[June:] What's this for?
[Sandra:] I'll tell you all about that afterwards, and then you can tell me if you don't want to.... I'll put it
[June:] Alright?
[Sandra:] away.
[June:] Yeah. They can't
[Sandra:] And then nobody'll think about it.
[Pat:] Oh!
[Mary:] Yeah, that's true.
[June:] Here! I don't know whether I'm starting a hernia or ulcer.
[Pat:] Oh dear!
[Louis:] Oh! I've got a fairly.
[Mary:] Hiatus one?
[June:] Er, I think it is.
[Mary:] Yeah?
[June:] Er, what's it's... I was still on traction you see, and last week when I went... I thought I'd got these hives.
[Mary:] Oh!
[Louis:] Yet I sat.
[Sandra:] I'll
[June:] I
[Sandra:] leave that behind.
[June:] I couldn't make up my mind what it was. Anyway, I told her today, and she says it's nothing to do with it. But well, I've got it again.
[Sandra:] Oh!
[June:] And so I'm thinking it's... Sally says keeping moaning, go to the doctors.
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[Louis:] Hi Sandra!
[Marg:] Hello Sandra!
[Sandra:] Hello!
[Louis:] Hello!
[Marg:] Hello!
[Sandra:] Hello!
[Marg:] Hello! I'm, she can't come
[June:] Yesterday's carols.
[Marg:] with us yet. I think er, the good times are over judging by the way the
[June:] And they're stretched far back you see.
[Sandra:] Oh yeah.
[Mary:] Mind you, we've done pretty well haven't we?
[Sandra:] Ooh ah!
[June:] Oh yeah! Yeah!
[Mary:] And nice, that lady who... left it there.
[June:] I've left it there. Shown you, that was
[Sandra:] Oh yeah!
[June:] one of my Christmas presents!
[Sandra:] Oh!
[June:] Well they
[Sandra:] That's nice!
[June:] well they wanted twenty!
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] Oh []!
[Mary:] Who was that you did? Do you know?
[June:] Er, Grammar Catholic.
[Mary:] Oh! What are the?
[June:] Christmas presents.
[Pat:] Are they all?
[June:] the back of you, I mean couldn't you just
[Sandra:] That's.
[Pat:] I like the, no, that, that sums up the glory
[Sandra:] Yeah, yeah.
[Pat:] of it.
[June:] Doesn't it?
[Sandra:] Oh yeah.
[Mary:] How much do I owe you?
[June:] Well have a.
[Mary:] Well I've got my coat on why don't you come round and annoy me!
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker007:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] It was. That was Christmas Eve
[Mary:] You sure?
[Sandra:] wasn't it?
[Mary:] I know what you're gonna
[Louis:] No!
[Mary:] get.
[Louis:] The other one was Christmas day!
[Mary:] !
[Louis:] I know!
[Sandra:] Here's our lady. Our resuscitation lady.
[June:] Yes. That's the only good'un int it?
[Sandra:] Aye, aye
[Marg:] Who, who put that write up in the
[Sandra:] I haven't put it in.
[Marg:] I thought you had.
[Sandra:] No! No! I haven't put it in.
[Mary:] Nothing to do with me. I thought you'd
[Sandra:] No.
[Mary:] done it.
[Sandra:] No.
[Marg:] No.
[Mary:] In the Advertiser tonight.
[Sandra:] I didn't know there was one in!
[Marg:] Well that's
[Pat:] Oh yeah!
[Marg:] what I thought you were going on about. You have to take it out.
[Pat:] Yeah I, that's what I thought. Oh! Julie! What have you been doing now?
[June:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Well it's in our paper then?
[Louis:] I bet you thought I was, I did it.
[Sandra:] Yes, I thought you'd done it now.
[June:] We're just getting his presentation.
[Sandra:] Oh I thought they hadn't
[June:] Oh I when I get home.
[Pat:] What?
[Mary:] How many?
[speaker007:] I dunno. I didn't... because I said er, could say she put a hat on. . They haven't put in. Then how well
[June:] Yes, but I don't you have.
[speaker007:] But she has!
[June:] Placed it into there.
[speaker007:] But she has.
[Sandra:] You look
[speaker007:] She has.
[Sandra:] you look like you're in a drunken stupor don't you?
[speaker007:] Well she couldn't get up!
[June:] [LAUGHTER]... She's done that then
[Pat:] Oh!
[June:] they just dropped.
[Louis:] That was, what with being dropped at the end of the day.
[Sandra:] Must have been green. Something in green.
[Louis:] This was, at the end of the day when we finally
[Mary:] Oh!
[Louis:] sat down and said
[Sandra:] Well I said but
[Louis:] well I said as mu if I didn't take my shoes off it
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Louis:] ooh I was ever so poorly!
[speaker007:] end of the week.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[June:] You went white
[Pat:] Yeah.
[June:] you did.
[Louis:] And I was really, and, and the thought
[Mary:] But you
[Louis:] of being ill
[June:] Yes, you went white.
[speaker007:] [LAUGHTER]
[Marg:] Oh gosh!
[Sandra:] I just hope you're there [LAUGHTER] quick enough []!
[Louis:] I know Elizabeth was praying for me and James was, and my mother was. And Julie was.
[June:] White she went!
[Louis:] We got a hundred and thirty pins out in fifteen minutes on the twentieth didn't we Margaret?
[Marg:] Mm. Yeah, and then go and put a in the paper.
[Sandra:] Yes. Oh I know
[June:] Ah!
[Louis:] What was the again?
[Marg:] I went down and told them!
[Pat:] I should, I said oh they int... I said obviously they weren't there!
[Marg:] Yeah.
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Marg:] I went down... but, but they haven't put it back in the
[Louis:] How many times they get it wrong! But what's so down there?
[speaker008:] Yeah.
[Marg:] Yeah I know, yeah.
[Louis:] You know I wish I hadn't.
[Sandra:] Oh is that so?
[June:] and they put an article in saying, it's got nothing to do with it at all! And it's fairly easy
[Sandra:] Oh!
[Marg:] Yeah. Yes, I er, I went down and told them but they haven't pu they haven't put it back in.
[Sandra:] Anyway, Mary will have a sense of authority, she's going to she may go in his lecture, she'll meet him. Or like that when they
[June:] Well there won't be anybody
[Sandra:] how much er
[June:] coming this week should they?
[Sandra:] and er
[Pat:] No.
[Mary:] I rang Cathy from Market Drayton
[Sandra:] Oh yes Mary.
[Mary:] I put it on the... machine... and I didn't think she would... she'd get over just for the meeting at night, but I did. And I rang Je
[Sandra:] Oh!
[Mary:] Jenny and Dave... passed it on to them
[June:] Yeah.
[Mary:] for Mr and Mrs, so
[June:] Yeah.
[Mary:] whether or not they do make it. Er
[Sandra:] Oh yeah!
[Mary:] but I did say seven
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Mary:] so
[Sandra:] She understands. Oh yes, it was at the end wasn't it?
[Mary:] Well we just sort of sat down and said... [LAUGHTER] anything to eat! Anything to eat []!
[June:] Yeah.
[Mary:] Just let me get
[Sandra:] Did most of them that... is there?
[June:] The one in blue.
[Mary:] But my Edna couldn't get over the fact that sh she'd gone through all that
[June:] Yeah.
[Mary:] and stayed till the end of the party!
[June:] Yeah, but when I took her the toilet she wanted to go toilet
[Mary:] Yeah.
[June:] she says, [whispering] I'm sure they're gonna []. I said
[Mary:] Yeah.
[June:] well when you get back you tell me.
[Mary:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Is this the ones that were?
[June:] Yeah, but I mean, yeah.
[Sandra:] Yeah! Her heart stopped.
[June:] I took her the toilet she wanted to wash her face.
[Louis:] That's right! She stopped breathing!
[June:] And er
[Mary:] Well who got her going, you?
[Louis:] Yes, us and Sandra!
[June:] And then
[Louis:] going... whoo whoo... I said, I think the heart's still going! I was quickly going whoo whoo!
[Mary:] Good Lord!
[Louis:] And then her heart would go
[Sandra:] I mean I
[Louis:] erm... how do you erm... bandage the foot!
[June:] [LAUGHTER]
[Louis:] And me and him started laughing and had to know what it was.
[Mary:] Well I, and she didn't?
[June:] It's
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[June:] surprising what er
[Sandra:] We th we rang nine nine nine
[Mary:] !
[Sandra:] they sent er... two paramedics.
[Mary:] Oh stupid! I wouldn't have never have known
[Sandra:] Erm She had erm... er
[Mary:] and er
[Sandra:] angina... but she takes this spray
[Mary:] Oh! Doesn't she
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] not tablets. Me I mean she takes it when she's er
[June:] does it. See I wanted to take that.
[Sandra:] bad.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[June:] Yeah. But it doesn't go that far.
[Sandra:] And she said every time she takes it makes her ill.
[Louis:] Looks bad doesn't it?
[Sandra:] No. The father has the same
[Mary:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and he stopped
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] taking it cos it did the same thing.
[speaker007:] Mind you,
[June:] Oh yeah.
[Sandra:] Cos it makes her so ill!
[speaker007:] You can er, get that
[Pat:] Why doesn't she go the doctors?
[Sandra:] And th then she was saying well we told her
[Louis:] That's it!
[Sandra:] to go.
[Mary:] Stupid!
[Sandra:] So er
[June:] Well it's terrifying for us!
[Marg:] What a responsibility for you!
[Sandra:] Well, I was told somebody that there was a lady not feeling very well. So I went across and she was sitting by the fire exit behind the piano... and er, I said what's up? She said well, I've had my medicine I'm not too good and I feel a bit
[Mary:] Oh thank you very much!
[Sandra:] then sh she says I've been. Having, having looked at her
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and she was beginning to
[June:] Four or five of these.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] hyperventilate.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] She was panicking and the more she panicked the more she was
[June:] Yes.
[Sandra:] gasping!
[Mary:] Yeah!
[Sandra:] The more she was sucking in, and she says I'm going! Well fortunately, for me she wasn't what I call a big lady
[Mary:] Mm.
[Sandra:] so I put her on the floor, lifted her feet up to get the blood... back to her head
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and... she to she took about three minutes before she opened her eyes and came round. And then sh Elizabeth had come over by then... and I said it's... it's in her bag, so we had a look at it and her friend said it's for angina, it always makes her ill! Then we got her up and she said I'm going to be sick... so I said don't worry about it. But we undid the fire door, which was fortunate we were by it and I said look I'll take you outside the fresh air might revive you.
[speaker007:] Mhm.
[Sandra:] So Elizabeth was about to get her onto the to carry her out, [LAUGHTER] she said nice and gently and picked her up and taken her outside []!
[June:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] We sat her out on the chair, put her head between her knees... and said look, take some big deep breaths and if you're sick don't worry about it, you'll be alright. Next thing she says, I feel funny! Oh I'm going she says! And the ne that was it! Just gone! And she stopped breathing! And I thought
[speaker007:] What outside?
[Sandra:] Cos
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I laid her on the conc you know, like the, the step out
[speaker007:] Oh God!
[Sandra:] at the back we la
[Marg:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] we laid her on the step and I said to Elizabeth she's stopped breathing! Elizabeth going, stopped, oh oh oh! She has! [LAUGHTER] Well er
[Marg:] Good job sh you was still
[Sandra:] we sat there
[Marg:] there.
[Sandra:] well, we started this mouth to mouth and Elizabeth says I'll and I'll put, I said I think her heart's going, but... I mean, to me it means anything... to get her going.
[speaker007:] Mm!
[Sandra:] Anyway, we kept blowing in, and we must have been doing mouth to mouth for about eighteen... er about a mi a minute and a half.
[speaker007:] Really?
[Sandra:] She suddenly, Elizabeth... there's her one arm after she pressed down on her dress and then she goes, ooh! That's it, she's going! We rolled her on the side and she, she was very shallow breath
[Marg:] Mm.
[Sandra:] like... oh we talked to her and then we said, don't worry ambulance is coming. Just like, she went berserk! I'm not going anywhere! I'm not going! We had to promise she wouldn't go.
[June:] That's it, they wouldn't go.
[Sandra:] Anyway, when the ambulance men came... we made them a cup of tea, cos they said they a they'd have been that busy they haven't had a break!
[Pat:] Oh!
[Sandra:] So we made them a cup of tea and hopefully they were going to talk her into it. And they said, if she doesn't go... responsibility that we can accept and then... she's had the chance to go.
[Mary:] Yeah! That's right.
[June:] Yeah, they.
[Sandra:] And she should have gone.
[June:] Yeah well,sh when she went on Thursday she said... [whispering] I should have gone [].
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[June:] I said, well when you go back.
[Sandra:] Yeah well
[Pat:] Cos really, I mean an E C G might have guaranteed some.
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Well I think more than anything if they'd have seen the state she was in after she'd had this
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] drug, they could have probably kept her in, stabilized her on a new one
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and then kept
[speaker007:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] her on the new ones.
[June:] And she needs something.
[speaker007:] Yeah. Yeah I know.
[June:] I mean you shouldn't be feeling like, I mean... my mum had angina and my husband had angina but no,th the medicine never affected her like that!
[Sandra:] Well it did on my dad. This new spray apparently
[speaker007:] Oh well, I've had
[Sandra:] does give them
[speaker007:] no complaints about the er
[June:] Terrible innit!
[Sandra:] It's the... tri-nitrate, you know. The glycerine tri- nitrate.
[speaker007:] Yeah. Yep.
[Sandra:] How it affected them.
[speaker007:] Now I know one or two people who said they've had such terrible headaches
[Louis:] You're not gonna cook another
[Sandra:] Yeah?
[Louis:] it's really
[speaker007:] I
[Louis:] hot!
[June:] Yeah. Oh
[speaker007:] Sometimes Graham had a headache
[Sandra:] This spray gives a headache most of time.
[June:] That's the
[Mary:] Had your father had the pains in his chest
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Mary:] and the terrible thumping headache as well?
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Pat:] Oh dear!
[Mary:] You see, a lot of people are saying that they should take
[Louis:] Ooh I was frightened! Well I don't think I can feel like I suppose that were Victoria wasn't it, ringing nine nine nine they forgot to ask
[Sandra:] Mm. I know.
[Louis:] See, she stopped breathing!
[speaker007:] Yeah.
[Louis:] And they were ages out
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Louis:] in
[Sandra:] Anthony came through the corridors and say is Elizabeth there and was on
[speaker009:] One, two, three, four, five, six,.
[Sandra:] the floor and said, oh! [LAUGHTER] And sort of came away [] much to say... thought it was a joke, like
[speaker007:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] you know. Cos we didn't want... the four,th the ladies that she was with... they knew what was happening but nobody else knew
[Louis:] No!
[speaker007:] No.
[Pat:] But what, I mean, why they have
[speaker007:] I thought you had five of them, I didn't realize.
[Louis:] You know, I didn't know what to do with her Pat she!
[June:] I thought perhaps she had too much to drink.
[Sandra:] No. Cos a gentlemen who'd come from
[Louis:] Or bra brain damage anything!
[Sandra:] there and... Grange, and he's had a bit to drink, he wasn't drunk, but
[speaker007:] But she's a nice lady!
[Sandra:] apparently he's argumentative.
[Marg:] Oh yeah.
[Sandra:] He'd said something to this lady and under normal circumstances he would not a she wouldn't have said anything
[Louis:] Ooh sorry Margaret!
[Sandra:] but
[Louis:] It's gone on.
[Marg:] Oh it's alright, don't worry.
[Sandra:] she did.
[Marg:] Alright.
[Sandra:] And it was upset of answering
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] him back.
[speaker007:] Oh!
[Sandra:] He argued back with her... and
[speaker007:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] she just
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] panicked!
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] It was the argument that did it.
[June:] Yeah. It did.
[Marg:] Oh!
[Mary:] And I think it's, it's.
[speaker007:] Well it doesn't do you any good.
[Sandra:] It's that little man.
[Pat:] Is that the little man?
[Mary:] Yes I I know.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[June:] Yeah, him.
[Sandra:] But it were quite
[June:] They were telling him he'd had enough drink and stop
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker007:] [LAUGHTER]
[June:] being a piggy!
[speaker007:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Yeah. Yeah.
[June:] But
[speaker007:] He is argumentative.
[June:] when she went we oh he is!
[Sandra:] It's what he said! And somebody's car was actually
[June:] She was a bit troublesome.
[Louis:] I doubt
[June:] What
[Louis:] if it's her. She... really that's.
[June:] She is a bit like that int she?
[Sandra:] ... This is the one that that bloke
[Louis:] Yeah!
[Sandra:] and these all came off the same train. I thought
[Louis:] Ah! Well
[Sandra:] this lady was one who was... arguing with him as well.
[Pat:] [LAUGHTER] Eh! Will you stop [] trying to
[June:] Yes.
[Pat:] blame someone now!
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker007:] All those calories, and eh! I couldn't really She really One Crunchie and it's alright.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Louis:] Well
[June:] You know, how the
[Sandra:] do you know the lady
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] that came in the wheelchair but her husband didn't come? He ca they'd gone to pick them up
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and, he'd got her up and got her ready and sent her out and said he wouldn't come. And they were all saying... oh but he's always like that! Well, on reflection, we actually said afterwards... perhaps he wanted a day off.
[June:] Yes.
[Sandra:] If she was
[Mary:] Yes!
[Sandra:] in a wheelchair
[speaker007:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and she was well in her seventies!
[June:] Yeah. Mm.
[speaker007:] Yeah.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] He probably thought that Christmas day, even if he wasn't with her would be a godsend
[June:] Go Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
[Sandra:] if he could have a day's peace.
[Louis:] Yeah!
[Sandra:] And I actually spoke to Jenny about it
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and saying, what do you think cos... of all the qualified ones at least she... cos she worked on the elderly side.
[June:] Right. Yeah.
[Sandra:] She said, I think, you'd be better off leaving him a if he doesn't want to come
[June:] Yes.
[Sandra:] leave him alone.
[Mary:] Leave him alone, yeah
[Sandra:] And
[Mary:] that's right.
[Sandra:] they wouldn't let her sit with them because they said oh well, she's... she's you know, leave her with them, and it was that little lad
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and the next one... that woman that, this one that you
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] were saying
[June:] Aha.
[Sandra:] was complaining about him, and about this other woman so I think
[June:] That's right.
[Sandra:] the lad's got
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] they never have a good word to say for each other!
[June:] No, that was it, you know!
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[Louis:] But finally
[Sandra:] Well
[Louis:] some old people are like that That reminds me, have you said anything?
[Sandra:] And where she's moved to
[Marg:] She doesn't like it.
[Louis:] Oh!
[Marg:] And she says, they are not real friends!
[Sandra:] No. Oh! So there you are, another saga! An hour before it she was crying to Theresa.
[June:] Er
[Mary:] Who was?
[June:] which, this one?
[Sandra:] The one that passed out.
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Saying that she'd had
[Mary:] Oh I see, yeah.
[Sandra:] she doesn't like where she's been moved to because of her ill health. She had
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] to move.
[June:] Yeah.
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] She doesn't
[June:] She would
[Sandra:] like it and she turned round and she says they're not real friends.
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] And
[Mary:] Ah!
[June:] But she went to see that.
[Sandra:] Now did you that other woman, a younger woman
[June:] Erm
[Louis:] Constance.
[June:] I don't know, is she?
[Pat:] Oh yes!
[Sandra:] Oh yeah!
[Pat:] And all on her
[Louis:] She's always playing with that
[Pat:] own!
[Mary:] I know. But she's a tough one! She's the one with the
[Louis:] Yes. She looks as if she's
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Louis:] trouble!
[June:] With her table
[Sandra:] She was, she had a pocket full
[June:] Yes.
[Sandra:] of anti-depressant pills
[speaker007:] That's right.
[Sandra:] Valium
[Louis:] Well I saw her
[Sandra:] barbiturates.
[Louis:] standing in the entrance of the
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Louis:] canteen, and I said to her, are you alright? She said I'm trying to lose my temper! So I thought, oh crikey! I'll leave her alone!
[June:] [LAUGHTER] Yeah []!
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[Louis:] Cos she just sat on her own didn't she?
[Marg:] Yeah.
[Louis:] And she had a
[Sandra:] But she wasn't any trouble though.
[Louis:] No, but she
[June:] No.
[Louis:] sat on her own, Anthony came
[speaker007:] Are you sure?
[Louis:] to me and said, ah! Mum that lady's crying! I said, leave her alone, she's alright, I said, she's happy like she's like that. And then somebody else came and said she was er... I think
[speaker007:] Mm.
[Louis:] it was young Victoria
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Louis:] I said, ooh, I said, she's alright on her own, I said she's quite happy, you know
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Louis:] crying into her beer and what have you.
[Mary:] Oh yeah.
[Marg:] [LAUGHTER]
[Louis:] And she was!
[Sandra:] Yeah!
[speaker007:] Well that's right!
[Sandra:] I hope I never like that!
[speaker007:] Yeah! She wasn't very tired Marg.
[Sandra:] And she'd had a drink, and a good cry, she'd had a good time.
[Louis:] Yeah!
[Sandra:] There's her dad?
[Louis:] Yeah. There's, there's Helen's dad.
[June:] Oh! Does he?
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Your, your husband?
[Louis:] Yeah.
[June:] Oh!
[Sandra:] But, but sh
[speaker007:] Oh!
[June:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] but you re you re you realize, and I don't suppose would, that she's a psychiatric patient, to a certain degree.
[Mary:] Well whoever, whoever
[June:] [LAUGHTER] Yeah []!
[Mary:] Yeah. Yeah.
[Louis:] Well he does, sometimes she sa did she say him or did she say
[Sandra:] No, she says your dad keeps trying, er kee when I see your dad down the town... and try and
[Louis:] Well he doesn't know who's, his dad is.
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Well perhaps, perhaps the... so and so, so told me.
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[Louis:] I guess she's.
[June:] [LAUGHTER]
[Louis:] Oh I see! I see.
[June:] Oh what a shame! Oh!
[speaker007:] Well I can't remember, that's what she said
[Sandra:] Yeah well
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Well... we did have a letter off erm... Good Neighbours... through the lady who also came to sing, cos I know her
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] of old
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] to say... you know, to thank us
[June:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] been looking forward when I come and
[Marg:] She was very good wasn't she?
[Sandra:] Erm, yes. Erm, actually on... reflection, having seen the bit of disaster that occurred because erm... unfortunately Freda didn't get the phone call until early Christmas day morning... off her daughter, to say that instead of them coming up to here to see them... that something had happened in London, could they go down to her, so she was prepared to do us a half an hour at... half past one... and then she was going to drive to London! I said, I think you better go before you... don't worry about the party.
[June:] No.
[Sandra:] And that was a sort of a last minute... cancellation, and I had to really persuade her to go. And we realized on reflection, had... Freda have not volunteered early enough, another lady who used to work... at the station... played,u plays for Nigel when he does his gigs.
[June:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And she's on her own, and... so next year
[Pat:] She is
[Sandra:] they're coming back again
[June:] Yeah.
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Pat:] And she's
[Sandra:] Yeah. It's coming back again thi na na time next year, this year
[June:] This year.
[Marg:] Is she?
[Sandra:] And
[Marg:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] they're going to bring Darlene with them.
[Marg:] Oh good!
[Mary:] It's only three hundred and sixty days to go!
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[June:] harder this year having that.
[Louis:] Boring! Boring! Boring!
[June:] Boring!
[Sandra:] Well, well it, it did even itself out. Yeah. It did even itself
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] out.
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] And, I mean, actually on Christmas day we lost about ten people who've been found ill.
[Marg:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I mean one lady was found wandering in the street! And fortunately, it was, it was one of the councillors, well they phoned... that was meant to pick her up, and found her walking the street!
[speaker007:] Oh!
[Sandra:] Her husband had been taken into hospital and she was waiting for her son to come and pick her up at half past twelve, this was at half past ten in morning!
[June:] No it wasn't in the morning.
[Sandra:] Now tha that's the Good Neighbours' officer.
[June:] But and er... all the same.
[Sandra:] And she erm... well... and she sat with him
[June:] How did it go?
[Sandra:] fo for about
[speaker007:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] half an hour talking to her. But of course,
[speaker007:] Oh yeah.
[Sandra:] she's trained to do this.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I mean, er... kind words.
[June:] Yeah.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Marg:] [reading letter] On behalf of the may I thank you for your... you your commitment, your concern and a wonderful party held on Christmas day at the Wilsden Hall. to you all for accommodating a for your party that people in our street needed the hospitality. A lovely time was had by all and everyone expresses their thanks. Well done! Especially to the. Yours sincerely... [].
[Sandra:] Well on the whole we've had some
[June:] Yeah.
[Mary:] Mm!
[Sandra:] I've had
[June:] Gets better
[Pat:] the best yet.
[June:] Yeah.
[Pat:] And I said
[Mary:] Yeah I know.
[Pat:] I sa I said about... half past three, that she must have been enjoying it because she never once... came to me
[June:] To you, yeah.
[Pat:] and said... after... and I have. So I knew she was enjoying it.
[Sandra:] Yes.
[Pat:] And I said, Thursday, did you enjoy it? And she said fabulous! It was the best I ever had!
[speaker007:] I think so.
[Sandra:] And she sat... with the
[speaker007:] Yes.
[Sandra:] old dears
[Mary:] Yeah.
[June:] Yeah.
[speaker007:] Cos she wanted to.
[Mary:] Yeah. Yeah.
[Sandra:] She said I quite enjoyed the singing.
[Mary:] Yeah. Oh yeah.
[Sandra:] I think there was a lot of atmosphere.
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] My mother said that.
[Pat:] There was a lot of atmosphere.
[Sandra:] Yes. My mother said that.
[Pat:] Yes. Perhaps, perhaps cos
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Pat:] they don't think she's old, you see.
[Marg:] No, I know that. that.
[June:] Yeah.
[Marg:] Rather than it's a... wi with more children wasn't there this time?
[Sandra:] Only in so much that... there was... er
[June:] Not for dinner.
[Sandra:] not for dinner, but all the came
[Marg:] But then she doesn't eat dinner, you know, the one
[Sandra:] Er, no what happened, my sister came up and brought her two kids in the afternoon
[Marg:] Ah! Ah! Ah!
[Sandra:] And then Gloria turned up with her kids in the afternoon
[Marg:] Oh I see.
[Sandra:] but they didn't come until three o'clock.
[June:] It was after
[Marg:] Ah! Ah!
[June:] it was after four.
[Marg:] Ah!
[Sandra:] And they knew
[Marg:] Ah!
[Sandra:] that by coming late they'd have to just take the entertai I mean, except for the monologue.
[speaker007:] Oh!
[June:] [LAUGHTER]
[Marg:] Yeah. Yeah.
[Sandra:] Well she said you'll be
[June:] Is there any more tea in that pot?
[Mary:] But that's where the cars are.
[Sandra:] Well
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[Louis:] Oh that girl was there, yeah.
[Sandra:] He looked by the way from the most of them, playing up with them at the games and did the up there.
[Mary:] I went off to the doctors, she said I had and I was upset
[Pat:] Ha! Ha!
[Mary:] that er
[June:] Oh we'll have it down at there then.
[Sandra:] Get them out the way.
[speaker007:] And she went to him
[Pat:] Yeah.
[speaker007:] afterwards didn't she?
[Pat:] Oh did she?
[Sandra:] Oh she went to him afterwards.
[June:] Yeah she did. Yeah!
[Louis:] Oh! At home, yeah.
[Pat:] Oh I didn't see that one then.
[speaker007:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Well no, she finished it. I think if we ever need to fill in half an hour we know what to do!
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] She can
[speaker007:] Can you re
[Sandra:] by the microphone then.
[Mary:] Can you remember er if we got her on, after we got her on
[June:] Yes we did!
[speaker007:] [LAUGHTER]
[Louis:] Our son was in one of them when he was at school. He used to be able do all those, you know, er Stanley Holloway?
[June:] Yes.
[Louis:] Sam
[speaker007:] Ah! Well Brian
[Sandra:] Yeah I know
[speaker007:] our Paul.
[Sandra:] Well if it is a it would have been good!
[speaker007:] Same er
[Sandra:] But
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] nobody knew what she sa
[Mary:] Yeah!
[Sandra:] she were talking to herself in the end!
[June:] Yes.
[speaker007:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] We didn't, I'm, I'm going back to the letter, we did have another one off Tom.
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Mary:] And I said she'd have had a
[Sandra:] So we've looked at that.
[Mary:] microphone.
