[B. Singh:] cos I got the earphones. Oh no that's a point it won't just, I can't
[speaker002:] Well
[B. Singh:] hear what they say.
[Justin:] Cos sometimes these Walkmans have a built-in speaker something like that.
[B. Singh:] Yes. But I thin, this one hasn't so
[speaker002:] I can put it all down.
[B. Singh:] Are you following it? Did you hear it on the radio this morning about the research that the, these people are doing?
[speaker002:] No.
[B. Singh:] They were talking about language on Radio Four and erm... what people e, it isn't anything to do with the training course we're on, it's the language. It's nothing to do with T N T or anything er... at all, it's just... er they that organization has wro written to a number of large companies and asked them to... er... record er, so many, er tapes so they can analyse it. But really they're looking at the... the er sounds you're making and the language you're using rather what, they're not interested in what we're saying.
[speaker002:] what people? What age?
[Justin:] on me.
[speaker004:] What is it for?
[B. Singh:] ... [LAUGHTER]
[speaker004:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] And I won't ask you what situation
[Justin:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] you were in when you found that out.
[speaker004:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Right. Let's have a look at what yo, who's gonna represent us on the old er... features and benefits this morning?
[speaker004:] Phil.
[B. Singh:] It's gonna be Phil. Oh right Phil.
[P. Ford:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Elected. Good old Phil. Okay. What did we
[speaker002:] [cough]
[B. Singh:] have?
[speaker002:] [cough]
[Justin:] Good of you to volunteer Phil?
[P. Ford:] Sorry?
[Justin:] Good of you to volunteer.
[P. Ford:] It was, weren't it?
[J. Gibson:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Do you want me to, to write it up for you
[P. Ford:] Yeah
[B. Singh:] somewhere? Yeah?
[P. Ford:] Yeah. Yeah.
[B. Singh:] Can you talk us through
[P. Ford:] Well this is
[B. Singh:] them?
[P. Ford:] what I've done, I done... about seventeen of them.
[B. Singh:] Right.
[P. Ford:] Well we done about seventeen of them... but mainly on the super mail side but we stick to the one sort of with
[speaker002:] [cough]
[B. Singh:] Yeah.
[P. Ford:] Erm... on the first one it's the before nine service... er basically
[B. Singh:] Yeah.
[P. Ford:] a benefit for the customer that it is a guarantee before nine. Erm... it is obviously beneficial particularly for banks and financial institutions to use
[B. Singh:] In what way?
[P. Ford:] Well they start work quite early and they can get cheques processed erm... situations like that.
[B. Singh:] Yeah. So what
[P. Ford:] And then
[B. Singh:] what, what's the benefit then? Just, what is the benefit.
[speaker002:] It's there at the start of a new day.
[B. Singh:] See
[P. Ford:] It's there somehow.
[B. Singh:] that's the benefit? Describing the feature is only describing the feature.
[P. Ford:] Mhm.
[B. Singh:] Before means, nine, means your getting it there before nine you said and er, that means it's there nice and early. [LAUGHTER] That's describing a feature [].
[speaker002:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] The benefit of getting it there early... and... a little leap word which takes you from a feature to a benefit
[P. Ford:] Which means
[B. Singh:] Well done. Which means that... so you have to make
[speaker002:] [sighing] Ah ah [].
[B. Singh:] it into sentences by a little leap word
[P. Ford:] Actually I've got it on here but I just don't like saying it all the time. I've got a
[B. Singh:] Ah ah!
[P. Ford:] I've got it on top of bank though.
[B. Singh:] Okay.
[P. Ford:] Right.
[B. Singh:] Before nine
[P. Summers:] You just wrote that though.
[P. Ford:] Eh?
[P. Summers:] You just wrote that.
[P. Ford:] Yeah.
[P. Summers:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Which means you, that you can start... what was your words Jenny?
[J. Fowles:] So you can start the working day.
[B. Singh:] means that it's ready for the start... of the working day... giving you a
[P. Ford:] Eh?
[B. Singh:] that's the real benefit. Alright.
[P. Ford:] [cough]
[B. Singh:] There at the start of the working day, giving you, you've gotta say that next step... and tell them, okay, if you can say so what, you haven't told them the benefit. Okay? So what? Let's see how many so whats you can come up with after this. Okay. Go on. So what's the next one?
[P. Ford:] Again, before ten thirty it is a guaranteed service before ten thirty... which is a benefit.
[B. Singh:] No. Before ten thirty guaranteed is a feature. It is built in by design. We build that in. If you build it in by design, like we build this in
[P. Ford:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] and the design... of that was so that it will stay on, built in by design. And should stay on. Which means that... what did we say yesterday? Right. And therefore helps with your presentation simply. That's the benefit. Right. So, the fact that it's guaranteed that, we've actually built that in by design which makes it a feature.
[speaker002:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] What he, what the customer gets out of that is what? So
[P. Ford:] Well, on, on the ten, ten thirty one
[B. Singh:] Yeah.
[P. Ford:] I've put it very similar to that of the nine o'clock one... really.
[B. Singh:] Which it, it is. It's still
[P. Ford:] Yeah I've I
[B. Singh:] the elements of time really, yeah?
[P. Ford:] That's it. It's just cos I, I couldn't do a lot more about that one.
[B. Singh:] What other things, what other things other than giving them actually
[speaker004:] Cheaper. They're paying less
[P. Ford:] Well it's, it's an option
[speaker004:] and they might
[P. Ford:] as well isn't it? They got an option.
[speaker004:] sometimes get it before
[J. Gibson:] Nine.
[speaker004:] nine. Yeah.
[B. Singh:] It gives them, what does, what does options give you?
[P. Ford:] A choice.
[J. Fowles:] A choice.
[B. Singh:] It's choice, and I feel I'm, I'm able to choose... what does that make me feel?
[speaker004:] Good.
[speaker002:] In charge.
[B. Singh:] In charge. Can I use the word control now then? Yeah? You're saying in charge is sort of like, I am in charge which is like this.
[P. Ford:] It is if you make the customer feel they are literally
[B. Singh:] That's right.
[J. Fowles:] Yeah.
[P. Ford:] in charge of their
[B. Singh:] Now
[P. Ford:] service.
[J. Fowles:] They like that.
[B. Singh:] I like to know what's happening. Yeah. Adrian
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] said look Ka Kath, gotta get to Plymouth tonight, I need to know. Cos you, here he needs to know as well, don't you? You sit here today knowing that something's gonna be done. Because it couldn't wait until lunchtime and that, that's perfectly understandable because he wants to feel in control of what's going to happen to some degree, rather than just be at the mercy of someone else's position. He wants to be part, you know, influence that decision, and that's important to all of us isn't it? To know where we stand. You know people say, I like to know where we stand. I like to know whe, know where I stand. People love the feeling of being in control. And the before nine guarantees, just give them the time factor again. Er, that enables that they choose how much time they need, er because it, do I need to go that time or that time? And that gives them control. And as you say... it's one of the best things that they want. Because, when you subcontract it out, has anybody changed hairdressers? Or changed banks? Use a service where they've changed before now?
[speaker002:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] Was there an element of risk involved? Were you a bit concerned at the time making the decision? Worrying about what might happen? And everybo, when you contract out something, when you ask someone else to do something for you. Ooh oh! There's just that... doubt. Obviously, repeat experiences, good ones, gives you peace of mind. But what I'm saying is, it's this that you really want. And becau, that's one of the most valuable benefits you can give a customer... time and control. Any more?
[P. Ford:] Yeah the er, the noon one.
[B. Singh:] Mhm.
[P. Ford:] You're fo, guaranteed
[B. Singh:] Oh yeah.
[P. Ford:] before noon.
[B. Singh:] Oh sorry. The noon, yeah. Again, we come into... which means that... what?
[P. Ford:] Well it's, I put down on here that er, it's a benefit for customers that possibly their shops close half day where they can have collections, er sorry deliveries in the morning... so that they've got benefit of having deliveries A M
[B. Singh:] Right.
[P. Ford:] only.
[B. Singh:] Well done. Again, we're back to... being involved
[P. Ford:] Choice, yeah.
[B. Singh:] and choice. Well done. Yeah.
[P. Ford:] And als, erm... and on them three services is what we said a few moments ago, they got the choice of three different options.
[B. Singh:] Right.
[P. Ford:] So that the
[B. Singh:] Really, you're giving them time and control and it's up to you, it's an alternative choice on the whole thing.
[P. Ford:] I dunno whether a price would be a feature or a benefit. I mean it's gotta be
[B. Singh:] I think
[P. Ford:] a benefit
[B. Singh:] Yes.
[P. Ford:] to them.
[B. Singh:] Be, yes certainly. But obviously people always receives the choice doesn't it? If, well it's a value judgement they make isn't it? But I don't think selling price saving is a, I don't think putting money up front first is a good idea.
[P. Ford:] No. Because if you put it up front first, what do we now discuss everything around?
[speaker002:] Money.
[B. Singh:] Money.
[P. Ford:] That's right, yeah.
[B. Singh:] D'ya see what I mean?
[J. Worrow:] That dictates.
[B. Singh:] That's right. What I'm saying is, you always assume that that is people's... er albeit, which it is obviously isn't it? But
[J. Worrow:] You're detracting from the real issue of their needs.
[B. Singh:] That's right. That's right. Why, I mean it might not be worth anything, I mean, you know, it's a value, you can't, you can't start influencing them about money to early, because it's the value benefit of that... that they're really looking at. So I would keep money well out of it.
[P. Ford:] Last thing innit, really?
[B. Singh:] Yeah. Because when he makes out... mu,bi how much is this worth? Is what, is where the money thing is coming in... not, how much he saves on the level of service. And then he makes a value judgement. Is it worth it? No. You get a taxi sometimes don't you? To places. You don't have to go in your own transport. What's the deciding factor? Are there special taxis?
[speaker002:] Mhm.
[B. Singh:] No. Is it worth it sometimes?
[speaker002:] Yeah it is.
[B. Singh:] Would you use it as an everyday mode of transport? Yeah.
[speaker002:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] You see what I mean? Some people do. Some people get taxis everywhere. Do their shopping... with a taxi. Because for some people... there may be a value judgement made about it. I don't know. But what I'm saying is, is that everybody makes their own value judgement and be careful that you're not making, imposing your value onto them. Th they're free to judge. Yeah? Next one?
[P. Ford:] Saturday... Saturday delivery.
[B. Singh:] Right.
[P. Ford:] Erm, again it's an option for them to have if need be. Er, but I've put down here that erm... but possibly some retail outlets... although the Saturday is the busiest day of their week they might important merchandise... to arrive particularly at, you know, Jaeger shops, expensive shops... where like the price of the item warrants paying a Saturday surcharge.
[B. Singh:] Alright.
[P. Ford:] So certain areas can have delivery Saturday.
[B. Singh:] What are the things apart from the value of the item ones in erm... you're right... Phil, by the way I'm not saying you're wrong.
[speaker002:] The urgency of the package.
[P. Ford:] Convenience.
[speaker002:] If a restaurant needed a microwave cos they're open all weekend they couldn't wait till Monday.
[B. Singh:] Well what about erm... working weeks... for industry and... commerce.
[speaker002:] A lot of Six a lot of factories Yeah. do open on a Saturday
[J. Worrow:] That's right.
[speaker002:] and they don't actually do collections, they don't actually do, do any production.
[B. Singh:] What do they do?
[speaker002:] They do all the Cleaning. clean up on a Saturday.
[B. Singh:] Right.
[P. Ford:] I've put that down. Mhm. Put that
[B. Singh:] Right.
[P. Ford:] down.
[B. Singh:] Mm mm mm.
[P. Ford:] Cos
[B. Singh:] That's what we want. Obviously, it's again, it's control so, so... a Saturday delivery
[speaker002:] [clears throat]
[B. Singh:] could give you the benefit of erm... reduce down time. Have you heard that expression? When, if a production line is going and the production breaks down... but er... if we can reduce our time, has anybody worked in a... in a, er, a co, an industrial environment on, what sort of cost saving could you
[speaker002:] Well
[B. Singh:] say er, a production of say two hours would be where you worked, would you know that time?
[speaker002:] Er er
[B. Singh:] On a production line?
[speaker002:] choo choo choo choo choo choo
[B. Singh:] Er, to give some, but none of us have worked in that environment and it's not something we're familiar with.
[speaker002:] To be honest it's really difficult to put a cost to that.
[B. Singh:] Hundreds or thousands.
[speaker002:] Er, thousands.
[B. Singh:] Thousands. I mean we're talking big numbers an hour aren't we really?
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[J. Worrow:] In the steel industry we'll probably
[speaker002:] I mean
[J. Worrow:] talk in terms of both.
[B. Singh:] Tens of thousands per hour?
[J. Worrow:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] Terry? Yeah? So what I'm saying is, is getting a delivery... if you can't get something there in time... I mean, it may mean that you know in advance that you need something done and you can deliver in a normal working week, but maybe it's inconvenient in a normal working week. Maybe, there's nobody really there, maybe it's engineer brought on site.
[P. Ford:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] Because you're not, although you're using the... power space, the power er er of the production line or equipment, they might not be, that might not be what you're making, you're just using that kit and you need the supplier of that kit to bring an engineer in and you need to get a part of it, but you want control of that rather than just waiting on a supplier to do it for you. Yeah?
