] Yeah....
[speaker001:] From January?
[Russell:] Yeah....
[speaker001:] Right.... I'll get some more information about that.
[Russell:] Okay. I mean I'm aware of the thing that's what makes me ask you more about that account, but I am worried about it and and actually in a way are in a very good position. Because they can be seen to be playing ball and yet benefit. You know what I mean?
[speaker001:] Mm.
[Russell:] [LAUGHTER] So that's what worries me.
[speaker001:] And you reckon we're we're four per cent you're about four per cent below.
[Russell:] It's about four per cent on each of the prices. But I mean, you know obviously Ken's not gonna tell me exactly what.... If we knew what price were at then it would give me more er confidence to know where we stand and how to go about it. I mean I don't know what the the the the the standing is with our knowledge of information but I would like to think that if there is er erm... not a hidden agenda but agreement being made at a level, that we could share the business.
[speaker001:] Mm.
[Russell:] But what I want to do at my present moment is maintain my share of the business.
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] I'm not interested in taking it off anybody.
[speaker001:] No no. No that's that that is our objective is to maintain the share of business at a higher price level. And erm
[Russell:] I mean even at the risk of probably er the other suppliers making a bit more than us if it means that.
[speaker001:] It'll be interesting if we could find out erm actually what prices are because if he's a good he would have said exactly the same thing to.
[Russell:] Oh yeah. Mm.
[speaker001:] And he will have told that that erm The prices are four per cent below yours dear boy.
[Russell:] but we've always known that they have been below.
[speaker001:] Yeah you've always been told you've always been told that they are.
[Russell:] we've always kept the business cod Ray was the buyer.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] Yeah. And yes I I agree he was a good contact to have but he ain't here any more.
[speaker001:] Yes. And it was predictable
[Russell:] And also
[speaker001:] And it I mean it it doesn't help saying I told you so but I did
[Russell:] Unfortunately
[speaker001:] tell Peter so.
[Russell:] Yeah yeah, well he's gone so don't worry about that.
[speaker001:] Er and erm Yeah he's gone too so.
[Russell:] Why worry about it.
[speaker001:] Erm what er what are our contacts like at a technical level at?
[Russell:] Okay.
[speaker001:] How often do we get a technical visit in there?
[Russell:] Er well it's actually at the technical side is, I I've seen before Christmas. About the new Phoenix machine that er we haven't got a er opportunity for business on anywhere. I've tried and they're not interested.
[speaker001:] What s what sort of bearing was it?
[Russell:] It's a small miniature nine millimetre and fourte thirteen millimetre one. Er a single one and a flanged on as a a pair a matched pair. And I sent off details with the
[speaker001:] A flanged a straight a straight flange?
[Russell:] One straight bearing.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] One plain bearing and one flanged bearing. As a pair.
[speaker001:] What erm
[Russell:] It's reference. Sent it all to Viv with all the details, broke all the reference
[speaker001:] What volumes?
[Russell:] Two thousand a year.
[speaker001:] How how.
[Russell:] Two thousand on one and a thousand on the other.
[speaker001:] Has he re-inquired on Japan?
[Russell:] No. Can I?
[speaker001:] Yes of course you can. Of course cos if [break in recording] particularly pointed out the flanged bearing and said, You know that does the flanged bearings don't you? I said, No I didn't. He said, they do. They do flanged miniature bearings and it is possible therefore that
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] somebody somewhere will know. So what I suggest you do is to give erm Jerry a ring.
[Russell:] Yeah okay. Cos they won't need to be to P four limits.
[speaker001:] Well give Jerry a ring and see if there's anything to offer Yeah yeah. Yeah. Yeah yeah. Yeah. Fine yeah. Yeah.
[Russell:] So Yeah okay I will do yeah. I'll send. Ask for his comments I'll use K John cos he's the machine tool man. So I'll use him as my contact. It's best to keep. Yeah okay. Oh and I've spoken to Tony meeting. I'm arranging to go and see him, it'll be into next month now when
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] I've had me
[speaker001:] Good.
[Russell:] time off and yeah.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] Right okay. So could could you do something on that, worries me.