[June:] He's gentleman isn't
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[June:] he, Tom?
[Sandra:] Give him a microphone
[Mary:] I don't like him.
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[Marg:] You don't like people at all!
[speaker007:] Yeah.
[June:] It er, er Mr used to live down here.
[speaker007:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Yeah. Erm, I mean, he wrote a lot, I saw him church on Sunday and I did thank him for the letter
[June:] Oh!
[Sandra:] and he said well it was the least I could do under the circumstance. He, he is a gentleman! He is an old fa
[speaker007:] Yeah but is he again then?
[Sandra:] Yeah. I know.
[Pat:] have some cheek don't they?
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Louis:] Aye.
[Sandra:] Yeah, he normally goes to
[June:] Then he says, are you going now June? I said, yes, got to get Theresa up. I said, er, he says have you been across now June? He says I told her I'd come straight from church if there was a cup of tea. I said, come on then Tom let's go get one!
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[June:] And er... he enjoyed it.
[speaker007:] Yeah.
[Mary:] Mm.
[Louis:] Then they said
[Mary:] Yes.
[Louis:] everybody came in they had
[June:] Mm.
[Louis:] sherry all the while.
[Sandra:] Yes!
[Marg:] Well I said to er one lady who's been for first time and she thinks it's marvellous!
[Sandra:] Mm!
[Pat:] Well I know with two ladies th their daughters wanted to, them to go the house and they wouldn't.
[Mary:] Mm!
[Pat:] They said, no we want to go the party.
[Sandra:] Oh! Oh!
[Pat:] And one of th the daughters was quite upset about it.
[Sandra:] Mm!
[Pat:] Well I think I would, I'd take
[Mary:] Did the old man play the violin?
[Louis:] Oh!
[Sandra:] He, he really
[Pat:] No.
[Sandra:] er
[Pat:] What could I do?
[Sandra:] I mean he pla
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] he played his violin beautifully! But it was a bit of a behind everybody else but er
[Marg:] I know, but I was only pointing out something.
[Sandra:] Er i it was.
[Marg:] I was that because
[Sandra:] Nigel
[Pat:] Oh well!
[Sandra:] Nigel got them all up before they even said too much.
[Pat:] Yeah. Yeah.
[Mary:] Shall I play my violin? [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Yeah. No.
[Mary:] He loves taking his violin.
[Sandra:] He he played his violin, he got up, and actually there was erm... the dad,th the mum, she sang with them, is tha was that who it was? The
[Pat:] Who?
[Sandra:] the lady who was singing with them was that
[Pat:] Oh yeah!
[Sandra:] Victoria, her mum?
[Pat:] Well yeah.
[Mary:] That's her mum.
[Sandra:] She's another so er... light operatic singer. She got up and then when it came round to singing Jerusalem and... Edie was put out at not singing Jerusalem, this is another one off the psychiatric list and Pat goes
[Mary:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] so she got up as well. And he played his violin as well so... and actually what Nigel had wanted was to get a little choral group so we
[June:] Yes.
[Sandra:] could all sing.
[June:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And then what... what was Jimmy offered the day after? But some ninety twenties song sheets with all the old time
[Louis:] Oh!
[Sandra:] singers on!
[Louis:] Right! This is what you want.
[Sandra:] So then he said he was getting them copied ready for th
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] another year.
[Louis:] Oh yeah. They'll want something, yeah.
[Sandra:] But, when Nigel comes next year he'll bring Eileen and I think that under circumstances I think if we say well come for about quarter to two.
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Mary would have come and helped at dinner time but she thought... that, well it would be alright, you know, and
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] we didn't [LAUGHTER] need anyone. Said if you'd have come early []!
[Louis:] Who was Nigel?
[Sandra:] That was the lad who sang
[Louis:] Yeah, but wha who is he?
[Sandra:] Well, he lives in
[Mary:] Next to me. Just next
[Sandra:] er
[Mary:] to me.
[Sandra:] this lady who's secretary
[Marg:] sit in Sandra's
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Marg:] chair.
[Louis:] ?
[Sandra:] Yeah. Yeah, well she used to work at the station in the offices. I've known her for twenty odd years!
[June:] Jimmy knows this Nigel. He's goes up the Cricketers.
[Pat:] I keep thinking
[Sandra:] Oh he does.
[June:] Mm mm.
[Pat:] if we could, I keep thinking about your lunch
[speaker007:] I said
[Pat:] problems.
[Sandra:] Pardon?
[Pat:] I keep thinking about your lunch er, opportunities.
[Sandra:] Why what do you mean?
[Pat:] Well, I was telling you or are they alright?
[Louis:] Well no, we're alright in the mornings.
[Pat:] Right.
[Louis:] Yeah, we're okay.
[Pat:] I know we were at one point.
[Mary:] Yes. Yeah, we're okay for help int mornings.
[Pat:] And how long have you been going now?
[Mary:] Er, just over a year. Started before... last Christmas.
[Pat:] Mm mm.
[Mary:] Yeah. Yeah. It's great. It's dead on.
[Louis:] Supposing you don't have any of the ones
[June:] And how many did you want?
[Louis:] you talked about a minute ago and do a... a for them.
[Marg:] After one of the Christmas parties?
[Mary:] Er was it... that wasn't a person was it?
[Sandra:] No.
[Marg:] No.
[Sandra:] But, there was a reorganization at Cortilles before you went
[Mary:] Oh yeah? Oh.
[Sandra:] and, they asked us did we want to take over the dinners... because
[Mary:] Oh!
[Sandra:] it was being reorganized and the lady who did it couldn't do it any more and would one of us like to take the
[Mary:] Oh!
[Sandra:] organization on? And I said well, I'm sorry to say that we're a bit too busy in the
[Mary:] Mm mm.
[Sandra:] week to to... take it on.
[speaker008:] [tape interference and buzzing]
[Sandra:] I mean, the same goes when the when they seem to be organizing something that
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] runs well... it's so easy for other groups to, to try and get you to help them out.
[Pat:] If you do
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] But, if you get involved you end up... either taking over
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] or not doing what you set out to do. So it's
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] best off not doing any of it.
[Marg:] No you have to say... cos I
[Sandra:] You've got to choose what you
[Marg:] cos I won't take any more on.
[Sandra:] No.
[Marg:] Not if involves this weekend. Their... club... Wednesday afternoons, the children, asked the children a bit of reading. And they have their lunch and come out Tuesday.
[June:] Mm.
[Marg:] And I
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Marg:] and I won't take anything else on.
[Louis:] No. Yeah.
[Marg:] Well I mean that when we start organization... and I am on, I'm on Cortille and on the committee and they wanted me to take over the Vice Chairman and I said no way. Because I mean... we've helped you with this... and helping with that anyway. I mean, I
[June:] Yeah.
[Marg:] haven't got involved in like taking friends and organizing and baking cakes and that sort of thing. And also, I mean... with badminton you have to be
[Sandra:] Mm.
[Marg:] committed to that, you've gotta be committed because otherwise you're letting other people down.
[Mary:] People down.
[Louis:] Yes, yes.
[Mary:] Oh yes. Yes.
[Louis:] You said. That's right. Yeah.
[Marg:] I mean, I said no I've got enough without, without being Vice Chairman. I don't mind ha as much as I can, when I can, but I don't want to have to be there... all the time, every time there's a committee meeting there
[Sandra:] Mm.
[Marg:] every time there's, you
[Sandra:] Mm.
[Marg:] know, there's that, gotta go here and get things.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[Marg:] Don't want that. I don't mind being told what to do
[Sandra:] Mm.
[June:] Yes.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[Marg:] and doing it. I mean, I was there... er, I left yesterday afternoon, I mean, I had to go in early and we had erm... an auction... and I helped do that. So, I don't mind doing that, I don't mind helping... but I don't want to be
[June:] You want
[Marg:] involved in any more
[Sandra:] No.
[Marg:] business.
[Pat:] No.
[Marg:] Because otherwise yo... you miss out on something else
[June:] Yeah.
[Marg:] cos you get fed up of them in the end
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Marg:] anyway, don't you?
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Anyway, is this committee coming to order?
[June:] Yes.
[Pat:] Yes.
[Sandra:] Or is it turning into rabble! [LAUGHTER]
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Right. Is there anything left
[Louis:] Yeah well... there is about seventeen pounds in change in there but we still have to get the Christmas puddings cos we haven't seen any yet.
[June:] I've got the... was there something?
[Pat:] I haven't been up to buy meat
[Sandra:] Well I didn't go
[Pat:] No.
[Sandra:] er er because... er we had a rather an in-depth session at the football on the telly on Monday night. and there were, I'd got a, a room full of young boys wanting to watch Crewe... play Liverpool. And er... I don't think I was particularly keen of having a house full and I thought
[Louis:] Mm.
[Sandra:] while th going out leaving them
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I fell asleep.
[speaker007:] Oh.
[Sandra:] Er, and... I'd forgotten to take the money up before... Christmas... so it was still here yesterday.
[Louis:] Well, I wasn't there. And, I was expecting you and I took a... a bag full of clothes... just to try
[Mary:] Well I told you not to go in
[Louis:] on Monday night.
[Mary:] Yes I
[Pat:] Did you?
[Mary:] was just after those things.
[Marg:] How they, how they know.
[Louis:] Anyway, what I'd got was a bag of clothes for Caroline to try
[Marg:] Oh! Super!
[Louis:] she might have to
[Marg:] Yeah.
[Louis:] cos some of them are trousers but they're really
[Marg:] Yeah.
[Louis:] nice and really warm and there's a sweater dress and a jumper and
[Marg:] Ooh! Ooh!
[Louis:] these things.
[Marg:] Yes. Yes.
[Louis:] And I brought them up on Monday night
[Marg:] Yeah.
[Louis:] in case you and Sandra came.
[Marg:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Well she'll be there this Monday.
[Louis:] Yes. Have you, you got er, have you, well you've got transport
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Louis:] for her?
[Sandra:] Aha. I shall be there this Monday.
[June:] This is what we want... some little of the like them crafts made.
[Pat:] I got it on one of their dos Sunday morning from June's.
[Sandra:] What is it?
[Pat:] Just some
[Sandra:] Oh! Yes of course.
[June:] I thought, well that's a nice little thing.
[Sandra:] Yes.
[June:] Innit?
[Sandra:] Yes.
[Marg:] Yes. That's a cherry drawer that is.
[June:] Yes, I got one of them when I got
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Marg:] And for no more money. Are mine smaller than that?
[June:] Yeah.
[Marg:] Only that bit.
[June:] Mm.
[Marg:] But, they're from erm... Kwik Save and they're no dearer in this nice little jars than they are in the plastic tubs with the same cherries
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Marg:] on.
[Mary:] Oh.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[June:] I thought, oh if we could hold of some of them what we could do with them.
[Marg:] Yeah, yes,bu yes.
[Sandra:] Er, I've loads. You know, in fact, they're bigger than that, but the big jar's like a chocolate tin with the red lids on... whether you could fill them with bath crystals and some things like that.
[Louis:] And people are more into foam baths and that sort of thing
[June:] Yeah.
[Louis:] nowadays aren't they?
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Unless you were to put, like to fill, to fill it with a cheap flannel and a bar of soap... and a sponge.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[June:] Well we'll have to think of summat.
[Mary:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Ooh!
[June:] If we're er... having the centre
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Louis:] Yeah.
[June:] for the... are we that far or shall we offer them
[Sandra:] Well
[June:] a lift?
[Sandra:] I er, I was just going to bring them up with erm... you know about the cheque, cos you got
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] did you know about the cheque? We got a donation given to us.
[Mary:] From your dad?
[Sandra:] No. No. That never came, that never came to fruition.
[Louis:] Didn't it?
[June:] Oh.
[Sandra:] In so much that, they were dithering over other things that we think
[June:] There's another cup of tea in, er, Margaret if you want a cup.
[Sandra:] er, they were meeting... and the lad who was supposed to be at the meeting didn't know what they'd come to decide on. We'd got to go and pay a bill
[June:] That's right. Yeah.
[Louis:] Oh.
[Sandra:] and they needed to know what to pay.
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] So in the end I had to say I haven't got any more time to chase up after him, but I could always probably come back again later on in the year. It would have meant
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I would have to pay for it and try him again. I think Christmas beca cos... there was that... er... you see, they were sorting out
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and I was blue with that with them on one and at this on the other
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and the lad who was dealing with it all, we had some hassle from another quoter. And then he said, they haven't had their meeting.
[Pat:] Mm mm.
[Sandra:] He said, how do they what they've said, but they haven't had it? No, we had a cheque which we presumed had come from... Social Services
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and when it arrived it turned out to be a donation from the Lord Mayor's charity. It had
[Pat:] Oh!
[Sandra:] been applied for on our behalf... so it wasn't in fact from Social Services.
[Mary:] Mm mm.
[Sandra:] And it... had been made out to
[June:] The church.
[Sandra:] the church.
[Mary:] Mhm.
[Sandra:] So, in the end... rather than send it back and ask for
[Mary:] Mm.
[Sandra:] it to be rewritten... we usually have one event after Christmas that pays for the extra gas and heating that we use.
[Pat:] Yes.
[Sandra:] Er, I know it's twice what we normally pay, cos it was a hundred pound.
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] But on reflection, a quick little sub-committee meeting at the end of Christmas Day he said well... we've paid it now, but we are in fact, in hand
[June:] Yes.
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Mary:] Mm.
[Sandra:] for the next twelve months
[Pat:] Yes.
[Sandra:] that we use the hall.
[speaker007:] Yes. Right.
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Even though we never asked, I think we still have to make
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] sure
[Pat:] Sure, yeah.
[Sandra:] that we're not... costing anything.
[Marg:] Cos that very nice I think.
[Louis:] That's all, yeah.
[June:] Yeah.
[Louis:] ... And I
[Sandra:] So, I mean, if anybody
[Louis:] wear and tear
[Sandra:] Yes.
[Louis:] then
[Sandra:] I mean, if anybody asks you to see if it's gone through our books it hasn't, but
[Mary:] Mm.
[Sandra:] having said that... it's in lieu of the debt that we would have paid.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] But, I then, subsequently met... the chappie in charge of Social Services outside the school! Who said, how did it go? Blah, blah! Very nice. He said there might be some more money coming. From them this
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] time. But he
[June:] Oh oh!
[Sandra:] he said this last year
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and it never came.
[Marg:] And the year before!
[Sandra:] So... I mean, I will continue to harass him through the twelve months if possible, because I think
[Pat:] Well when you think how many people we have to
[June:] Yes, they
[speaker007:] I know!
[June:] yeah.
[Louis:] Yeah!
[Sandra:] And they
[Louis:] Of course!
[Sandra:] for those who are housebound
[Louis:] But I mean
[Sandra:] and incapable of driving
[Marg:] They only have to think about
[Sandra:] they have to provide it for them, you see.
[June:] So we take
[Marg:] Yeah!
[June:] it off them.
[Marg:] We take it off
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Marg:] and they should
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Marg:] come round.
[Sandra:] We're not doing it to compensate Social Services
[Marg:] Yeah!
[Sandra:] we're doing it
[Pat:] No!
[Sandra:] to provide a day for the people who
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] come.
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] But, at the same time it does take the burden off them.
[Marg:] Yes it does!
[Mary:] Yeah! Of course!
[Pat:] I mean, they
[Marg:] Yes!
[Pat:] should have to find somebody to go wouldn't they?
[Louis:] Yes! They would.
[Sandra:] Course they would! Yeah.
[Marg:] Yes!
[Sandra:] So, I will carry on. But, at the moment, there's enough in there to pay off what debt we've got left.
[Marg:] For the puddings in there?
[Sandra:] For the puddings. And there's a few coppers left over.
[June:] Well I've got mine then, that woman give me.
[Sandra:] Yeah. Well, in the bank's four hundred and forty seven. So, we are well in hand.
[Mary:] Mm!
[Sandra:] Erm... we went up as high as er... eight hundred forty one... erm...
[Louis:] What do you reckon it'll cost this year then, er last year then Sandra?
[Sandra:] About... er... I keep saying we need somebody to keep account book. About
[Mary:] Mm.
[Sandra:] six hundred pound. About five to six hundred
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] pounds
[Louis:] I, I thought about six hundred.
[Sandra:] Bearing in mind that this year we got a lot more, I mean, we... we got all those crackers and blowers from... the hotel. Er, I haven't sent him a letter back yet cos I thought, wondered whether anybody'd like to volunteer to write, I sent a card last year.
[Marg:] What's this? Er what is it for?
[Sandra:] The... Borough. They sent
[Marg:] Did they?
[Sandra:] one hundred and fifty crackers and a tub of at least a hundred blowers!
[speaker007:] Ooh!
[Marg:] Well how do they get it bearing in mind the other
[Sandra:] No, the co the cost of that alone
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] those boxes of crackers are about... I think they're about fifteen pound a box and the three
[Mary:] Mm.
[Sandra:] boxes
[Louis:] Mm.
[Mary:] Mm.
[Marg:] Fifteen
[Sandra:] But
[Marg:] pounds a box!
[Sandra:] Well there's fifty in each one.
[Marg:] Oh!
[June:] Yes.
[Mary:] Yeah!
[Sandra:] I think there are... ah, no! No! No!
[Marg:] I was gonna say!
[Sandra:] No, they're nine pound. Cos I know when I went to the warehouse
[Louis:] Oh that
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] erm... when I went the first year I looked at them. Do you remember when I bought the wrapping paper
[Pat:] Yeah. Yeah.
[Sandra:] and they were up there then. And I looked at them and I thought well it's a lot of money to pay out, we'll see what comes in. Erm... and on, on reflection I er... I didn't buy them and he sent us three boxes and they came from the same warehouse.
[Mary:] Oh good! Yeah.
[Sandra:] Course they cost a lot
[Marg:] I think a letter would, I think a letter would be very nice.
[Pat:] The manager of the hotel?
[Sandra:] Don't ask me his name because it's Italian!
[Pat:] No, just to the manager, Borough Hotel, what's the, what's the?
[Sandra:] The Villa Arms
[Mary:] The Villa Arms.
[Pat:] Hotel.
[Louis:] I hope he hasn't got his tea towel with him!
[Pat:] Villa Arms hotel?
[Marg:] Yes. Yeah.
[Pat:] Right. And he sent... three boxes of crackers.
[Sandra:] Yeah. A hundred and fifty crackers
[Pat:] Er
[Sandra:] and a box of blowers.
[Pat:] [writing] a hundred and fifty crackers... just a letter addressed
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Pat:] and a box of blowers. Just to say thank you very much, they were very much appreciated.
[Sandra:] Well they were, because
[speaker007:] Oh! Very good!
[Sandra:] things like that, and we also, I think this year we ought to send Sid one... because he came up with... ten litres of... five each of them boxes... so came up with ten litres of wine.
[Marg:] Well I thanked him twice.
[Sandra:] I know. But
[Louis:] Nice really to write a letter.
[Sandra:] I think, I think to have made effort, that's to the
[June:] It's his wife who normally does things.
[Sandra:] Well, it might put the cat among the pigeons June, but then so what!
[June:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] It needs revitalizing []!
[Marg:] Well I thought I would
[Mary:] As half of them would
[Marg:] they all made funny
[June:] Oh!
[Marg:] pictures on the
[June:] Oh yes.
[Marg:] wall.
[Louis:] Oh that's my er... lads up in from the. I've seen them there.
[Pat:] Oh!
[Louis:] Cos when the
[Marg:] On behalf of the war times
[Louis:] That's the last one there.
[Marg:] committee?
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Louis:] They
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Louis:] show.
[Sandra:] Oh.
[Louis:] And they never lose them then.
[Sandra:] Bit difficult.
[June:] Yes.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[June:] They said at the Cricketers this year.
[Sandra:] It's at the Crick
[Pat:] Cricketer's Arms. Er, well, was it Mr this time? Er... er...?
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[June:] Shouldn't you put Mrs and Mr cos they are man and wife.
[Pat:] Well that's, oh yes alright.
[June:] No.
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[June:] [LAUGHTER]
[Pat:] S A, [spelling] []?
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Pat:] Yes. Cricketer's Arms.
[Sandra:] Just do a duplicate copy of the letter. And also, I think, to add.
[June:] Ooh yes! They should have one.
[Pat:] And, the manager of?
[Louis:] No, Arthur
[June:] No.
[Louis:] .
[Pat:] Arthur
[June:] Is he the manager there?
[Louis:] No he was the one that
[Sandra:] He's the commissions manager.
[Pat:] Arthur
[Louis:] .
[Sandra:] Well I think if you were to send it to the manager, care of, Mr Arthur.
[Pat:] Mr Arthur.
[Sandra:] If we send it to the manager, care of... Mr Arthur.
[Pat:] Right. Yeah. [writing] Care of, Arthur. How do you spell Arthur?
[Louis:] Yeah. Yeah.
[Pat:] I would just.
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[June:] And I, I tell you something else and all... on Saturday... it's erm... Margaret
[speaker007:] .
[June:] 's birthday.
[Sandra:] Oh is it?
[June:] Yeah. So I think er
[Sandra:] A card.
[June:] if we all sign on a card. I've got one.
[Sandra:] Have you got one?
[Mary:] Right.
[June:] And er, I'll put it through.
[Sandra:] Right.
[Mary:] Fine.
[June:] Because by God she's a great'un int she?
[Sandra:] How did she go on
[Louis:] I know.
[Sandra:] at... does anybody know how she went on at her dance... New Year's Eve?
[Marg:] Well I was there.
[Pat:] No, there was nobody there.
[Sandra:] Did she go?
[Mary:] Yeah.
[June:] Who? Margaret?
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Cos she, I heard her voice
[June:] A New Year's resolution.
[Sandra:] Oh! That Well, why I'm asking
[June:] Yes.
[Sandra:] I saw her on the way to the doctors and she'd thought she'd got chicken pox.
[Mary:] Oh yes.
[June:] Yeah.
[Mary:] No, she's had.
[Sandra:] I said, I bet you're allergic to something. Oh nothing
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Sandra, I've been with somebody with chicken pox
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Mary:] Mm.
[Sandra:] cos she said if I can't go do you want two tickets? I said, well I'll find somebody but I hope you haven't got chicken pox.
[Mary:] Oh no, she went.
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[June:] Er er urgh! The music was terrible!
[Sandra:] Mm.
[June:] We left here at half past eight... and we didn't get on the dance floor till twenty to ten... cos there was three
[Sandra:] Oh.
[June:] girls hip-hippy shaking.
[Sandra:] Oh!
[June:] That was the music.
[Sandra:] Oh!
[June:] And when he played a square tango... it was just like er....
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[June:] You know, I mean tramping.
[Pat:] Ah! Dear.
[June:] It were true.
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[June:] It was full eight.
[Sandra:] Oh!
[June:] Then he played summat else.
[Marg:] [LAUGHTER]
[June:] Well we ha went round wo we had to come off the bloody dance floor!
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[June:] Yes I said, no, I said next year... we'll have tickets but if it's the same whatsit we don't want him. Well we pay all that money for the disco thing.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Marg:] You don't have much to eat either do you?
[June:] Oh yes! It's quite
[Mary:] Well yeah.
[June:] good, yeah. There was two salmon sandwiches, two cheese
[Marg:] Oh yes. I was talking about another dance where you've had your bit
[June:] There's only bit I've.
[Marg:] Oh!
[June:] It's only a jacket potato missing.
[Marg:] Oh!
[June:] And all the er... rice and... oh there was salad on the table.
[Sandra:] Oh was there?
[June:] Quite enough.
[Sandra:] Oh!
[June:] Yeah. But erm... the music, oh dear!
[Mary:] [yawning] What er, Margaret are you talking about []?
[Pat:] Got blonde hair.
[Louis:] She came up Chris Christmas day in the home.
[Sandra:] Up there in the home.
[Mary:] .
[June:] It's, I think, it's in the book.
[Mary:] Oh really? Oh why
[June:] Well [LAUGHTER]
[Mary:] should we then?
[June:] No.
[Sandra:] No.
[Pat:] She has.
[speaker007:] Not for most.
[June:] She had, and
[Mary:] I think I know the bar lady.
[June:] Oh yeah.
[Sandra:] It was lovely!
[June:] But even they couldn't dance to the music.
[Louis:] Couldn't they?
[Mary:] No.
[June:] No. And er, there was another... table... there was eight or ten on that one. Erm... the little one Marg. I dunno, she always call him Aden. We've got nicknames for them you see
[Sandra:] Mhm.
[June:] and I'd had a... and er they, I never saw them on the floor.
[Marg:] Oh.
[June:] And they do all the sequence dances.
[Louis:] I know that, they love dancing.
[Mary:] A do we know how erm Mavis is?
[Marg:] No.
[Louis:] Well getting a better, a little bit better each day.
[Pat:] Was she badly hurt?
[Louis:] Never felt better.
[June:] That was a shame Margaret.
[Mary:] She didn't have any broken bones.
[Pat:] Oh and... I mean th... there was some little Christmas tree, gingerbread... al
[June:] Yeah.
[Pat:] almonds on. And they had little pink icing of a star on the top... and we must have had six dozen.
[Sandra:] Oh that's nice.
[Pat:] And they, a lot of them got
[Louis:] Is this when they rang up and said they'd got cakes left?
[Sandra:] Yes, yeah, and Julie went down
[Mary:] Yeah I had them.
[Sandra:] and saw
[Pat:] and
[Sandra:] them.
[Pat:] we did, some had gone out on the plates and then I had three boxes left and I was going round giving them out. I got rid of them all cos they're all taking them home.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Pat:] And, there was some on a plate and my sister's little lad went up and went to take one off this plate and then Valerie tu turned round, she said er, you can't have one of them, them are for the old folks.
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Ah ah! No!
[Pat:] [LAUGHTER] And he was, cos it, I really want a Christmas tree []
[June:] Yes.
[Pat:] only it was just what
[Sandra:] Mm mm.
[Pat:] he wanted.
[Louis:] Yes.
[June:] Oh!
[Pat:] She wouldn't let him have it.
[Sandra:] Tt! Oh!
[Louis:] Well, and God's honest truth I never saw them. Cos they went out and they were playing
[Pat:] That's it.
[Louis:] and that's it.
[Sandra:] Yeah. Yeah.
[June:] Yeah.
[Pat:] Cos, I suppose it was cos we were all so
[Marg:] Mind you,a
[Pat:] er
[Marg:] you do find don't you?
[June:] But I
[Marg:] I mean I don't know... cos I'm not, I think when they give something away for nothing... it's almost worse than when they're paying. And when
[Sandra:] Well
[Marg:] they're paying they don't want to
[Sandra:] unfortunately I, I mean there were two plates
[Louis:] Oh yes.
[Sandra:] of salmon sandwiches
[Marg:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and we've, I mean we've said this on reflection afterwards, as much as we don't like cutting up plates of sandwiches... there must have been some that took home half a dozen
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] salmon, and there were some
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] that never saw a salmon.
[Pat:] No.
[June:] We didn't get, we'd
[Sandra:] I
[June:] loads over cos.
[Sandra:] No. My father never saw a
[Pat:] [LAUGHTER] I said I bet, when I saw this June [].
[June:] I said that... I couple of the
[Pat:] No.
[June:] sandwiches, there's a cup of tea I said and they'll never know.
[Pat:] No. I never
[Louis:] Well you know what?
[Pat:] the only thing I got was of Stella cutting that cake all the time.
[Sandra:] Cos she'd burn more. Old fashioned trifle
[Marg:] [LAUGHTER] Oh don't make me Pat []!
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Marg:] She had a cake.
[Pat:] She had a cake.
[Sandra:] They always say the thought might be worse and to, we know it costs about, it costs about ten pound to buy... well, I think at the end of the day worth it, is to put them out on a paper plate.
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Simply
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] not to save the washing up but to stop the arguments
[Louis:] Yeah!
[Sandra:] that came!
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] As to who'd got what.
[Marg:] [clears throat]
[Sandra:] And if they didn't want it then, they had a plastic bag they
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] could have just put their plates in and taken
[Louis:] Yes.
[Sandra:] it home. As it was, I mean I found another chocolate gateau under those Christmas tree cakes. And somebody said, we haven't had any cake! And I went, I know everybody had a piece of this chocolate on their plates, but there was nothing else I could do, once they saw it that was it.
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I never got to the end of the table.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[June:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And there are
[Mary:] I know.
[Sandra:] there were sixteen... portions
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and they sell at fifty four pence
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] a slice.
[Marg:] I never saw that those, under that ga table.
[Mary:] No I didn't.