[speaker002:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] And that reduces our time. We are now talking... a few over there. It may be making
[A. Bond:] Quite... quite often you tend to find in industry where... er, if you're dealing with mechanical bits and pieces
[B. Singh:] Mhm.
[A. Bond:] if you've got one bit that can't work without another bit, and the bits can be relatively cheap, say may only be about twenty P a bit, but if the twenty P bit doesn't arrive to work with the other bit
[B. Singh:] One of the
[A. Bond:] then it's worth [LAUGHTER] twenty thousand [].
[B. Singh:] I suppose it'll be into your. . Well said Andrew. Do you know what this is?
[speaker002:] Mm.
[A. Bond:] Well that's a bulb, you need one without the other, so... if that doesn't arrive so you're knackered.
[B. Singh:] What do you reckon it's used for... that? What do you reckon it's used for? That sort of thing.
[speaker002:] Probably used for machinery
[B. Singh:] Yeah. If I looked on one of your er... account... entries, it would probably say... fastening. Now to me, what's a fastening to you?
[speaker002:] Zip.
[B. Singh:] A zip.
[speaker002:] Zip.
[B. Singh:] Mm, yeah.
[speaker002:] A button.
[B. Singh:] A button. Yeah. But fastening is a complete industry. It's how we've, on the actual er vehicles... there is actual metal fastenings that's holding the whole trailer together.
[speaker002:] Rivets.
[B. Singh:] Yeah. Rivets, or fastenings. Right? This' d probably be used for... a construction of some sort I would imagine. Would you?... Maybe er
[speaker002:] Bolting tasks.
[B. Singh:] Bo, holding machinery through er a base of some sort. Yeah. Some, I mean... it's the sort of item that people probably buy hundreds of to hold items down with or construct something, er er put something together right? How much do you reckon it's worth?
[speaker002:] Not, not a lot.
[B. Singh:] Be interesting, ha?
[speaker002:] About four pound. I don't think it will be but
[B. Singh:] Four pound. Which bit's worth more than the other two?
[speaker002:] The bolt is.
[B. Singh:] Yeah. Do you
[speaker002:] Either.
[B. Singh:] reckon they sell them like that? D'ya think they... some people buy... cos they need more... oops... because they need more of these than these at some time? No. Or, they maybe replacing some of these but they got plenty of these, or they're replacing some of these but they've got plenty of these? Yeah? I reckon that you'd probably buy those cheaper than this item because of the raw materials would you say?
[J. Worrow:] Yep.
[B. Singh:] I mean
[speaker002:] Plus that's a lot, lot smaller.
[B. Singh:] They probably come in sets, yeah? Or people order them together, yeah?
[speaker002:] [clears throat]
[B. Singh:] If you were ordering hundreds... and hundreds of these would you put, express them through a parcel delivery service?
[P. Ford:] No.
[B. Singh:] Someone else here.
[speaker002:] Well probably not, no.
[B. Singh:] Would you probably,
[speaker002:] Well no.
[B. Singh:] how d'ya reckon people buy these? How are they delivered?
[speaker002:] At a time. Box. Box. [phone rings]
[B. Singh:] They probably get them on pallets and stuff like that.... Tell them to ring back?
[J. Worrow:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] And er [phone rings] so, if I was to walk into the place that was selling these
[J. Worrow:] [on telephone] Hello. []
[B. Singh:] what sort of picture have you got of the environment I'm in?
[J. Worrow:] She will call you back.
[speaker002:] Industries.
[B. Singh:] It's in a heavy industrial warehouses, they're, they're, they're they're probably pressing these out at quite a rate of knots aren't they?
[J. Worrow:] It's... er Bob student they've asked to interrupt the.
[B. Singh:] Oh! Oh well I apologise for that then.
[P. Ford:] You'll need a then won't you?
[B. Singh:] Shall we go up? Apologise for this. [on telephone] Hello []. You can carry on.
[J. Worrow:] Where were we? Where were we?
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[P. Ford:] Construction engineering manufacturing.
[J. Worrow:] Construction engineering. Oh, well I think we've got to the point haven't we, where these are probably cheaper than the bolts. And they're
[B. Singh:] Hello.
[J. Worrow:] they bolt like this in pairs
[B. Singh:] Hello? How did you get
[J. Worrow:] as, as a pair.
[B. Singh:] then?
[J. Worrow:] but what tends to happen? Probably if you'd brought something from M F I.
[speaker002:] You got one missing.
[P. Ford:] Missing. You got one missing.
[speaker002:] You got, you know.
[J. Worrow:] Yeah. Yeah.
[J. Fowles:] Yeah.
[J. Worrow:] And what usually goes missing?
[J. Fowles:] The bolt.
[J. Worrow:] Nearly always the nuts.
[J. Fowles:] Mm.
[speaker002:] [clears throat]
[J. Worrow:] So er, what we've got is a situation where somebody's ordered maybe a couple of thousand of these
[J. Gibson:] But no nuts.
[J. Worrow:] but they want, no, they've got the nuts as well.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[J. Worrow:] But inevitably they've been sort of thrown in a corner and people have fiddled around with them like I've fiddled around with this and we find we got what, twenty or thirty of these missing. Now, we're talking about a totally different situation. The weight is different... the numbers are
[speaker002:] [clears throat]
[J. Worrow:] significantly less... and so you might well consider... the need to use this means
[J. Fowles:] [clears throat]
[J. Worrow:] we, can't use them as you were saying earlier Adrian, yeah we can't use one part without the other.
[A. Bond:] Yeah.
[J. Worrow:] It is necessary. So, this now becomes very urgent. And so we might well Express these then or even send erm
[A. Bond:] I suppose for the construction industry you're then looking at
[speaker002:] [clears throat]
[A. Bond:] perhaps when you po produce like the channel tunnel and things
[J. Worrow:] Yep.
[A. Bond:] like that, where it's labour intensive that you're paying people maybe thirty, forty, fifty pound a hour
[J. Worrow:] That's right. And if they're sitting there
[J. Fowles:] Yeah, that's right, yeah.
[J. Worrow:] on their backsides waiting for nuts
[A. Bond:] , you know
[J. Worrow:] Yep.
[A. Bond:] then it's... not just the intrinsic value of the items themselves
[J. Worrow:] Yep.
[A. Bond:] It's the
[speaker002:] That's a consequential loss.
[J. Worrow:] In fact you could in
[A. Bond:] in
[J. Worrow:] yeah in fact that's a fir, that's a very good example you see, because in that situation you might well pay more for the carriage than the value of the item
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[J. Worrow:] because of the other things that you're losing, er guys sitting
[speaker002:] Mm mm.
[J. Worrow:] on their backsides
[A. Bond:] Overtime
[J. Worrow:] getting paid whatever it is.
[A. Bond:] and cost, overheads.
[J. Worrow:] O, other machinery maybe, maybe you're burning electricity unnecessarily because of er having to keep
[speaker002:] To stay warm.
[J. Worrow:] compressors and things running. Allsorts of costs may well be impinging on this. So you find yourself... maybe paying well over the price of the value of the item
[speaker002:] Mm mm.
[J. Worrow:] just to get it there because it's urgent. Think of any other examples?
[P. Ford:] Well clothing might have said, important merchandise, clothing
[J. Worrow:] Yep.
[P. Summers:] In a place I used to
[speaker004:] Eyes.
[P. Summers:] work
[J. Worrow:] [clears throat]
[P. Summers:] at least I think at work
[speaker004:] operation Pete is it? [LAUGHTER]
[J. Worrow:] What, what was that Carly?
[speaker004:] Eyes.
[J. Worrow:] Yeah. Course, yeah.
[speaker004:] [LAUGHTER]
[P. Summers:] Mo
[J. Worrow:] Organs.
[P. Summers:] Most products used in er manufacturing, whether it's in pharmaceuticals, food, industry, er all products that rely on, you know being there on time
[J. Worrow:] Yeah.
[P. Summers:] to meet, meet that kind of.
[speaker004:] I mean, even deadlines isn't it? Magazine
[J. Worrow:] Yep.
[speaker004:] deadlines.
[J. Worrow:] well my wife's in the rag trade... and... this morning she's got er, a fashion show starting, and I'll bet you, I don't know this, but I'll bet you at least two of her manufacturers... will have sent her samples to put in that show... which probably will arrive at nine o'clock this morning. Now how they're gonna send them I don't know, but I can assure you they will send them in a hurry. Cos they were probably putting buttons on, or doing the last stitching
[speaker002:] Last night.
[J. Worrow:] last night.
[speaker002:] That's it. Mm.
[J. Worrow:] Now it isn't,th the value it doesn't matter there. What they're doing is they're sending it so that somebody will place orders. And they could find themselves with, you know, somebody asking for a thousand of an item... and it's well worth their while therefore, spending a bit of money getting it there.
[B. Singh:] That was Adrian's, also, that was Adrian's point. Exactly Adrian.
[J. Worrow:] Yep.
[B. Singh:] And this is when you've been on the receiving end of it. Now, some of us haven't. I've never worked where I've had to get materials together and... you know, sort things out. I've worked in advertising.
[speaker002:] You see it in the crisp industry, they're all
[B. Singh:] Yes.
[speaker002:] they're all
[B. Singh:] well
[speaker002:] No salted crisps.
[B. Singh:] We were
[J. Worrow:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] well to be fair, first i
[speaker002:] Times I got that in.
[B. Singh:] ha, how can I say, what,whe when you're talking about fa, I mean fast moving consumer good are fast
[speaker002:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] moving off the shelves and into the shop and, what we would do was erm... deli people now do er, stock an order by computer and, and people like Sainsburys were doing that in the seventies, you know, and they would actually work over... er work on erm... data erm, from their computer... and order er erm... you know, okay, they'd be an event at the weekend or something and they'd, they'd of, increase it or something, but they would technically work out exactly what the throughput of certain items were.
[J. Worrow:] And it goes through the till now doesn't it?
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] Well, yes, they have a comput yes they have the computer software. In my, in my day probably someone did it a little bit off that, different
[J. Worrow:] Maybe.
[B. Singh:] but the, but the proce, the, er the, the whole thing works on the same principal but now they're doing it without, with less effort. Now what I'm saying is, is the retail trade or the sharp end of th, you know,i it's, it's very much, it's staying alive. If you over stock, you're dead!
[A. Bond:] You know I mentioned
[B. Singh:] Yes.
[A. Bond:] the manufacturing point, from that end, not from the end- user to get the products, to, to the retail
[B. Singh:] Yeah.
[A. Bond:] outlets, I meant that
[B. Singh:] Ye, you're probably right. But I mean to be fair we used to we, warehouse... thousands of tons of potatoes in Leicestershire, you see what I mean? We've made
[A. Bond:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] we make er, you know you feel, ah my factory we thinks looking at
[A. Bond:] Like a.
[B. Singh:] see looked at, looking, looking, look how we treat our potato, aren't they gorgeous! You know, and tha, we wouldn't go and have a look at a parcel machine system we'd look at lovely potatoes,. And Marks and Spencers use the same potato. Can you just get your girls to wear their hats on each layer and we'll have your potato,the, you know, that's how you used to get the Marks, get their Marks and Spencers account. A, but what I'm sa,wha the point you were making Adrian, is tha, is is... that's what you've gotta keep in mind about every time you walk into a business or phone up a business, that it does matter that it's in, your, that's not what we want... cos I'm telling you, you know, don't you know, the security guys... photographing, you know, lampposts and stuff like that. But if it's a bolt that holds a lamppost down and they've under... under-ordered, there's not, but they're with them, then we can take those. The other thing is, is docu, documents are the same. If, there are, there are industry working to deadlines all the time. I in... Terry was just mentioning his wife's business, in advertising, d'ya, would sell the advertising space in your feature or your magazine or whatever... try and get the bleeders to send you that what they wanna put in it!
[speaker002:] A friend of mine sends things like that and they gotta be... and the proofs have to be sent.
[B. Singh:] Honestly!
[speaker002:] You know.
[B. Singh:] Oh trying to get companies to decide
[speaker002:] [clears throat]
[B. Singh:] how they're gonna say, what they're gonna say, coming up with art work ideas and whatever. And it was always to,ye, you know, you ask a commercial artist what sort of lead time, that's another, another er... another word that you might come across, because again, you don't want them to speak our jargon but we can speak there's. You know, if I said to Terry's wife, Mrs, how much lead time do you need to set up your show? What would she say? What does sh, what do I mean by lead time?
[Justin:] To set it up, the amount of time it takes her to get it up, be prepared
[B. Singh:] That's right.
[Justin:] for it.
[B. Singh:] what about... we, and if I, if one of her suppliers I asked them, if I said well okay, if we feature your outfit here, how much lead time you ne, do you need from order to production? What do I now mean?... If I place the order today how much lead time do you want? What do I mean?
[Justin:] Actually the time from er
[J. Fowles:] Time.
[Justin:] when the order placed to the, when it's gonna be on the rack and ready.
[B. Singh:] In i, actually in my shop is what I mean. Now
[J. Worrow:] It doesn't work that way in the rag trade that. Remember I was saying to you about the whole of the rag trade? I know it's gonna cost sending them by the way.
[B. Singh:] Mhm.
[J. Worrow:] And the rag trade was... also upside down ready on the trailer to come across, I won't bore you with the way they do their budgeting for example, but what happens is, my wife will go to one of those suppliers and say... yes, a number of my people want to buy that dress so we want a thousand of them. And I want them on, such and such a day.