[speaker001:] I will see what I can find out.
[Russell:] Yeah I'm I'm I'm. I'm stuck to be honest.... I quoted forty per cent on those screw support sizes last Friday.
[speaker001:] Yeah?
[Russell:] I faxed him over on his on Saturday morning. So we'll see what happens. Erm but er what I've just put here is forty per cent margin until price is sorted. We need to
[speaker001:] Okay.
[Russell:] do this visit with Roy and get this price list sorted.
[speaker001:] Waiting his reply.
[Russell:] Right okay. Er
[speaker001:] You you might you might er er
[Russell:] Cos I did have a word with Steve on Friday and said have you seen Jerry and and has he mentioned this
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] and and Steve said, No I hadn't heard of it actually. I said, well look, we intend to fax through to Roy saying, yes we want to do business with you. Yeah?
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] And erm you know, we're waiting for him to come back and say, Yeah we need to talk. Jerry so he said he hadn't seen but he's not necessarily going to.
[speaker001:] Do you do you have direct contract with Jerry?
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] Why don't you give him a ring?
[Russell:] Yeah fair enough.
[speaker001:] And and say erm
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] you know I'm just off likely to be off for for next week and like to get
[Russell:] Right.
[speaker001:] something fixed before I go.
[Russell:] Yeah okay. Right and then he probably ring Roy and Yeah
[speaker001:] You know, use that as an excuse. Yeah.
[Russell:] fine okay. Right okay I think that's it then, er... Okay
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] so one's really the one where I need to involve you. Basically i if you can. Yeah. The rest I'll let you know
[speaker001:] I hear. Erm I I'm also I also quite
[Russell:] Ooh
[speaker001:] would like to know what's going on with and. Whether actually has any er control over what 's doing in the marketplace.
[Russell:] Okay yeah yeah. I know it was Andy last time and he's a guy so yeah, I'll find out.
[speaker001:] Well you find out I might be able to find out to.
[Russell:] Well yeah okay. Erm that was a point,, I er spindle bearings and I want to take the business off 'em. Now with it being, we're not gonna look at a high margin straight away cos I know that's a waste of time. Er but we can make a reasonable margin including spacers. It's a set of three bearings with a pair of spacers. So you have two bearings in tandem, a pair of spacers and a third bearing. And it's their normal machine centre range. They use like about forty pairs a month.
[speaker001:] [yawning] Yeah. []
[Russell:] Erm sell for about eighty seven pound including spacers so I was gonna go in at about eighty three, eighty four but it's the new pricing company so I've got to ask your permission haven't I? [LAUGHTER]. It's a new product, I'm gonna make reasonable It's about thirty five per cent margin
[speaker001:] It's a new product?
[Russell:] No it's it's a new size for us to supply. We've never b
[speaker001:] Well
[Russell:] historically with what's happened is, the design from Japan was taken under licence
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] and they were based around and and designs.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] Now on the five fifty series for example, it's an complete cartridge spindle on the twelve thousand revs, yeah? And we get you know so Anthony would get that business. Because complete spindles come under the precision range of products.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] This is something I was trying to get clarified but I don't care really as long as somebody gets it. Erm... but what happened then is er tended to get the main bearing supply for the normal spindles that manufactured and built.
[speaker001:] Mm.
[Russell:] And that was a set of three angular contact ball bearings, and then a N N thirty double row roller at the rear. Er we're now doing this partnership which was what today was about, about the new generation spindle.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] Erm so that's going great, I think that's really going well so the new design, I think we're well in on. Erm the old on that you know, took me two years to get the bearings approved and er you know but then having to wait a year and a half cos had a year and a half's worth of orders on 'em and promised to hold the price for three years is that's what it took for them to use them up, er has run out, new orders have been put on but I've got the chance of taking the business. Er but erm obviously with the thing again, I wanted er obviously
[speaker001:] What was the
[Russell:] you don't to go to 'em for and they say, well you just took the bloody off me, I want a cut in me.