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[Marg:] I was left with the
[Sandra:] You know
[Marg:] trifle left, and by the time the trifle was there but there was no sandwiches or.
[Mary:] [LAUGHTER]
[Pat:] Do you know what it reminds me of. I, I will, I always
[Mary:] [sighing] Oh [].
[Pat:] used to give our kids... birthday parties, always... and when Paul had a, I don't know if you knew Jason
[June:] Yeah.
[Pat:] erm last year? A little
[Sandra:] No.
[Pat:] boy named Jason tha... he's a young man now but when... and we used to have the sandwiches on the table and Jason always used to sort of take umpteen and po pile them up on his plate and
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Pat:] and I used to say, just take, there was loads
[June:] Mm.
[Pat:] just take one at a time. But no.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Pat:] He had to have... five or four
[Marg:] Some are like that. Well I
[Pat:] Well I think those old people are
[Marg:] Yeah.
[Pat:] like that.
[Louis:] She's like that even now at thirteen.
[Sandra:] Yeah. Yeah.
[Pat:] If he hasn't got three times more than anybody else he'll scre
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Pat:] you know, he'd have nothing. But I mean old people
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Louis:] They're the sa the same
[Pat:] yo you know they're are like children aren't they? They want everything
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Pat:] just going for them.
[Louis:] Mind you
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Louis:] it's better than throwing a lot of stuff away.
[Pat:] Oh yes
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Pat:] but
[Louis:] They can eat it at home when
[Sandra:] You can say if
[Pat:] That's right.
[Sandra:] if, if, if it had been proportioned
[June:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] out... that, they had one salmon, one cheese, one ham
[June:] Yes.
[Sandra:] with a couple of cakes... and one of these
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Christmas tree, a bit of
[Mary:] Yeah. Yeah.
[Sandra:] and given them a dish of trifle I think a lot would have just eaten the trifle, had a cup of tea and taken the rest home.
[June:] The rest home.
[Louis:] Oh yeah!
[Sandra:] As it was
[Louis:] Yes
[Sandra:] they were seeing how much more they could eat and take home.
[speaker008:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] And if they knew it had all been
[Mary:] Yes.
[Sandra:] divided and gone out there wouldn't have been a
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] problem.
[June:] Mm.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Marg:] D'ya think it might be worth writing to some of the and asking them... to donate any paper plates?
[Sandra:] We, we actually wrote to the manufacturers of paper plates
[Louis:] Yes, that's right.
[Sandra:] the first year and the most you get out of them is they don't even bother to come and see you in the corridor do, who went down?
[Mary:] Yeah, I know.
[Pat:] I know. I know.
[Sandra:] Somebody went there.
[Mary:] Was that Deeko?
[Sandra:] Yes. Stood outside and... I'd been rung up
[Pat:] That's shocking!
[Sandra:] rung up and th
[Mary:] Yes.
[Sandra:] many times, not only for this group but for another one.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] And they don't even answer.
[Marg:] Ooh! How awful!
[Sandra:] And we lost our contact didn't we?
[June:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Although I, we wasn't... surprised by them
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] suddenly erm...
[Pat:] Anyway, shall we start ideas, good
[June:] Right
[Pat:] ideas?
[Sandra:] Yeah. Well
[Marg:] That we put the teas out
[Louis:] Yeah, the plate.
[Marg:] on the plate.
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Marg:] Save a lot of bother.
[June:] Mm mm.
[Sandra:] Well it, it, it caused a lot of aggravation to some
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] that
[June:] Didn't
[Sandra:] particularly those in wheelchairs that couldn't fight their way to another table
[Marg:] Well I said... can
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Marg:] I get you anything? But th none of the men had too much... it'd be the women who'd be in
[Mary:] Oh yeah.
[Marg:] there.
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Marg:] Cos we couldn't find this for lunch over
[speaker007:] Yeah.
[Marg:] there.
[June:] Mm mm.
[Sandra:] The women... that erm, I must admit though that
[Pat:] Yes.
[Marg:] The men's
[Sandra:] The er
[Marg:] was just there.
[Sandra:] the dinner organization was better cos we did manage to get seconds out to those that wanted it.
[June:] Yes.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] And, there wasn't one complaint about the turkey.
[Mary:] No.
[June:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Not one.
[Louis:] One complaint about the carrots.
[June:] Carrots. But we solved that didn't we?
[Louis:] Said it was lovely.
[June:] [LAUGHTER]
[Pat:] She wasn't that
[Sandra:] Oh well I'll get
[Pat:] sure. I said to Edie, was the dinner nice? She says yes, but the carrots weren't done. And she'd got two little rings of carrots left on her plate. And so, after, bringing out a spoonful, so I went to and er... tasted them, I said mum they were done, done to perfection. She said well it must have been just those two little bits.
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[Louis:] Have you got a photograph of her Pat?
[Pat:] Aha.
[Louis:] Cos we're keeping a photograph of all
[Mary:] [LAUGHTER] She's [].
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[June:] Is that it on my bag?
[Pat:] Yes.
[Mary:] [LAUGHTER] Well you [].
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[Pat:] I mean she'd only left two rings on her plate.
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Pat:] Did you get the turkey breast the same from Asda?
[Louis:] Yeah. No, no.
[Pat:] That she got from? Only
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Pat:] I've seen them in Asda. I
[Louis:] Yeah.
[Pat:] er
[Louis:] It ji they haven't done them before, not on that scale.
[Pat:] No.
[Louis:] And, I did notice they're doing the turkey legs but they're a lot
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Louis:] dearer.
[Mary:] Dearer. Yes, I noticed that.
[Sandra:] [cough]
[Pat:] Well I had breast.
[Sandra:] But, the breasts were the same price
[June:] Mm mm.
[Sandra:] and... to make up the weight instead of five he sent six to make the weight up.
[Pat:] And we didn't, we, we only needed five.
[Sandra:] We only needed five. Bearing in mind, you only needed four though and knew they hadn't of come cos well
[Mary:] Oh yeah.
[Sandra:] having said that
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] they weren't wasted cos you went
[Louis:] Did you put your hams on the dinners?
[Sandra:] They had a slice of ham
[Louis:] Oh did you?
[Sandra:] and a slice of turkey.
[June:] Yeah.
[Louis:] Oh right.
[Sandra:] Yeah. Er erm... I think, I mean they all eat... most of them eat the ham, there were a few that sent it back... I think it was probably a bit much for them.
[Pat:] Yeah.
[June:] Mm
[Sandra:] But er
[Louis:] Did you slice it yourself?
[Mary:] Yeah. I've got
[Sandra:] Two
[Mary:] two electric, electric
[Sandra:] two electric
[Mary:] carvers. I used one of them on the
[Pat:] Yeah.
[Mary:] ham.
[Louis:] The only time I ever use that is when I've got children there.
[Marg:] [LAUGHTER]
[Pat:] I buy unsliced bread so I can use my electric knife.
[Sandra:] Do you?
[Marg:] [LAUGHTER]
[Pat:] An and Jim
[Louis:] Oh well I'll, have to do that. I love an unsliced loaf.
[Pat:] Ooh! I know.
[Louis:] I like a sliced one but i
[Marg:] And d'ya know,
[Mary:] Yeah.
[Marg:] he's er cut up, as soon as comes in the morning he likes a piece of toast. And I've used this uncut bread
[June:] Sandra's got a tape recorder on here.
[Mary:] You
[Sandra:] Anyway
[Mary:] should have given us the nudge.
[Sandra:] Margaret wants to say something.
[Pat:] Right!
[Sandra:] Let's listen to her.
[Marg:] She then said that is
[Louis:] This is clever!
[Marg:] this woman's
[speaker007:] Right.
[Marg:] And she's She was really in love.
[Louis:] I know.
[Marg:] Have you seen where she lives? And she wanted the other... and er... and she didn't want her sandwich. She said, why have you got? Why can't we pay for that here? Anyway she go it really looked good.
[Pat:] Yeah.
[June:] Yeah.
[speaker007:] Straight line! I have gone in and back that way, I've gone straight over! Straight over.
[speaker010:] I did that!
[Sandra:] You di, straight o... I'll demonstrate. Give me these here.
[speaker010:] No!
[Sandra:] No, you put that to, turn that to a different colour. What you did, you went into the middle and out again. You've got to go to the middle and straight across. But then, if there's another one... there
[speaker010:] Well you just came
[Sandra:] because your draughts are like this.
[speaker010:] You just go and
[Sandra:] I had a, that's a straight line because then when you get to there you put another straight line across another jump! You've gone a straight across there. A straight line. What you had done
[speaker010:] But you didn't let me go like that!
[Sandra:] You did! You did that all the way down that line when you started didn't you?
[speaker010:] So why didn't you let me have that one then?
[Sandra:] Because what you did, you went... over to the top of it... in a sense, and then... straight at... an angle to it. You've to go straight across. When you did it this way you go straight across, straight across,strai, but yo... your second jumps you were doing you were going there... like that... instead of going straight across.
[speaker010:] Do, show me what you've just done.
[Sandra:] I went across yours like that.
[speaker010:] So I can jump over mine too.
[Sandra:] Yes! But yo, not the way you did it over here.
[speaker010:] So why didn't you let me go
[Sandra:] No because you di, you made two, you made two mi, what you did on this one over here you moved into a space first... and then jumped. That was your move.
[speaker011:] Yeah, he did do this. He went
[Sandra:] You did
[speaker011:] like that.
[Sandra:] that, and then jumped. Well that was your move into the space.
[speaker011:] There's yours.... Excuse me! That was there.
[speaker010:] Wasn't.
[Sandra:] Wasn't!
[speaker010:] It's my go.
[Sandra:] It's your go.
[speaker011:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker007:] [whispering] Block her off []!
[Sandra:] Never mind trying to block me off!
[speaker010:] [LAUGHTER]... [LAUGHTER] I don't know where she's going to. []
[speaker011:] Ah! No I do. No I don't.
[Sandra:] Ian's not far enough across the board to do anything to me.... What you doing? Mm?
[speaker010:] , I mean, like you aren't gonna move that anywhere else... until you've moved all them in. And then you'll have to go round.
[speaker011:] Oh yes! I know what you mean now.
[speaker010:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Are you playing at er, a cheating game you two?
[speaker011:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker010:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Mm? And he goes backwards?
[speaker011:] Yeah?
[speaker010:] Ooh! My go, right.
[Sandra:] You see you're,yo, make sure you're going backwards but he'll keep going forwards so I wouldn't listen to him Ian otherwise you'll end up... losing.... Yeah! That'll do
[speaker010:] He
[Sandra:] there.
[speaker010:] Now move that one? No, move... your fingers. [singing] dong di di [].
[speaker011:] That's when you move there then.
[Sandra:] It's your go Ian.
[speaker011:] Urgh! Urgh!
[speaker010:] Me?
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker010:] [LAUGHTER]... Cor!
[speaker011:] Ah! Oh oh!
[speaker010:] Your turn.
[speaker011:] Ooh sorry!
[speaker007:] I didn't want to come really! [LAUGHTER]
[speaker012:] You could have just, really boring!
[Sandra:] Ignore me!
[speaker012:] That was Sally up there. And arranged to fetch
[Sandra:] Well I must admit I I was bought, my sister saw them in er.... It's a little box... and in the lid was a recess
[speaker012:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] with a little plastic fork and spoon.
[speaker012:] I think I left them in.
[Sandra:] And they were fifty pence. And I bought a couple but... the kids have taken them to school.
[speaker012:] Do you want to pick them up?
[Sandra:] They take a cold meal. But
[speaker012:] Meals? Oh I thought you said cold meat!
[Sandra:] No, cold meals!
[speaker012:] Cold meals, right.
[Sandra:] So... I bought two
[speaker012:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] they're not quite big enough for putting Matthew's in separate.
[speaker012:] Oh.
[Sandra:] You know, I can't him enough
[speaker012:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] So I've put myself er... salad and cottage cheese. Erm, and our John... he did take but he doesn't like it when it goes.
[speaker012:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] So he's back on just er... but, I have another box... at home... and it's, it's a round box with
[speaker012:] Yes.
[Sandra:] four
[speaker012:] I've seen you with that one haven't I?
[Sandra:] , yeah.
[speaker012:] Yeah. Okay.
[Sandra:] Well what I do with Matthew is, I put him the lettuce and tomato and celery in one portion... he has er, cottage cheese and coleslaw in the other... and
[speaker012:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and then whatever... he's got some corned in another one. And I put cling film on the top so I forgot. And then, the other one... I add a cut of erm... chocolate teacake or something.
[speaker012:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] La, like I've done today I've made him another jelly in it.
[speaker013:] Kevin takes his er... packet of Quavers. His chocolate [LAUGHTER] biscuits []!
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker012:] Do you like Quavers?. Actually feels like as if you've eaten one.
[Sandra:] Where's the? Well I'm off next week, Thursday we got an extra four packets at the time.
[speaker012:] That's right, yeah, that's what I say, they're all going spare.
[Sandra:] The oth, it's the other ones we've.
[speaker013:] I know.
[Sandra:] Er
[speaker012:] No. I've seen at school that one. Er... trying think what her name is?
[speaker013:] Julie.
[Sandra:] Julie. Julie with the blond, er dark hair and she doesn't like Sonia. And she sits... on the opposite to us last year.
[speaker012:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Any time, any time at all I'll get you off. I says, are you in Thursdays? [LAUGHTER] And she said no []!
[speaker012:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker013:] She's not... oh she's not doing erm
[Sandra:] She says she's in Tuesdays for one sodding hour! I said that's exactly what I have Thursday. I said nothing you can to change it because of the way the... system works.
[speaker012:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] If I changed it they'd probably convenient. And she she's primary ed so she's no good to Jean either.
[speaker013:] No.
[speaker012:] There are Jean.
[Sandra:] I'll, I'll ask this other girl who I don't know so well... but I'm sure if she's going that way, she, you know, she's in that area anyway.
[speaker012:] Well I know both Julie and er... and then I'll
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker012:] I've forgotten her name!
[Sandra:] Oh it's Paula?
[speaker012:] No, I don't think it is.
[Sandra:] No, it's Mandy. Doing education and... But as I say, it's just a case of asking though. It's nothing you, you know even if you only can manage for a few weeks. I used to find in Newcastle College, I mean I was wa... walk back and people used to stop and
[speaker012:] [LAUGHTER] Yeah []! Shall we?
[speaker013:] Yeah.
[speaker012:] I was gonna say have you had a nice Christmas but we saw you [LAUGHTER] last week []!
[speaker013:] I've had a lovely Christmas thanks Joan! Have you?
[speaker012:] Yeah. At my mother's
[speaker013:] Christmas?
[speaker012:] Oh this super Sandra, by the way!
[speaker013:] I know. We've met.
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] Haven't you met me []? [LAUGHTER]
[speaker013:] Yeah I know. Tired today.
[Sandra:] I am.
[speaker013:] Oh dear!
[speaker012:] I was giggling there's a big fat boy was going to take a chance with this toffee bar, you know, super Sandra!
[speaker013:] I do think that's nice actually I might get one.
[speaker012:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Can I get up this one?
[speaker012:] Er... yeah.
[Sandra:] Oh yeah. Might as well
[speaker012:] I'll remind Ray.
[Sandra:] go up there.
[speaker012:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I don't know who put it in you know.
[speaker013:] Don't you?
[Sandra:] It's not a member of the committee.
[speaker012:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] We did actually have er, it's a, I think what it might be... we had a lady who came to... brought her son, mind, her son's thirty odd... and they did the singing for us. And er... she's the secretary for the Good Neighbour... there was another man there from the, from the Good Neighbour who does like, the articles or the advertising, and I think probably it's got to be her.
[speaker013:] And what did you think to the?
[Sandra:] I'm never really saw it
[speaker012:] Well... to be quite honest with you wasn't very impressed. I mean I
[speaker013:] Anyway, it didn't.
[speaker012:] Bad, I thought.
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] And Joan said... she must have been depressed.
[speaker013:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker012:] I would have been... been less chance of me doing that if I felt depressed.
[speaker013:] I mean really look... I said to Fred the other day... if you knew you were depressed.
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker012:] Yes. In fact,
[Sandra:] If you'd said the right things at
[speaker013:] Yes.
[Sandra:] the right place.
[speaker013:] It serves her right really. But not, I mean
[speaker012:] And then er
[speaker013:] yes, he wasn't impressed.
[speaker012:] Well I thought th th was alright didn't I?
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker012:] And...
[speaker013:] I think everybody
[speaker012:] Ah, I shouldn't think they will.
[Sandra:] I must
[speaker013:] Won't they?
[Sandra:] admit I am
[speaker012:] No!
[Sandra:] going to miss that Jane.
[speaker012:] Course not, cos we've got the summer to, as well haven't we?
[speaker013:] That's it, and get one in now
[Sandra:] Er, have you been to Biology? Go, you sorted your
[speaker012:] Erm
[Sandra:] cos I went last night.
[speaker012:] Yeah, my room number's O O three in the big one.
[Sandra:] That's right, yeah. Is that a ca, is it a
[speaker012:] And it's the one with Hi Hilary
[Sandra:] or a departmental.
[speaker012:] Departmental.
[speaker013:] I've got the big place as well!
[speaker012:] Oh have you?
[speaker013:] Yeah. But they're all... well I went and I said to them...... I'd forgotten my essays, my room number, the lot! And I said... I said... so I told her the registration... and she gave me the room number but she said.
[speaker012:] Oh.
[speaker013:] Didn't seem to be very specific at all.
[speaker012:] Were they not?
[Sandra:] Well, we put all of that [LAUGHTER] we've not any offers anyway []!
[speaker012:] Oh!
[Sandra:] You gotta consider them. Still, we're having a cat!
[speaker013:] ?
[speaker012:] She won't say yes.
[speaker013:] At the corner.
[speaker012:] Yeah?
[Sandra:] Oh you're erm... magazines at the top there. Er, when you've finished with it, all I want is the token off the corner of the page it happens to be on the reverse side
[speaker012:] Right.
[Sandra:] of the first page. I'm not saying we're going to collect the tokens, but just in case our John says... mum! You know?
[speaker013:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Oh this erm... it's the currency of the world.
[speaker012:] Oh!
[speaker013:] Yes.
[speaker012:] From the Times?
[Sandra:] Yeah. Well, of course, we do have The Times dear!
[speaker012:] Here! Here! We can just about.
[Sandra:] I have never known so many articles on Russian!
[speaker013:] It might be a thing in there.
[Sandra:] This is on the black market Russian.
[speaker012:] Do Russians, Russians come up and er?
[Sandra:] Oh yes. What did she do to the market? That's what this is, Mrs
[speaker013:] Well
[Sandra:] Bolcek... Bolcek
[speaker012:] Right. Aha.
[Sandra:] She will actually,.
[speaker013:] Yeah cos my friend
[Sandra:] Yeah. She felt that the education of the Boars wasn't me, er the basics to get some education for them. I thought that she gave them education to add to er, to the poor. And cos she always, she brought
[speaker012:] That's just like.
[Sandra:] er... she brought a, a lot of Western artifacts in it, she brought Western civilization
[speaker013:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] had been taught.
[speaker013:] I do that in fact, quite like it.
[Sandra:] Ah, well yes, I suppose
[speaker012:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] what I mean is er
[speaker013:] [LAUGHTER]... Nothing really, when they
[Sandra:] I wa, I know when I
[speaker013:] haven't got mine, yeah.
[Sandra:] when I looked at the front page and he said about two paragraphs
[speaker013:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I thought you'll be lucky!
[speaker013:] You'll be lucky!
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker012:] She communicated Peter... outside.
[speaker013:] Did she really?
[Sandra:] She just put that
[speaker012:] Yes she did.
[speaker013:] Cos he's such a friendly I Joan picked up a lot of little incidentals that we didn't pick up.
[speaker012:] No, you picked up i... I mean, I put that she recognized the gap between... you know, the Russian ally... to the Ger, I presume they did have Russian ally.
[Sandra:] Is that the right word?
[speaker012:] Er, and and the Marsey's you know, they were ordinary peasants. She volleyed something, but I couldn't remember what she had.
[speaker013:] Thurston was he?
[Sandra:] She didn't like Thurston
[speaker012:] Probably she
[Sandra:] did she?
[speaker012:] I don't know.
[Sandra:] I sat there and thought... what did this woman abolish? I th, you know when you're sitting there and can't click your brain into gear?
[speaker013:] Well mine was like the lecture.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker013:] That was on er... are you going to the Highbury now?
[Sandra:] No. I can probably go sometime this morning. You got something to drop off?
[speaker013:] No. Not that that's got any
[speaker012:] off your... your
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker012:] card.
[Sandra:] You want me to, it took me, it took me an hour and it'll finish it.
[speaker012:] You see, I'm gonna have to go, go today I'll go in the break.
[speaker013:] That's all I'm thinking now.
[Sandra:] You should have asked, you mean by Friday don't you?
[speaker012:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Erm, you know the parent's, you know parent psychology
[speaker012:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] er, psychology... are you only in Thursday same as me two till three.
[speaker012:] No.
[Sandra:] Oh! You're in for four lectures aren't you?
[speaker012:] Oh yes.
[Sandra:] Will you get a lift back?
[speaker013:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] You'll miss this one []!
[speaker012:] Well I don't back for
[Sandra:] Oh you don't go back?
[speaker012:] the sixth form.
[Sandra:] Oh we're not, we don't need to take it till the next one.
[speaker013:] Yeah, I go by car. Five till six I do.
[Sandra:] What's that for?
[speaker013:] Er it's er
[speaker012:] Tutorial. See
[Sandra:] Ah!
[speaker012:] we have a lecture
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker012:] four till five.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker012:] Well they've... stopped that lecture we're only having one now, but we've
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker012:] still gotta do... tutorial five till... unless, we can come to some arrangement
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker012:] with the bloke... who we have it with and say can we have it a bit earlier.
[speaker013:] You going home this afternoon?
[speaker012:] I would say, yeah.
[speaker013:] Right the way through?
[speaker012:] No, I shall go home about... erm... after the
[speaker013:] Oh it's alright. No, cos er
[speaker012:] What time are you going at?
[speaker013:] Well, we've got last lectures at five.
[speaker012:] No. I'll go home. I've got nothing this afternoon.
[Sandra:] Erm
[speaker013:] I mean, your getting a bike key.
[speaker012:] Well I haven't yet. What we'll have to do,yo yo
[speaker013:] Where will you be at twelve then Joan?
[speaker012:] did you think you knew someone or is that the one that you saw?
[Sandra:] Erm... I'd seen one this morning but she isn't in the core lecture so she's no good to you, but I said to her... could you give me a lift at all? You know, at any time during the week? She said, any time at all if we're at the same time. I said, you in Thursday? She said no.
[speaker012:] [LAUGHTER] That's what I want you for []!
[Sandra:] But I do kno, I know another girl, I don't know her well, but she does do core lectures.
[speaker013:] Cos it might be somebody is
[Sandra:] Well I'll find out what she's doing
[speaker013:] er Biology.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker013:] You know, you know
[speaker012:] Yeah.
[speaker013:] you'll recognise her when you get
[Sandra:] But
[speaker013:] there.
[Sandra:] Joan's just said she thinks she knows someone that's in core lectures that comes up from our way.
[speaker012:] She comes from our way see, so she'd come through your way
[speaker013:] Oh does she?
[speaker012:] so er, I I can ask her anyway.
[speaker013:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Well we hope that we might
[speaker013:] Might do.
[Sandra:] sort of, see her
[speaker012:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] probably, twelve-ish and
[speaker013:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker012:] Right, will you be in the
[Sandra:] We'll be in the corridor.
[speaker013:] Yes, that'll be
[speaker012:] Yeah, we will be in
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker012:] there then.
[speaker013:] We'll be in the corridor at twelve.
[speaker012:] Okay.
[Sandra:] Yeah. Tarrah!
[speaker012:] Thanks a lot.
[speaker013:] Tarrah! Oh I thought that was Alice then! But it wasn't. Got that on.
[Sandra:] I've got a couple of... erm, really going to be specific to do essay writing, but I need to get in the subjects in. But I've got plenty to read up o, I've read my criminology. I want to read my physics also. [2352 1] So that's more than enough [LAUGHTER] for this morning []! And I've got a chapter to read for American Studies.... No, if if you fail this coming back after Christmas I didn't actually
[speaker013:] ... Oh! They've left their lights on here.
[Sandra:] Left their lights on. Someone's going to have a flat battery!
[speaker013:] Mm. It's John..
[Sandra:] Ha, ha, ha!... I've got to go and tell the teacher this morning Alex needs to stay till twenty past three cos they only want them to stay till half two. But there's nothing I can do, it's very inconvenient I know. alright.
[speaker013:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] And we've been waylaid on
[speaker013:] Ah.
[Sandra:] the way back by another mother. And then I better go and see Annette to tell her. To straighten it up.
[speaker013:] How do you organise them to baby-sit for? I mean, they're alright you don't get a mess? Children.
[Sandra:] Yes. Erm... Rob and Polly's mum's picking Simon up and taking him home... and erm, Annette's picking up... most nights Gary's gonna be home just after four... so it's actually someone to take them home. But tonight, he's got his first staff meeting till half five... so tonight there's extra
[speaker013:] Extra to pick up.
[speaker007:] This year that we ever had the party. We haven't had this fifty pounds have we, off... the gas
[speaker014:] The gas
[Sandra:] board? Do you know what I thought?
[speaker015:] You've got another bill haven't you?
[Sandra:] Yeah. Why
[speaker014:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] don't we get a great big saucepan lid he can give them bill?
[speaker014:] We could... er, the trouble was that the meeting for the people that we were going to decide
[Sandra:] Right.
[speaker014:] how much... wasn't held until after I'd gone up for the money for Matthew's back.
[speaker015:] Oh yeah.
[speaker014:] And he
[speaker015:] And
[speaker014:] didn't know what had been happening because he wasn't at the meeting.
[speaker015:] Enjoyed yourself.
[Sandra:] Mm. I know.
[speaker014:] And the company who's in on it was Christmas
[speaker015:] Did you want to go? Do you want to go?
[Sandra:] I'm going to
[speaker014:] we go
[Sandra:] how do we get the, I'm absolutely
[speaker015:] Alright then.
[Sandra:] exhausted!
[speaker014:] Er
[Sandra:] I'm gonna to go.
[speaker015:] Tarrah for now! See you guys Monday.
[speaker014:] That's right.
[speaker007:] Tarrah!
[speaker014:] I don't think fifty pound... will cover it do you?
[Sandra:] Well how many, how much is wrong?
[speaker014:] I don't know.
[Sandra:] Where would you go? I think... we could do with doing like we said and asking St. Edwards if they've any.
[speaker015:] Did we think we about the old staff did you say?
[speaker014:] Erm on there but it's
[Sandra:] Yeah, it is, it isn't closing.
[speaker015:] Oh isn't it?
[Sandra:] No, well not yet, they're hoping for a takeover bid.
[speaker015:] Oh!
[speaker016:] Machine.
[speaker014:] I don't reckon everybody's gone home
[Sandra:] Well when I say, they're certain, a big one. Like one of those great big ones
[speaker015:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] that you use in the school.
[speaker014:] Yeah, there is a to do anything.
[Sandra:] Oh!
[speaker016:] Well se, she's now, she's given up, they've got a paper shop at... Blaby I think.
[speaker015:] Mm.
[speaker016:] I dunno whether she does it.
[Sandra:] They want to try and get her home instead of going in a school.
[speaker015:] I mean what
[speaker014:] Oh yeah.
[speaker015:] we've said it, if we can accumulate our own pots and pans, we'll be like before they're there for everybody up here to use.
[speaker014:] Well exactly, yeah. Because everybody is beginning to meet
[speaker016:] Yeah. Well Maureen's doing a bit of catering now
[Sandra:] Yes.
[speaker016:] as well.
[Sandra:] And, it's... we like
[speaker014:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] we said... it's easier for us... than to keep borrowing Eileen's every year
[speaker014:] Yeah.
[speaker016:] True.
[Sandra:] Because, if we start building up. We're building up the crockery.
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[speaker014:] We could do with building up the.
[Sandra:] Because we, even if we ever came to a final close if
[speaker014:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] we ever had to
[speaker017:] Well how much are a big pan?
[speaker014:] How much are they?
[Sandra:] Well we don't know, but I've tried the education authority, they haven't got any in stores at the moment.
[speaker014:] Where would we go for it
[Sandra:] And I wondered about Chedderton
[speaker015:] Er, that, no th that
[Sandra:] St. Andrews.