[B. Singh:] Alright.
[J. Worrow:] That's no problem. It's not
[B. Singh:] Fine.
[J. Worrow:] how long does it take you, what's your lead time?
[B. Singh:] So really what's the, what
[J. Worrow:] You get it there on time.
[B. Singh:] What, what you're saying is, is the lead, if I ask that question then now they would say,tha when, when do you want it?
[J. Worrow:] That's right.
[B. Singh:] It's like, if you go... to, I've heard, I've not been, but if you go to Hong Kong, you can have a suit made overnight.
[speaker002:] Yeah? Yeah.
[B. Singh:] That's a tailor-made, handmade suit that is stitched
[speaker002:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] overnight.
[J. Worrow:] And shirts.
[B. Singh:] And shirts
[speaker002:] [cough]
[B. Singh:] made. In Thailand while you wait.... Cos they will just say, they'll just sit down and make it. Measure you up... make it cos they want... the money. Cos, that's what they need. Because labour, there's loads of it... and it's very cheap. And really, what the rag trade's famous for is labour, very cheap. And that's why they can
[J. Worrow:] Stretch it.
[B. Singh:] That's right. And that's why they can
[J. Worrow:] You've been watching House of Elliot.
[B. Singh:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] What I'm saying is, that's why they respond in that way, which, in in other industries and comp, businesses, er, we have different er, things to consider don't we? Like arranging where they're bought and so on. Now T N T do something, when d'ya want it? We'll get it there. We'll get it there. Because, I mean, if we can't do it through T N T overnight i, if tomorrow's too late who do we use? And if they say well, we want erm... seventy five different locations served with crisps stands by ten o'clock tomorrow because our advert is going out... on national T V tomorrow... can we do it?
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] And we then go and recruit, we'll go the, you know, we'll go to the job centres and get them.
[speaker002:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] Or, they'll turn round, if the money's, if the money is big enough, they'll turn round to anybody who works for us and say, d'ya wanna join us? Come and join us. Get your kit on and do a bit, d'ya know what I mean? And they'll just ask people to partake and we'll get it done. If it's, if it's, feasible we'll get it done. And that's the sort of ethos that T N T's got. But we're likely to make more money at it than... perhaps the sweat shops do. So what I'm saying is, is lead time in lots of business is highly valuable... but... if you can cut down the delivery time and give them more lead time... you're actually extending
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] the lead time by tightening up and this is where your time deliveries come in. Because, although it's before nine... erm, the next morning... erm... you're actually giving them now more lead time, you've given them another day because an, sometime tomorrow... you know, if it gets there at two o'clock and it's off-loading in in in at the bay and someone checks that it's been received and then someone makes a phone call to tell them it's there, and then they're doing something else, and then they come down and have a look at it, how many boxes do you think are sitting on loading bays that don't get looked at for a day or two, or three, or four, five... when they've had a next day service? Quite a few.
[speaker004:] Quite a few.
[B. Singh:] Mm. My other half ordered from a catalogue disc drives to assemble compu, er a home computer... and he was looking very carefully cos computer parts can be quite expensive and he was looking at national catalogue for the best prices. He knew exactly what he wanted, or, or the range of things he wanted, and the price that he, he was price conditioned and working out which was the best price, priced package. And oh! Look at that place in Southampton, can do me a disc drive for two hundred quid or whatever it was, I don't know why but I can't remember the price, but let's keep it at two hundred pound, And he phoned them up and said oh your price is very good on that one. Right. Yes it is. There's a lot of people ordering that one. Okay then, can I have one? Yes he said. That will be two hundred pounds plus V A T, plus thirty pounds carriage. He said... thirty pounds? That's a hell of a lot to be asking, you know, why is it so much? Oh it's express. He said right, oh so I'll have it tomorrow? He says, no it takes thirty days to get here.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Sorry it wasn't thirty days, ten days to get here. What service does he need Carly? I can deliver to you next day, but it takes him ten days to get it here, what service does he need? Mm?
[speaker004:] Before nine.
[P. Summers:] Before nine.
[speaker004:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] Say it again louder.
[P. Summers:] Carriage forward. Carriage forward.
[speaker004:] It's called carriage
[B. Singh:] Can you
[speaker004:] forward.
[B. Singh:] co can you explain to those who don't know what it is cos it's
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] a, it's a stupid name isn't it? Carriage forward. Sounds like the, talk about the horse before the ca, the cart before the horse.
[P. Summers:] In the first place you've got three companies, A B and C... C's your manufacturer
[B. Singh:] D'ya wanna draw, do you want to draw it on here?
[P. Summers:] Yeah, wait a minute.... You got three companies... A, B and C. Erm... we'll call B the carrier... sort of like the go between if you like... A, is your say, shop... and C is your manufacturer. Now you may have a customer that comes into the shop... at A and they need something desperately, they walk in the sho, may walk in and say look I need that compact disc player, my life depends on having compact disc player and shopkeeper... no see now we haven't got it. But what they can do in this case is... the manufacturer's at C, but the manufacturer cannot deliver to the shop until... maybe two weeks time... they can phone us, the carrier, we will then arrange... for someone to go to manufacturer at C, pick it up, bring it to us and then we'll take to the shop.
[B. Singh:] Right.
[P. Summers:] All for a charge of course.
[B. Singh:] Right. So that gives what, to the shopkeeper?
[speaker004:] Control.
[B. Singh:] Control again. Now what else we could do, well said
[speaker004:] Customer satisfaction.
[B. Singh:] that's, that's... that's well said, but we can also do third party
[J. Fowles:] Third party.
[B. Singh:] carriage forward
[P. Summers:] Oh yeah.
[B. Singh:] that's why, that's so that we can give the shop his control of supply... which actually like my da, you're saying if it was a computer disc supplier he could have next day delivery to him and then next day delivery to my man.
[speaker004:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] Right? What we can actually do is suggest to the C, the C D or the computer shop... your manufacturer can send directly to Peter... via us, I then say... via us.
[P. Summers:] Aye, you'll get the bill.
[speaker002:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] But... we will send the bill
[P. Summers:] To that shop.
[B. Singh:] you can
[speaker004:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] send them the bill and we'll send them the goods. They, Peter, if he found out where they were coming from what might he do?
[speaker004:] Phone them.
[P. Summers:] To the supplier.
[B. Singh:] He might cut out the middle man you see. Cos he might be able to go straight to the ba, the
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[J. Worrow:] [cough]
[B. Singh:] Now obviously, we don't
[J. Worrow:] [clears throat]
[B. Singh:] want to lose his business so we protect him but we don't say... it's coming from there. We are, we represent him, it's his delivery van
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] that delivers to Peter. And that's third party carriage forward which is even, and Peter's even happier because he doesn't even have to wait two days now, he gets his delivery next day. And the bill he, that he gets at the same as the time as the delivery, and what's normal credit conditions?
[speaker004:] Thirty days.
[B. Singh:] Thirty days. So when does the thirty days start ticking by?
[A. Bond:] We get our money back much quicker.
[B. Singh:] That's right. You do. So instead of waiting ten days for delivery and then the invoice being,tha, you know being delivered with the goods... when you open
[J. Worrow:] Yes.
[B. Singh:] it up there's the bill... the bill can be eleven days in advance of that which means improved
[P. Summers:] Well that means everybody's happier. The manufacturer's happier
[B. Singh:] That's right.
[P. Summers:] cos he gets his money quicker.
[B. Singh:] Well done.
[P. Summers:] The shopkeeper's happier because he gets
[B. Singh:] Aha.
[P. Summers:] his money quicker. We're happier... because we get paid quicker and the end-user's happier cos he's
[B. Singh:] Aha.
[P. Summers:] got his product quicker.
[B. Singh:] That is it.
[J. Worrow:] And if the shopkeeper uses our service all the time he doesn't have to carry any stock.
[B. Singh:] Yep.
[P. Summers:] Yeah. Right.
[B. Singh:] Improved cash flow. And if he doesn't have to carry any stock... what does that mean with th er in terms of his capital being tied up.
[P. Summers:] It isn't.
[B. Singh:] He can do
[speaker004:] He could
[B. Singh:] what? Open
[speaker004:] He could do so something else.
[P. Summers:] Another shop.
[B. Singh:] another shop.
[J. Fowles:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] D'ya see? But d'ya know something? There are businesses out there that don't understand that.
[P. Summers:] They probably don't even know we exist.
[B. Singh:] D'ya know, d'ya know
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] why? D'ya know why they don't know it exists?
[speaker004:] People like shops.
[speaker002:] I don't know why it is, no.
[B. Singh:] Because nobody has target them.
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[A. Bond:] That's right.
[B. Singh:] Anthony?
[A. Bond:] I've seen a lot of companies like that
[B. Singh:] Honestly.
[A. Bond:] just recently.
[B. Singh:] Why, why
[J. Worrow:] Can I tell you another reason why as well
[B. Singh:] Peter rang this computer
[J. Worrow:] because
[B. Singh:] in Southampton and he said we can give you next day this, they won't, they won't enter into it, we can give you next day delivery... but it takes ten or twenty days. And I bet you, if you look at how many of your accounts are not using carriage forward when they should... you would be amazed. Existing on your roller now.
[J. Worrow:] And so, why so many don't know about carriage
[B. Singh:] I know.
[J. Worrow:] forward
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] They don't understand.
[speaker004:] That's it.
[B. Singh:] They don't understand what it means. Th,ca, what do most people use carriage forwards for?
[J. Fowles:] Just collecting from somewhere else and bringing it back to themselves.
[B. Singh:] Bringing it back, sending it back.
[J. Fowles:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] Invoice them
[speaker002:] [clears throat]
[B. Singh:] let me, the o the other thing we can do is if it's broken... the shop can send it back but the man, the other person pays.
[J. Fowles:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] That is also carriage forward. Comes back to the person. And a lot of our carriage forwards are
[J. Fowles:] Are
[B. Singh:] returns.
[J. Fowles:] Yeah. And then they put in a claim form.
[speaker004:] Or sometimes they've got an account in your name.
[B. Singh:] And that's why we don't make money on carriage forwards cos we don't sell carriage forwards for the positive reasons, we say, well if they don't want them send them back, or if they're damaged send them back.
[J. Fowles:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] Or if you have to have, I used to do it for erm... West Bro, er... Northampton Brewery. Banson's
[J. Worrow:] Banson's
[B. Singh:] Brewery. Erm, it was, was Banson Brewery. Er no it wasn't Ba, Banson's Brewery, erm
[J. Worrow:] Anson's
[B. Singh:] no sorry, I'm I'm in the wrong trade, it was er... gas cylinders. And we used to send back the erm
[J. Worrow:] The valves.
[B. Singh:] the valves. They used to er se, we couldn't carry the empty ga, you can imagine that's not express parcel stuff, but the valves er, would sometimes need er replacing and we would send them a valve and, and while, instead of having any down time, we would give them... you know deliver the spare, have the spare come back for repair. Do you understand? Cos there's a lot of this maintenance thing that goes on as
[speaker002:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] as well isn't there... with businesses? It isn't just... service doesn't end at the sale,so, a lot of things have to have after-care don't they? Or
[J. Worrow:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] a service contract with them and there's lots of business, repeat business. Another one we did, er, out of South Wales was hip replacement... kit
[speaker002:] Gosh!
[B. Singh:] to erm... [tut]... the hospitals... and erm... they would... appar, I might be wro, I'm sure this is the way she explained it to me cos one of the girls in the branches did explain it to me once, and they said they have a choice of joints, like the doctor would say... er
[speaker002:] New brain.
[B. Singh:] your due to, you know, you, you were due for your hip replacement. Right. And what they would do is have a look and say ooh that's, ooh that's about your size, that's about it. Right. They don't make a joint do they, for you, you, you, you and you? They're all sort of standard sort of size pieces of kit. Cos it's an engineering job really isn't it?
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] You know.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] Providing you're looking after the blood supply, I mean, you know, the cardiovascular bit, you know, it's a bit of an engineering job. So they,th, you, you have a choice of hips, and they also have a bit of saw, a bit of sawing kit and screw in, you know, have delicate screws. Cos it's, it is pins and stuff isn't it, that makes
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] the hip work? So they have little screws to, you know, to go into the bone and little er... delicate instruments which are highly developed instruments and manufactured by certain pattern. And they actually supply them in special sealed containers, you know, little... cases that er, so, when you're doing a hip job you have a little kit come... from the supplier. And what they do, is they give them a couple of choices of bo, you know, hip joints to go for and the guy decides, the surgeon decides, does his job and then the kit goes back to the manufacturer again... and then when the, another hospital orders it they make up a, another kit. Obviously there's a lot of sterilizing going on in the meantime and all this. But they don't, these tools are used again, and again, and again... you know. The screws they make are, are to be there in the body... and the parts are in the bodies, but the bits they don't use come back and then they are put back into stock again. And our service was so good... to hospitals,, that they'd be somebody on the table... well where's the bit?
[speaker002:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] She's just getting her anaesthetic now. Well where's the bits you know? And they're ringing up... er... Julie about it, and say Julie... well, they're here. What's happened? Because the service was so good... they'd all, you know, they'd forget about the delivery that would be there. She'd supply them.
[speaker002:] So it was there?