[speaker001:] Yeah. This is this is
[Russell:] You know I don't want to be seen to be
[speaker001:] This is clearly er erm a situation where erm we must not knowingly take business which we have not enjoyed before at a price below No at a price below... the existing suppliers ninety four prices.
[Russell:] [sigh]
[speaker001:] Now when erm you say are supplying at the moment.
[Russell:] Mhm. Yeah.... The problem is Dave, the buyer at, is worse than Ken [LAUGHTER] []. He's a real dipstick. Yeah? W his last comment. Wh what happened is, Richard was the team section leader, Dave historically looks after the bearings sales. But he's such a dork I'm taking him off it. And they're letting him keep linear. Cos linear is just consignment stock and you know job there. Sally the lass who's taken over the buying for precision bearings, is a great lass got on great with her, and Richard. And they want to come and see the factory, they want to go to yeah, it fell down cos Richard was too busy at the end of last year, fine get that sorted and i Sally was dropped in the crap by right at the end of last year, came on five sets of bearings, I could've done 'em in two weeks. I said I'll get you in two weeks, wallop wallop It's alright, to do it, they have 'em back in a month. We're alright you know, they only way you'll get the business, he's like that, he talks like that, is if you can you know offer a big price saving.
[speaker001:] That I'm afraid that's one thing you can't do
[Russell:] Alright.
[speaker001:] even if it means that this year Yeah yeah. Er
[Russell:] From my own point of view I want the business but bearing in mind what's happening I'm asking you before I do anything.
[speaker001:] Erm I
[Russell:] Should I let the dust settle first?
[speaker001:] Yes.
[Russell:] So I'll leave it.
[speaker001:] E you either either leave it or
[Russell:] If I quote three or four quid underneath, he'll consider it and we may get an order in a few months time when the schedule runs out. Do you want me just to leave it?
[speaker001:] I think what you could sensibly say, to them, is, Look, I gather you've had supply problems with
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] Cos I was there when it happened.
[speaker001:] And s n a look you won't have supply problems with us.
[Russell:] Mhm.
[speaker001:] And you could say, look what we've done with.
[Russell:] Yeah
[speaker001:] Competitors of yours. Yeah. Competitors of yours, wanted bearings in a week, we got 'em bearings in a
[Russell:] The problem the problem is that's happened with the design people. Yeah?
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] I have been given Roy, the dra the engineering the the senior designer, Dennis er Kev who's our
[speaker001:] Mm Mm.
[Russell:] he was a development manager, I've been giving 'em earache for the last year and a half, saying, you are falling behind man. We're up and running with, we've got the test rig going, new spindle bearings up, we're pushing it. Yeah?
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] And it's taken that long for Dave to get his arse in gear and he's a so slow. He's he's he's been reluctant to do anything because he's had other things to do.
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] But Malcolm in in the end got him to do something.
[speaker001:] Who who who are the who's the boss of these erm wankish buyers?
[Russell:] Richard was the team leader, he's the guy for me to work on. I know I could do it
[speaker001:] Who's his boss? Who's his boss?
[Russell:] Well Peter but er
[speaker001:] Who's Peter.
[Russell:] Peter 's the group er materials manager. But I wouldn't. He's not one that you can lean on. Er to wh actually leave it with me because Richard 's the guy. And Sally is taking over from David, it's a handover period.
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] Because Sally's not she doesn't understand one end of a bearing from another.
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] She used to do a bit of part time buying from the accounts department.
[speaker001:] Yeah yeah.
[Russell:] She's come down now to take over buying and she thinks Dave's [whispering] a wanker. []
[speaker001:] A prat.
[Russell:] Yeah?
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] And I can get Richard and and Sally interested
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] but David's sat there at the minute in the background.
[speaker001:] Right. Now Yes wait
[Russell:] What I need to do is get him out the way.
[speaker001:] till he's out of the way,
[Russell:] Right.
[speaker001:] and suggest to your Sally
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] that you on on one of your visits it would be a very good idea if you sat down with her and the engineering pal
[Russell:] Yeah, and Roy.
[speaker001:] Yes?
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] And you have a c not not necessarily with not necessarily with the boss
[Russell:] No no mm.