[speaker016:] Is it in that little square?
[Sandra:] St. Andrew's Place.
[speaker016:] I bet it was shut.
[Sandra:] Well I'll start at Old Street.
[speaker016:] Yeah,th
[Sandra:] The County Caterers
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I think it is.
[speaker017:] I've er, oh I've been there.
[speaker014:] I've to get Friday off.
[Sandra:] They're very expensive though!
[speaker014:] Because I've been to catering things
[Sandra:] I was, you see, when the... Head was closing.
[speaker014:] Yeah!
[Sandra:] Teddleton whether they would have any. But I
[speaker015:] Oh yeah!
[Sandra:] I tried ringing them and I didn't get any answer on the phone
[speaker016:] Oh!
[Sandra:] you see, so I didn't try again, but... maybe tomorrow if I think about it
[speaker014:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] in the morning I'll try it again.
[speaker014:] Well is this the... place at?
[Sandra:] It's not, it's St. Andrews
[speaker014:] Is it?
[Sandra:] Place.
[speaker014:] Why is that
[speaker017:] It's erm
[speaker014:] one?
[speaker017:] down George Street.
[Sandra:] It's just a shop right at George Street. Coming up from the baths. Go past
[speaker015:] And there's a, like a little square, a little set back of shops.
[Sandra:] And it's set back like that on the crossroads.
[speaker014:] Oh! Yeah!
[speaker015:] By
[speaker014:] It's near the castle?
[speaker008:] Yeah.
[speaker014:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker015:] You have to go in and have a look... at what they've got.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker015:] You know.
[speaker014:] Well I was thinking that fifty pounds off the gas board.
[speaker016:] No.
[Sandra:] But we haven't actually had a set amou, although they said that there would be money coming
[speaker014:] Mm.
[Sandra:] nothing came out of the last committee meeting to a definite, this is definite this.
[speaker016:] Well I mean er we could always have raffles ourselves anyway!... I mean, you could, you know what I mean, used to have a little raffle every week. In fact, we've had
[Sandra:] See we bro, we bought, we bought six turkey tins
[speaker015:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] rather than keep using the big tins for the school.
[speaker015:] Yeah, the school.
[Sandra:] I mean, they're ninety nine pence a tin and turkey tins stowed for years so I don't think these are gonna come to any harm over
[speaker017:] No!
[Sandra:] the next five or ten
[speaker017:] No.
[Sandra:] years. They'll have paid for themselves.
[speaker015:] Yeah. What did you think of then?
[Sandra:] Er,we... well I thought
[speaker017:] And wo we these warehouses Maureen has a ticket ou, have you a ticket
[Sandra:] I've got one.
[speaker017:] Do they sell them there?
[Sandra:] Not large catering ones, I haven't
[speaker017:] Oh!
[Sandra:] .
[speaker017:] So the... we want somebody in th, do we know anybody who, in a hotel who would get some like er
[Sandra:] Well... we do have a contact at a hotel.
[speaker017:] I thought you might have Sandra
[speaker007:] Oh I know!
[speaker017:] I mean, let's
[speaker007:] Who?
[speaker017:] face it, there's not many.
[speaker014:] Oh!
[Sandra:] .
[speaker014:] Who?
[Sandra:] We have a contact in a large hotel in the town
[speaker017:] Well this is what I thought.
[Sandra:] It might be worth asking mightn't it?
[speaker016:] Fabulous!
[speaker017:] Yeah! If they could order you some and then, you know
[speaker014:] And like in a very
[speaker017:] Have you any money in the house?
[speaker014:] Yes.
[Sandra:] Yes!
[speaker015:] All of five pounds
[speaker014:] No we haven't it's
[speaker015:] have we!
[Sandra:] No. No. No.
[speaker017:] Well I mean, if you bought them and then you're building up during the year, but you know, we can always have them for
[Sandra:] See apparently education now, we're on a such a cut back that they've
[speaker007:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] recycled them so much by the time we get back to school... they've had it!
[speaker017:] Well, I'm afraid, I look at it, like, that if you've run out of.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker007:] Yeah.
[speaker014:] That's the time isn't it?
[speaker017:] And then if you started off in here
[Sandra:] But bearing in mind... we use... four... of the big ones
[speaker017:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] right, so... for starters, one isn't any good.
[speaker016:] No.
[speaker014:] Yeah but
[Sandra:] Wo, I mean one is a start but... erm, in that I may as well still got a half a dozen off the school.
[speaker015:] How much is she paying for school?
[speaker014:] Yeah. How much do you think
[Sandra:] They're bound to be at least sixty, to eighty pounds a pan I would think, if not
[speaker015:] A pan? Never!
[speaker014:] Oh you, well they
[Sandra:] I bet you you're not going to be far short of at least that much per pan. I mean an ordinary
[speaker015:] What type can you get?
[Sandra:] strong saucepan
[speaker015:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] ordinary household now, you're looking at thirty pound!
[speaker014:] Or depending, yeah
[Sandra:] , now I mean it, I mean
[speaker014:] Mind you, you don't have to do, with it being gas, you don't have to have a solid thing
[Sandra:] No.
[speaker014:] thing do you?
[speaker015:] The aluminium
[Sandra:] No.
[speaker015:] ones are alright aren't they?
[Sandra:] Er, providing
[speaker015:] That's what I want.
[Sandra:] but you see being catering, they come heavier and thicker
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] anyway because of
[speaker014:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] the amount of time that they're the stove.
[speaker017:] Yeah. That's true.
[speaker015:] Mm.
[speaker016:] Anyway,
[Sandra:] I might
[speaker016:] you'd have to ask wouldn't you?
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker016:] And I mean, it's great! I mean, er the thing is if you've got a name and you want to that's the time to work for it in that little
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker016:] thing
[speaker017:] Will we have individual pies?
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[speaker017:] And I suppose, instead of doing pie and peas
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[speaker017:] we'd do stew
[speaker014:] Do a lot of
[speaker017:] .
[speaker016:] I see! Yeah!
[speaker017:] Yeah.
[speaker015:] Oh!
[speaker017:] Makes a change.
[speaker015:] That's a good idea!
[speaker017:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Except
[speaker014:] I see!
[Sandra:] with the crusty tart.
[speaker014:] Oh.
[Sandra:] And the raffle.
[speaker015:] The thing is now, when will you be? Er
[speaker014:] Perhaps a tenner.
[Sandra:] They're not prepared to settle for sarnies and a cake on the side.
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker017:] Well that's
[speaker014:] You see
[speaker017:] so popular you see Sandra
[Sandra:] And unfortunately we have one
[speaker017:] Yo, you know when the
[Sandra:] lady who doesn't eat it but brings the bowl.
[speaker014:] Yeah, and she serves him herself.
[speaker017:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker016:] That's an improvement on a plastic bag!
[Sandra:] Yes, we take the meat pie home in a plastic bag!
[speaker014:] Can't you say pie and peas then?
[speaker007:] Oh! No!
[Sandra:] What?... Er... so I mean, we're, we're, we'll say
[speaker016:] Oh!
[speaker014:] Well... have you had to make them?
[Sandra:] we really need to start. No!
[speaker016:] Oh, well they do Home Economics yo at school you know.
[Sandra:] I wonder if I could get them through the education.
[speaker016:] Yeah! Well, you know, it's worth asking her. She might... she might just know! The more people you ask, the better the!
[speaker017:] Yes, I've got something. Yes.
[speaker016:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Who said
[speaker014:] I'm sure I don't know.
[speaker017:] Yes she... at the church used to do function years and years, you know, she permission and what have you.
[Sandra:] Well, I mean,
[speaker016:] Glenda... er, she's home economics isn't she? See Glenda on Friday.
[Sandra:] Well mention it in passing
[speaker016:] Righto!
[Sandra:] and then... if not, I will have a word with the contact here, the contact... for the
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] hotel wear.
[speaker014:] Well, or if you ask
[speaker017:] Have you asked... sorry! I was going to say I'll ask Glenda on Friday
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[speaker017:] you can tell me what to say to
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[speaker017:] her then I
[speaker016:] Well you can ask her if you want.
[speaker017:] probably be better. I suppose.
[speaker016:] Yeah! Well one of us will remember whoe, I mean, the thing is, I've so much on I could
[speaker017:] Yeah.
[speaker016:] forget by
[speaker017:] Yeah. Yeah.
[Sandra:] You see, and we, we remember last time we did something, we'd go down into a... or scout movement where
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] they have large pans, but even they were looking for some large pans!
[speaker016:] Larger pans. Yes.
[Sandra:] So
[speaker016:] Would have, yeah.
[Sandra:] they want using when they're here otherwise it's pointless, it's like pots
[speaker016:] Buying, yeah.
[Sandra:] and pans,th th the crockery
[speaker016:] Yes.
[Sandra:] if it's here it's not much point leaving it for once a year.
[speaker016:] Oh no! I mean
[Sandra:] It, it's got
[speaker016:] that er Yeah.
[Sandra:] to be used otherwise
[speaker016:] True
[Sandra:] it's waste of space.
[speaker016:] Yes! Yeah!
[Sandra:] But er... the pans would be the same. If we
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] do get them, if
[speaker014:] Yes you see
[Sandra:] they go in stock
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] as long as erm... there's space found there for them.
[speaker014:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] The trouble is, we're bringing so much stuff in... [LAUGHTER] it's just the amount of space []!
[speaker007:] Beryl.
[speaker017:] Well they can't say a lot
[Sandra:] Well I think
[speaker017:] it's their, they're catering as well! But I mean, it wasn't
[speaker015:] I might have down to have proper plates... the amount of
[Sandra:] True!
[speaker015:] you might have spent a of time
[Sandra:] Oh!
[speaker015:] washing up, but it was a darn sight better than paper
[speaker014:] Yes it was.
[speaker015:] plates!
[speaker017:] Those were awful!
[speaker014:] When are you
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker014:] putting your
[speaker016:] And the plastic.
[speaker014:] Valentine's Day
[speaker016:] Yeah! I mean
[speaker014:] up for sale? St Valentine's Day.
[speaker017:] I did, I'm just, they're flogging the races you know.
[speaker014:] Oh are they? Cos I'll have two
[speaker017:] Yeah.
[speaker014:] for that.
[speaker007:] Oh do you?
[Sandra:] I've, I've got one but I've got nobody to go with!
[speaker017:] Oh! Why don't you come with us?
[speaker014:] Well me and Jimmy are going!
[Sandra:] Well I refu, I I mean Henry won't come out
[speaker016:] No.
[Sandra:] and... I bought one so, I said to him I can't afford
[speaker014:] Well me and Jimmy are coming, and you're coming aren't you Mary?
[Sandra:] four pounds for a dance if I'm not coming
[speaker014:] Oh yeah!
[Sandra:] but I don't mind two pounds for a race night.
[speaker016:] Well, and Barry and we have a lot of table and be on there!
[speaker014:] Yeah, well me and Jimmy are going just.
[speaker007:] It is the
[Sandra:] Yeah, cos I bought a ticket.
[speaker007:] er
[speaker014:] Oh! Erm, also we,
[speaker007:] twenty
[speaker014:] who else?
[speaker007:] twenty
[speaker015:] Something like the twenty eighth?
[speaker007:] Twenty fourth.
[speaker014:] Oh. I've just given her twenty pounds, she's got no change so she's going to drop me the pound in. So if you've got twenty pound
[speaker007:] in January or later on February
[Sandra:] yeah.
[speaker007:] I don't know.
[Sandra:] I've got twenty pounds at home.
[speaker014:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Has she got the twe, she's know how much
[speaker014:] Yes.
[Sandra:] to give me?
[speaker014:] Yeah. Yeah I told her.
[Sandra:] Oh right!
[speaker014:] That'll be seventy two.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker014:] And I told her to keep the twenty for that stuff in there....
[Sandra:] Well you'll have to come in on the way ho
[speaker015:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] mind
[speaker015:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] you
[speaker015:] Oh it doesn't matter now.
[Sandra:] I did say I wasn't staying. I better go!
[speaker015:] In the morning you can give it me.
[speaker007:] Do you want another go before you go? Have another
[Sandra:] Er, well it's not so much that, I keep looking at the clock and then we'll... he'll be, he'll
[speaker007:] Well I'm staying up for one more game
[Sandra:] thinking that you... and he's got to put his
[speaker016:] You, you can still have one more game, Pat, me and you and
[speaker014:] Yeah.
[speaker016:] and the others.
[speaker007:] Well I'll have one.
[speaker017:] Oh we can put her on then.
[speaker008:] Er
[speaker016:] Cos I have enough staff
[speaker015:] Now
[speaker016:] for a long time.
[speaker015:] Mary... Gerry
[speaker017:] Pat
[Sandra:] Pat
[speaker015:] And Sandra.
[speaker016:] And Sandra
[speaker015:] Right then.
[speaker007:] There's a.
[Sandra:] Oh where's my racquet gone? Where have I put it?
[speaker015:] On the chair, look. A, between those chairs.... Up there.
[Sandra:] Right. Come on then.
[speaker007:] You're gonna have to start with three I need.
[speaker017:] Right! So it's er
[speaker015:] Don't shout!
[speaker017:] Mary, Gerry, Pat, and Sandra.
[Sandra:] I can play with Gerry can I?
[speaker007:] Yeah. Yes.
[speaker015:] You both go on next and then we'll run you home while you're
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker014:] Yes, you go.
[speaker007:] So I'll see you erm... Thursday.
[speaker014:] Thursday and, yeah.
[speaker007:] Half past one. Rest of conversation inaudible. They're in a hall playing badminton or something so too far away and a lot of shouting and laughing all at once. Impossible! Always the lady that co that come round isn't it? Or is that the lady with
[speaker018:] Oh!
[Sandra:] the colleges? I don't know, now The one. Mm. Must have come from Keele doesn't she?
[speaker018:] Oh yes! Henry.
[Sandra:] Oh! Oh yeah.
[speaker018:] Mm.
[Sandra:] . [cough]
[speaker018:] Right.
[Sandra:] When's he placing the order?
[speaker018:] He's not late at the moment, so... What?
[Sandra:] Who's he placing the order with?
[speaker018:] Erm... well... all the groups are going to have... be... changed around, er, from February... erm... I don't exactly know yet
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker018:] at the moment who, who, who you'll be... er, taught by, because it really depends on er... how the timetable works out. I think it'll be... different groups. Probably, er I don't know even, you know,th the groups may not rema, remain the same. It depends on how your timetables work out and er, how the... available tutors' timetables work out.
[Sandra:] Right.
[speaker018:] So it maybe a bit different. Erm
[Sandra:] Will it still be this room or... will
[speaker018:] Erm
[Sandra:] it be a different room?
[speaker018:] no, it won't be this
[Sandra:] Oh!
[speaker018:] room. No. I was going to say that, definitely because
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] because it's a room... and I won't be [LAUGHTER] involved []
[Sandra:] Oh right.
[speaker018:] from er... the point of view
[Sandra:] Thank you. [cough]
[speaker018:] of that.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker018:] Erm... well it'll be useful I think for you, I me, assuming that peoples' timetables may well have changed a bit since er, the beginning of last term... it'll be useful... if you
[speaker007:] Hello.
[speaker019:] Sorry I'm late.
[speaker018:] it'll be useful if you would... fill one of these in
[Sandra:] Mine hasn't.
[speaker018:] for us again please.
[Sandra:] Oh! Have you got mi, do you want me to do it again anyway?
[speaker018:] Er
[Sandra:] Cos mine isn't altered.
[speaker018:] Isn't it? Erm
[speaker019:] It'll yours won't.
[Sandra:] I know, well mine
[speaker018:] Well you might as well do it as
[Sandra:] Do it again?
[speaker018:] if all the others are doing it. I think I've probably still got yours but
[speaker019:] As for what subject, I'm not sure what it's gonna be cos I've gotta pass... in the
[speaker018:] Yo no, you're not sure yet?
[speaker019:] I don't know.
[speaker018:] Oh!
[speaker019:] But I can put in
[speaker018:] But I think, aren't they always, their timetables are at the same time aren't they, the topics?
[speaker019:] Well yes, we have everything at.
[speaker018:] Oh I see! Oh yeah, well... you've obviously passed if they.
[speaker019:] That's right.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] Erm, I was just saying this before you came in Hannah that er... er... they'll... probably be quite different groups from the beginning of February and certainly will be... er... a change of tutor as far as you're concerned cos I won't be involved in the. And I can't... er, so you'll, you know... you will be this, for this... three, for three weeks in erm... in er... January.
[speaker007:] Yes. So is the erm, tutorials likely to change?
[speaker018:] Well we haven't had
[Sandra:] Oh of course, yes!
[speaker018:] all of a sudden it will change.
[speaker007:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] They'll be a different tutor and a, a different room obviously we
[speaker007:] Mm.
[speaker018:] whichever tutor'll be with you and
[Sandra:] Tutor.
[speaker018:] tutor will probably
[Sandra:] [cough]
[speaker019:] Especially when we've been going well. That's a shame!
[speaker018:] Yeah, last year we got so much equipment ah the... that's just a there, but
[speaker019:] Mm mm.
[speaker018:] you know
[speaker019:] Ah! That's
[Sandra:] Oh that's a quarter
[speaker018:] Oh! Ju, is anyone likely, oh thanks very much.
[Sandra:] I haven't bothered to put myself down for tutorial or shall
[speaker018:] No don't
[Sandra:] do it?
[speaker018:] don't bother because actually
[Sandra:] And the, the core topic at the bottom is only two weeks so
[speaker018:] This one here, you want?
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] The education for the afternoons... starts... in
[speaker018:] Is that... two weeks... from January?
[Sandra:] Yeah, it's a... Friday, and then another Friday but just the other ones
[speaker018:] And that's our core is it?
[Sandra:] that's it, yeah.
[speaker018:] Ah! Well... you can cross that out ta actually because it's really... er, only from the beginning of February is it? Or well you se
[Sandra:] No, well that
[speaker018:] you see anything
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] that happens before the beginning of February... you can leave out. I think it's.
[Sandra:] I think, I I'm positive it finishes by the end of term.
[speaker018:] What that one?
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] This is your one is it?
[speaker019:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] And that's going to on to February is it
[speaker007:] Eh?
[speaker018:] this topic... you've got? Er
[Sandra:] Yes. I can't re, I... I can't remember when we exactly started, I've got quite a lot this term.
[speaker018:] Yeah. I see. Right.
[speaker019:] Oh right. Oh well.
[speaker018:] Is anyone likely to see Fran?
[speaker019:] Tomorrow... probably.
[speaker018:] In a class do you mean, or
[speaker019:] Mm.
[speaker018:] oh well, she probably be there cos she's, she's got flu.
[speaker019:] Oh!
[speaker018:] Erm... other than er does anyone, is she friend of anyone in this group? Is anyone likely to see her... other than in classes? No? Erm... cos I want to have her try and go with er...
[speaker019:] Shall I hold onto it and try and find out? Try and sort her thing out.
[speaker018:] Yeah but what ha, any idea when you might be able to find out?
[speaker019:] Yeah, I'm gonna try and get into.
[speaker018:] Ah! I see.
[speaker019:] That's probably when it will be.
[speaker018:] But it will be... er, er this week?
[speaker019:] Oh yeah!
[speaker018:] Mm. Yeah, well, as soon as you can... er, let me know that.
[speaker019:] Shall I borrow it?
[speaker018:] ?
[speaker019:] Do you mind if I borrow them?
[speaker018:] No, it don't matter, no.... But don't forget to let me have it will you?
[speaker019:] Yeah, okay.
[Sandra:] Put it in your book or your folder there. Oh I. Having got
[speaker018:] You have put your names on have you?
[Sandra:] What's it meant to be?
[speaker019:] Erm... a little
[speaker018:] Pardon?
[speaker019:] hardback one but I don't know if it's right one.
[speaker007:] I thought.
[speaker018:] Is it? Which Oh yes!
[speaker007:] Just put it in there.
[speaker019:] Oh yeah.
[speaker007:] Oh actually, hang on!
[speaker019:] It's one of these.
[Sandra:] [clears throat]
[speaker019:] Must be your day isn't it?
[speaker007:] Mm. Yeah.
[Sandra:] I don't think I've got that one.
[speaker018:] This is erm... er th er th, from, from February onwards, up to the end of the May, in fact... anything that's likely
[speaker019:] Yeah. Mm.
[speaker018:] to affect your, you know, it's a big extra demand on your time... over that period, first of February to end of May. Cos that's, that's the er
[Sandra:] I've put it, oh I've put it that goes to the summer doesn't it? Cos the education will then come on to Thursday, Friday isn't it? After Easter.
[speaker019:] No, it's not, they've changed it around a bit.
[Sandra:] No. No. But it comes
[speaker019:] So that
[Sandra:] onto Thursday and Fridays.
[speaker018:] Does it?
[Sandra:] Yeah. But don't know
[speaker018:] So does it affect your
[Sandra:] Yeah!
[speaker018:] You don't know yet.
[Sandra:] If if it's go, well yo, we don't know because they don't, they haven't put out exactly when it is, whether it No, second years.
[speaker019:] Oh!
[speaker007:] I didn't know either.
[speaker019:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] Well is it erm
[speaker019:] isn't it?
[speaker018:] is it a kind of first come, first served sort of
[Sandra:] No. Won't be, it expands
[speaker018:] Will you able to pick
[Sandra:] in the summer... and they take over two more
[speaker018:] Must be the heat that [LAUGHTER] does it []!
[Sandra:] It must be the heat that does it! Yeah. And we only know that if it goes on for Monday afternoons for an hour, instead of
[speaker018:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] being an hour it's going onto two... hours
[speaker018:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and it's going to be afternoons.
[speaker018:] So when it
[Sandra:] But apparently it will go on into the... being Fridays, but
[speaker018:] Oh I see! Oh well you may find you might have to renegotiate something... in the summer term then I suppose, but you'll just have to see it how it works out.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker019:] I suppose we could always, you could always swap with somebody in groups couldn't we?
[speaker018:] Yes. There's likely to be four groups meeting
[speaker019:] Right.
[speaker018:] at times, so erm... there's likely to be one group that is late
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] and er... erm... ah yes!
[Sandra:] Oh my gosh!
[speaker019:] Mm?
[speaker018:] So does everyone know what er
[Sandra:] [sneeze]
[speaker019:] Bless you!
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker018:] Your pushing your luck now dear aren't you?
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker019:] , [LAUGHTER] you what I meant [].
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker019:] All very complicated, yeah.
[speaker018:] I think there's a ri
[speaker019:] Oh yeah. There.
[speaker018:] some notes here that have been here all, all the vacation, I think they're yours aren't they?
[speaker019:] Oh! They are, yeah. [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker018:] They've been next to my telephone for four weeks. Right... well there's [LAUGHTER] not much space left is there []!
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker019:] Convenient!
[speaker018:] [LAUGHTER]... Does anyone know... what subjects Francine is doing?... Don't know.
[Sandra:] No.
[speaker019:] Do, would she start the day off as it's a, a long
[Sandra:] Yes.
[speaker019:] day
[speaker018:] Yes.
[speaker007:] Oh right.
[speaker018:] Erm... does anyone know if she's
[Sandra:] Would she go to criminol, does she do criminology?
[speaker018:] I don't know.
[speaker019:] I don't think that she does.
[speaker018:] Er, do do do you know if she's likely to ha to have any timetable changes this term, do you know?
[speaker007:] I have no idea.
[speaker019:] Oh no I think she's on she's still in F Y isn't she? Oh yes
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker019:] so she'll
[speaker018:] Is she?
[speaker019:] be on our course, it won't change
[speaker018:] It'll be the same?
[speaker019:] much. Mm.
[speaker018:] So we, I can use the time table she
[speaker019:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] gave me last term then? Right. Okay. Tt! Erm... sorry about this, but er... it's a sort of a chore we have to... do at this stage. Erm... now is there anything else I need to... tell you? Erm... you'll be getting a new set of... essay... titles... soon, that is for... the second semester from February to erm... the end of.... Erm, and the deadline for those would be... in the summer term. But erm... I'm compiling a list at the moment on... tutors and er... I'll be able to... let you know the... probably next week I should think.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker018:] Erm... but in the meantime... those are the first essays I can er... erm... are you erm, working on that or thinking about that?
[speaker019:] Mhm
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker019:] Mm. But
[Sandra:] Mhm.
[speaker018:] Right, okay, thinking is the first step in the way that... you know. Okay. What else is there? The the... exam, for part of your assessment will be in much the same form... it'll be in two parts... er... recreating to... the two parts of the course... and,yo, you'll get roughly the same number of questions as the... than the essay questions that you have with each... each semester. And they'll cover roughly the same topic areas. It obviously won't be the same questions but the... same sort of areas will be covered on it. Any, any questions about that?
[Sandra:] Do you have a choice on that or is it compulsory all questions?
[speaker018:] Is it what?
[Sandra:] Is it a compulsory set of questions... on... or do we have a choice?
[speaker018:] Well you have a
[Sandra:] You just said
[speaker018:] choice... so that
[Sandra:] Yeah but
[speaker018:] you
[speaker019:] How many questions do you have to answer?
[speaker018:] you, I think it's er, the case that you have write four... four answers... four... you know, do do four questions, so you do
[Sandra:] Two from each?
[speaker018:] two from each.
[speaker019:] Oh! That's it. Right.
[speaker018:] And erm
[Sandra:] In three hours is it?
[speaker018:] Three hours, yes that's
[speaker019:] Oh good!
[speaker018:] right.
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] That's some doing []!
[speaker019:] How many words do you expect?
[speaker018:] Well, the usual.
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker019:] Well do... you're not bothered about the amount, are you more concerned with the quality?
[speaker018:] Oh well... er, quality is more important than quantity, but obviously if the quantity is very tiny,i it is... there's not much room for quality.
[speaker019:] Mm. Gordon Bennett!
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker018:] I mean a co a couple of pages of good quality stuff would be fine, in the time, you know, if people... sometimes people write half a book in that time but... er
[Sandra:] Trouble is, how legible
[speaker018:] it's not always
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] do you want it []!
[speaker018:] Oh it's got to be reasonably legible.
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker018:] I mean, we do make all sorts of allowances... with exams... you know, people repeat words and th... and they can leave words out and... they can't think of a... eloquent way of expressing that... something at the spur of the moment so it's
[speaker019:] Can you keep a dictionary?
[speaker018:] a as long... well I don't think so. I,yo yo, you spend too much, you waste too much time. But erm... what we're looking for is... th, what you've learnt and er, the ability to think for yourself... and erm... all sorts of scrappiness and inaccuracies and... you know, all that, we've we make allowances for, because that happens under the pressure of time... and erm nerves. And erm
[speaker019:] The... what about plans into consideration as well? Erm
[speaker018:] Erm... it's a very, it's always a good idea to do a plan, cos yeah, spend... five minutes or so planning and... jot down... a rough plan... and... it might... be that we would, we wo, we would normally ignore, ignore the plan when marking... but if, you haven't finished a question and er, it's a bit thin we might look at your plan to get some idea of what you would actually written
[speaker019:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] and you might get one or two marks from that, so... you don't... it's always a good idea to... do a plan.
[speaker019:] Is the pass mark... forty six... or fifty six?
[speaker018:] Ah erm, I ha
[speaker019:] And do you have to pass those papers with twenty six... points?
[speaker018:] It's erm... I think it's one paper isn't it? Er, there two parts
[speaker019:] Over two parts, yes.
[speaker018:] Two parts one
[speaker019:] Do you have to have those... oh, so it counts as one
[speaker018:] Erm
[speaker019:] anyway.
[speaker018:] it's all, I think it's marked overall, I mean
[speaker019:] Yes.
[speaker018:] it's a... percentage
[speaker019:] Mm.
[Sandra:] of the overall paper. And... erm... I always think it's a bit funny about pass marks because I don't think... you know, this is worth fifty percent and then I think what's a, now what's the pass mer mark? And I tend to think now, does this, is this work a pass? And
[speaker019:] Mm.
[Sandra:] they, if, I mean, if the pass mark is ninety percent and... I've already decided it's worth a pass then I give it [LAUGHTER] ninety percent you see []! Mm.
[speaker018:] Or... you know, it's that way round, and you decide
[speaker019:] Mm.
[speaker018:] whether it's
[speaker007:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker018:] you know. I mean... it's a bit arbitrary where you put the pass [LAUGHTER] by a mark
[speaker019:] Mm.