[B. Singh:] Yes. Already
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] there. And then one day it didn't. Can't find this bit. They're always going down for anaesthetic, we can't find it. Now she's just had a pre-med now. Right okay. We can't find it. Can you find it for me? Okay then. Traced it. But of course it took a little bit of time, an hour or so, and th, the woman came round again, they said can't do you today
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] can't find the joint. So, she came back out of er... pre-med, had a nice happy half hour on a bit of valium and came back out of it again. Went back up to the ward cos there was no bit. Do you know where it was? In the erm... gate house... at the hospital. We had delivered it but they hadn't taken it from the gate house to... you know, normal procedure but they, we delivered it normally but they hadn't taken it to the exact part of the hospital it was going to. So, Julie sent the patient a bunch of flowers... and sh, and said sorry for the de, for the delay, you know it's there tomorrow, and she had this, she had it done again. But really, what, all they wanted to do was save face from the hospital because it wasn't our fault... but she used a bit of... you know, we won't embarrass the hospital... we'll say
[speaker002:] And then our customer's happy.
[B. Singh:] bit of customer care, but really
[speaker002:] And, well
[B. Singh:] we all, we'll lose face with the patient
[speaker002:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] because we int gonna, we haven't gotta worry about what she says about, but he sa, the hospital didn't wanna lose face, but I mean, the hospital said thank you. Cos they were saying will they tell her, you know the part hasn't come and, so we said okay, let's pretend the part didn't get there. Send her a bunch of flowers. But really it had got there but again... But what I'm saying is, that service... of carriage forward... we were making almost as much money on the kit coming back... cos we could have charged another
[J. Fowles:] It's five quid isn't it?
[B. Singh:] Yeah. It's five pound at the moment is it? It has been up to nine or ten pound... for
[J. Fowles:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] return. Because it ca, most, we do lose a lot of money on carriage forwards. If I talk to, if you talk to our operations they will say, oh my God! Do you know why? Because, we don't know what we're carrying. A lot of carriage forwards
[J. Worrow:] [clears throat]
[B. Singh:] are returns and damages.
[speaker002:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] And they're in a terrible state when we pick them up. Because, you can imagine working for us, you received something and thought that's no good and can't use it, what happens to it then in your warehouse or... despa
[J. Fowles:] Just sta, lays there.
[B. Singh:] And what happens to it while it's?
[speaker002:] Kicked around.
[P. Summers:] Kicked around.
[B. Singh:] Kicked about. Right.
[speaker002:] Broken.
[B. Singh:] Broken and all that. And, what did you say that we get a lot of claims on carriage forward?
[speaker002:] Damaged foodstuff.
[J. Gibson:] You have to insure them don't you, carriage forward of course?
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] That's why we have to
[speaker002:] So
[speaker004:] No you don't.
[speaker002:] Yeah. Tha that means we're paying out
[B. Singh:] But you see the problem is
[speaker002:] if we do actually find out.
[B. Singh:] Yeah, you see the trouble is though we're so open to abuse. because
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] people, they don't rush back, they don't wanna urgently express back a carriage forward, they don't work. What they want is, they get on the phone and say that's no good, send me another one. And we send them the replacement, and they let the broken one sit there. How many times have you... supposed to have taken something back... or have it repaired or something and it's sat there, and it's sat there, and it's sat there, and it's sat there... and it's collected du, I've got things round the house that I've been working on and that I've gotta, I've gotta... and it's collected dust. You know, that's another project that went sort of slowly the way. Erm, and what I'm saying is, we don't address the things that aren't urgent
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] we only address the urgent things. But we do leave
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] ourselves, well we've gotta protect ourselves as carriers against other people saying... ah! We broke that, or that was broke... er, but we'll blame the carrier now and look at it, then our security guy goes out and they know it's been sitting around someone's... you know, it's been there for months! And er, we we, we are open to abuse on them. But that doesn't mean to say that what Danny said... was very valuable, and as you said Adrian, the four, the four parties, the receiver, the thirty party receiver, the people who are paying the bills... buyer and us are very happy in many cases with... using carriage forward in a positive way not just for returns
[speaker002:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] yeah? The returns do get a bit dodgy I find. But we still do it... cos we insure it, we, charge an extra fiver every time... then it's good money. I'm stopping you through your list... Phil.
[P. Ford:] Well I mean, I've got a
[B. Singh:] Any more?
[P. Ford:] quite a few on here. Is there any ones that you want me to pin point at all or
[B. Singh:] Erm le, what I wanna do is just get, just insure that we know the difference between what is giving the customer the, the benefit and the features. So we probably won't go through them all. But
[P. Ford:] No.
[B. Singh:] let's just discuss our way round a couple of other things because these are, this is your product knowledge now isn't it?
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] This is what you need to know about selling the service. It's no good, er... talking about how you do something, how you do is not what they're interested in. So whats, that's how you do it.
[J. Gibson:] How do you do it?
[P. Ford:] the customer. [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] It's, it's what can please me.
[P. Ford:] [LAUGHTER] Cuddly toy [].
[B. Singh:] What's in it for me? The with them factor. What it is in it for me? Okay.
[P. Ford:] I've got liability options.
[B. Singh:] What d'ya mean by that, liability options?
[P. Ford:] Well like being insu, like people have got a choice of different options of insurances and
[B. Singh:] That's a good one. Now if I said, ooh! We offer good liability options. We can give you... transport liability at, what level's that?
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]... Aha. Five thousand pounds, ten thousand pounds, and fifteen thousand pounds costing three, three, six, and nine pound respectively.
[B. Singh:] Five, ten, and fifteen.
[speaker002:] Which is forward transit.
[J. Worrow:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker002:] Don't be like that.
[B. Singh:] What is the free?
[speaker004:] Fifteen pounds a kilo.
[B. Singh:] Sorry, five, sorry I got that one. Three,
[P. Ford:] Six and nine.
[speaker004:] Six and nine.
[B. Singh:] and nine. And the free one is?
[speaker004:] Fifteen pound a kilo.
[B. Singh:] Right. Okay. Now what I'm saying is... we, because we have good liability what can that imply?
[Justin:] You're getting a
[B. Singh:] How can you sell it's properties then?
[speaker002:] In the likely event
[B. Singh:] In the likely event
[speaker002:] In the likely event Likely event so
[B. Singh:] Well we won't us, it won't graduate any but does it have to do got this
[A. Bond:] You're committed
[B. Singh:] liability?
[A. Bond:] you're committed, you're committing to your service
[speaker002:] It's like life assurance.
[A. Bond:] on the fact that you can offer you your high rate of liability. Cos by offering a high rate of liability it's, it's suggests that we
[speaker002:] Concerned.
[A. Bond:] that we care.
[B. Singh:] [cough]
[A. Bond:] And say we co, we, we're committed.
[J. Fowles:] Rather than see non-damaged if you like.
[A. Bond:] We're limited... I won't ta, I don't like using the word problems without.
[B. Singh:] The reason why
[J. Worrow:] What about the
[B. Singh:] we can afford to offer such good liability cover is the risk is very minimal.
[A. Bond:] Is small, yeah.
[B. Singh:] The cost is very minimal.
[A. Bond:] Yeah.
[speaker004:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] That's what you're saying isn't it Adrian?
[A. Bond:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] Good.
[A. Bond:] We can get excellent
[B. Singh:] Try to find the words but you had a good, good case there.
[A. Bond:] We can get excellent rates from insurance companies
[B. Singh:] That's right.
[A. Bond:] because we are so good.
[B. Singh:] Now we, actually
[J. Worrow:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] we are our own
[A. Bond:] I know about this.
[B. Singh:] inge, we're our own... which means that we are, our problems are so limited... that we actually carry the liability ourselves, we don't even have to use an external... company... to get the rates on. We are so, so what I'm saying is, we can afford to offer marvellous cover... because it's, because erm, the risk is minimal.
[A. Bond:] Dixons Starsfield got er, the same as ours really, got....
[B. Singh:] Who does?
[speaker004:] Who does?
[A. Bond:] Dixon Starsfield, Dixons, Currys.
[B. Singh:] Right.
[A. Bond:] Where they, they offer extended five year warranties. Now the chance of you actually needing a
[B. Singh:] Yeah.
[A. Bond:] five year warranty on a T V is.
[B. Singh:] That's right.
[A. Bond:] They generally don't go well.
[B. Singh:] My friend li, my friend offers a lifetime guarantee on his leather furniture. Lifetime. But the way
[speaker002:] It's a it's not.
[speaker004:] It's a ex, it's an extra selling point that's what
[B. Singh:] It's like when when
[J. Fowles:] Exactly.
[B. Singh:] you sell me a
[J. Fowles:] When you go to buy it you think oh I've got a life I can change it.
[B. Singh:] you take out, I think most people take out
[J. Fowles:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] life insurance
[J. Fowles:] Don't you?
[B. Singh:] you don't expect to die but you just cover every
[J. Worrow:] That's right.
[B. Singh:] eventuality.
[J. Worrow:] That's right.
[B. Singh:] That's the pitfall. But what
[J. Fowles:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] what what the insurance salesman do is do wobble you a little bit so that you will take it out, you know, can you afford... down, if you were forty having a heart attack leaving a wife and young child behind. I mean, they do tell you, they sell on that way don't they?
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[Justin:] Yeah well they do
[B. Singh:] To sell, sell them.
[Justin:] they sell you som something to do with it.
[B. Singh:] You say that, that is negative. Cautionary tales. Yeah. You know when somebody's at, when someone's at a lowest point, that's when they go straight in Anything for a sale.
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] and you get them to make a will afterwards. It's co
[speaker004:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] you see salesmanship is applying psychology, you know, and a lot of people, I mean,wha the reason why insurance companies are justified is a lot of people are protected by it, you know. You don't always know what's good for you, you do need someone to say.
[speaker002:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] And you're twenty one
[A. Bond:] Can you explain it to me again Kath
[B. Singh:] Mhm.
[A. Bond:] about the options there please?
[B. Singh:] Right. What is it that you are, you don't understand?
[A. Bond:] Well I understand that you get fifteen, it's just that I've got a lot of customer where I got... business that is depending on the kind of insurance that we give them, based on what our
[B. Singh:] Yes I understand.
[A. Bond:] competitors are offering. Erm, the fifty P, P a kilo up to fifteen thousand, that I
[B. Singh:] Yeah. That's pro-rata.
[A. Bond:] Yeah. That I understand.
[B. Singh:] Fifteen pound per kilo.
[A. Bond:] Oh sorry I co, sorry, fifteen pound
[B. Singh:] Yeah.
[A. Bond:] per kilo... up to
[B. Singh:] Pro-rata. Up to a thousand kilos.
[A. Bond:] which is, yeah, that I
[speaker004:] That's
[A. Bond:] that I understand.
[B. Singh:] So, if it only weighs kilos you will get how much cover?
[speaker004:] Thirty quid.
[A. Bond:] Er thirty, thirty quid.
[B. Singh:] Yeah. You understand that, right?
[A. Bond:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] Now
[A. Bond:] But when you got to the options, now
[B. Singh:] The full liability, yeah?
[A. Bond:] what are you saying now fi, up to five thousand pounds?
[B. Singh:] Per item, per per assignment.
[A. Bond:] Right.
[B. Singh:] Regardless of weight.
[A. Bond:] What's that, what... right
[speaker004:] You're buying a aren't you?
[B. Singh:] You pay three pound extra
[A. Bond:] Oh extra?
[B. Singh:] Yeah.
[A. Bond:] On top of your own
[B. Singh:] On top of
[speaker004:] Oh that's right.
[A. Bond:] on top of the fifteen pound per
[B. Singh:] No.
[A. Bond:] kilo?
[speaker004:] No.
[A. Bond:] On top of whatever
[B. Singh:] No, no.
[A. Bond:] price the customer's paying.
[J. Worrow:] Customer's rate.
[A. Bond:] How do you achieve a rate
[B. Singh:] Sorry can, can anyone
[A. Bond:] say if you
[J. Worrow:] [clears throat]
[B. Singh:] can
[A. Bond:] well
[B. Singh:] I just say
[J. Worrow:] [clears throat]
[B. Singh:] he doesn't pay fifteen pounds a kilo Adrian, he pays nothing. He pays the rate you... ask him to pay
[A. Bond:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] and, inbuilt in that rate... Mr, is fifteen
[A. Bond:] Oh I see.
[B. Singh:] pounds coverage for every kilo of weight.
[A. Bond:] That's right.
[B. Singh:] So if you have a thousand... kilo pallet... it's fifteen thousand pounds. But if your item weighs a half a kilo, we'll round it up to the first kilo so that's any valid for fifteen pounds.
[A. Bond:] Right.
[B. Singh:] Now obviously that's worth a lot more than fifteen pounds to you isn't it?
[A. Bond:] Right.
[B. Singh:] So what I suggest you do is pay an additional three pounds which means that that is now covered... for up to five thousand pounds regardless of it's weight.
[A. Bond:] Right. Now I understand.
[B. Singh:] Are you happy with that Adrian?
[A. Bond:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] Now, the reason
[A. Bond:] Yes, yes.
[B. Singh:] why you give them different options... right.
[A. Bond:] Thank you.
[B. Singh:] On, on, on the same day they only charge nine pound and i, everything's valid up, insured up to fifteen thousand pounds per consignment. Are you happy,yo you happy with that then?