[speaker001:] Yeah. But just the the the buyer
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] and the engineer.
[Russell:] Right.
[speaker001:] And s and begin to drive them with a consolidated plan. Look wh you're in this business for a long time, things take an awful long time to happen in this world
[Russell:] Mm. Mm.
[speaker001:] you know that, I know that. So we've got to get our plans sorted out. I want to help you do that. No Sally's new at the job, we've been working at this for for on on the technical front for some time, now let's just sit down and and work out what we're gonna do. Is that alright?
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Yeah, so try and bring those two together
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] because if if you do that, and it begins to erm o occur to her and if she's fairly bright
[Russell:] Mm she doesn't seem daft yeah. She's not clever cos she's bearings,
[speaker001:] Erm it it it no
[Russell:] she doesn't seem engineering clever.
[speaker001:] No.
[Russell:] But she's not daft.
[speaker001:] No but but you're gonna help them.
[Russell:] Yeah yeah.
[speaker001:] You're going to your object in life is to help her do the job better.
[Russell:] Right.
[speaker001:] And explain to her. And by sitting down and having a technical and commercial conversation together
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] you can sort of chair that that
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] meeting and help her to understand
[Russell:] how much we're helping them through this.
[speaker001:] and appreciate how much else we can do. And and okay if we're a pound or two different.
[Russell:] We're forty minutes up the road.
[speaker001:] Yeah. Yeah.
[Russell:] If we can't e e I've had a couple of months of stock on the shelf for 'em.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] In fact I must admit, I hinted to Dave if if linear will do consignment stock for, why shouldn't we if we're only forty minutes away. But I mean that's the last thing I wanna do but
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] but even then we could have consignment stock here in effect cos they're only forty minutes away, we could throw 'em in the back of the car and have 'em delivered.
[speaker001:] Well that's what we've got we've got consignment stock here, it's on our premises
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] so they don't have the problem of of of of of
[Russell:] Yeah
[speaker001:] the hassle of stocking it and so on.
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] So you know
[Russell:] I've just got this David thing and and the thing in the background. I didn't want to tread on toes.
[speaker001:] Well well you've got a lovely you've got a lovely opportun You've got a lovely opportunity there to sell the non-price benefits.
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] Just have a try and h try and set up a c a a a meeting with this Sally and your engineering winger
[Russell:] Yeah okay.
[speaker001:] and don't talk price at all.
[Russell:] No.
[speaker001:] And than at a later stage go bock and have a go at Sally and and remind her of all these good things that you talked about.
[Russell:] The problem is we're buttoned down on deliveries on standard bearings cos of the balls up about.
[speaker001:] Well okay so you've got to talk
[Russell:] [LAUGHTER].
[speaker001:] you've got to talk your way through that. It's the precision bearings that's really the prize.
[Russell:] I mean that's why. Yes.
[speaker001:] And and and of course now that er now that we've got the total business beginning to operate as one, the chances of letting them down on standard bearings is very much smaller than it ever was before.
[Russell:] Yeah.
[speaker001:] The problem the reason we've let her down on standard bearings is because of this changeover.
[Russell:] Mm. Oh yeah.
[speaker001:] You see it's got nothing to do with the with our
[Russell:] No no.
[speaker001:] competence as a supplier.
[Russell:] No. Yeah okay. Alright.
[speaker001:] I'll give you something to
[Russell:] I'm going tomorrow morning there anyway cos Roy's just given me a call, they've got some problems with screw support bearings locking up, but er I'll go over there some time
[speaker001:] Right.
[Russell:] . Yeah.
[speaker001:] Yeah.
[Russell:] . So I'll Sally.
[speaker001:] Okay, is that happiness?
[Russell:] Right, yeah okay. Erm just the one's me main concern. I mean the others you know it's it's what we get and and sort of thing. With them it's it's yeah.
[speaker001:] Mm.
[Russell:] Erm I'm not happy with them and I don't know how you get round it. Knowing what's happening there.
[speaker001:] Well er at the end of the day it may be one that we're gonna we're gonna lose but erm
[Russell:] Mm.
[speaker001:] If it is [recording ends]