[speaker018:] actually []!
[speaker019:] Mm, I suppose it's hard
[speaker018:] Er
[Sandra:] marking, yeah.
[speaker018:] but you ju, you know, you judge how good it is
[speaker019:] Mm.
[speaker018:] and then you decide on the percentage in relation to how good the piece is.
[speaker019:] Do pe people mark the papers or is it just... one?
[speaker018:] Erm... brurgh urgh urgh! Well, finals are always double marked, I'm not quite sure about this. I think they are double marked, yeah. I think so.... They should be. But
[speaker019:] Well, yeah I was just, you you could see them for, just thinking that perhaps you could be slightly biased in one when
[speaker018:] Mm.
[speaker019:] the other lecturer might seem to be
[speaker018:] Yeah.
[speaker019:] the other way and like
[speaker018:] Well that's right.
[speaker019:] giving us a more or
[speaker018:] Yeah, well we always
[speaker019:] less mark.
[speaker018:] Well, finals are always double marked... er, because of that. Er... yeah, but when you've got a big pile of papers your judgement gets impaired [LAUGHTER] after you've... you've er []
[speaker019:] You've got... [LAUGHTER] fed up and say []
[speaker018:] had several hours and getting bored with the same answer over and over again!
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] Just as if it's []!
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker018:] Yeah that's... I think you'll find that. Yeah, so... you know, er counter-marking the normal practice. Erm... if you get a problem... just trying to remember what... what we did last year. I think it was... it was double marked.
[Sandra:] Did many people fail last year?
[speaker018:] Th the question, yes the
[speaker019:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker018:] exam erm... exam was double marked with, the question arose as to whether the essay should be double marked, because obviously they are part of the assessment.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker018:] And I think... er, I'm hoping,sh, not quite sure what we decided about that. In principle they should be because they are part of... erm... your assessment.... But, I'm not sure, I'll have to... enquire about that.... Er, what was the other... somebody
[Sandra:] Jus
[speaker018:] else was saying that
[Sandra:] Yes, I was just saying... what was your pa, did
[speaker018:] Oh!
[Sandra:] many people fail?
[speaker018:] Can't remember, but it... no... we don't expect to fail... people. I mean, we do look for things on the papers to try [LAUGHTER] and justify... giving people [] marks, you know, we're not sort of out to fail you. We're out to pass you really, but we we won't unless it's worth it, but erm... the emphasis is on... trying to find something there to give [LAUGHTER] a mark to []... sort of thing... rather than the other way around. Er... I can't remember wha, erm... happened last year.... Er, there may be one... there may have been one that failed, I'm not sure but... they probably did a resit and... got through in September. Er, you don't want to evolve with that do you?
[speaker019:] I didn't realise you could do resits actually.
[speaker007:] Well the... the tutor.
[speaker008:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker018:] Erm Ooh! You may be able to, but you might have trouble with your
[Sandra:] [cough]
[speaker018:] your grant giving authority
[speaker019:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] because er... they're
[speaker019:] I see.
[speaker018:] not too keen on paying... for another year.
[Sandra:] Does that go for all subsid if you fail your subsid you can retake?
[speaker019:] I think you can... take another
[speaker018:] Retake the exam you mean?
[speaker019:] No, I think you usually mita, submit a... another piece of work or something like that.
[Sandra:] Oh!?
[speaker019:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] Yes I'm I'm not quite sure the regulations are about subsids... We, I mean we, it's only quite recently that we have had a subsidiary, erm, last two or three years, we've, for many years we didn't have one. So, it's not a thing I'm very familiar with. And they always seem to changing that as well you [LAUGHTER] see []!
[Sandra:] Oh!
[speaker018:] Er, any more, any
[Sandra:] [cough]
[speaker018:] last questions on anything you don't know? If you want to ask
[Sandra:] [cough]
[speaker018:] I'll explain to you about the course, and the exams... the rest of it.
[speaker019:] What sort of percentage do the erm... essays that we hand in before the exams...
[speaker018:] I think it counts
[speaker019:] of the mark?
[speaker018:] for fifty percent of the overall assessment.
[speaker019:] Oh does it? Right.
[speaker018:] Yes,th the two essays
[speaker019:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] combined would... that's fifty percent of your overall, so the exam is the other fifty percent. So can already... be well set, you know.
[Sandra:] Mm mm.
[speaker018:] If you with good essays. Right, well, let's get on with something. Erm... Sharon... who you heard la last night at the
[Sandra:] Brilliant! Oh! She was lovely!
[speaker019:] Really, really good!
[speaker018:] Was it good?
[speaker019:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] Oh! So
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] it was good. Er, she runs the whole of this course, and erm... she's been with the school for years. Erm... this was erm... all about the gypsies wasn't it?
[Sandra:] Mm mm.
[speaker019:] Oh yeah.
[speaker018:] Yes. Ho how do you... well you really sees, seem to have been quite erm, well, was it her approach do you think?
[Sandra:] I think
[speaker019:] Well
[Sandra:] she's so
[speaker018:] Or a
[Sandra:] vivacious about it!
[speaker019:] Oh! So enthusiastic!
[Sandra:] Enthusiastic! [LAUGHTER]
[speaker018:] Enthusiastic?
[speaker019:] really chatty as well.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker018:] Yes. Yes.
[Sandra:] She actually made it interesting, because I think you think, oh dear, gypsies! But yo you couldn't help but take things in.
[speaker018:] Mm. And th th th the er recommended reading side I think.
[Sandra:] That, yeah.
[speaker019:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] I did have... er... upon my door from the last week in last term was a saying... er, you know this one, I don't know if you've had this?
[speaker019:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] Did you get this one last night or did
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker019:] We got it from down there.
[speaker018:] you collect it from round here? Part of the reading.
[speaker019:] Mhm.
[speaker018:] Erm
[Sandra:] She did, by the way, give us next week's as well, so you don't have to
[speaker018:] Oh good!
[Sandra:] put next week's up.
[speaker018:] Yes I thought she probably had. Yeah.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker018:] Erm, the other thing is that in the Nuffield erm... it sometimes... er... er in the, in the book... er list, and sometimes it's in the photocopy books, so you have to check both... and if it's a book that's... been... erm... not come into the library over the last fourteen months you've er, you also need to check the erm... Von Ryan catalogue. It's all a bit complicated! It'll be... be much more straightforward when they've got the whole thing on the computer but... at the moment it's a transitional phase. I went er, in to check whether these were available last week, just to make sure they were available and, they we, they had been reserved last term but I went to check... and, I found so much difficulty finding my way around
[speaker007:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker018:] that I, er, I almost concluded that they weren't there
[speaker019:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker018:] and I couldn't get them... and in the end.
[Sandra:] You feel sympathetic to how
[speaker018:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] we've been all term!
[speaker018:] in the end it turned up
[Sandra:] Because this is how we've
[speaker018:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] on every subject!
[speaker018:] It turns out in the end that, that, all the readings were in there... it's just a matter locating them!
[Sandra:] Finding them. Yeah! [LAUGHTER]... And I was looking out through the door and... you haven't got five minutes longer.
[speaker018:] Yeah. Well this...... reading is actually in, in the corner of the book, you know, so it's in the, the list of books. And it's nineteen eighty three so it should be... it wouldn't on the catalogue yet. Er, but the next week's... reading... erm... with chapter by, er from a book by... Smith... is actually a photocopy so you'd find that in the list of photocopies. So, I'm sorry it's so... complicated... and the final week's reading is also... a book er... erm... the actual book is got rid of that chapter. So er, you better, you'd better check both catalogues... erm catalogue
[Sandra:] [cough]
[speaker018:] to be sure it's there. And if it doesn't seem to be there... ask... Phil... because, you know that... is that only by asking him that I discovered that these worked... last week.
[Sandra:] Aha.
[speaker018:] So... he's that... sort of sma, small bearded chap, of course. I think quite helpful on those.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker019:] Mm.
[Sandra:] He'll probably sa
[speaker019:] What about these essays then?
[Sandra:] ask.
[speaker018:] Cos... he
[speaker019:] I'm so... is this
[Sandra:] Photostat.
[speaker018:] That's a pho, yeah that's a photocopy
[speaker019:] Thank you.
[speaker018:] er... from the work so that you won't find the book in there but you'll find a photocopy of that.... But, but you've just gotta be very persistent and th there are things out now, and locate Phil and he'll... he'll tell you what's.
[speaker019:] I hate that one!
[speaker018:] Do you? Yes it's... much easier. I mean, it's bound to get easier when it's all been fully computerised. At the moment it's all... chaotic and things.
[speaker019:] Excuse me.
[speaker018:] Right, so
[speaker019:] didn't have the requirements and
[speaker018:] what did you learn about gypsies
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker018:] then?
[Sandra:] They've got very definite ideas about their size and... outstanding
[speaker018:] Mm. Mm.
[Sandra:] Mm. Mm.
[speaker019:] Mm.
[speaker018:] Er, certainly are... no gypsies here.
[speaker019:] [LAUGHTER] Yeah [].
[Sandra:] I often wonder you know, whether they don't like your money cos you'd amazed at however much wealth they possess, but if you do get inside... it's amazing the collection that they... that they... round here, they used to collect red glass, and er... Spode
[speaker018:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and they used to be caravan down on Lyme by the park... and
[speaker018:] Mm.
[Sandra:] standing outside it was no different than anything else, but the minute you got inside
[speaker019:] Mm.
[Sandra:] one vase on the ledge would be two, three thousand pounds worth of red glass! Unbelievable!
[speaker019:] they got a..., the
[Sandra:] Th, that is a big family round here isn't it
[speaker019:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] the gypsies?
[speaker019:] Mm.
[speaker018:] That's it.
[speaker019:] And
[Sandra:] There's a family at Stafford as well, they live on part of it and they actually bought a field off... I don't know if you know the bypass at Stafford, the
[speaker018:] Mm mm.
[Sandra:] site?
[speaker018:] Yes.
[Sandra:] And there's a field there, and there's nothing, a couple of ponies in it and a caravan... and when one of those died... is it last year, or the year before there was... one of the biggest funerals ever seen! And they came from abroad... and they had a
[speaker018:] Yes.
[Sandra:] big wake round here for the
[speaker019:] Mm.
[Sandra:] the family.
[speaker018:] Mm. So erm... they're, they're a quite a distinct ethnic group aren't
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker018:] they? Although
[Sandra:] Very!
[speaker018:] they... and er... they've been around for centuries of course but er... erm... there's all sorts of myths about them... some of which are half-truths and some which un-truths. Er... but er... they've not been studied a great deal by
[speaker019:] [cough]... [cough]
[speaker018:] er... in, in this country at any rate. Judith Oakley is er... as you know, is the... was an anthropologist... who, who did do a study... of gypsies. Erm, there's been one or two others, erm... a guy called Thomas who... studied er... gypsies also, and learnt their language, languages, really... erm... a bit before Judith Oakley. But, apart from there's not been a great deal of er... anthropological study of gypsies a as an ethnic group and... you know, studying their... and their relationship with the... the common population. Erm... so it's... in terms of erm... er, careful... logical field work... erm... there's not a great deal of information, but there's,th, there have been early anatomical historical... er investigations and there is something... a literature... erm... dating from early in the nineteenth century which... and it shows you the bloke who... also resolves to, to, to make comparisons... with what she found. Erm... I suppose what we... [clears throat]... ought to... focus on, is not so much the details of... the ethnography... so came up from the study, but erm... but some of them are almost thieves
[Sandra:] [cough]
[speaker018:] which I think... [clears throat]... erm... Sharon was... trying to emphasize... last night. She was looking at the... the question of self-scripture, and she has... as a... a criteria... for differentiation or some, or as you might say boundary marks, it's a question of boundaries between different groups. Erm... quite commonly, gypsies have been defined by... geourgos, it says, by the predominant er... you know, house-growing population. [clears throat]... Erm... how far that actually is accurate... er, designation of them as a... a group, is, is debatable. Certainly, they have their own quite distinct way of other people.
[Sandra:] Did you see that evening about the others what, the so- called Tinkers. Those that aren't true Gypsy or Romany
[speaker019:] Ju just travellers.
[Sandra:] just the, just those that tag round because they've
[speaker019:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] nowhere else to live and
[speaker018:] Well unfortunately
[Sandra:] they frustrate them.
[speaker018:] according to this, these excerpts from... Judith Oakley's book, they're a bit sort of flexible in the definition of these
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker018:] though... depending on who they're talking to, you know. Er, for some purposes... er... other groups are excepted as... as part of the Romany, for all the purposes they're not, but then they said, it depends... if it serves their interest to say we're the true gypsies and they're not
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker018:] then they'll say [LAUGHTER] that []! But, if on the other hand, it serves their interest it serves their interest to see the other group as, as the as themselves [LAUGHTER] they'll say that []!
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] Oh right []!
[speaker018:] So, I mean... th the thing is, they are... erm... they are minority group. Erm... in some ways they're... persecuted bu, but they tend to get pushed around from post to post.
[speaker019:] Mm.
[speaker018:] Erm... but there's a, quite a strong... prejudice against them... from erm... the, the population.
[Sandra:] Not uncalled for
[speaker018:] And certainly
[Sandra:] though in many er
[speaker018:] Pardon?
[Sandra:] not uncalled for though in many respects.
[speaker018:] No. No, I think there's there's reasons
[speaker019:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] for it. Yeah. Certainly reasons for it. But, the thing is that they... their attitude towards... the dominant group... and... their behaviour towards the dominant group is going to be... erm... influenced by how perceive their... like the treatment, so they're quite prepared to change their er erm... the story they present as it was, about themselves to outsiders, depending on how... they see the outsiders erm... as likely to react towards them. If they see, some advantage in putting something in a particular way, they'll do that.
[Sandra:] They'll manipulate the situation.
[speaker018:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker018:] Yeah. Now, this is, to some extent this is... perhaps to be expected of any group which is... erm... which runs the risk of being persecuted and then, they will be
[speaker019:] But they probably persecuting themselves leading the risk.
[speaker018:] Mm.
[speaker019:] And then they control their own power then.
[speaker018:] Mm.
[speaker019:] Unless they.
[speaker018:] Yes. And after,yo, you can se, there's a, there's a clash of, a clash of cultures here
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker018:] isn't there? And I think there's a lot of
[Sandra:] Cos the true gypsies, the true Romany wandering gypsies tend not to settle
[speaker018:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] in that sense, and
[speaker019:] Mm.
[Sandra:] don't actually... make the sort of mess that, what we call gypsies, the tinkers, when they're
[speaker019:] Yeah, but even when they move on
[Sandra:] just the travellers.
[speaker019:] even when they move on they.
[Sandra:] But those are not, I don't think those are the true... gypsies. Those are what we call Tinkers and the Irish call the Diddicois and... the wanderers
[speaker018:] Or
[Sandra:] those are the ones that going away tend to leave.
[speaker018:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] It, it's
[speaker018:] But I think it,th the wa, the way in which... gypsies and geourgos, to use that terminology, interpreted, er interpret the same situation but in, in quite different
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker018:] ways. It's quite illustra, well illustrated in this..., er this... erm extract from... Judith Oakley's book.
[speaker019:] How do you
[speaker018:] Best, it's the idea of dirtiness.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker018:] Erm... gypsies have a complete, er th th they have a very, very different view of what is dirty and what is clean... but it's a very different clean from what, er the general population. And they regard, they regard geourgos as dirty people, just as... [LAUGHTER] typically [], erm... the house- growing population tends to regard them as... di dirty. But... they've got a different perception of dirtiness
[speaker019:] [cough]
[speaker018:] which is... which involves ideas of ritual purity... and impurity. A bit similar to some of the, the... I think in in, in a lo, attitudes towards other. Erm... er... but some high cast Hindus, for instance, will not eat food... which... which has had a shadow of another person
[speaker019:] [cough]
[speaker018:] cast over them. Well gypsies... the, the gypsies
[Sandra:] [cough]
[speaker018:] they refuse to eat erm... while a, while another person's shadow has fallen on them, especially if the other person is a
[speaker019:] [cough]
[speaker018:] ritually unclean person, namely, one of us. [LAUGHTER]... Erm
[speaker019:] How did erm, Judith Oakley?
[speaker018:] I, I don't know. I haven't actually read the whole book, and er and whole of that er... and... obviously pa, this is part expla, observation
[speaker019:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] which
[speaker019:] She must have really wanted to.
[speaker018:] And er... sa, getting an appropriate way in, to something like that is, one of the main problems of that.
[speaker019:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] Erm, how she did it, I'm not sure.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker018:] Perhaps you could ask er... Sharon but... she's a. And tha, that is invariably a problem. If you were going to do, if you decided you wanted to do research on gypsies... and, you yourself, a lot of gypsies... er, and you decide th the best way to do it is to... which gives a kind of subjective insight to their own lifestyle and thinking. Then, it, it's immediately a problem, how do we get in, we've got to have some kind of role which is acceptable... to the people you're studying.
[speaker019:] Mm. again I mean, because there's always a load of
[speaker018:] Well that's right.
[speaker019:] isn't
[speaker018:] Yes.
[speaker019:] there?
[speaker018:] Yeah.
[speaker019:] I mean
[speaker018:] But one thing about partic, observation is, that is involves... actually living with the people you're studying for a fair amount of time is
[speaker019:] Mm.
[speaker018:] traditionally
[speaker019:] Mm.
[speaker018:] be developed by... people who go to study childhood societies over the other side of the world... and er... you know, you stayed there, several months or a year or two, so it's not just for a... a brief visit. So, erm... you really live
[Sandra:] Who finances this sort of?
[speaker018:] Pardon?
[Sandra:] Who finances it?
[speaker018:] Oh! [cough]... Well, I suppose that erm
[speaker019:] [cough]
[speaker018:] erm, organizations like the Economic and Social Research
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker018:] Council, although, the amount of money they give for this kind of research is pretty... sparse! Erm... but... if you don't get a grant you, you do it on the side out of, you know, in... location
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker018:] using your own salary as it were. But to erm... get it left in terms of reputation... royalties on your books, and things like that.... Anything that... er... legally fundable erm... will have to be done and published..., which may be that.... So what I was gonna say was, that, that partic,partic er... participant observations typically involves actually living with the, the study for a fair amount of time, so... erm... although they might tell you a pack of lies initially... you can actually observe what they're like, what they do and see whether they fit what they've said and... as time goes on you ha hope to develop some kind of rapport with them so that they might... totally understand. Sa so, in time you hope to get sufficiently accepted... erm... to be told the truth or in fact, a bit nearer the truth. You can never be quite sure actually! But, there are ways of... checking,yo you can... you can, obviously compare... words and then perhaps you can... er invariably time about the situations and draw your own conclusions as to whether they were telling you a lie... earlier on. And... there's lies and lies, [LAUGHTER] as well aren't there []? Er... people make up... deliberately... to be telling you lies but they still, in some sense, trying to give you a favoured view...... which is a... out and out lie. So this is one of the regular problems you've got... and er... erm... it's not a kind of strictly scientific detective way of studying gypsies... er... but it, a bit of which, which gets... rich material, er yo you get into the... the actual way of thinking of the people you're studying. To a great extent rather than a... a formal interview. So... there are problems,i it's it's quite, it's rather, there's two criteria which are obviously applied to this, as a research methods, one is validity, and one being reliability. Validity means... you're actually getting what you think you're getting. which... er.... Reliability is much to, much more to do with... replicability, it's, it's another... if another researcher went in and did it the same way, would they get the same results? Well, usually with this sort of, with the replicability, or reliability is pretty low. But validity can be quite hard with this sort of er... because there's, there's detailed ways of and cross checking. Er... and erm... it's difficult for people to maintain...... er not only as I say, but in their lifestyle over a particular period of time, so... you could be more likely to get at the truth... by this method, than by sending out questionnaires. Imagine [LAUGHTER] the []... er as an alternative method, you send out questionnaires to a set of gypsies
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker018:] would you get any replies at all?
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker019:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] You'd probably the D H S S
[speaker018:] You might.
[Sandra:] then!
[speaker019:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker018:] Well with that, immediately you're gonna be suspicious
[Sandra:] Yeah I know.
[speaker018:] of, I don't know what they're called, but
[Sandra:] Oh!
[speaker018:] erm... er, from the, probably that would be a non-starter as a research then wouldn't it?... But even if you went in as researcher who's going to interview them, and a, and informal way... which might be a more appropriate method, you'd still have considerable difficulty in... that there is, they'll spin you a yarn... and whatnot, you know... what they wanted you think rather than what... what they should. But participant observation you stand the best chance really... of being able to check... the accuracy of what,th they're telling you in terms of behaviour and wha, and what people say, and what different people say in those situations over the, so... you know. Validity is quite high. A lot depends on the personality and style of the researcher, whether they're er... how they're planning to... how they relate to people. So obviously... one researcher a very different er... from what another person
[speaker019:] Oh!
[speaker018:] would get doing, researching the same people. So... er... what they get, what one person gets may well be true but it'll... won't be the whole truth. Er, another bit of the truth might be got [LAUGHTER] by another researcher [] and er... so... there will be differences in what two researchers, using the same method, would get. So, so a low, low reliability and type of researcher. It's qualitative rather than quantitative.... And... and it lends itself to interpretive kind of approach rather than a... politics sort of approach which... tends to be. Er, the purpose of this sort of research is to understand... the context of meaning in people's minds wi with, in terms of they do. Er... erm... and that is typical of anthropologists. Erm this sort... this sor, this sort of method was pioneered by... particularly by... erm... somebody called Malonovski Er that's er... the British Academic, but obviously Polish.... Th the research in
[speaker019:] [cough]
[speaker018:] round about the first world war time, he used this sort of... sort of pitching his tent up to the... and staying there and learning their language and... observing their rituals, getting to know them. And er... prior to that, researchers had relied on... from missionaries,, administrators and... travellers and so on, which... er... mixed quality. And... this method of actually going there... living with them, learning their language... and er so on s,... really participating... er... would, finally there's a way of actually... in a sense, getting of the people, the nearer you can, anyway, of course, it's relying on the people you stay with... that you understand that something of the world comes over onto you... so that imposing... what's essential in... and... So, here what Judith Oakley's trying to do, is trying to understand... how... gypsies, themselves, differentiate, how do they define the boundaries between themselves and others. Erm... er... and... erm... two of the main er... things, I mean, there's, there's ob, obviously erm the things like er... they definitely. But, erm... in terms of more subjective er..., is er, the two, two particular... features which... are important, one is descent, how they reckon they descent. They reckon... a true gypsy must have at least one true gypsy parent... erm... it's quite possible, er the the there's a fair amount of inter-marriage, you might be surprised [LAUGHTER] to learn []! But the gypsies and geourgos... but er a lot of gypsies have got one geourgo parent... but, they would reckon that there must be some sort of descent, er... er erm... that, where they're aware of... to qua, to... qualify as a gypsy. So wo, one parent that must have a been gypsy or both. Er... but, how they reckon descent is variable. This is one of the perhaps..., it's not some kind of calculated thing, it depends on the circumstances. Erm... er, and I think that was brought out fairly well in the.... Th the variability on how they reckon descent in that sort of life. The other major seems to be, to do with ideas about... what we would qualify, but could equally well be called ritual purity and impurity.... And er... she contrasts what... erm... except in official reports... gypsy camp sites... er...... er... sort of say they're dirty and, terribly dirty er... paint of picture of erm... people with no civilized standards or er... er, that's er, the geourgo view of it. Erm... it, and as they sa, and as she says this tends to be er... a description of a gypsy camps campsite... which looks at the external surroundings of the caravans, but it doesn't actually look inside the caravan. Er... if they did they'd find erm... quite... spotlessly clean interiors of the caravans... but, in an area where... there's all sorts of that... a few yards away and... quite carelessly dumped and left around. Er... th th the the geourgo or, you know official view is... that they're dirty because they never... and er, they leave scrap metal around and... everything... and all kind of things. But, from one point, from that point of view it's quite true, I mean,i i if you define dirtiness in those terms, then they're dirty. But, er the gypsies
[speaker019:] [cough]
[speaker018:] define dirty in sort of quite different way. They haven't got this conception of... that, that the inside and the outside of the body... and what's important is to keep the inside clean... and so, this is extended also to... the... caravans.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker018:] Er the... er... the insides have got to be kept clean... it doesn't [LAUGHTER] about [] the surroundings are dirty so... you know, it's quite okay to... you know, throw your half-eaten bread out! So if you'd like to... if you let me. Erm... it's it's quite an elaborate erm... set of beliefs about... the, you know
[Sandra:] [cough]
[speaker018:] the dirty. Erm... they regard the inside of the body as, as pure and to, and and essentially to be kept clean, but the outside... is essentially unclean, say, you could have a dirty, dirty clothes but you're clean inside is the.
[Sandra:] I wonder they view erm...?
[speaker018:] Oh!
[speaker007:] So what was this play then? Puppet show?
[speaker010:] About... the green knight.
[Sandra:] The green knight?
[speaker010:] Yeah.... You know, a knight.
[Sandra:] Was he just called the green night or did
[speaker010:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] he have a name?
[speaker010:] Just the green knight he was called, cos he was green.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker010:] And then there was this he sa... the green knight said I... am I having some chocolate? An an we one o, will one of the knights... chopped
[Sandra:] Chopped off my head. That's the story I was thinking you were doing it today... erm... it's called the green knight, but he has a name doesn't he?
[speaker010:] Er,
[Sandra:] And he gives them... er, a magic
[speaker010:] Yeah! The three things
[Sandra:] He gives three things that'll help him. I tho, isn't one a magic belt or something?
[speaker010:] Yeah a belt is what they [door bell] I was about to say the magic belt.
[Sandra:] Oh! Oh I bet you timed that for tea time!
[speaker007:] What's he done to er.
[Sandra:] It's tea time just.
[speaker007:] For what?
[Sandra:] Well I'm going out later.
[speaker007:] Oh! Yeah!
[Sandra:] Yes.
[speaker007:] I'll come back tomorrow night.
[Sandra:] Alright then.
[speaker007:] Sandra I er... get that.
[Sandra:] Okay. Hang on.
[speaker016:] No it's not mine. What's it for?... Going out.
[Sandra:] Well I'm going out too.
[speaker016:] What as he done till now?
[Sandra:] Well I, he'll go back and find another door er, er back up to where he lives.
[speaker016:] business.
[Sandra:] Have you? Thanks a lot!... You always seem to want a curry.
[speaker010:] Who's?
[Sandra:] Dad did!
[speaker010:] Dad did. His dinner'll be cold.
[Sandra:] So what happened to the green giant in the end?
[speaker010:] Well
[Sandra:] The green knight.
[speaker010:] All that happens right... the... the other knight... er is...... and the green knight ran off and discovered that he didn't, you know the rest.
[Sandra:] He did initially, and I said him back.
[speaker016:] You shouldn't! Have they been in there? Has it been in there with the books?
[Sandra:] No, I didn't get that far.
[speaker016:] It's in the other room.
[Sandra:] No, he only got this far.
[speaker016:] Dog shite... everywhere! Get some, smell it!
[Sandra:] No I don't want
[speaker016:] Then
[Sandra:] to! I'm having my tea! I'm not surprised because every time
[speaker016:] everybody won't put their foot down, the only one in this house to put their foot down, is me!
[Sandra:] Every time
[speaker016:] And I'm not
[Sandra:] you come in,a... listen! It was across the before I could shout and say come back.
[speaker016:] No one! It's only me! No one! Which way did he come in?
[Sandra:] Back door. It don't matter!
[speaker010:] [whispering] It does! Cos it means I put it up there [].
[Sandra:] Well I'm sorry but
[speaker010:] But look!
[speaker016:] I want to I want to
[speaker010:] Look!
[Sandra:] Don't you worry about it!
[speaker010:] [whispering] [].
[speaker016:] Only cos they haven't checked round the.
[speaker010:] Mm.
[speaker016:] See, the last one in here you was already in.... Dog shite! I haven't seen fucking all like that!
[speaker010:] Cleaned up all the time.
[speaker016:] Has he, has he walked through this carpet John?
[Sandra:] He's walked across as far as this middle door.... Ye, I know!
[speaker016:] You already found out?
[Sandra:] Will I have to swear!
[speaker016:] [sigh]... Why have a dog? At least I know.
[speaker010:] I've finished!
[Sandra:] Beans! Come on! Er... I'll pick them out.
[speaker010:] I don't... want them!
[Sandra:] Well I'm sure he doesn't go on his own a, with shoes on like that!