[A. Bond:] In actual fact, sorry to point it, that's consignment contracts [LAUGHTER] [].
[B. Singh:] Right. But yo,
[A. Bond:] So
[B. Singh:] i I haven't, you know, it, because when you read it it doesn't always make, it goes in there, and I understand
[A. Bond:] Right.
[B. Singh:] people getting a little bit confused about that. But, that just means the levels of insurance, as a risk, ah, you know, and we've just put a rate in to, to represent the, the levels of insurance because... we charge you more if we insure you for more then. Erm
[A. Bond:] So if I've got a customer that's sending erm... quite a lot of parcels but have got a
[B. Singh:] Now parcels, have, what is the, what is the, what is the erm definition of a consignment? Cos this is regarding consignment. When is a
[A. Bond:] Ah ah sorry, it's... [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] So, what I'm saying is
[A. Bond:] it's solely for, it's erm... i,yo you could have six or seven parcels all picked up in one consignment if it's picked up by that carrier
[B. Singh:] By one carrier.
[A. Bond:] going to one address at one time.
[B. Singh:] So that's one consignment. Now if say, let's
[A. Bond:] So it's one consignment.
[B. Singh:] keep it
[A. Bond:] so
[B. Singh:] to a dozen.
[A. Bond:] Okay, so you got one consignment
[B. Singh:] You've got a dozen items... I want a dozen items
[A. Bond:] Yeah. Which is made up of one consignment.
[B. Singh:] One consignment. You're only covered per consignment, so the whole twelve together are only insured for fifteen
[A. Bond:] Ah ah, ah!
[B. Singh:] thousand.
[A. Bond:] Aha.
[B. Singh:] What he must do
[A. Bond:] Is make sure that each individual box
[B. Singh:] becomes a consignment.
[A. Bond:] Ah ah.
[B. Singh:] He's got to label up and pay for... at a consignment rate each item. He
[A. Bond:] Cos
[B. Singh:] can't
[A. Bond:] I understand.
[P. Ford:] Can he put that on his er, consignment
[B. Singh:] or
[P. Ford:] note? Can he actually... put a, a tick o on a box, you know when you fill in a consignment note?
[B. Singh:] Yes.
[P. Ford:] D'ya know when yo, d'ya know when you put one on each parcel
[B. Singh:] You write a co sep separate consignment number
[P. Ford:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] for every consignment.
[P. Ford:] If if the customer feels that every item he's sending out
[B. Singh:] Is valuable.
[P. Ford:] is er is valuable, can he do, I dunno. a dozen individual consignment notes and then tick the particular box
[B. Singh:] Yeah.
[P. Ford:] that he wants?
[J. Worrow:] That would work out
[A. Bond:] Yeah.
[J. Worrow:] then
[B. Singh:] That one.
[J. Worrow:] because he's gonna pay
[B. Singh:] Yeah.
[J. Worrow:] he'll be paying
[B. Singh:] If that's what he wants.
[speaker004:] Yeah, that's it.
[B. Singh:] If he needs five thousand pound coverage on each item
[P. Ford:] On each one. He's gonna, he's gonna have to pay for it.
[B. Singh:] he's got to send five, if you've got a twelve... well twelve percent. Now, can I put it another way Adrian?
[A. Bond:] I'm just trying to get an edge on my competitors
[B. Singh:] Right.
[A. Bond:] cos, I
[B. Singh:] Let me put it another way then. This is only what we publish. If you know the value of the level of insurance your client wants
[A. Bond:] Right.
[B. Singh:] and if he wants to send them as one consignment, but now the value is twenty five thousand pounds... collectively... you can ring up Stubbings... and as, or get your F and A to do this for you, Finance and Admin, ring up Stubbings and can you give me a special rate for these goods and ar, can you give me what I can charge them for special coverage to take it higher than our normal coverage of fifteen thousand pound?
[A. Bond:] Oh I see.
[B. Singh:] Now what they will wanna know is the ins and outs of everything that you're sending. How delicate it is,
[A. Bond:] As most insuring company,mos most brokers or people like that.
[B. Singh:] how value it is, and most insurance, yeah, that's right through a brokers.
[P. Ford:] Would you have to send in a profile? Do you have to send it in?
[B. Singh:] Yeah. I've never done it but I think you do have to send that in. And can I please recommend you speak to your finance and admin people and they will say, now don't expect to be saying, oh that'll be no problem, because we na, we ain't got a F and A like that, they're always to caution, you know. They're all
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] [mimicking finance lady] don't think you can do that son []! You know you'll get this thing, don't worry, say okay
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER] Cor!
[B. Singh:] Now, do we? We don't know.
[speaker002:] Been looking everywhere. I dunno. Anywhere er
[B. Singh:] Who would call?
[speaker002:] My husband
[J. Fowles:] Er erm, you, you couldn't, could put a call through.
[speaker002:] Can't.
[J. Fowles:] Er, well you could leave a message then?
[speaker002:] No.
[B. Singh:] Well done Jenny. Very good.... And just all the right format Yeah. of questions there. How did it feel about ringing and asking questions that were...? Did it throw you a bit did it?
[J. Fowles:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] I mean really you're saying
[J. Fowles:] I could
[B. Singh:] I can't think of anywhere to go, my God! I mean, she's saying well... what do you exactly mean by this question? I mean, I wasn't the world you know.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Now
[speaker002:] Erm
[B. Singh:] did she hesitate for some time before the answers?
[speaker002:] Yeah. Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] and what did Jenny do when she hesitated?
[speaker002:] Lis listened.
[B. Singh:] She did, but she did something else as well.
[speaker004:] She went ha!
[speaker002:] She went off.
[B. Singh:] She went
[J. Fowles:] Mm. [LAUGHTER]... Everything.
[B. Singh:] And you say ooh, come on, come on. Come on
[speaker002:] Have I said the wrong th
[B. Singh:] Did you feel a bit uncomfortable when she hesitated a bit then?
[speaker002:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] You we, and it feels like that when you're on the phone. Now all she was doing now you can see that... you can read those messages about... the hands went didn't they? The shoulders went, the face went long.
[speaker002:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] Ooh! Er, oh! You could see her thinking about it, but you couldn't have heard that on the phone.
[J. Gibson:] Yeah, you do get silences like that sometimes don't you?
[B. Singh:] And you get silences on the phone... and you're thinking... this is going down like a lead balloon. No! She's engaging brain... it takes her some time to come out to the phone... instruct the whole thing. Yeah? Don't worry about it,ta, the pregnant pause
[J. Fowles:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] is to use. On a moment's thought for them to sort of.
[J. Fowles:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Did you feel the pressure of having to ask the questions till then, when, when they were asking you to do it to to plans?
[speaker002:] Very much so.
[B. Singh:] Yes. And you will feel like that and you sit there... [whispering] Oh God! I've gotta do that [].
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] Preparation, good preparation will help that. Relax, Jenny, relaxation will help that as well. Just
[J. Fowles:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] breathing calmly and waiting. And, when she said... anywhere... was that enough information really? Do you really wanted to know where Jenny had, where Mandy had been on holiday?
[J. Fowles:] No.
[B. Singh:] Would,wo, would you liked to have known more? I would have.
[J. Fowles:] Mm. Mm.
[B. Singh:] Yeah?
[J. Fowles:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] How could you prompt her to expand on that?
[speaker002:] Er
[P. Summers:] Could you give me a few examples?
[B. Singh:] Well done Paul! That's, oh yeah, how did i, repeat the question,an an and emphasize on the word.
[J. Fowles:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] Could you give me an example? Now if you say it in an ex, in a, in a... do you want to give me a few examples?
[J. Fowles:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker002:] You're a bit Yeah.
[B. Singh:] All she'll say, no I
[speaker002:] No.
[B. Singh:] can't. If you say... ah! Neil says you've been everywhere, what are the type of things, that you know, you can use tone and voice cos they can't see you. It's all in the voice what you put into voice. Bill had... the opportunity to sit face to face with them and... you catch his eye, you you used to... er... time to... er use, use hand gestures and show things to them on, on presenters. You haven't on the phone. Can you give me a few examples? Could you expand on that a little? We what was your question Phil? Yours was a good one. Aha. Where have you been?
[P. Ford:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] Th the, the fall on the, the repeatedness, the broken record that sort, when you repeatedly question. Ah! Where have you been? Oh I've been to, or you rephrase it in another way. Well done. Very good. And don't lose, just because she said... I wanted to know, they didn't answer me. Stick with it. Even if it means a few phone calls. What exactly do you mean by that? Sorry, I've never worked in your industry, why is that? Yeah? And follow it up with a new question. So the experiences, although it's got nothing to do with your product, is what is gonna actually happen to you on the telephone out there. Yeah? Mandy, would you like ask Jenny a question?
[speaker002:] Yeah. Erm... how long have you been driving?
[J. Fowles:] Two and a half years.
[speaker002:] So when did you learn to drive then?
[J. Fowles:] When I was seventeen.
[speaker002:] And what were your ideal car?
[B. Singh:] [clears throat]
[J. Fowles:] [LAUGHTER]... [LAUGHTER] Er a Rover [].
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]... So I give you the choice of a, a Lamborghini or a Rover what would you rather have?
[J. Fowles:] A Rover I think then.
[speaker002:] Ah. So if I let you drive my Rover home, would you?
[J. Fowles:] [LAUGHTER] Definitely. Yeah [].
[B. Singh:] And if I let you drive my Rover home, would you? She said yes to the actual question. That was more than a closed question, it was closed
[speaker002:] Oh right.
[B. Singh:] would you? You said would you drive my Rover that's the question? When you said we'll talk about that question last.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] And the others will have to wait till they come up again.
[speaker002:] Ah ah! [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Right. Well done. See that, excellent. Right. How did it feel Jenny asking a load of questions? Straight out weren't they?
[J. Fowles:] [LAUGHTER]... Yeah, when she was saying asking them
[B. Singh:] And the, that's right. Now, the other thing is Phil... because he's got a new experience with it, struggled to find a question.
[speaker002:] [clears throat]
[B. Singh:] Right, he knew what she was talking about, she'd got it written down and she was gonna get that information. But sometimes it can sound too... I know this didn't happen
[speaker002:] Yeah, comes a bit too
[B. Singh:] it's just I mean I'm not suggesting you, you behave like that on the phone
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] but what I'm saying is, awareness now, I'm just slagging off the awareness. [clicking fingers] When it sounds rehearsed, it sounds, like, that. And it doesn't sound quite as clear as if you have to think about who you're talking to. So the fact that you struggled Phil
[P. Ford:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] to find the next question, the customer knows you're thinking. Ah... that's interesting. Try and get that now... buy yourself a bit of time
[P. Ford:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] think about that. Let me, let me think about that. Do you mind if I come back to you on that one? And if you can't stand the heat... get out quick... and come back to it. But it, eventually it will sta, you'll think afterwards, oh God! I didn't know the next thing. Analyse what you did
[P. Ford:] Sure.
[B. Singh:] then think about it, and there's always another call. Yeah? No problem at all. Okay. Now, that was very well done. No problem at all there. Paul, would you like to ask Carly a question?
[P. Summers:] I didn't understand it. I've done three questions of each.
[speaker004:] [LAUGHTER] Oh God Paul []!
[B. Singh:] Do you understand it now?
[P. Summers:] No I, no I understand what you're saying, it's just that I thought you said three questions of each. I done three open, three limited, and three... yes and no questions.
[B. Singh:] Would you, would you wanna erm, d'ya wanna
[P. Summers:] No I've crossed them all out now.
[B. Singh:] Okay. Go on. Well away you go then?
[P. Summers:] Sorry, well I've
[B. Singh:] The blurb.
[P. Summers:] got that one.
[B. Singh:] My, must be my mistake.
[P. Summers:] Well I thought you would have got it in black and white.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[P. Summers:] I got a big
[B. Singh:] No go on.
[P. Summers:] in the mornings.
[B. Singh:] Go on Paul. Carry on. Carry on.
[P. Summers:] Hello Carly!
[speaker004:] Hello Paul.
[P. Summers:] How long were you seeing your boyfriend then before you married him?
[speaker004:] Er, about six years.
[P. Summers:] [tut] About six years. Whose idea was it to get married?
[speaker004:] Both of us really.
[P. Summers:] Yeah? Right. How old were you er when you got married?
[speaker004:] Twenty one.
[P. Summers:] Do you live at home with your par, er your parent's home or erm... do you live in, in your home?
[speaker004:] Well currently with my parents because we moved down.
[P. Summers:] Are your parents ha
[speaker004:] Or moved up I should say, sorry.
[P. Summers:] erm... are your parents happy with your choice of husband?
[speaker004:] Initially... no. [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Well..., I was afraid of the answer then. Well done. That was a very
[speaker004:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] good question Paul.
[speaker004:] Yes obviously.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Excellent
[speaker004:] [LAUGHTER] Keep you on [].
[B. Singh:] Excellent questioning Paul there.
[P. Summers:] Well I did have some more but I thought no I
[speaker004:] Ah, thank God for that!
[P. Summers:] .
[B. Singh:] How did you feel about answering those questions?
[speaker004:] Fine.
[B. Singh:] No problem?
[speaker004:] No.
[B. Singh:] Again, speed
[speaker004:] But I think erm
[B. Singh:] Sorry go on.
[speaker004:] Sorry.
[B. Singh:] No.
[speaker004:] Answering back... I thought he could have given me a bit more time cos I wanted to say something else and he was
[B. Singh:] Ah ah! That's interesting.
[P. Summers:] Yes.
[speaker004:] You could have got more information Paul!
[P. Summers:] But I didn't.
[B. Singh:] Ah I know.
[P. Summers:] But I didn't
[B. Singh:] But just
[P. Summers:] want any more.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[P. Summers:] I thought it was, it was, it was,en en en
[B. Singh:] No can I just, can I say
[P. Summers:] encroaching on her private business.
[B. Singh:] the er... yes I know. I know.
[speaker004:] I don't care.
[B. Singh:] It's only an exercise and, and you
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] and you have e, your own agendas there, obviously. What I'm saying is... is sometimes slowing the pace... and simply
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] let her think a little longer because... and then she'll say, oh! And then she's just think of that. With Phil's hesitance... we got a bit more. And Phil was thinking... I wonder whether this is about and I'm [LAUGHTER] trying to think of the next question [].
[speaker004:] [LAUGHTER]
[P. Ford:] No.
[B. Singh:] Which is the question of what you feel when you're in the field out there trying to work something through. Which calls
[J. Worrow:] Actually you've hit the nail on the head there didn't you?
[B. Singh:] Mm?
[J. Worrow:] When you said... Phil thought he wasn't, I'm not listening.
[B. Singh:] No.
[J. Worrow:] Because that's what it's all about.
[B. Singh:] Yes.
[J. Worrow:] And when you're listening you're watching for body language as well.
[speaker004:] Mm.
[J. Worrow:] And so if you have not been concentrating on the question
[B. Singh:] Yeah.
[J. Worrow:] you will probably have recognized the body that says... I'm prepared to give you more.
[B. Singh:] Now, to be fair... that comes with experience.
[J. Worrow:] Of course.
[B. Singh:] Listening, as you become more comfortable and you become, you've done it a few times... you know what you're gonna have to say... and then you, you er, you listen more carefully to the answers. But the listening is the key. Paul had it well prepared and really she sa, but sh all his answers met with... a logical sequence didn't it?
[speaker004:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] Very well done... and he spent a lot of time working on that did you notice? I'm not saying that's, okay, you got a bit misled by the instructions but don't worry, but he still gave... you could see that... you know... he was, you know, he was just
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] you know, he was caught in a
[speaker004:] He was [LAUGHTER] concentrating [].
[B. Singh:] train of thought.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] He was erm, he was trying
[P. Summers:] Thanks.
[B. Singh:] very hard and e, good, good preparation does take effort. I mean I know we're only playing here, but it does take effort and, practised effort becomes easier... it doesn't become hard work. It's like... playing a good game of squash, squash, to get a better game... and it's not so hard... because you're off to, you, you're fit for the game. And that's what you'll do, you'll become fit. You'll be a better player.
[J. Fowles:] As you say, when you're on the phone you get those silences you just of go, mm mm, mm
[B. Singh:] Well done Jenny!
[J. Fowles:] And like,
[B. Singh:] Well erm, what's ha, what would you call those? Right. Okay.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER] They know you're listening.
[B. Singh:] Listening noises. That's very good. That's very good. Right. All
[J. Worrow:] Can I do, just make one announcement?
[B. Singh:] Yes. Please do.
[J. Worrow:] Just to illustrate how important this thing is, you've probably all come across and it really irritates me, you see people interviewing people on television... and they've got their clipboard there and they've obviously got a prepared question so they can't falter... and fine, that means they've prepared it. And they ask a question and somebody's very open with the answer and they da, they just,sa expand on that answer... and then, two or
[B. Singh:] Aha.
[J. Worrow:] three questions later they ask them the very question they just answered
[speaker002:] E e expect
[J. Worrow:] and that really irritates me! And that's purely and simply because they're just not listening.
[speaker002:] Oh. [LAUGHTER]
[J. Worrow:] The easiest thing in the world to take off that question
[P. Summers:] Yeah.
[J. Worrow:] so that it's so think about that because
[B. Singh:] Yeah. And you'll lo
[J. Worrow:] you don't want to get the backs up of your customers by asking them questions.
[B. Singh:] That is right. And you'll losing the point of why
[J. Worrow:] Absolutely.
[B. Singh:] you're asking the question. See
[J. Worrow:] Aha.
[B. Singh:] you're not, you're not paid to ask questions, you're paid to get in, information.
[speaker004:] Info.
[B. Singh:] Yeah? That's the point. So that fact that you can't think of a next question Phil
[P. Ford:] Mhm.
[B. Singh:] don't worry, you've got some information. We can all ask questions... later... okay? What you really want then is a way to sort of happenings or embarrassments because you're a bit stuck of where you want to go.
[P. Ford:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] That's interesting. Let me write that down. Ah! You're giving yourself some new, you know.
[J. Worrow:] I think one of the things Phil can do in that si
[B. Singh:] Don't worry about it.
[J. Worrow:] or anybody could do in that situation is having asked a question, they're a bit hesitant about... er, the next question then simply throw in there to buy yourself some time something like... ee, is that all? Or, is any more that you can add to that? Just to give yourself a bit of time
[B. Singh:] Mm. Or repeat the question.
[J. Worrow:] for the next question.
[B. Singh:] It will help
[J. Worrow:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] you. Like we've just suggested. Oh have you? Or, what was your way of doing it before you said? When, when you wanted to know where Mandy went? Can you give us, tell us about that Paul?
[P. Summers:] Well I kept asking her, it made hard work, yeah.
[B. Singh:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] What did you do to her?
[speaker002:] You've not been listening have you Paul?
[B. Singh:] You know whe when, when we asked
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] He's still
[P. Summers:] Well I thought she didn't know that.
[B. Singh:] No he's still sitting back on his reflected glory now.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] And rightly so as well. Well done. Carly would you like to demonstrate yours
[Justin:] Kath.
[B. Singh:] now?
[speaker004:] Er
[Justin:] Could I say, say something?
[B. Singh:] Yeah.
[Justin:] I just think... I just think... it's quite important for us all to realize... I did a, when I used to do a similar job to this... it took me a long time before I realized... that the customer, you know on the phone doesn't know that your... you shouldn't have asked an open question there
[B. Singh:] Oh.
[Justin:] on the close... and it comes, it just comes with practise, get all
[B. Singh:] Right.
[Justin:] from practise doesn't it?
[B. Singh:] Which is exactly it. what I'm saying is is, you can, it doesn't matter how you ask the question, but sometimes
[J. Worrow:] [clears throat]
[B. Singh:] what I'm trying to help you practise, cos we're not, we're very good at asking closed questions in conversations but don't very often recognize, but you know, we, we we we, we'll zip backwards and forwards, and that's okay, but I want you to do consciously is know what type of questions you're asking because you can sometimes be hitting a brick wall and thinking I'm getting anywhere here and it's because you're asking too many closed questions.
[speaker004:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] And you're making it sound like an interrogation. Erm, especially when you're in front of a screen er or you're in front of a, a form that you're, someone's saying get the traffic profile out and th what they send, what they, how many they send, it can sound like an interrogational. Get the buyer, get the product, get the carrier, get, and so on like that. You've got to be careful that you are not losing the skill of a conversation.
[speaker004:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] Open question... what th va, advantage of open question is, is you do a... less of it... and they
[speaker002:] More of it.
[B. Singh:] More of it. And that's why it, on a foundation course we keep the questioning very simple. Justin's experiences has tooken it, taken it further than that which is brilliant, and he can apply those skills straight away. And if you've got those skills apply to them job, I'm not suggesting you don't, but remember... the first part of a, a tele, er a telephone or a face to face sales negotiation is,th th two of these and one of these. Right? You should you be posing the questions and letting the discussion take place. Posing the questions, controlling it... but posing it and letting it go. Right? And you're gaining information. When you've gathered information... a, and and come to a conclusion... erm interesting, we may have something for you there. And that's when you get your presenter out and start matching to what the customer wants. Now you've gone through an alternative yesterday... and we know, we ta, we don't talk what is built in by design, what do we talk about? We tell them what's built in by design and then we
[Justin:] Tell them the advantages.
[B. Singh:] of what they get out of it.. And we keep it simple. One feature... maybe one or two benefits... and you don't have to tell them the whole story.
[speaker004:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] As you said Bill, pull out the benefits and features that are appropriate to what you've heard.... Er, there may be something you're interested in there? Now there are tighter ways of actual sales negotiations but we haven't got the time to go into it today. You'll have to come back on your selli, your course to do this. Okay? Or you ca, if you can do it on your own, brilliant! Run with it now. But what I want you to do is gather information, this is your answers, and match what you're doing... er, what we sa provide with what you found out then. Okay. And you'll find out what method by just simply questioning them... about the. Let me just check before we start that everybody's got this. I'm sure Danny, Jenny, and Carly have, but just because... we've gone half way, can I just let the other three finish off their presentation? Cos they've sat and done the preparation. Carly.
[speaker004:] Okay. Hello Paul! [LAUGHTER] Erm, I know you're allergic to food and drink, so you keep on telling me, what sort of food are you allergic to?
[P. Summers:] Just about everything under the sun.
[speaker004:] What sort
[P. Summers:] Dairy products... erm... [LAUGHTER] dairy products [], oranges... various fruits.
[B. Singh:] Remember the listening noises. Right.
[speaker004:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] Yes?
[P. Summers:] Er, can't think of anything else specific at the moment. But it's just about, I've got a list at home, it's about this long though.
[speaker004:] Right. Okay. Erm... do you actually
[B. Singh:] What type of question is that when you do actually? him. What type of question
[speaker004:] A minute.
[B. Singh:] Yeah. And then, give him a choice like, can you
[speaker004:] A choice.
[B. Singh:] what were you going to ask Carly? Do you actually
[speaker004:] I was gonna ask him, do you actually eat the products still to a limit?
[B. Singh:] Right. Okay.
[speaker004:] It's a closed question there.
[B. Singh:] Right, that's right. How can you change... ask,ge get to that, but say it as an open question. [whispering] []
[speaker004:] If there are limits
[B. Singh:] No. That's a closed question. What do they begin with? Sorry, they're the words which you were.
[P. Summers:] Which foo, which food do you eat?
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] They're the words true. There is nothing to give me
[speaker004:] There was no last night.
[B. Singh:] these are open questions. You said, do you actually eat the products that made you allergic Paul? Right? What you're saying... how can ask any of those, any of those sort of questions? This is a very useful one.
[speaker004:] [whispering] Just by [].
[B. Singh:] How can you ask but using that word at the beginning of it? I am allergic to almost an anything. And you wanted to know do you eat almost anything don't you?
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] Do you still suffer? So, what, what word do you make it into an open question?
[speaker004:] Can you have them?
[Justin:] How
[speaker004:] Just
[B. Singh:] How
[Justin:] How much of this food do you eat?
[B. Singh:] How much of these
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] do you?
[speaker004:] Mm.
[P. Ford:] Which food.
[B. Singh:] Does anybody have any other suggestions. Mandy, you were saying
[P. Ford:] Which foods do you eat?
[speaker002:] Which food. I was gonna say which food do you
[B. Singh:] Which foods, yeah.
[speaker002:] normally
[B. Singh:] But that's still sort of limiting a bit though isn't it?
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] What I want, what food?
[speaker002:] Types.
[B. Singh:] What, what is it? What's, er er, erm, what off this list do you feel...?
[P. Summers:] It'll come to
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[P. Summers:] you.
[B. Singh:] Alright.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] We're gonna ask another question then though aren't we?
[speaker004:] Right.
[B. Singh:] Right well, can you... ask your third open question?
[speaker004:] Okay. Third open question. What was it? I can't
[B. Singh:] What food
[speaker004:] What food
[B. Singh:] off this list, what do you actually eat?
[J. Worrow:] No, she's already asked him what they
[B. Singh:] What do you actually eat?
[speaker004:] Yeah. Please
[J. Worrow:] Yeah?
[speaker004:] Erm what food?
[B. Singh:] That would be useful, yeah.
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[P. Summers:] What foods do I eat? Erm, I get everything, I'm allergic to at the moment.
[B. Singh:] No, I'm allergic to everything and I still eat it all.
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[P. Ford:] Going by last night apparently, ordinary roast.
[P. Summers:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Okay. Let's get back to the point, the point of the questioning. Carry on Carly.
[speaker004:] Go on then. Erm
[B. Singh:] Wha
[speaker004:] are you scared erm
[B. Singh:] No. Are you scared, what type of question?
[speaker002:] An open.
[B. Singh:] Let her work it through for herself.
[speaker004:] Oh yeah.
[B. Singh:] I know, I know that your trying to help her.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] But I'm trying to make her brain work not one of yours. [LAUGHTER]
[speaker002:] No, I have got a.
[B. Singh:] I want to borrow, I want to borrow... we can borrow your brain tomorrow Mandy. We'll probably need you again
[speaker004:] Erm
[B. Singh:] tomorrow. [LAUGHTER]... What I'm saying is, are you, what er
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] what does it, what are you trying ask him Carly?
[speaker004:] [LAUGHTER] I dunno []. What was your second, answer to your second question? Sorry.
[B. Singh:] I eat lots
[P. Summers:] I eat, I eat everything that I'm allergic to, virtually.