[speaker010:] Well you haven't given us our.
[Sandra:] I don't care!
[speaker016:] Well I don't like that. Fuck! You'll never get that stain up!
[speaker010:] Of course, your dinner's going cold.
[speaker016:] Have you been in the other room John with this?
[speaker010:] No!
[Sandra:] I don't think, I shou, I shouted here.
[speaker010:] No! Here, then stop.
[Sandra:] About here? He got up to as far as the doorway, but I don't think any further.
[speaker010:] No he didn't. He... then we went off playing! Dad! Don't! Will you stop that!
[speaker016:] Then all round here?
[Sandra:] Then as far as, no
[speaker010:] No!
[Sandra:] love. Just got as far as the door.
[speaker016:] Right.
[speaker010:] Urgh! Urgh!
[speaker016:] Just from out the pond?... There's only one putting their foot down in this house!... Don't care whether they're big or small! Come out the way........ Urgh!
[Sandra:] Oh! What a good boy!
[Marg:] So the, you know that thing I was showing you about,th finding them bones the other night?
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker016:] Did I put the thing in my pocket afterward?... It doesn't matter anyhow. And I
[Sandra:] Well
[speaker016:] was, I knew that they were
[Sandra:] they might be still in here.
[speaker016:] I knew that they'd still written me a, a second letter, like asking permission to send it through the erm... what do you call it?... Er... cos I owed the.
[speaker010:] [belch]
[Sandra:] Pardon!... Come and have your tea first Hary.
[speaker016:] Them two are no good?
[speaker010:] [belch]
[Sandra:] No. They're not, so, I don't know what you've got papers with this for?
[speaker016:] Aha.... Well Mike gives his permission so
[Sandra:] Yeah, well I don't know, that's what I said, I don't know why you've got
[speaker016:] John, look!
[Sandra:] it.
[speaker016:] Remember that thing I told you about the bones the other night?
[speaker010:] Yeah.
[speaker016:] I said there were the... that county record form and this man asked me from the museum that handled it... if he could send them back to erm... to Wiltshire.
[speaker010:] Why, was it er found? Oh!
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] No, it's not been found before.
[speaker016:] So they're being sent back... and he said there was a county record found.
[Sandra:] You shouldn't ask Jonathan. Jonathan couldn't persuade him.
[speaker016:] Who's that?
[speaker010:] I want,ca, I wanna ta
[Sandra:] Jonathan!
[speaker010:] take one of these?
[Sandra:] At mother's, you know? David.
[speaker016:] Ah! That's right.
[speaker010:] Mum, I wanted to take one of these to school and
[speaker016:] Aye. I don't think
[Sandra:] Did you?
[speaker016:] it's feasible cos they got
[speaker010:] Mum! You could have told me!
[Sandra:] [sighing] Oh []!... What did you do with the dog then? [talking from other room]
[speaker010:] What?
[Sandra:] Are you feeding him on?
[speaker010:] No.
[Sandra:] Oh! I bet you've studied about every pile of dog muck!
[speaker010:] ... Is he back yet?
[Sandra:] No.... Seen the headlines here?... Asda's sixty five million pound losses.
[speaker016:] Who?
[Sandra:] Asda.
[speaker016:] Well a bunch of the others too were down at. Mm?
[Sandra:] [reading newspaper] Three hundred and fifty redundancies at head office. Twenty million written off... for launch of the new distribution system [].
[speaker016:] Well... just goes to show you! They're depending upon... you and me and other people aren't they?
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker016:] That's who, in fact, they're living off. Yes? And they get to keep putting up bloody prices like they're living on, on on people! On the poor! You're giving it all to their profit. Right?
[Sandra:] Mhm.
[speaker016:] Mm?
[Sandra:] Mhm.
[speaker016:] Has to be improved, like isn't it? I always knew that! I could have done a little the papers let them off of the hook for years!
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker016:] Sainsburys is er... the very one that has done it for years! And I'm sure Tescos, and have been here the longest
[Sandra:] Mm!
[speaker016:] ge, and not the new firms have started that.
[Sandra:] Seen this? [reading newspaper] Brian created a piece of history when he invited his former teacher... to a special church service. V I P guest was Roman Catholic... leader Cardinal Basil Hume [].
[speaker016:] They're not on about again. I can't... get away from it!
[Sandra:] No. His name John. Sheriff.
[speaker016:] Oh where are they?
[Sandra:] Staffordshire.
[speaker016:] What's this for?
[Sandra:] [reading] Former pupil at Ampleforth College in Yorkshire [].
[speaker016:] Yeah?
[Sandra:] Where Cardinal Hume was his housemaster.
[speaker016:] Yeah?
[Sandra:] And he was appointed the county's high sheriff, he decided to invite his ex-teacher to attend the traditional church service... to mark the opening of high court session. [reading] The service at St. Mary's
[speaker016:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and the tenth centre was attended by civic dignitaries [].
[speaker016:] St. Mary's?
[Sandra:] It's the church that's in... in the middle of the shopping... you know, it's got all the grass round it. Well tha, that's the county... chur, that's the town of the... like St. Giles is here, is the town's church... well St. Mary's is the town's,o all the se service is to do with civic dignit, dignitaries... and to mark the opening of... courts is always held at St. Mary's.... They said it's, [reading newspaper] he is the first Cardinal for hundreds of years to visit St. Mary's [].... Mm!... Do want some more?
[speaker007:] Do you want that warming up?
[speaker016:] Ah! It'll be alright.
[Sandra:] Well it won't because it's gone cold! Let me, give it two minutes in the microwave. Co co cold!
[speaker016:] Ah dear!
[Sandra:] Some sauce here if you want it.
[speaker016:] So the stores are letting off work for us then, are they?
[Sandra:] I don't even know whether they let them off at the head office.
[speaker016:] Oh, the head office.
[Sandra:] No you don't!
[speaker010:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker016:] I'll come upstairs with you. In just one minute.... Okay. What? Your trousers are falling off.
[Sandra:] He'll come back in a minute. I'll pull them up when he comes back.
[speaker007:] Oh! Comet opening at Festival Park!
[speaker016:] Mm. Mm?
[Sandra:] Comet are opening at Festival Park.
[speaker016:] Mhm.... Mm?
[Sandra:] Well!
[speaker016:] They sure.
[Sandra:] Well see! I can't see them keeping two stores on.
[speaker016:] Not in the recession.
[Sandra:] But they're looking for more erm... sales staff!... See in here. Full time and part time, seven days a week.... So they're gonna take you on now on the basis that you work seven days a week.
[speaker016:] Who's that?
[Sandra:] Comet!... Says full time and part-time seven days a week.... [reading newspaper] Sales assistant, part-time. Part-time job that offers the flexibility you've been looking for. Day's, evening, or weekends []. It says, or weekends, so... I wonder whether they'll stick to er... giving you the chance of not working.
[speaker016:] That'll. It's a job though. Worker exploitation! Or... they don't work Sundays they're to lose their job! Or.
[Sandra:] Well if they take you on on the basis that you don't have to work Sundays, they can't change the regulations when you're working.
[speaker016:] Mm mm. I
[Sandra:] But
[speaker016:] don't think that
[Sandra:] one wonders whether you're forced into signing, that if needed, you'll
[speaker016:] Ah!
[Sandra:] work.
[speaker016:] That's it! Yeah.... They might be moving into a premises that's already er, there... now.
[Sandra:] Mm mm.
[speaker016:] Right? And that's the case... they're not gonna mo, they'll take the next twelve months to put... er a free run in there for twelve months. They make that much in twelve months! Even if it falls down after that, they're alright. Right? That's what.... They've got their heads screwed on! Did you get back that letter?
[Sandra:] What letter? Ye oh yeah!
[speaker016:] Did you?
[Sandra:] Yeah. It's in the kitchen cupboard.
[speaker016:] I mean, the bottom there cupboard.
[Sandra:] It's in the kitchen cupboard.
[speaker016:] Is it all, the whole thing is back.
[Sandra:] She sounds as if they're back together again even.
[speaker016:] There's a little slip at the bottom.
[Sandra:] She Sellotaped it back on.
[speaker016:] And erm... bottom draw of the... where?
[Sandra:] I would have thought they'd have been in touch about extending the guarantee through you.
[speaker016:] No lunch or nothing.
[Sandra:] You'll wear it out!
[speaker016:] Mm?
[Sandra:] You will try.
[speaker016:] What time is it now?
[Sandra:] Four fifty.
[speaker016:] What time?
[Sandra:] T T F A.
[speaker016:] Mm? T T F A.
[Sandra:] Mm mm.... That was where the phone call was from. The woman that's the secretary.
[speaker016:] Mhm. Yeah.
[Sandra:] Although I... I don't exactly belong to it any more, but I said I'd go down.
[speaker016:] Oh!
[Sandra:] They wanted some in, well she was after information.
[speaker016:] Mm mm!
[Sandra:] Cos she didn't realise I'd be going down.
[Marg:] So you're quite sure he hasn't gone in the other rooms then?
[Sandra:] I don't think he got that far. I shouted i I was busy on the
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] phone... and I undid the door
[speaker016:] Mhm.
[Sandra:] and I turned round and shouted. You seen what's on tonight?
[speaker016:] No.
[Sandra:] Nine o'clock. Repeated. [reading newspaper] Powerful drama about the political turmoil in Ireland during the twenties when the British Prime Minister Lloyd George met with... Michael Collins and Eamon de Valera... leaders of Sinn Fein.... No?
[speaker016:] No.
[Sandra:] It's on till ten and then it's on after the news, for another hour. It's on for two hours.... Oh!... I bought you a leaflet.
[speaker016:] Mm.
[Sandra:] [humming]
[speaker016:] Well that's if you're o, you're on about erm... this Father Phil, you didn't mention anything....
[Sandra:] About what? Just said I met him.
[speaker016:] Yeah?
[Sandra:] I only said hello to him.
[speaker016:] Who else has met him?
[Sandra:] I told you, I was... it was only the man who looks after the buildings. He's like a... porter, caretaker.
[speaker016:] Mhm.
[Sandra:] He knows who's coming, who's going and... who's due to use the place.... He happened to come in... on
[speaker016:] Are you allowed to go in there?
[Sandra:] Oh yeah! Co th... we go in there and sit and study because... they've got a kettle and coffee and tea, just help yourself when you cup of tea. Take some coffee up, or tea up and leave it there and... in payment for the drinks that you've had.
[speaker016:] And he lives there does he??
[Sandra:] He lives somewhere up... at Keele but
[speaker016:] Aye.
[Sandra:] I don't know whether he lives on campus or in the village.
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I think it's in the village.
[speaker016:] Is he permanently attached to there?
[Sandra:] Oh yes! Permanent.
[speaker016:] So he must every morning.?
[Sandra:] I don't think it's... every day though... actually in the chapel, I think it's down at where he lives.
[speaker016:] Cos he'll have to say mass somewhere every day
[Sandra:] But I think it's where he lives. Not, not... there is a side chapel there, the east chapel and that's the catholic chapel but it's also used by the non- catholic group. And they have united services and then split part way through. They have a lot of united services, and then when it comes to... communion... they segregate and then join again. But I do know that he, where he lives, I'm sure I've seen it written that where he lives... he has... services there. Doesn't give his address, it just gives his phone number.
[speaker016:] Mhm.
[Sandra:] But that's what you check.
[speaker016:] Ah but it doesn't say there, it doesn't.
[Sandra:] Well when it does ste, it, you can fill that in and send it to them and then they phone. And you can sort of join in the... the church group. And it sort of lets them know who you belong to. That's the people who I would think more probable for those who are living... on campus.
[speaker016:] There's the free church, Anglican... Associated Anglican.... But you will let them know that you're there like and I mean that
[Sandra:] No, because I have a parish of my own.
[speaker016:] No, but it would be nice because it's an extra one on the list.
[Sandra:] Well i
[speaker016:] You boost up. You are a catholic you should be able to.
[Sandra:] I, he he said that but I
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Yeah. It's no for... if you're going to be there all the time, that they know where you are and where they can contact you.
[speaker016:] Yeah, but it's nice to boost up the list
[Sandra:] Well
[speaker016:] because they might have only a few, whereas the others have got thousands on them. Right?
[Sandra:] Well the
[speaker016:] Er
[Sandra:] last time I
[speaker016:] and Father... does he, does he know that you are a catholic?
[Sandra:] Oh, the other chappie who was there, he knows. Actually, he, he knows that... Paul the bloke who looks after the place he goes to St. Andrews.
[speaker016:] Ah! That's the
[Sandra:] And er
[speaker016:] Church of England isn't it?
[Sandra:] And he ac
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] he actually told, said to him when he came in, he said, oh he is one of your flock! So he came in and he... he said this is... Father and I said, oh are you better?
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] And he looked, I said well... I knew you'd been ill.
[speaker016:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] And I I explained, like, I said... where I lived like, and he said ooh I stayed there convalescing at. I said yes I know you did. Erm... and I just said, I said I used to housekeep there and at Nutton Oh! Did you? And I sa, I was telling him, I said, cos I fo, I'm sure he... I'm sure he met Father Tom.
[speaker016:] Oh I do, I'm not sure he has yet... in London.
[Sandra:] No, they used to meet up.
[speaker016:] Yeah?
[Sandra:] Because... actually... the village of Keele... would be under Nutton... It's only the University that he's got... under his chaplaincy.
[speaker016:] Oh!
[Sandra:] The village would come under Nutton
[speaker016:] Maybe.
[Sandra:] So they cross paths slightly
[speaker016:] Ah yeah.
[Sandra:] in that sense. So they had met up.
[speaker016:] But it would all come under... Newcastle really, because it was a parish.
[Sandra:] Oh yes! It it would all come
[speaker016:] It's the parish, yeah.
[Sandra:] under the er
[speaker016:] It's just a matter of er
[Sandra:] the area.
[speaker016:] what do you call it? Always was. Even Woolstaton was up to the
[Sandra:] But I mean if you count how many people were there when I went to mass when it was... a holy day. Erm... how many thousands are up there, and of those thousands, how many mu, how many hundreds must be Catholic?
[speaker016:] I don't know. How many were there there?
[Sandra:] Well I don't know. Actually who stayed for mass... there was only about thirty.
[speaker016:] And the catholic too?
[Sandra:] Yeah.... They have their own choral society the Catholic church, and the Anglican church do. But you got a chaplain, the erm... the chaplaincy of Keele, so it's like a united one, they have their own... choir, but the kee, the catholic one also have theirs.
[speaker010:] Yeah.
[speaker016:] [sigh]
[Sandra:] A, oh dear!
[speaker016:] What age is Father?
[Sandra:] About he's, I would say he's in his mid-sixties.
[speaker016:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Possibly slightly older.... They in there?... It's when they broke into er... near.... Between... the day after New Year and Sunday... stole a video recorder. Mm!
[speaker016:] Mm!
[speaker010:] Mum!
[Sandra:] What?
[speaker010:] Do you know where my is?
[Sandra:] No.
[speaker010:] It is! You can carry that out!
[speaker016:] What's that about res, wiring cables? What's that about?
[Sandra:] They've got er... a deal with Toyota for producing er... parts.
[speaker016:] Oh yeah!
[speaker010:] Stevie! You can carry my game on. Yeah.
[speaker016:] Where are you going?
[speaker010:] I don't really know.
[speaker016:] Mm? Matthew alright?
[speaker010:] Yeah.
[speaker016:] Is his trousers fallen down?
[speaker010:] Mum!
[Sandra:] Darling!
[speaker010:] Guess what I want for next year?
[Sandra:] Ah! What do you mean next year? We've only just started this year!
[speaker010:] This year! Mum?
[Sandra:] What?
[speaker010:] Well it costs a lot, and I don't know what... you will buy Saturday. But... it costs about... three hundred pounds.
[Sandra:] You can't have it!
[speaker010:] Why?
[Sandra:] Well, you've just said a word, it costs three hundred pounds!
[speaker010:] Anthony had one!
[Sandra:] His didn't cost that much!
[speaker010:] How much?
[Sandra:] I'm not telling you! But it didn't cost that much.
[speaker010:] But... you know se, I'll, anyway I wanted the same as yours.
[Sandra:] Well I suggest that between now and the next er... Christmas er, day you decide
[speaker010:] But mum
[Sandra:] to er
[speaker010:] what are my chances?
[Sandra:] Well you'll just have to wait and see!... You think it's Christmas every day!
[speaker010:] I do!
[Sandra:] Yeah, well
[speaker010:] Do know where my bus is then?
[Sandra:] Alex
[Alex:] What?
[Sandra:] Will you come and set the table for me.
[Simon:] Ner ner... [computer game]
[Sandra:] See the knives and forks there.
[Alex:] He said ner ner.
[Sandra:] He said ner ner? What does that mean?
[Alex:] I don't, ner ner,
[Sandra:] erm I think it means... yes mother dear.
[Alex:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I thought he did. Right then....
[Alex:] ... Can we have
[Sandra:] No I should leave that there so you don't get burnt....
[Simon:] No.
[Alex:] my go.
[Simon:] It isn't cos you had another go....
[Alex:] No I did not.
[Simon:] Right! Right I'm gonna try and make [whispering] [].... [shouting] Alex quick []!... I made it past that
[Alex:] [crying]
[Simon:] I made it past... I made it past there...
[Alex:] [shouting] []
[Simon:] Look where I am now then.... [playing on computer] Oh I shouldn't have gone on to you last time, that is where the mistake comes.... Ha!... Oh!... Ooh I've just got that...
[Alex:] Mum
[Sandra:] Yes?
[Alex:] I think I need another fork.
[Sandra:] Well has that one not been on the floor?
[Alex:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Well just wipe it, it doesn't matter, just wipe it on this towel....
[Alex:] What towel?
[Sandra:] Wipe it on this towel.... There you go.... my place... I don't mind put it in my place.
[Alex:] ?
[Sandra:] No, now go and put it my place, that's alright, now off you go.
[Alex:] Well you haven't got a... knife.
[Sandra:] I expect I'll survive it somehow....
[Alex:] Ooh Sandra hasn't got a knife.... Oh Simon have you died yet?
[Simon:] No.... I haven't actually....
[Alex:] Tell me you're kidding!
[Simon:] I haven't.... Right.
[Alex:] ... ha! Don't know what you're doing do you?
[Simon:] I've got there.... Look at where I am now.... I'll go... Ah! I'm back here again!
[Alex:] You've gone back home.
[Simon:] At the gate!
[Alex:] go back home
[Simon:] I wonder how I got here.... I'll go back there. I have to.
[Sandra:] Okay boys, dinner's done....
[Simon:] Ha!... I'm dead...
[Sandra:] Do you want gravy?
[Alex:] What?
[Sandra:] Do you want gravy?
[Alex:] Yeah, yeah I'm just going to drink my drink. I don't like gravy.
[Sandra:] It's gravy based on chicken.
[Alex:] Is it the normal one though?...
[Sandra:] It's the normal one that we have but it's a bit thinner....
[Simon:] Oh, bit hard carrying the dinner and this at the same time.
[Sandra:] Can you manage?
[Simon:] Yeah. I, I'm gonna get a piece of bread.
[Alex:] Where's a fork?
[Simon:] Do you want a piece of bread anyone?
[speaker007:] You need a
[Alex:] [shouting] Yeah []
[Sandra:] Give Alex a piece of bread. Erm
[Alex:] Mum I think I need... a bit more on my carrots.
[Sandra:] A bit more what?
[Alex:] But... I think er no I think I need a knife.... I think I need a fork.
[Sandra:] fingers.
[Alex:] Ow!
[Sandra:] Do you want some more gravy?... On your carrots?
[Alex:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] There you go then. There you go then Simon's gonna bring you some bread and then you can dip it up.... [singing] []
[Simon:] What? Remember what they used to say at Pontins. Do you remember that?
[Sandra:] What did they use to say at Pontins?
[Simon:] Remember?...
[Sandra:] Oompah oompah stick it up your jumper?
[Simon:] Yes.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Simon:] Mm something else.... They used to say that didn't they?
[Sandra:] What was the other thing?
[Simon:] I can't remember.
[Sandra:] No I can't remember either. Have you got some bread for Alex?
[Simon:] Oh... forgotten.
[Alex:] Was it oompah doompah dingley doompah?
[Sandra:] No, that's what they sing
[Simon:] [shouting] Erm Alex []
[Alex:] [shouting] What []?
[Simon:] Oh, oh, alright. I thought, right, this pa this bread's empty, you'll have to have the
[Alex:] [crying] I don't want the crumbs []...
[Simon:] I've cut it so you can't have any What?...
[Alex:] Hey I've only got one carrot left....
[Simon:] I'm eating my chicken first.
[Alex:] I'm eating my first.
[Sandra:] There you go, there's your bread. Goodness you're eating that fast int you?
[Simon:] carrots yeah.
[Alex:] [whingeing] []
[Sandra:] No that's a piece, that's a sandwich piece,... watch that programme?
[Simon:] Erm and played games. We played this thing called Octopus.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[Simon:] Well one, one person is the octopus... but you have to... like... mm then she had to, this person has to try and tick everybody... and
[Sandra:] And kick everybody?
[Simon:] Tick everybody
[Sandra:] Oh tick everybody.
[Simon:] bu and when you it you have to stand in one place going like that and being, and if you touch anybody else and do that and try and get all the people.
[Sandra:] Can you move your feet?
[Simon:] No. You can
[Alex:] D d they get
[Sandra:] People run around you and past you do they?
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Alex:] Simon did they get you?
[Simon:] . Yeah they got me and I had to turn into one of them octopus things.
[Sandra:] And then you can get changed back to normal?
[Simon:] No... you can't get...
[Sandra:] But till everybody, does that, does it carry on like that until everybody's
[Simon:] Mm.
[Sandra:] turned into an octopus?... And what else do you play?...
[Simon:] Erm... there is one called erm Dracula. like... like one person is chosen and some... and one of chooses somebody to say someone's name and that, and the Dracula has to go towards that person but if that person says someone's else's name before you get them
[Sandra:] Yeah?
[Simon:] they... that has to go over to there, so
[Sandra:] Instead.
[Simon:] [talking with mouth full]...
[Sandra:] And who was there, was Daniel there?
[Simon:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And Jesse?
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] And Rachel.
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] And you.... Was some, did you say there's some boys from your school gone?
[Simon:] No one of them, one
[Sandra:] Who's that? What's his name?
[Simon:] Mm dunno.
[Alex:] Jesse?
[Sandra:] No, we know Jesse. And who runs it? Who's in charge?
[Alex:] Jesse?
[Garry:] Erm
[Sandra:] No.... Was it a friend of Barbara's?
[Simon:] I think so....
[Sandra:] Is it a lady that's,ar are there ladies that aren't an aren't friends of Barbara's? Most of them aren't they?
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] And did you find out what you do next week?
[Simon:] No, you don't know what you're doing next week.
[Sandra:] Oh. Could always ask... then you'd know.... And what time are you going to the pantomime tomorrow?... Do you know?
[Simon:] Erm... It doesn't matter cos when you're going now.
[Sandra:] Oh right.?
[Simon:] What can I take?...
[Sandra:] Well you were going to take a satsuma and some Quavers weren't you?
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] We haven't got a satsuma, what about a pear, packet of Quavers and a pear?... Do you like pears or
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] find a packet of Quavers somewhere there....
[Alex:] Can I go?...
[Sandra:] No they won't let you go, you'll be able to go next year with your school. You know when you, you only just started your school didn't you after Christmas?
[Alex:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Well they'd already been to the pantomime at your school so you'll have to wait till next year now.... You'll be a bit bigger then....
[Simon:] Mum, will it be like that Cinderella didn't stick to the story?
[Sandra:] Er yeah, pantomime's usually are like that. If you go to the New Vic you'll find a pantomime probably sticks, really sticks to a traditional story. And they don't shout things like oh yes you are and oh you're not and oh yes you have and oh no you haven't.... But this' ll be do you remember the one we went to the other day?
[Alex:] Like
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] They sometimes say rude things and that don't they?
[Simon:] Yeah
[Alex:] Like hello I'm posh.
[Sandra:] And then somebody'll sing some song that's completely unrelated to it
[Simon:] Mm like
[Sandra:] What were they singing? [singing] dee dum, dee dum dee dum dee dum []...
[Alex:] Oh do you know what we sung today? We sung [singing] all things bright and beautiful []
[Simon:] [singing] all creatures great and small, all things wise and wo wonderful, the lord God gave them all. He made their blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah. He made their glowing colours he made their tiny wings []
[Sandra:] [singing] glowing colours he made their tiny wings []...
[Simon:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Good job you have a hymn book....
[Simon:] Yeah you can't remember all the words.
[Sandra:] would you?
[Alex:] What?
[Sandra:] Well daddy was to have been with us for this wasn't he, for this meal?
[Alex:] Da we've got a hymn book.
[Sandra:] Have you?
[Alex:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Does it say... School Praise on it?
[Simon:] The state of some of the hymn books at our school.
[Sandra:] That's cos children have them.
[Simon:] Have you seen them?
[Sandra:] No,wh what's wrong with them?
[Simon:] Darren's hasn't, no Paul's hasn't got a cover and it's all curled up.
[Sandra:] Why hasn't he covered it? Didn't he... cover it at home?
[Simon:] Dunno.
[Sandra:] You used to take them home and cover them don't you? Is yours covered?
[Simon:] Yeah. With, with that plastic stuff.
[Sandra:] Oh right. are the stuff with the papers going on... put paper on some didn't we?
[Simon:] Mm....
[Sandra:] And what sort of things did you do at school?... Who's that banging?...
[Simon:] You.
[Sandra:] What things did you do at school today?
[Alex:] I did all things like
[Sandra:] Yeah...
[Alex:] and them some sausages
[Sandra:] What did you have for dinner?...
[Alex:] Sausages
[Sandra:] Mm....
[Simon:] He has sausages every day.
[Sandra:] You're beginning to look like a sausage.
[Alex:] [LAUGHTER]
[Simon:] You mean a pig.
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] Smiles like a sausage, looks like a sausage [] my God he is a sausage.
[Alex:] ... I'm a sausage eater.
[Sandra:] What else did you have with your sausage? Did you have potatoes?
[Simon:] Nothing for our boy, just twenty five thousand sausages each day.
[Sandra:] You didn't did you?
[Alex:] No no do you know what? What I had?
[Sandra:] No what? What?
[Alex:] my sausages so I don't have anything except sausages.
[Sandra:] I don't believe that.... I don't think Mr
[Alex:] dinners.
[Sandra:] No, I don't think Mr would want you just to have sausages. I'm not paying eighty five pence a day for you to eat sausages.
[Alex:] I, I wasn't really.
[Sandra:] What did you have then?
[Simon:] Eighty five pence? It isn't eighty five pence a day.
[Sandra:] It is eighty five pence a day, yours is ninety pence so you'd better be even wiser with your choice.... Incidentally what have you had for dinner? That's because you're
[Simon:] S spaghet spaghetti rings and erm...
[Sandra:] Not those cheese and potato things? Oh something different was it?
[Simon:] it's just cheese...
[Sandra:] I think you could probably eat that sausage. Or are you, are you satiated with sausages?...
[Alex:] I'm tired of seeing sausages....
[Sandra:] I bet the sausages see you coming... oh no here's Alex, quick then, hide.... [LAUGHTER]...
[Alex:] Mum can you... talk posh?
[Sandra:] Can I talk posh? What for? Like, what like how?
[Alex:] Like [mimicking] ooh I'm posh []....
[Sandra:] That's not how you talk posh is it?
[Alex:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Do you mean Stop kicking. Stop kicking.... I talk posh.
[Alex:] [mimicking] Ooh []
[Simon:] Like Mrs Thatcher. [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Like Mrs Th le let's hear somebody do Mrs Thatcher then....
[Alex:] Impression of Mrs Thatcher? [shouting] Me, me, me []
[Sandra:] Impression of Mrs...
[Alex:] [mimicking] Ooh I'm... poor. I wish I was []
[Simon:] I'll do an impression of Prince Charles
[Sandra:] Just a minute. Go on.
[Alex:] [mimicking] Ooh ooh I'm posh, I'm [] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Now okay let's have Prince Charles.
[Simon:] [mimicking] ha ha ha []
[Sandra:] at school.
[Simon:] Mm.... No... Fiona can do a great one of Christopher Watkins.
[Sandra:] And what's that like? Which one's Christopher Watkins? The one that looks like a problem school boy
[Simon:] Mm.
[Sandra:] with a knife?
[Alex:] He looks like
[Sandra:] Can you talk common like cockneys talk?...