[B. Singh:] I'm allergic to everything but I still eat it all. That's the information you've got so far.
[speaker004:] Right. Is there a special method of cooking your food at home, not obviously outside?
[B. Singh:] Now nobody help her at this stage. Is there a special method? Wha what, how are you gonna answer that Paul?
[P. Summers:] No.
[B. Singh:] Now, what sort of question is it you've asked then?
[speaker004:] Closed.
[B. Singh:] Right. Is there a special method? Which of these can you ask to get your open answer?
[P. Summers:] What special
[B. Singh:] Shush! I'm asking
[P. Summers:] [LAUGHTER] Oh []!
[B. Singh:] Carly.
[speaker004:] How do you cook your food?
[B. Singh:] Well done! What, or how
[speaker004:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] how do you cook your food?
[speaker004:] Thank you. Thank you.
[B. Singh:] Well done Carly!
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] How do you cook your food Paul?
[speaker004:] How d'ya cook your food?
[P. Summers:] I don't, I get my mum to do it.
[B. Singh:] Right. Don't worry about that. Now you've got to
[speaker004:] Okay.
[B. Singh:] go into
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] a limiting one?
[speaker004:] If your mum doesn't do the cooking at home, who does it?
[P. Summers:] I go out and buy chips.
[speaker004:] You do. And er
[P. Summers:] No sorry, go on, I'll, I'll be helpful on that. I do.
[speaker004:] You do?
[B. Singh:] That's no help Paul. Carry on.
[P. Summers:] Oh okay.
[B. Singh:] [LAUGHTER] Next question [].
[speaker004:] Do you like your cooking?
[P. Summers:] No.
[B. Singh:] Well, well done!
[Justin:] Well done!
[B. Singh:] Well that was a hard effort! Very well done!
[speaker002:] [clapping]
[speaker004:] Thank you, thank you, thank you!
[B. Singh:] Well done! Jean, would you like to have a go?
[speaker002:] I want to know what happens to him.
[B. Singh:] Er
[J. Fowles:] I know! That's what I was
[B. Singh:] I'll save the best till last.
[J. Worrow:] [LAUGHTER]
[J. Gibson:] Hiya Danny.
[speaker004:] Hiya. Hiya.
[J. Gibson:] Erm, where do you wo usually buy your clothes from now?
[speaker004:] I beg your pardon?
[J. Gibson:] Where do you usually buy your clothes from?
[J. Worrow:] Oxfam.
[speaker004:] Er
[J. Worrow:] [clears throat]
[speaker004:] I've just recently changed to Next but I used to buy them from Oxfam when I used to live here.
[J. Gibson:] Oxfam? Good shop that is.. [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Put it down now.
[J. Gibson:] Right yo... you go, got to Next? Well why do you usually shop there, in Next?
[speaker004:] Erm... because it's got the Next label on it... and I like that outfit.
[J. Gibson:] What do you think of the staff in Next?
[speaker004:] I think they're a load of pompous gits!
[J. Gibson:] [LAUGHTER] I'm []. And do you consider price or quality more important when you buy your clothes?
[speaker004:] Quality.
[J. Gibson:] Quality.
[B. Singh:] Good question.
[J. Gibson:] And erm, do you spend a lot of money, money on clothes?
[speaker004:] Not if I can help it.
[J. Gibson:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker004:] No.
[B. Singh:] Excellent! Wasn't that good.
[speaker004:] Yeah. Good.
[Justin:] It was good.
[speaker002:] [clapping]
[J. Worrow:] Right.
[B. Singh:] You can keep your pen on the table.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[J. Gibson:] He's gonna stab.
[speaker004:] I have this, it's, it's it's it's
[B. Singh:] It's like being stuck on a telephone line.
[speaker004:] it's a really annoying habit I've got
[B. Singh:] I know.
[speaker004:] I know but I just can't help fidgeting my bottom.
[B. Singh:] I know it's annoying, no. I know it's annoying.
[J. Gibson:] [LAUGHTER]
[Justin:] But I have anno
[J. Gibson:] It is annoying though.
[Justin:] with a pen.
[J. Gibson:] [LAUGHTER]
[J. Worrow:] Do we all agree, we say annoying?
[B. Singh:] Yep.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[J. Fowles:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Okay. Quiet, please, for Daniel.
[speaker004:] It's incomplete.
[J. Gibson:] Think of a word.
[speaker004:] Thank you Jean, I'll forgive ya. Erm... what type of music do you like?
[J. Gibson:] I like most types of music but erm... at the moment I'm, I'm into U B forty, I quite like them.
[speaker004:] You say, now... erm... why do you listen to this particular music?
[J. Gibson:] I think my daughter really weaned me onto it. [LAUGHTER]... I didn't have much choice, I wasn't listening to it anyway so then I... got quite to like it then.
[J. Worrow:] Yes, you.
[speaker004:] Erm... where do you listen to this music?
[J. Gibson:] Er, it's just at home usually.
[speaker004:] So, do you listen to this every day
[speaker002:] [sneeze]
[speaker004:] or is it like
[J. Gibson:] Oh no, just occasionally
[speaker004:] just sort of like
[J. Gibson:] occasionally
[speaker004:] when you've got a bit of spare time?
[speaker002:] [sneeze]
[J. Gibson:] It's usually at weekends you know
[speaker002:] Ooh! [LAUGHTER] Excuse me [].
[J. Gibson:] I listen to them.
[speaker004:] Yeah. Will you have this music played at your funeral?
[J. Gibson:] [tut]!
[P. Ford:] [LAUGHTER] Oh God []!
[J. Gibson:] Mm? No I don't think so. [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Erm, I need that one there.
[Justin:] You sound like a copper.
[B. Singh:] That one there. A what?
[Justin:] He sounds like a copper doesn't he?
[B. Singh:] [LAUGHTER]
[J. Gibson:] A copper. Aye.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[J. Worrow:] Jean, you know what the answer is don't you?
[J. Gibson:] I don't know. [LAUGHTER] I don't care, I'm not there [].
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Yeah. Well done. Well done. Lots of informa, I know it's not re, I know we haven't talked about selling T N T, and I'll, your questions aren't really about this time, I'll do that in a minute. What questions can we ask about T N T, to T N T potential customers? We asked about music, we asked about food, we asked about holidays, we asked family, we asked about, what was Ja, Mandy's questions to you Jane? What was your
[J. Fowles:] Driving.
[B. Singh:] question?
[speaker002:] Driving.
[B. Singh:] Driving. We asked about, what was your question to
[speaker004:] Music.
[B. Singh:] music. Er, er clothes to Danny. What questions do you want to know from customers about, what d'ya wanna know about them?
[Justin:] Their business.
[B. Singh:] About their business. What about their business Justin? What is the question that you want... answered?
[speaker004:] Do they send goods out? Do they want a carrier?
[J. Gibson:] Do you use a carrier?
[B. Singh:] Right.
[P. Summers:] How regular?
[B. Singh:] Can we assume that something moves out of most buildings?
[speaker004:] Yep.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[J. Fowles:] Yeah, we can.
[B. Singh:] What sort of things move out of any... business premises.
[P. Ford:] Papers
[J. Fowles:] Letters.
[P. Ford:] or letters.
[speaker002:] Documents.
[B. Singh:] That's right. Something's likely to move. So yo, rather, do they send goods out? Can we assume that one anyway Ju, maybe not goods
[Justin:] Well I su
[B. Singh:] but there's, something moves that needs a delivery
[speaker004:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] somewhere. Would you, would,wo, I mean, just the way, what made you feel that it wouldn't be the case? But would you mean
[speaker002:] Well er, well I've, and added two hundred mailers
[B. Singh:] Mhm.
[speaker002:] in like two days and
[B. Singh:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] that's the fir, and you ring up hairdressers and
[B. Singh:] Mm.
[speaker002:] vets and all sorts
[B. Singh:] Mm.
[speaker002:] so you had to ask them.
[B. Singh:] Mm.
[speaker002:] A couple
[A. Bond:] Some people just have, some people will will never have a need for a carrying service.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[J. Gibson:] No, there is some
[speaker002:] Are you, sort of
[B. Singh:] Okay, you were talking about, you you're talking about your target customers were sort of like abattoirs and hairdressers and stuff like that?
[speaker002:] Yeah but you know the mailers that we did, I mean
[B. Singh:] Right.
[speaker002:] that that
[B. Singh:] They were just registered businesses.
[speaker002:] we were told to ask
[B. Singh:] Right.
[speaker002:] you know
[B. Singh:] Okay.
[speaker002:] do you ever have a need for a carrier
[B. Singh:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] at all? You know before you start giving them all the spiel
[B. Singh:] What type of question is that though? Do you ever have a need
[Justin:] Closed.
[B. Singh:] for a carrier?
[speaker002:] It's closed.
[B. Singh:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] Cold. It's, still a
[Justin:] You have to open.
[B. Singh:] How can you ask to that? Yeah, you could say that. Well there's, they need to know a little bit about you. So you said, you know, good morning, my name's Kath. I'm a, the business repre, I'm, I represent th er, T N T super mail, I... er, am responsible for business development here you've recently received... er erm, a some information from our company, am I right?
[speaker002:] Yes.
[Justin:] Yes.
[B. Singh:] Or I know you've recently received some information, that's good. I can see that you are a hairdresser... now what question do you wanna ask?
[speaker002:] Would you ever need
[Justin:] How often do you have a use for a parcel carrier?
[B. Singh:] How often would you ever send, or something into your company, or have something sent out especially, by perhaps a customer request? So you need to know how often, right? Assume something goes. I guarantee something'll go. It might be once in
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] bloody blue moon... and you may not be worth putting on your and calling every six weeks Mandy, but, it might be worth asking it in a more open way. Because Sod's law'll say if you ask it open, you'll find summat out you never assumed.
[speaker002:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] Yo you know. You never thought. Well actually, yes we're the head office
[speaker002:] [clears throat]
[B. Singh:] for a regional group here and as well as have a, er an actual service for hairdressing we also have a distribution... er control shop at the back. And, we have our own delivery service... to our cu, to our own network. Now what's the question you can ask this hairdresser that got his own bus, I know I'm using a, a an extreme
[speaker002:] Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] point, they've got their own delivery service. What else would you like to ask?
[speaker002:] Is there any place you can ever not go to?
[B. Singh:] What areas does it, do they tend to serve? What happens if... give me an scenario, a cautionary tale like the insurance man does to his customers. You sell
[J. Worrow:] God forbid
[B. Singh:] God forbid?
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[J. Worrow:] God forbid that you should ever lose parcel... and Mrs on Newcastle hasn't got a wig base any more
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[J. Worrow:] your reputation's going to be in tatters, isn't it?
[B. Singh:] What do you do in that situation?
[J. Worrow:] What are you gonna do?
[J. Gibson:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Do you know the one thing in that
[J. Worrow:] God forbid!
[B. Singh:] he said, and I wrote it down here, which I think is wonderful, probe th the past problems and future worries. What would happen if
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] in the future? What has happened, when
[speaker002:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] is past. Yeah? That's a very good question.
[J. Worrow:] That's how they do, sell insurance cos e everybody knows who they've use, had a mishap and not insured.
[B. Singh:] Because if you say, have you, what type of question's this? Have you ever had any problems?
[P. Summers:] It's a closed one.
[speaker002:] Na, no.
[B. Singh:] And what they gonna say?
[speaker002:] No.
[B. Singh:] How difficult was it Mandy to think when Jenny was asking you about your holiday?
[speaker002:] It was quite difficult. Why? Mm mm.
[B. Singh:] And you, you gave... mono, what's the word?
[Justin:] syllabic. Syllabic.
[P. Summers:] Syllabic.
[B. Singh:] syllabic. Can't get my teeth right. Monos, one word answers didn't she? Long words like. What I'm saying is, is if customers feel like that and if you ask, if, they must say yes, no, because it, to engage, hang on th the phone rings, ring, ring, ring, [mimicking telephone voice] ya, yes? Yeah? Erm, yes... right... er, yes []. You know, and they're in this sort of
[speaker004:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] mo, very
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] fra,ma frame of mind, you got to demand... and wait for the answer, even though it might take a minute for the to say [mimicking telephone voice] erm, erm, oh we use erm, you know, we've got a, a, a local van that comes and se, like, you know []. What happens if... [mimicking telephone voice] Well, oh sa, pwurgh, I don't know, I mean she has to wait... for a week []. You know? You know. Or we rush one over to her specially, make a special journey. Right, now where d'ya, what do you wanna go, what question do you wanna ask her next? Someone other than Justin now.
[A. Bond:] How do you achieve that?
[B. Singh:] How do you achieve that. Good question. What sort of question is that Bill, open or closed? Open.
[A. Bond:] Open.
[B. Singh:] Wo! That is open question. How do you achieve that? Now sometimes what salesmen do is suggest the answer, do you do this? Do you do that? Do you do that? Do you do that? Shut up! Don't keep on.
[J. Worrow:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] How do you do that? Quite difficult eh, er... well usually somebody goes in their car, you know. She'll send her, or I'll le I'll let someone go, someone from the shop go. Now what do you wanna ask? You think of the problems.
[P. Summers:] Could this possibly leave you short handed? No that's a closed question.
[B. Singh:] Closed.. Right, a good question. A very good question. Could it leave you short handed? Change it to an open question.
[Justin:] How do you manage when this person's out delivering... the goods?