[Alex:] Dunno....
[Sandra:] No it's, I mean I'm not very good at this [mimicking] cor blimey... up the apples and pears []...
[Alex:] [mimicking] Cor blimey, cor blimey []
[Simon:] That isn't supposed to be posh
[Alex:] Who...
[Simon:] [shouting] He hasn't eaten his sausage [].
[Sandra:] You haven't eaten your sausage.
[Alex:] I don't want it.... We, we haven't ate the stuffing.... Mum we haven't ate all the stuffing.
[Sandra:] Er well... I left the stuffing cos I, I didn't think I'd left it in long enough, I put it in a bit late and I thought we'd leave the stuffing.
[Simon:] Why?
[Sandra:] Have some stuffing next day.
[Simon:] You kicking?...
[Sandra:] Have you had enough to eat now?
[Alex:] Yeah
[Sandra:] Are you nearly ready for bed then?
[Alex:] No.
[Sandra:] Good. Have you shown Simon your picture that you've done at school?
[Alex:] I did a monster picture.
[Sandra:] He's done a picture of a man with hair
[Alex:] No it's a monster.
[Sandra:] He's done a picture of a man monster
[Alex:] No it's not a man
[Sandra:] Oh just a monster.
[Simon:] Mm.
[Sandra:] It's got hair, eyes, nose and mouth... and it's got a big yellow sun, hasn't it, shining over and it's the bestest picture you've ever seen since you last went to the art gallery. Remember that one, that Picasso?
[Simon:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Well it's much better than that, and this is something taken from one perspective int it?
[Alex:] And, and do you know how big it was? It was this big.
[Simon:] How big?
[Alex:] This big. That big. It's big... as big as you. [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] a man, that big isn't he?
[Alex:] Yeah that big.
[Sandra:] Mm I suppose so, yeah.
[Simon:] Does it go from there up to the sky and up to there?
[Sandra:] manage to eat that chicken.
[Alex:] What chicken?
[Sandra:] Chicken will make you grow into a big strong boy.
[Simon:] What will?
[Sandra:] Chicken.... You don't eat it. [LAUGHTER]
[Simon:] What do you mean?
[Sandra:] Chicken, if you eat chicken it makes you grow strong cos it's got protein in, if you... it makes you
[Alex:] What?
[Sandra:] it makes
[Alex:] What?
[Sandra:] so that your bones will grow.... What would happen if you didn't drink enough milk and you didn't get enough calcium and your bones didn't grow... but you kept eating lots of protein?
[Simon:] Mm I dunno.
[Sandra:] Well you wouldn't be able to grow any
[Simon:] A midget.
[Sandra:] taller but you'd kind of grow out.... A midget? Well... a sort of small, fat person probably. But you couldn't get any either
[Simon:] Erm a mutant.
[Sandra:] A mutant
[Simon:] thre like three... three, six, nine, twelve... fourteen
[Sandra:] Fifteen
[Simon:] four fifteen, eighteen
[Sandra:] No.
[Simon:] twenty
[Sandra:] Seven, twenty
[Simon:] twenty one
[Sandra:] seven threes are?
[Simon:] Twenty one.
[Sandra:] Correct. Go on then, off you go.
[Simon:] twenty one?
[Sandra:] Have a look. If twenty one's there then it's right isn't it?
[Simon:] I'll put that next to there then.
[Sandra:] Yeah join it up to the sum answers.... Cos seven threes are?
[Simon:] Twenty one.
[Sandra:] Twenty one. You could do the arrow going from the figures to the answer, from the sum to the answer not from the answer to the sum really doesn't it? Just think next time you do it. Okay you know you're looking for eight threes, what are eight threes? Count in threes
[Simon:] Seven
[Sandra:] on your finger.
[Simon:] Well that one was...
[Sandra:] Right. Seven threes were twenty one
[Simon:] Twe twenty er... [whispering] twenty one, twenty two [] twenty four.
[Sandra:] Eight threes are twenty four, you're getting better aren't you?... See next time you have tables at school you'll be able to show them how it's done. Eight threes are twenty four, that's an easy one but what's the next one? Three threes are?
[Simon:] Three Six. Nine, nine, nine.
[Sandra:] You're getting there, go on, three threes are nine.... Now that was five threes.
[Simon:] Oh.
[Sandra:] It doesn't matter. Put, put the nine going to the three threes, I'll understand, possibly. Three threes are nine, so what are five threes then?
[Simon:] Just ignore that one. Just ignore that one.
[Sandra:] Okey-doke.
[Simon:] I'll cross that out like that.
[Sandra:] So what are five
[Simon:] so that one's... wrong.
[Sandra:] Mhm. Five threes are?
[Simon:] One more. There's one more
[Sandra:] Well you've got five threes are... and twelve threes are, you've only got two figures left, so which is to which? five threes are thirty six and twelve threes are fifteen.
[Simon:] No it's fifteen. It's fifteen.
[Sandra:] Five threes are fifteen, right....
[Simon:] Oh!
[Sandra:] That's alright, yeah. Er I, I know what, as long as I can see what you've done. And twelve threes?...
[Simon:] Thirty six.
[Sandra:] Thirty six, do you wanna check that on your fingers? You've got twelve fingers... lend you two.... Okey- doke, go on then.
[Simon:] wrong with this.
[Sandra:] ... Twelve divided by three
[Simon:] put things over the top
[Sandra:] No you put it behind the equals sign. You would if it was a proper division sum but you've actually put the equals sign there.
[Simon:] Three er is it just like that?...
[Sandra:] No they're multiplications
[Simon:] How many threes in twelve.
[Sandra:] Right, how many threes in twelve?
[Simon:] Could you lend me two fingers?...
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[Simon:] Go on!
[Sandra:] You don't need three, you don't need two fingers.
[Simon:] [shouting] Twelve fingers [].
[Sandra:] C you're counting i no, you're counting in threes... three, six
[Simon:] Three, six, nine, twelve... four.
[Sandra:] Right, four threes are twelve, you don't need twelve fingers for that... count each finger as three cos you're counting in threes.
[Simon:] Twenty one. Three, six, nine, twelve... fourteen si
[Sandra:] Fifteen.
[Simon:] fif fift fourt fifteen
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Simon:] eighteen, twenty...
[Sandra:] Eighteen...
[Simon:] twenty one
[Sandra:] twenty one.
[Simon:] ah... seven.
[Sandra:] Seven. You ge you forget yourself don't you and you go back to the two times table, we're on threes now.
[Simon:] Well this one's just the sa are these just the same?
[Sandra:] That's easy-peasy that one, three into three goes... three into three goes
[Simon:] three... I had trouble with this one last night though.
[Sandra:] Eleven times table that one is.
[Simon:] I know it is.
[Sandra:] Three into thirty three? Count on your fingers, I'll lend you, you'll need a finger, I'll lend you one.
[Simon:] Three, six, nine, twelve... fourteen
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] Well you've got ten fingers and if I'm gonna []
[Simon:] eighteen
[Sandra:] lend you one that's eleven. Carry on.
[Simon:] eighteen, twenty... twenty one... twenty four
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Simon:] twenty seven
[Sandra:] Yeah. Twenty seven.
[Simon:] thirty...
[Sandra:] Thirty
[Simon:] thirty one.
[Sandra:] No, you're on thirty there because ten threes are thirty, you want another three, what's that?
[Simon:] Thirty three.
[Sandra:] Thirty three, how many fingers?...
[Simon:] Eleven.
[Sandra:] Eleven, right, because eleven threes are thirty three. Thirty three divided by eleven is three, thirty three divided by three is eleven. The whole thing is interchangeable... divisions to multiplications.
[Simon:] Eighteen... and divide by three again
[Sandra:] Correct. Three into eighteen... in other words.
[Simon:] Three, six nine, twelve... fourteen, eighteen
[Sandra:] Fifteen.
[Simon:] fifteen, eighteen... eighteen... twenty, oh
[Sandra:] No the answer isn't eighteen. Do it again. Three, six
[Simon:] Three, six, nine, twelve, fourteen
[Sandra:] Fifteen.
[Simon:] fifteen, eighteen... six.
[Sandra:] Six, because six times three makes
[Simon:] Eighteen.
[Sandra:] Correct.
[Simon:] And three times six makes eighteen.
[Sandra:] Twenty seven divided by three.
[Simon:] And eighteen i and eighteen divided by three makes six.
[Sandra:] Correct. And eighteen divided by six is three.
[Simon:] And three twelve... and three er divided by twelve equals four, four divided by three equals twelve... and three divided by four
[Sandra:] No, no, no no no no no no, four times three equals twelve. Three di three times four is fifteen
[Simon:] Oh. You mean I've been doing them wrong all the way?
[Sandra:] No they're fine, you've just got to... sort out what the difference is. All these there are multiplications and you can change them to divisions.
[Simon:] Yeah but I've gotta know how many threes in them.
[Sandra:] Yeah that's division. When you divide something by three how many threes.
[Simon:] But that was multiplied.
[Sandra:] See with the crosses... well that's multiplication. And it actually says here look.
[Simon:] But why can't you just put one over the top there or something?
[Sandra:] That means division... that's what, you've done them right, they're divisions but... three into twelve goes four... but at the same time four times three is twelve, you can change it into a multiplication but it, it doesn't start off as one.
[Simon:] Is you've got, are these divides?
[Sandra:] These are all divides all the way down... but you can change them all because you say four threes are twelve, seven threes are twenty one
[Simon:] Three, six, nine, twelve
[Sandra:] Correct.
[Simon:] fourteen... three, six, nine, twelve... fourteen fifteen... eighteen, twenty... twenty one... twenty four... twenty seven
[Sandra:] Because... twenty seven
[Simon:] nine
[Sandra:] divided by three equals nine.
[Simon:] nine nine nine nine nine.... Oh you're just doing the sums in different ways.
[Sandra:] Well I ain't doing them, the book's doing them, it's different ways of showing division, you can do a divide sign, you could write the word
[Simon:] How many more have I got left out of these?
[Sandra:] you could put one over the other. You've got one, two... you tell me, you're the ones that doing the maths....
[Simon:] Nine, nine, three, six, nine... three.
[Sandra:] Right.
[Simon:] Three threes are nine.
[Sandra:] Three threes are nine. Nine divided by three makes three....
[Simon:] Three, six, nine, twelve,fif... thirty six... twelve, it's twelve... twenty
[Sandra:] How you doing?...
[Simon:] [whispering] [] eight... [sigh]
[Sandra:] Have you been chinking like this all the time I've been gone?
[Simon:] Mm.
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] Right.
[Simon:] I multiplied
[Sandra:] But in actual fact, although it's something multiplied by something, it gives you the answer.
[Alex:] Mum come and look at my man.
[Sandra:] If you t if you divide some it'll be easier.
[Alex:] Mum, come and look at my man, he's dead funny.
[Sandra:] Which one's this?...
[Simon:] Yeah look, it's nine.
[Alex:] The man on the computer.
[Sandra:] In a minute, can I come just now
[Simon:] Is it nine?
[Sandra:] I'm just doing something at the moment
[Simon:] Is it nine?
[Sandra:] with Alex. Yes that's right, three times nine is twenty seven, yes.... Alright sometimes you see a pattern don't you?... But you see if you make it as a, a division it makes it easier.
[Simon:] Thirty six six
[Sandra:] You say to yourself how many times does three go into twenty seven, nine. You've got to learn how to change the sums round.
[Simon:] Is this is this thirty six.
[Sandra:] I'm afraid, no eighteen divided by
[Simon:] We'll have to treat it as a
[Sandra:] three.
[Simon:] multiplier
[Sandra:] Yeah, so how many times does three go into eighteen?
[Simon:] Is it is it...
[Sandra:] It isn't a multiplication.
[Simon:] eighteen divided... eighteen divided
[Sandra:] Divided by something equals three. Which is just the same as saying eighteen divided by three equals something. So put three into eighteen and see what the answer is, cos that's the answer.
[Simon:] Three eigh how many threes in eighteen, yeah
[Sandra:] Three, six, nine, off you go
[Simon:] Three, six nine and twelve... four fifteen
[Sandra:] You've got it.
[Simon:] eighteen, eighteen.
[Sandra:] There you go it's
[Simon:] Six.
[Sandra:] taught you something hasn't it?
[Simon:] Six.
[Sandra:] Taught you that in the three times table fourteen doesn't come after twelve.
[Simon:] Four multiplied by blah equals twelve.
[Sandra:] Four multiplied by something equals twelve.
[Simon:] Blah... twelve
[Sandra:] In other words...
[Simon:] Ah how many
[Sandra:] how many times does four go into twelve.
[Simon:] How many fours in twelve.
[Sandra:] I mean we are doing a certain times table
[Simon:] How many fours in twelve.
[Sandra:] How many fours in twelve?
[Simon:] Okay.
[Sandra:] Four
[Simon:] S I can't
[Sandra:] No you're back i that's because you're stuck in your three times mode.... Count in three times table then
[Simon:] Three, six, nine... three, six...
[Sandra:] Nine
[Simon:] nine
[Sandra:] mhm
[Simon:] twelve
[Sandra:] Twelve, right. So this is three times table... or
[Simon:] Can't keep that
[Sandra:] times three makes twelve. Three times four makes twelve, four times three makes twelve....
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] That's it.
[Simon:] Four
[Sandra:] It's not four... because you counted up, you counted the three times table
[Simon:] It's er how many fours in twelve you said.
[Sandra:] Yeah, but... there are four threes in twelve.... Right. So how many fours are there? If there are four
[Simon:] Three
[Sandra:] Right, there are three fours
[Simon:] I told you these are mad.
[Sandra:] You just change it round, that's all it is.
[Simon:] A mu oh another one. How many threes in thirty six...
[Sandra:] You have to sometimes learn to do a bit of guesswork with maths, you're doing
[Simon:] How many threes in thirty six?... [musical horn in background]
[Sandra:] Dear oh what's that? Is that a car going past?... [humming] It's the American
[Simon:] Alex, could you leave mine alone Alex.
[Alex:] This one's mine.
[Simon:] Could you leave my alone now....
[Sandra:] Well let's get these finished.... Right three multiplied by something equals thirty six.... What do you have to multiply by three to get thirty six? Three
[Simon:] How many of what?
[Sandra:] three times something makes thirty six.
[Simon:] Three of what makes thirty six
[Sandra:] Yes. Correct. Start counting... on your fingers.
[Simon:] Three, six, nine... twelve, can you lend me a few fingers?
[Sandra:] Mhm
[Alex:] Mum
[Sandra:] Yes?
[Simon:] Fifteen eighteen, twenty one
[Alex:] can,
[Simon:] twenty four, twenty seven... thirty
[Sandra:] Thirty....
[Simon:] thirty three... thirty six... thirty six
[Sandra:] Thirty six. How many
[Simon:] twelve. Twelve, twelve, twelve, twelve, twelve
[Sandra:] Twelve threes make thirty six.
[Alex:] Mum could you help me
[Sandra:] Three multiplied by twelve makes thirty six. I think that's had it, I think the er man from customs... Simon was saving that, the man took it all apart... and I think that's why it probably got broken so quickly because I think they messed with it.
[Alex:] Could you help me fix it?...
[Simon:] I don't think you can.
[Sandra:] I don't think the people that work in, in customs are very bright, I think they also steal things... cos we've had things go missing haven't we? Careful of that. I can't fix it Alex er I don't, oh hang on, why don't we just leave those two pieces out, see if we can fix it without them.
[Simon:] Yeah but that's bent... to one side....
[Sandra:] Oh right, you mean it's broken in more ways than... we previously thought.
[Simon:] The twenty seven times table!...
[Sandra:] No! Twenty seven divided by something
[Simon:] How many twenty seven
[Sandra:] equals nine.
[Simon:] how many... twenty sevens in nine do you mean?...
[Sandra:] I don't mean how twenty se many twenty sevens in nine, I mean how many of those... blank, in twenty seven
[Simon:] [sigh]
[Sandra:] or how many nines.... How many nines, or nine of how many... make twenty seven.
[Alex:] Mum
[Sandra:] If you put nine into twenty seven how many does it go? Say the nines you can do in the three times table... and that er you've got to get a three in
[Simon:] Three six, nine, twelve
[Sandra:] somewhere.... I think it's had it Alex.
[Simon:] twelve... fifteen, eighteen, twenty one, twenty four, twenty seven... thirty, thirty
[Sandra:] No you you've gone too far.
[Simon:] Oh! Twenty seven... nine....
[Sandra:] Nine what?
[Simon:] [LAUGHTER] Nine [] nine...
[Sandra:] Nine nines make twenty seven?
[Simon:] But I've got nine
[Sandra:] You've got nine nine what?...
[Simon:] Threes.
[Sandra:] No three's right.
[Simon:] Three.
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] Correct, yeah []. You're doing
[Alex:] [whingeing] Mum []
[Sandra:] I can't mend it Alex, it's broken. You see you're doing it
[Simon:] Twenty one.
[Sandra:] Right
[Alex:] [whingeing] []...
[Sandra:] Do you know you're doing the three times table?
[Simon:] Is eight three, is that multiplied by three twenty one?
[Alex:] [crying] []
[Sandra:] Eight, no eight times three is twenty four. It was when I was at school.
[Alex:] [crying] mum why did they take it to pieces []?
[Simon:] twenty one
[Sandra:] Because they do things like that at customs because they're looking, they're always looking for drugs and things that shouldn't come in.
[Simon:] Se well seven, seven mul
[Sandra:] You're lucky that they didn't take the Turtles apart, they didn't open them.
[Simon:] Is seven multiplied by three twenty one?
[Sandra:] It might be that it was just a little bit open and they think that somebody's tampered with it so then they, they open
[Simon:] Se is it twenty one divided by... seven?
[Sandra:] Yeah. Twenty one divided by seven....
[Simon:] Seven divided by
[Alex:] [whingeing] Mum when are you gonna read me my story []?
[Sandra:] I'm going to read you your story now.
[Simon:] Yeah, the story of your life before...
[Sandra:] Tt... he's lovely for you int he, your brother?
[Alex:] [shouting] No they're my... [] [computer game]
[Simon:] I, I've got a ray in there... that gives me pow that can give me power Alex. Watch this one, it's really good....
[Alex:] Yeah, it can dig
[Simon:] Yeah, you can that out of your
[Sandra:] Go on then.
[Simon:] see there, and he digged
[Sandra:] Oh my God.
[Simon:] and he digged through there
[Sandra:] Honest? Well how did you find out that cos you haven't got any instructions have you?
[Simon:] I just did it and he appeared. He digs through there for you.
[Sandra:] That's good of him. Oh and then you can just follow him through?
[Simon:] No he, he just disappears when you've got through.
[Sandra:] Oh he's a kind of, he gets released for favours done.
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] But you've managed to get so many exciting things going.
[Simon:] I, don't
[Alex:] [shouting] Get a ray []
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[Alex:] get a ray sign
[Simon:] They can't do anything though Alex, the rays can't do anything.
[Sandra:] I only manage to get one thing on I do
[Alex:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] ah I don't know.
[Simon:] [shouting] Why don't you have a try of this []?
[Alex:] Can I have a try?... Simon can I have a try?... [whingeing] Simon can I have a try []?
[Simon:] Watch this, I can do this on too, there he is
[Alex:] You can't though.
[Simon:] [shouting] Look what I made appear mum []
[Sandra:] In a minute, I'll come in a minute, I'm just doing dad's dinner
[Alex:] [shouting] He jumped he did, ha ha ha... ha ha ha ha. Mum look he's jumping all []
[Simon:] You can make one of these little pink things appear with one of them
[Sandra:] Oh right
[Simon:] so they jump around.
[Sandra:] well how, when did you find out about that?
[Simon:] [LAUGHTER] I just found out about it now []. I've got some, you get one of each thing
[Sandra:] a better game now isn't it, altogether? You get all them animals and everything.
[Simon:] Yeah you get one of each kind when you start.... So I've got a ray in there I think. Let's just see what I've got. I've got one fly, one pink thing, one ray, one of them creatures, the diggers and erm a thing, I don't what they're for though.
[Alex:] Get another digger, get that digger there.
[Simon:] I don't know what them fly things are for.... I just don't know what they're for.
[Sandra:] five more minutes
[Alex:] I is he digging for you?
[Simon:] Yes.... No I'm not gonna make him dig for me yet.... I'm gonna try and get a few more of them that can dig.
[Alex:] Whoo! And then they can dig a few holes for you. [LAUGHTER] Hey see that little pink thing. [LAUGHTER]... So try and get that... wish I... could get through that.
[Simon:] If I can get another one of them.
[Alex:] Like that one?
[Simon:] Well jump up here and try and get one.... I caught it.... I'd better get another one now.... I think I'll be able to get another one. Three of them big diggers. [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] only a tiny spot cos that's
[Alex:] Can I?
[Sandra:] cider.
[Alex:] Can I?...
[Sandra:] A tiny little drink.
[Simon:] Cider isn't that bad though.
[Sandra:] Well it's... strong enough for little boys....
[Alex:] Ah ah! It is nice.... I, I had a lot or something, a little lot.
[Sandra:] Oh you had a little lot did you?... Put the light on
[Alex:] No.
[Sandra:] Go on, the other side.
[Alex:] Okay Si.
[Simon:] I caught it! I got two of them now. I'll go back down... then I'll see what they'll both do....
[Alex:] ...
[Simon:] He hasn't dug out yet.
[Alex:] Why?
[Sandra:] Out of where?...
[Simon:] Oh eh I c I can't catch one of them. I've got lots of stuff in there...
[Alex:] Wonder what they do it for
[Simon:] They're just in there. Right...
[Alex:] Wonder what they'll do
[Simon:] er now I'll release one of those things.... Oh I've got three of them anyway!... Come on... come on, come on....
[Alex:] Hey!
[Simon:] Oh he just fell off getting the, I've transported him back somewhere.... I've transported him....
[Alex:] Oh can, can I have a go?
[Simon:] I'm gonna find somewhere to dig....
[Alex:] he could dig on to that.
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Alex:] [LAUGHTER] Pull it down and then pull it....
[Sandra:] ...
[Alex:] Don't you want, that? Can I er... oh can I have a go?... Simon's taking all the
[Sandra:] Alright, I think er Simon... had your ten minutes, it's Alex's turn.
[Simon:] Ten minutes! one minute. Ha there's one of them now. Wonder what he'll do.
[Sandra:] ?
[Garry:] No.
[Simon:] Dad, look what I've found out.
[Sandra:] Have to go to bed early
[Simon:] Dad look what I've found out. What?
[Garry:] Dead easy to do a master's degree.
[Sandra:] Lot easier than teaching.
[Alex:] [shouting] He's digging for you []. He's digging for you.
[Louis:] Do you know what you have to do Sime? Shall I tell you?...
[Alex:] [shouting] He's digging for diamonds, he's digging []
[Simon:] Dad watch this, I've found out something, if you ca for what you capture all these creatures for... I've found out.
[Garry:] You've found out?
[Simon:] Watch this, right you see this one here
[Garry:] Right do you think go on then.
[Simon:] watch....
[Garry:] Yes
[Simon:] See?
[Garry:] Oh! It appears.
[Simon:] Yeah they appear.
[Garry:] . How come they are
[Simon:] You can get them to dig for you, in this other rule, you can get them to dig through the wall.
[Alex:] And you can't get through the wall.
[Simon:] See they dig
[Garry:] Oh! How do you, well how do you manage to do that?
[Simon:] I just caught something for a, then put them on.
[Garry:] What do you s oh yeah, oh I see what you
[Simon:] When you get one of them you just jump around.
[Garry:] I see what you mean, when you've caught them you can then make
[Simon:] I into there you can erm
[Garry:] you can then make it do work for you?
[Simon:] Yeah
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Garry:] Well where's it gone? Where's that one you just had?
[Simon:] Er you
[Garry:] And that tells you the number you've caught?
[Simon:] Yeah.... I'm gonna get another game and try and get some more.
[Sandra:] It's much better without the instructions
[Simon:] I'm gonna try and get some more.
[Garry:] So you... so... is it more fun finding out how
[Simon:] Yeah
[Alex:] [whingeing] I want a go [].
[Garry:] You want a go as well?
[Simon:] Do you want me just to catch you something first Alex?
[Garry:] No don't turn the
[Sandra:] I can tell you something, Alex is a lot better than me at it.
[Garry:] don't turn the light off.
[Simon:] Why don't you have a go mum?... I just wanna catch one of these first
[Alex:] [moan]
[Garry:] Wait a minute, right, and and then Alex would like a go.
[Simon:] I wanna show dad how they.
[Garry:] Let me show, you're getting it...
[Sandra:] We've been timing him actually, ten minutes
[Garry:] How come you can't, oh you've got him. Yeah?
[Simon:] Right I've got him now. Watch
[Garry:] Now how do you get him to come up to you?
[Simon:] You just do this.
[Garry:] And you got, you call him up
[Simon:] Oh
[Garry:] Oh.
[Simon:] oh I've just changed into a spider.
[Garry:] Try again.
[Simon:] You get one of those
[Garry:] You get, you c you, so you right I'll have one of those please...
[Simon:] Right.
[Garry:] you change back to normal, you get one of those
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Garry:] leaves you with one left
[Simon:] Yeah I've only got one.
[Garry:] Right
[Simon:] That only digs through there for you, you have to
[Garry:] And he in there, you keep, what you push him?
[Simon:] No you don't push him you just follow along with him cos he disappears when he gets through.
[Garry:] Oh! And you can then go through?
[Simon:] Yeah....
[Garry:] Very cle well what does... what does the manta ray do for you?
[Simon:] Nothing, I don I haven't sta you, oh you see what these little pink things do for us [LAUGHTER]
[Garry:] [LAUGHTER] What do they do []?
[Alex:] [shouting] Simon... I think it's just []... I, I know where the hand is look
[Simon:] You just do this
[Alex:] go erm that way [whingeing] Si Simon I know where the [] hand is I do.
[Garry:] Well why's he vanished?
[Simon:] Because because when you do that to him
[Garry:] He only jumps so many times?
[Simon:] he just van no
[Alex:] [whingeing] Simon [] Simon... I just saw that hand.
[Simon:] I'll, I'll try and get a hand.
[Alex:] [shouting] I just saw it, that way... I just saw it []. You've gone past it.
[Simon:] Oh! Shall I try and catch that?... Yeah.
[Garry:] Very good. You have to catch it on a certain place
[Simon:] No you can catch it
[Garry:] like on i well no, no, you have to, you... the net has to fall over a certain part of the creature.
[Simon:] Just his head.
[Garry:] Just his head?
[Sandra:] Yes it has to go like that
[Alex:] [LAUGHTER] He's jumping [] he jump
[Garry:] And how, are you, are you just
[Alex:] Dad he shot me.
[Garry:] what?
[Alex:] He shot me and jumped.
[Garry:] He's ju jumping on you? Well careful then, careful....
[Alex:] [whingeing] Ooh ooh ooh ooh ooh []
[Garry:] Ooh.
[Simon:] I'll go all the way down here now....
[Alex:] Simon you know... no go, ah! That's where the hand is, up there.
[Simon:] I know.
[Alex:] The hand's up there....
[Garry:] Then you could be able to jump some time, oh there he goes! [LAUGHTER]
[Alex:] [LAUGHTER]... [LAUGHTER]
[Garry:] [LAUGHTER]
[Simon:] Do you want me to get up to, try and get up to
[Garry:] Well yeah can... oh, jump, can you jump onto that next bit there?
[Simon:] jump up there.... See that closes up there... and you can capture more if you want them to.
[Garry:] You can get, no, they must all do z
[Sandra:] woodcraft?
[Garry:] Have you been to woodcraft Sime?
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Garry:] You've been alright then? Did you take your thirty pence?
[Alex:] Hey!
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] So where's the change?...
[Simon:] Oh.
[Sandra:] Oh never mind. Probably in your trousers is it?
[Garry:] Did you get your change?
[Simon:] Yeah I got it.
[Sandra:] games. Did Steve
[Simon:] Ah! I know what I'll be, be able to do. No I'll have to go and and I'll be able to do it.
[Sandra:] Simon, did Steve stay or did he just leave you there?
[Simon:] He left us there then came back after.
[Sandra:] Oh.
[Garry:] to fetch you?...
[Sandra:] library so as possible I suppose. ...
[Alex:] Mum [shouting] mum... mum, mum, mum, mum []
[Sandra:] microwave all morning, warmed it up.
[Alex:] mum, mum......