[B. Singh:] Hang on Justin. Same question Paul
[P. Summers:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] but what it means is, what's the difference?
[P. Summers:] Well, you've gotta.
[B. Singh:] That's right. Or, you shut up
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[J. Fowles:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] and I start talking, you'll find out more. How do you manage? Really? God forbid! How do you manage?
[P. Summers:] Touch wood.
[B. Singh:] Oh! You don't say? Honestly? You've got that, you blow the problem up a bit. Hang on in there now, you've found it!
[speaker004:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] That's where you wanna be. I don't care whether you can't work a rate out... I don't care whether you know nothing about T N T, you've found a need. Do you want some help? You got to the close, do you want some help? And they say
[J. Gibson:] Well yes.
[B. Singh:] what are you offering? You say, I'll tell ya. I've got my, my
[J. Worrow:] Oh yes.
[B. Singh:] .
[J. Worrow:] Ah!
[B. Singh:] Yeah?
[J. Worrow:] That's when you, you get your question.
[B. Singh:] You're in there.
[J. Worrow:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] Your
[speaker002:] Oh Justin!
[B. Singh:] now you've gotta use those... features and benefits to explain. So you've gotta be thinking and know which features to pull out. You don't have to say... we are... a multi-national company with a hundred, in among hundred and ninety countries, we have a sales, a fleet of three thousand in this country, you don't have to give them a list. D'ya remember going through this and what did the fella say on the phone, can you remember?
[P. Summers:] You're too big for us.
[speaker002:] Too big for me.
[Justin:] Too big for me.
[B. Singh:] You're too big for us.
[J. Worrow:] Or
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] This is a, this a smaller regional office, you'll know that we have a local depot here in Lan, in Stockport. wherever you are, if it's a local set-up. Yeah? And you relate the features... in the right way to that appropriate... package, that... problem. Yeah? And in closing you simply say... do you want to use us? Shall we go ahead with it? What other ways can you have to close a question, when you want, wanna get a green light? You've presented your offers out
[speaker004:] Can we get some? Get some help.
[B. Singh:] Shall we start, shall we start coming up? Erm, shall we start, you might not even have to get the, shall we start it, the ball rolling then?
[speaker002:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] What other ways can you ask them if they wanna get the
[P. Ford:] Would you like me to arrange an appointment?
[B. Singh:] Would you like me to, yes, maybe ha, if you ask a question and haven't established what? You've gotta establish something else. Just wanna to try, get them to try, try it. Yeah. Would you like to u, can you see yourself that service? What d'ya wanna know now? Where? Quickly. You can't wait, see how the a, it begs the other question? When would like to start? Would you like to start now or good.
[speaker004:] Mm.
[B. Singh:] I'm gonna have to let Carly have your go now?
[speaker004:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] Cos you've got to get two, you need to, you need to really close there don't you? I'm gonna stop it there folks. Have I given you something to be going on with?
[Justin:] You have, yes, thank you.
[speaker004:] Thank you.
[J. Worrow:] Very interesting that.
[B. Singh:] I'll be keeping this for the next few days with me looking after it.
[J. Worrow:] No he, he said didn't want it.
[speaker004:] Can we take
[J. Fowles:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] You better take, we're spending, we'll be, yeah, you can spend more time there.
[Justin:] Kath, what am I doing tomorrow?
[B. Singh:] What, what?
[J. Fowles:] Stick up walls.
[Justin:] That,.
[B. Singh:] Come on then.
[J. Worrow:] phone calls can we make?
[Justin:] Ah that's alright then?
[B. Singh:] [LAUGHTER]
[P. Summers:] Same as this.
[J. Fowles:] Thanks Kathy.
[B. Singh:] Okay.
[Justin:] Thank you Kath. I won't be here tomorrow.
[J. Fowles:] See you soon.
[B. Singh:] Oh that's alright then.
[J. Fowles:] Hopefully.
[B. Singh:] You'll tha, you'll, yes
[Justin:] So we can ring you up.
[B. Singh:] have a brilliant time.
[J. Gibson:] Oh righto.
[B. Singh:] What I want you to do, I don't want to delay you because of your erm... trains and I'd will have hate to be the ones that keep you any later, you have an
[speaker002:] I know.
[B. Singh:] evaluation sheet
[P. Ford:] Yes.
[B. Singh:] and you have your agenda, will you fill it in and send it to me?
[Justin:] How shall we send it?
[B. Singh:] Right.
[Justin:] Which service would you
[J. Fowles:] Internal.
[Justin:] like us
[B. Singh:] You
[Justin:] to use?
[B. Singh:] you do that
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[P. Summers:] Three day.
[B. Singh:] Who is taking these
[P. Summers:] When did you want it?
[B. Singh:] through to... the
[Justin:] Me.
[B. Singh:] Oh are you Justin? Will you send me yours?
[Justin:] Okay.
[B. Singh:] Will the others fill them in now.
[J. Fowles:] Oh! Jenny, I need to get your
[A. Bond:] Can we fill them in tonight and
[J. Fowles:] my bag out of the back.
[A. Bond:] give it in
[B. Singh:] Can you give me it tomorrow?
[A. Bond:] but give them in the morning cos we've got to come over in the morning haven't we?
[speaker002:] Shall I give the keys to
[B. Singh:] Well what are you gonna do now then?
[speaker002:] Are you gonna drop it down?
[Justin:] I'll go and
[A. Bond:] I dunno. Cos I haven't thought.
[speaker002:] Oh brilliant!
[B. Singh:] You're gonna stay. You're gonna sit down and do them now.
[speaker002:] I'll give the keys to you in a minute.
[J. Fowles:] Have you got time to do it now?
[speaker002:] No, cos we'll be going in a minute. I'll do it tomorrow.
[B. Singh:] No you're se, you're sta staying
[A. Bond:] Said we've just gotta stay here.
[B. Singh:] to do them now.
[speaker002:] Yeah but I thought we should get cracking... in the car.
[A. Bond:] We can't really stay, you have to come in in the morning.
[speaker002:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] Danny, you're, you're getting your er, you're gonna wait for yours are you?
[speaker004:] I've already done it now?
[speaker002:] See you! Nice meeting everybody. .
[J. Worrow:] Take care.
[Justin:] See you later.
[B. Singh:] No Carly, it's too late to do it now.
[speaker002:] Yeah, hopefully.
[speaker004:] I just got a message from.
[Justin:] See you later mate.
[B. Singh:] Would you fill that in now
[speaker002:] See you later mate.
[B. Singh:] and then sleep on it? Are you feeling alright my dear you look a bit?
[speaker004:] See you back at the old sales office.
[J. Gibson:] No I don't.
[speaker002:] Yeah, you could say that.
[B. Singh:] No?
[J. Gibson:] I don't feel in here.
[Justin:] Right, see you later then.
[B. Singh:] Cos I've been spectating
[J. Gibson:] I know. John never said.
[B. Singh:] You look a bit, I've lost you somewhere now.
[J. Gibson:] Thanks a lot.
[J. Fowles:] See you Mandy.
[J. Gibson:] See ya.
[J. Fowles:] See you Mandy.
[J. Gibson:] Bye. Give me a ring.
[J. Fowles:] Yeah I'll find out.
[J. Gibson:] Even if it's.
[J. Fowles:] Cos I don't know your number, give me a ring between one and three.
[J. Gibson:] Give you a, a chat to you.
[J. Fowles:] [LAUGHTER] Freephone number [].
[J. Gibson:] Ah! Oh good!
[speaker002:] Oh sorry darling.
[J. Gibson:] Of course!
[J. Fowles:] Of course! See you Danny.
[speaker004:] Bye Jenny. Bye love., back to your car yes?
[B. Singh:] It's, Jenny
[speaker004:] Yeah well we'll going anyway so
[B. Singh:] will you, be alright when you get to your car?
[J. Fowles:] Yeah.
[Justin:] No stay here with me I'm gonna walk
[speaker002:] No but she's got a phone in the car.
[B. Singh:] Take care ladies, look after yourselves.
[speaker002:] Yeah and you Bill.
[J. Worrow:] Yes well this is.
[J. Gibson:] Best of luck Bill. I hope to hear from you. Get some.
[P. Summers:] Oh I see.
[speaker002:] Yeah and you.
[J. Worrow:] Oh I've got to see if Frank's changed.
[B. Singh:] Well no, you can do it first. I dunno, but we haven't got any. I need them. Well in, twenty minutes. Well yeah.
[J. Fowles:] In twenty minutes?
[B. Singh:] So you'll be back here at quarter past four Alright then. and you finish the. Okay then.
[speaker002:] [LAUGHTER]
[B. Singh:] So you don't have to. You know that would be better
[speaker002:] Wo oh oh oh oh!
[Justin:] Yeah, I think she wants... I'm trying
[speaker002:] Oh that's better.
[B. Singh:] Don't worry. Everything will be fine.
[Justin:] Alright. Well I'll bring him back here.
[J. Worrow:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] Yeah. Well where are you going, are you not coming back then now? Alright. What, what room number are you in then? One, twenty eight?
[speaker004:] Yeah.
[speaker002:] Right, I'll give you a ring when they
[speaker004:] Well er, once I've had my dinner.
[J. Worrow:] Cheers then.
[Justin:] See ya. Ta ta.
[speaker004:] See you later.
[J. Worrow:] Yep.
[speaker004:] Bye- bye.
[speaker002:] Ta -ta.
[J. Worrow:] I do get... I mean it's come back
[B. Singh:] I think it's, it's down there
[J. Worrow:] you might say it's... with, with.
[B. Singh:] [LAUGHTER]
[Justin:] What's second, third and fourth?
[B. Singh:] Jenny I thought would ring.
[P. Summers:] See you later.
[P. Ford:] I'll see you back at the classroom round there
[speaker004:] What room number are you in?
[P. Ford:] tomorrow morning
[B. Singh:] Okay.
[P. Ford:] then Bill?
[J. Gibson:] Thanks very much. My stomach's churning.
[A. Bond:] I'll see you when you come down tomorrow then.
[B. Singh:] If you'd like to go and get a cup of tea
[A. Bond:] No it's alright John.
[B. Singh:] from the canteen
[speaker002:] Bye!
[B. Singh:] you can fill that in down there. If you'd rather have a cold drink
[Justin:] We got a same day driver picking me up at five fo, five thirty outside the hotel.
[B. Singh:] Oh right.
[J. Gibson:] Five? Well you get off.
[speaker002:] On same day service now?
[J. Gibson:] Oh you're going same day are ya?
[Justin:] Yeah they said erm
[J. Gibson:] Can we see
[Justin:] Said it could be better [phone rings]
[B. Singh:] I'll get it. Don't worry.
[J. Worrow:] Use my cell phone.
[J. Gibson:] Can we cube ya?
[B. Singh:] I think this is a telephone shall I tell
[Justin:] No I think Mandy's in the area.
[B. Singh:] phone, does anybody know how I'm gonna get one? [on telephone] Hello [].
[speaker002:] Where's... Jenny now?
[Justin:] She's gone down to pay for the, get something out of the boot outside.
[J. Gibson:] And help me do [LAUGHTER] [].
[speaker002:] Oh has she?
[J. Gibson:] A fiver. Oh, you're a hard women, och I'll buy you.
[speaker002:] David's getting them in.
[J. Gibson:] What?
[speaker002:] Or thre er Terry.
[J. Gibson:] What?
[Justin:] Are you getting a lift with Justin?
[speaker004:] No I just said.
[J. Gibson:] No.
[speaker004:] Er Justin
[Justin:] I want erm my and my bag.
[speaker004:] No Jenny's coming back, I think.
[J. Gibson:] Justin's not coming back. I think
[speaker004:] Justin
[J. Gibson:] he's taking, has Jenny?
[speaker004:] Jus, er Justin's gotta come back in
[B. Singh:] I know.
[speaker004:] a minute. Jenny's come back in a couple of minutes.
[J. Gibson:] Justin's not coming back.
[speaker004:] Well
[B. Singh:] Yes.
[speaker004:] he's gotta come back
[speaker002:] Yes.
[speaker004:] hand his folder in. I said
[J. Gibson:] Yeah?
[speaker004:] that to him.
[B. Singh:] Do you wanna go and get yourself a cold drink?
[J. Gibson:] Oh oh.
[B. Singh:] The girls in the canteen want to lock up and go home.
[speaker004:] It's alright cos Jenny, Jenny'll be back.
[J. Gibson:] Shall we do our
[speaker004:] We're getting
[B. Singh:] Well so
[speaker004:] picked up.
[B. Singh:] Complete this up here. No, no, my bag has Then you come back here.
[speaker004:] Alright.
[B. Singh:] Go and get yourself a
[Justin:] And if I don't see her, you can wait another twenty minutes.
[B. Singh:] Alright. go and get yourself a cold drink and bring it back up here.
[speaker004:] ?
[Justin:] Yeah.
[B. Singh:] I dunno if she's coming back.
[speaker004:] That's a closed question.
[Justin:] Ah!
[speaker004:] Mind you, well that is.
[speaker002:] Shut the door
[B. Singh:] go and get yourself a cold drink... and come back and. The only ones I'll let go... are Carly and Bill, they've gotta catch a plane, er train, and Justin's got to come back before he heads back to the hotel. But while you're here... leave it covered like this... and it's a bit. [walking out of room]