[Garry:] You see what happens is people show up... all dressed up in their togs and whatever... from school, or maybe, maybe, maybe they're power dressing
[Sandra:] No point really.
[Garry:] Well, no, one has to bear in mind... the type of situation, so power dressing as in it might be a tool but it's very very professional.
[Alex:] Mum, can you do one of these?
[Garry:] And then the professional arrives and what's the professional dressed in?
[Sandra:] Jeans and T-shirt.
[Garry:] Denims! [LAUGHTER] Especially jeans and a denim jacket, while the teachers []
[Sandra:] Did you feel a bit uncomfortable in jeans?
[Garry:] because, yeah well I thought I might and then he said something about... I was at this meeting where I was talking to all these official in their suits and ties and I was only dressed casual... and I thought, at that point I sort of
[Sandra:] a bit like that, it
[Garry:] I thought great, I thought, I thought everybody else sort of cringe about the way [LAUGHTER] that maybe they [] were over power dressed.
[Alex:] [whingeing] []...
[Garry:] Over and out. [break in recording] these forms. I wanted, I wanted I don't know where it is. Alex was... I think.
[Alex:] No I wasn't!...
[Garry:] Well can I just ask, there was,th there were four... there were four of the rock and roll ones... and the piece up there that wanted to going back on, have you thrown that bit away Alex?
[Alex:] No....
[Sandra:] Don't think they have.
[Garry:] Eh?
[Sandra:] I don't think
[Garry:] Well what have you done,
[Alex:] That was Simon!
[Garry:] I don't care whose it was.
[Alex:] We well Simon done it. I haven't done it.
[Simon:] I haven't, I haven't.
[Alex:] I haven't.
[Garry:] Yeah well it's always strange isn't it how nobody manages to do it and yet it's always
[Simon:] Well I haven't!
[Garry:] Well who took the piece that was on there, that was stuck on?
[Sandra:] Has it fell somewhere?
[Alex:] I don't know.
[Garry:] No it's been torn off.
[Sandra:] Oh. I told them not to
[Garry:] I want or the rock and roll one. I only wanted the four rock and roll ones....
[Sandra:] Garry
[Garry:] anything....
[Alex:] [whingeing] Oh can I have a go []? Still got one on the, just a minute. [whingeing] Simon []
[Sandra:] Simon.
[Simon:] What?
[Sandra:] Alex now.... Alex now Simon.
[Garry:] I want, I'm just saying to you what I want to do... I actually want to consolidate my own qualifications
[Simon:] Ah, a bit missing there.
[Garry:] Yeah? Don't worry it's all
[Simon:] Oh it's there it's there.
[Garry:] yeah, okay.
[Simon:] It's there.
[Garry:] And what I want to do is, as the moment where I'm going in and teaching in the area that I am I don't mind the learning support bit, I don't mind the fact... that the chil er the, the, yeah, yeah
[Simon:] Dad
[Garry:] You don't want
[Simon:] Oh you're not allowed to stick that on are you?
[Garry:] No, I'm gonna take this off.
[Sandra:] You were saying?...
[Garry:] But er...
[Simon:] What about that bit?
[Garry:] Yeah don't worry there, I won't push it off.... I've thought it out Simes and now I'm going to apply... a bit of thought so it'll keep that on, yeah? And I can stick it back down.... No ju just saying that I'm looking for material that would be of interest to the kids...
[Sandra:] Your kids?
[Garry:] that would allow them, from a, a graphics point of view that would be of interest, sort of allow them... not only to be interested but would, would show them a variety of graphic design... based on similar ideas. I was just saying to Simon remember when I did, I did this, before these came out I did the Fab Four Rock and Roll Beatles
[Sandra:] Mm
[Garry:] and there you go, you've got them.... What's that?. Let me stick me other bits and pieces
[Simon:] I don't think it'll erm... there, there!
[Garry:] Well it'll repair okay.
[Simon:] Goes like that doesn't it?
[Garry:] As long as nobody's ripped all the little bits off. Yeah?
[Simon:] I don't think anybody has really.
[Garry:] No I think it's er...
[Simon:] I think he'll be
[Garry:] anyway you they w he was say
[Simon:] it might just have a bit here
[Garry:] he was saying, John, that he was so excited... mind you, what I want to know is how excited was mum when they arrived?... You weren't excited?
[Sandra:] I just said, goodness, I said we've been waiting for this parcel since before Christmas and he says oh have you duck. Mm I mean he looked at me like I was a bit silly and it was only when I got it and looked he'd got after Christmas written [LAUGHTER] []...
[Garry:] No explanations from the Post Office as to... it doesn't actually say on, it doesn't say on it
[Sandra:] Ah but I think, I was saying I think they've I think they've tested them at customs.
[Garry:] Did you think... well I, I'm not
[Sandra:] I think they must have opened
[Garry:] it doesn't say on that customs actually have opened them.... And it normally has stickers all over it saying
[Simon:] Perhaps they just have opened them.
[Sandra:] Mm. I don't know it was just a thought.
[Garry:] So...
[Sandra:] Mind you if customs had opened it it probably would never have got... maybe
[Garry:] Although he
[Sandra:] fancied them for their own kids.
[Garry:] Yeah but it is, it was ins it was an insured package so
[Simon:] Can I see if this' ll just
[Garry:] Yeah.
[Simon:] Right....
[Garry:] Just take, just take it carefully. Now this is, you know that you don't
[Sandra:] Now there's a letter in there that wants filling in for Alex for Alison.
[Garry:] We are restoring this.
[Sandra:] Yeah. Yeah but I filled it, I've botched it up in a couple of places but that's beside the point, it doesn't matter.
[Simon:] Dad.
[Garry:] Yeah.
[Simon:] Yeah? Just need a bit there first.
[Sandra:] Probably when they see I'm at Keele they'll know I'm stupid anyway. [LAUGHTER]
[Garry:] Well, what's that?... Why what have you done with the er
[Sandra:] Nothing. I just put a few things in the wrong place because I didn't read, you know, put them in too soon. It doesn't matter anyway, I mean I put er
[Garry:] Well but if you've ju yeah but if you just said, I mean what, you s you did that when Sue was here.
[Sandra:] Yes I know, that's what I'm saying.
[Garry:] You said straight, no but straight, you filled something in then you
[Sandra:] Yeah I realized straight away yeah.
[Garry:] But you said I'm not reading it, well why did you carry on if that was the case?... You said to me, the point you said
[Sandra:] That was it, that was where I went wrong.
[Garry:] Oh! Well tha well... oh well that's alright, it was only that it'd be... I thought you said there was a place for your name and address that hadn't been filled in by the computer so you filled it in?
[Sandra:] That's right, so I filled it in because that's what you do if you get stuck on Keele you fill in the bits that the computer hasn't
[Garry:] Well that seems fair enough fo
[Sandra:] sort of filled in.
[Simon:] Is Alex's alright? We'll have to do something with Alex's cos that thing's still on the front.
[Garry:] Yeah well don't
[Sandra:] So anyway you just want to sign by you, I've put your school and I've put your telephone number
[Simon:] Mum
[Sandra:] and I've put, no you can't... my number and... Keele and I, I've put nanny's number.
[Garry:] Oh
[Simon:] Mm....
[Sandra:] It just needs you to sign it. No tomorrow night there's a P T A at Allyson Street.
[Garry:] Oh yeah
[Sandra:] Well Annette said are you going, and I said well... we thought perhaps
[Garry:] Why, did they say they they would go if we would go?
[Sandra:] The, what?
[Garry:] Is that [LAUGHTER] is that what you think?
[Sandra:] Allyson Street P T A I'm talking about, tomorrow.
[Garry:] Yeah I know, that's what I'm saying, but did it
[Sandra:] Well she said I'd sort of thought of going, are you going, I says yeah okay I said, if you won't go I'll, we'll go together, I said but I don't particularly want to get, you know, roped into it at the moment. I don't mind going to show me face.
[Garry:] it doesn't ma Yeah
[Sandra:] You know but just perhaps, perhaps occasional help... and then maybe a bit later on get more involved. I don't want to not be in it but I don't want to, you know
[Garry:] Have over-involvement.
[Sandra:] well I, well I've got enough on at the moment....
[Garry:] Yeah.
[Simon:] What have you done?
[Sandra:] Anyway then I said are they interested in this quiz night, and she says I haven't go she says she'd ask Jan, I said well give me a ring back a bit later. Anyway sh she phoned me back and she said yes he was, he was dead keen, he wished it'd've just been like pop quiz... but he'll go anyway. So it's Thursday the twenty seventh. So I said we'll get out tickets... and they'll get their tickets tomorrow, we're gonna get our tickets separately. It says there's sandwiches on and it's at the Oxford Arms so
[Garry:] Yeah. Thursday
[Sandra:] Thursday the twenty seventh.
[Garry:] the twenty seventh.
[Sandra:] It's the day after er F S A.
[Garry:] [sigh] Yeah okay, well I was gonna say
[Sandra:] And you won't be able to go to the F S A anyway cos you're on your course.
[Garry:] Which F S A?
[Sandra:] Well it's an F S A or a governor's meeting or something up St Margarets....
[Garry:] On the, on the notice board? Does it say F S A on a, is on the
[Sandra:] I can't think, it was something to do with St Margarets, it was either an F S A or a governor's meeting. Thing is you can't go anyway.
[Garry:] The governor's thing is coming about quite useful tonight because we've been talking about the law as regards governors and parents' rights and what you're supposed to ask parents
[Sandra:] Parents' what?...
[Garry:] Parents' rights, yeah.
[Sandra:] Not such a thing as parents' rights is there?
[Garry:] That the parents are allowed to, to actually opt their children out of certain things. But they can only do that if they're actually away that they, they are aw... that they can actually do it.
[Sandra:] certain things in the first place.
[Garry:] If nobody damn well tells them in the first place that they can opt out then... they can't opt out can they? There's no point at a later date saying oh by the way you do realize that... that show we gave on AIDS...
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Garry:] so in actual fact your child didn't have to go if you didn't want to because
[Sandra:] Well that's like sex education and stuff isn't it? You can vote no to sex education can't you?
[Garry:] Well it comes under sex education. Yeah but there were some people who didn't realize that.
[Sandra:] I mean I we I would I, you know, personally I think I prefer to do it myself than put th leave it up to them cos mostly they don't know what they're on about anyway.
[Garry:] Well this,th this, these are the points we were discussing er that appropriate... appropriate
[Sandra:] Push forward the morals and the philosophy of the Conservative government.
[Garry:] Well you wanna read the, you wanna read the paper
[Sandra:] Like AIDS is a nasty disease that only homosexuals get.
[Garry:] Well... this is all part and parcel of it because... apparently it's now
[Sandra:] It's to do with moral it'll be a moral thing won't it?
[Garry:] it's to er encourage people to do
[Sandra:] Take a moral view point....
[Garry:] to have erm, oh I've forgotten what the terms are now... anyway, yes, it was very much a Thatcherite family view
[Sandra:] This is that new thing isn't it? Oh well it's always protection of the family and yet they're not prepared to put anything to the family.
[Garry:] That's what
[Sandra:] Decent respectable citizens on the lowest budget you can... make available.
[Garry:] Well that's that's really what this whole thing was about... tonight, and that's what we're tackling....
[Sandra:] No, I think er I think it
[Garry:] We've had to d
[Sandra:] it might be something worth pulling kids out of.
[Garry:] Well
[Sandra:] Cos
[Garry:] that's what I tried to say to people, that... if you want to be an informed parent then you want to know fully who's doing it, what, you want to know the content, you want
[Sandra:] And what the qualifications are,
[Garry:] you want to know the content and you want to know the delivery
[Sandra:] Well surely won't we have to have a meeting on that just like,do don't they have a meeting for sex education?
[Garry:] They should do but you, er again the reality of it as, as we know
[Sandra:] Seem to remember our sex education talk wasn't very s specific... and didn't cover a very wide area....
[Garry:] No. It doesn't cover the important things.
[Sandra:] I think it was mostly, you know, just meant for females of a certain age, it wasn't really anything to do with anything else....
[Garry:] What cos only women get pregnant?...
[Sandra:] No that's it, don't think it was anything to do with p it was all about periods and sanitary protection and stuff like that.
[Garry:] Oh well there you go.... There you go, it
[Sandra:] never mentions the condom.
[Garry:] doesn't even have anything [LAUGHTER] anything to do with sex does it really []?
[Sandra:] Well that was our talk....
[Garry:] I don't think, mind you we had biology so we didn't need it.
[Sandra:] No but biology is just purely clinical isn't it?
[Garry:] [LAUGHTER] Yeah, well no, well we did, that's what I'm saying
[Sandra:] I mean they'll do nothing about sex, they'll just do all about morals, won't they, and decent, respectable people I'd say and biology's just cold and clinical.
[Garry:] Well no
[Simon:] Mum
[Garry:] but that's what we were discussing.... That's w
[Sandra:] Int it?
[Garry:] we, were discussing, for instance
[Sandra:] They need to have somebody that's a bit liberal and a bit open and that won't be available under a Conservative government will it?
[Garry:] What's what's the aim we've been telling them is the aim, what, I mean somebody came up with the aim, in actual fact, despite whatever else you might be doing, whatever politics were behind it, the aim was to prevent AIDS no matter what you were doing, and not to have any kind of... prejudice against what you were doing as long as... the aim
[Sandra:] It's also in support of the nuclear family though int it?... One mummy and one daddy bound
[Garry:] It was, yeah
[Sandra:] together for the rest of their lives, and no
[Garry:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] relationships.
[Garry:] Well no but that's what this, this talk on is about... is er... well I forget the paper
[Sandra:] Have we got a loony left council round here, we have haven't we?... [LAUGHTER]
[Garry:] No.... Anyway,th the guy we had tonight reckoned that er he never quite got to grips with er Bernstein and he's f and he, he apologized for being stuck in restrictive [LAUGHTER]... which er he couldn't even remember that it was called restrictive until somebody told him but he said ah yes that's it, but yes I never managed to... he said [LAUGHTER] I never managed to really get very far... with that.... Very er very... very nice... fella and very, put us very much at ease. Erm... good.
[Sandra:] [yawn]
[Garry:] The first fella is a bit er I, I think is... is very academic or has a very ac academic
[Sandra:] Were there two fellas?
[Garry:] Yeah. The first fella was ver no there's, there's some women on the course w er we will see who are actually presenting the course, I mean... a good fifty percent of the course is
[Simon:] Dad
[Garry:] it's ab I think I said to you we've got... fifty, a good fifty-fifty split, if maybe not slightly more women... actually on the course.
[Sandra:] Oh on the course, education int it?
[Garry:] Erm Well I don't know, it's er... Yes
[Simon:] Dad
[Garry:] Simon?
[Simon:] could you take these off?
[Garry:] I can have a go but er like I said to you
[Sandra:] Have most of them teaching?
[Garry:] Whose bits are these?
[Simon:] Alex's. I was using them.
[Garry:] Right. So can you no well can you bear that in mind when Alex is sometimes playing with your things?
[Simon:] Mm.
[Garry:] And bear in mind also that... the more you take them off the more you bend them whatever and... yeah?...
[Simon:] You pull them don't you?
[Garry:] Well I think that's the intention but... as you know... it says M in there
[Simon:] What?
[Garry:] M for Michael Angelo
[Simon:] Oh.
[Garry:] I assume.
[Simon:] Don't know,
[Sandra:] Now who's phoned? Oh Barbara phoned to see about woodcraft, she said Steve had, or... well either her or Steve'd take them.
[Garry:] That being, yeah?
[Sandra:] Anyway Steve picked them up here. I said to her do you think
[Simon:] That's mine.
[Sandra:] there's any chance of picking them up here, said otherwise I'm going to have to her take Alex late.
[Simon:] That's
[Sandra:] Anyway Steve picked them up here and then dropped them off
[Simon:] ...
[Sandra:] And then who else rang? Rob, Rob... Robert... Rob or Robert from Quickprint, Robert
[Garry:] Oh yeah? Bob.
[Sandra:] Bob. No Bob, it wasn't...
[Garry:] Oh Rob from Quickprint?
[Sandra:] Rob, yeah.
[Garry:] Yeah?
[Sandra:] He said you'd had two more fax, one of them they just wanted a current catalogue
[Garry:] Yeah?
[Sandra:] and he seemed to think the other one wanted to buy something but he,whe whether he couldn't read the writing or he didn't understand it
[Garry:] Mm sometimes the faxes are pretty
[Sandra:] Something about a bootleg.... Could you get hold of a bootleg,bu but he didn't seem to know... I don't know what else he said about it.
[Garry:] I'll have to call in, I'll have to make a
[Sandra:] Well I sa I said can he contact you later and he says well no not really, I said well I'll tell him to give you a ring in the day some time tomorrow.
[Garry:] See I can't do that at all from... school, that's
[Sandra:] Oh.
[Garry:] that's the trou no that's the trouble now you see
[Sandra:] Oh you'll have to just try and call in but
[Garry:] so all I can possibly do is
[Sandra:] after school
[Garry:] I s well I wanna get a photocopy of that jacket, so I thought... if I, Friday night... which I should be home pretty, pretty much on the dot... I'll have to pick the, pick these two up and I'll have to just go run down before they close.... Yeah?...
[Sandra:] Well you could do, yeah.
[Garry:] Well I'll have to really.... [whistling]
[Sandra:] I'm thinking I finish at three tomorrow but then I'll have to get home, Annette, I said to Annette I'd be there by about four
[Garry:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] but I, I don't know er whether I could do it an hour or not. It's possible I could s if I walk from Newcastle... catch a bus to Newcastle then walk from Newcastle.
[Garry:] that other one Simes?
[Sandra:] just take er
[Simon:] asleep now but erm could I go and get it?
[Sandra:] He probably is asleep actually....
[Garry:] Oh did he take it upstairs?
[Sandra:] I think he did take something
[Garry:] It's alright I was just getting rid of all these
[Sandra:] Anyway so it's the P T A tomorrow and I said I'll go
[Simon:] Do you want me to go and get them
[Sandra:] er but we neither of us want to be
[Garry:] What time is the P T A?
[Sandra:] to do anything, half seven tomorrow night.
[Garry:] What are we going to do about a babysitter?
[Sandra:] You're, you're not going... only me and Annette are going.
[Garry:] Oh sorry, right. Fine.
[Sandra:] Sorry about that. [LAUGHTER]
[Garry:] Right, right
[Sandra:] No you're getting the other thing on a Thursday... the quiz night, twenty seventh. Annette and John are going
[Garry:] We're both going
[Sandra:] Well it's a night out. Sandwiches So it's two pound anyway so if you've got four quid spare between us.
[Garry:] Erm
[Sandra:] I've got a ten pound note I suppose....
[Garry:] [yawn]
[Sandra:] Did you say there was something on telly you wanted to watch?
[Garry:] something really intellectual.
[Sandra:] five more minutes....
[Garry:] Were they, were they very pleased with the parcel? Did they seem
[Sandra:] Oh yes, they were a bit pleased but straight away they started getting, you know Alex was getting tired so we were getting can I get it out, can I get this out, can I get that... and it were half open and I was frightened of losing the bits... so I gave him one and he said no he didn't want that one he wanted the other one, so I give him another one... and then I nearly gave him a clout.
[Garry:] Well what I'll do I'll get, I'll get a bigger box
[Sandra:] Part of it's erm which I thought actually, I shouldn't really three of them each, you know he was getting silly
[Garry:] Yes I know but they are his
[Simon:] What he... you mean he chose his own?
[Sandra:] No.
[Simon:] He chose his own?
[Sandra:] No they came
[Simon:] Before I even
[Sandra:] no, no, we chose there were three in a parcel for you and three
[Simon:] Cos if he did
[Sandra:] No there were
[Simon:] that wouldn't have been fair.
[Garry:] No, Don Don... Don
[Sandra:] Nothing's ever fair for you is it? There were three in the pack No, there were three in a pack for Alex and he opened his bef you opened yours Simon.
[Simon:] No.
[Sandra:] That was it, that was how it came, nothing was touched at all.
[Garry:] Don and Debbie sent them as they were.
[Sandra:] Except Don and Debbie sent three pairs of pants, that game with the... punchy springing thing
[Simon:] Which broke.
[Sandra:] and there was a talking
[Garry:] And Alex [LAUGHTER] []
[Sandra:] a talking turtle and a book, both got a talking turtle each and it
[Simon:] Which one was it?
[Sandra:] M er Michael Angelo. And it wasn't anything specific, it was just a turtle but thought perhaps Robert might like it. I offered to give it to Daniel actually for his birthday... but I, I fe I felt a bit sorry for Robert, I thought o opening all them.... He gives you things sometimes doesn't he? [LAUGHTER] And takes things off you sometimes [].
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Have you heard what he's done on him today? Tell dad what he done on you.
[Garry:] No, tell us what's he done on you today?
[Simon:] Well
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[Simon:] well I was... I'll go and get it.
[Sandra:] I said he'll get. He has actually given Alex one, he give him a, is it? Cos Simon wasn't
[Garry:] Oh one of the
[Sandra:] pleased about that cos he hasn't got that one....
[Garry:] One of the monsters in my pocket?
[Sandra:] The old ones, the one.
[Simon:] This was the cause of it all wasn't it?
[Sandra:] Go on, tell dad what happened.
[Garry:] Tell me what happened then.
[Simon:] Well we were on the bus and
[Garry:] Which bus?
[Simon:] Er to swimming
[Sandra:] Coming from swimming, going swimming.
[Simon:] and no back from swimming
[Garry:] Yes?
[Simon:] and I had erm... hmm I'd swapped Richard something
[Garry:] Richard?
[Simon:] No Richard... thingy, Richard
[Garry:] Richard?
[Simon:] No
[Sandra:] Yeah
[Simon:] and... I swapped him this elephant
[Garry:] Yeah
[Simon:] it's an elephant
[Garry:] Yes
[Simon:] you know Gnicia
[Garry:] Gnicia
[Simon:] Yeah, the god.
[Garry:] Oh right the In the, the, the In the In
[Sandra:] I hadn't heard of it at all, don't know what
[Garry:] I was gonna say the Indian one, yeah.
[Simon:] And I asked Robert if I could have a er have a look at one of these
[Garry:] Yeah.
[Simon:] one of his in a set and he says
[Garry:] Yeah.
[Simon:] that I could and he, and he gets
[Sandra:] Were you keen on the one you looked at? Did you want to see it? Was it really an interesting
[Simon:] I only wanted to see this one and he said
[Sandra:] Is that it?
[Simon:] and when he had a look at mine he said no swaps back
[Garry:] Ah.
[Simon:] we hadn't even swapped.
[Sandra:] Took one off him and said no swaps back....
[Garry:] You see it's all to do with being fair and
[Sandra:] I shouldn't worry too much.
[Garry:] and doing the same
[Simon:] But I don't want this one.
[Garry:] and doing the
[Sandra:] Well swap it for another one.
[Simon:] I can't, he won't swap me.
[Garry:] Well think, swap it with somebody else.
[Sandra:] Somebody else.
[Simon:] I want to swap, nobody else has got that one.
[Garry:] Which one?
[Simon:] The elephant.
[Garry:] Gnish
[Simon:] Gnicia
[Garry:] Gnicia Well the thing is Simes
[Sandra:] Swap it for that
[Garry:] that's what it's all about isn't it?...
[Simon:] Okay, if I give him the turtle... do you think he'd
[Sandra:] And that....
[Simon:] No way!... I'm not giving it away!
[Sandra:] You don't want that one.
[Garry:] You just said.
[Simon:] I do, I... well if... if I
[Sandra:] ... swap him that and said here I'll give
[Simon:] if I give him the turtle
[Sandra:] you this turtle as an incentive cos you're giving him the turtle anyway but he won't know that unless his mum's told him.
[Simon:] Bet she has though....
[Sandra:] I'm confused.
[Garry:] Are you confused? You will be.... Anyway, Simes, the Golden Girls are on, which is full of intellectual stimulation for dads... so I'm afraid I'm gonna put the T V on now.
[Sandra:] Old er old American women.
[Simon:] Old [LAUGHTER] American women [].
[Alex:] I can put these trousers on straight away.
[Sandra:] Go on then, let's have a look and see how nicely you can put your trousers on.
[Alex:] Where's the
[Sandra:] At the front, and the zip's at the front as well.
[Alex:] What that?
[Sandra:] That's right....
[Simon:] Mum why did I bump into a chair?
[Sandra:] Why, when did you bump into a chair?
[Simon:] And I knocked it over.
[Sandra:] You should be looking where you were going.... shoes.
[Simon:] Why should I bump into
[Sandra:] Go on, carry on, that's it.
[Alex:] Mum somebody put sand in my pockets.
[Sandra:] Somebody put sand in your pocket? Where was that, from school?
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Another boy was it?
[Alex:] Yeah this...
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] This dead, dead what [] [LAUGHTER]
[Alex:] He's dead.
[Sandra:] He's dead is he? Will, you mean he will be if he puts sand in your pockets again?... Is he your friend? Well that was silly thing to do really wasn't it?... You don't put sand in people's pockets do you?
[Alex:] I know
[Simon:] You mean you never put sand in his pockets?
[Alex:] What?
[Simon:] You never put sand in his
[Sandra:] Get your own ba do you play in sand at school still?... Does it take, do they take you, you haven't got sand in your play room have you, in your classroom?...
[Alex:] No.
[Sandra:] Well where, how did... you have got sand in your classroom?
[Alex:] Yeah but, but I never saw it, oh no.
[Sandra:] Oh right, so where is it, up a corner? Cos there's not a lot of room in your classroom is there?... lot of room
[Alex:] Do you know what, there's so much room.
[Sandra:] desks and the tables and all the children. I thought you had to go off to another room, to a play room... to play in the sand?...
[Alex:] There's all water as well.
[Sandra:] Is there? What do you do in the water? What sort of things do you do?... There you go, you can put your clothes on now.
[Alex:] They're in the same room.
[Sandra:] They've got sand and water in their playground daddy. In their
[Garry:] What?
[Sandra:] in their classroom.
[Alex:] Uncomfortable.
[Sandra:] You're uncomfortable? Alright.... I bet they do put it out in the
[Alex:] They don't.
[Garry:] Simes... how, don't leave that lying around so put it on the side when you've finished.
[Sandra:] then you could play, you cold splash couldn't you? You can. it wouldn't matter where the water went. Have you zipped your zip, yeah? Where's your tie now? Put your tie on
[Alex:] I've got
[Sandra:] Okay right. Well pull that right up like that your collar so your collar sticks up. No put your tie on so it goes over your collar...... that's right, now it goes over your ti over your shirt collar at the back... and then that's it but you'll have to, you'll have to do it yourself soon, you know
[Alex:] Can you pull it down?
[Sandra:] No you've got it down, you flap the collar back down again.... And at the back, cos it's very stiff, you need to turn it right over.... Oh there you go, Simon's brought your shoes as well. Put your shoes on.
[Alex:] Simon, if you wear my shoes...... Yes?
[Simon:] Yeah....
[Alex:] And I'll let you look at that thing with
[Garry:] Okay?
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[Garry:] I know it's twelve minutes past... I need extra few minutes.
[Sandra:] Go on then. Daddy's going now
[Garry:] Kiss boys.
[Sandra:] kisses.
[Garry:] Hey, have a nice day [kiss]... Alex...
[Simon:] Alex, you're...
[Garry:] [kiss] Be good boys. Have a nice day at the theatre.
[Simon:] Alex, I'm not going.
[Garry:] Simon. You're not?
[Simon:] Course I'm going. Yes I will.
[Alex:] I'm just having one with no weapons
[Simon:] Yeah. No don't you take it... used to have one little......
[Alex:] I think I'll have a pink face. What?
[Simon:] I think this is the best turtle.
[Alex:] It's not the best turtle ever. Do you know the best turtle?... Mine is. you said. This one's just like... er... cos they've got them little round things. this one's trousers.
[Simon:] No they're just like jeans aren't they?
[Alex:] Yeah....
[Simon:] your weapons that they have.
[Sandra:] Come on boys, let's brush your hair. Have you both got your shoes on?
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] You've got about fifteen minutes to play for fifteen minutes now, then we have to go ut.
[Alex:] Why do they have to have weapons that they have?
[Simon:] These are just the real weapons.
[Sandra:] I bet Alex wishes he was going to the pantomime today.... You'll have to go another time won't you?...
[Alex:] Yeah, cos them aren't really weapons are they? They're just things... Er is that one Leonardo?
[Simon:] Yeah. Raphael. The other one's...
[Alex:] Simon, do you on their arms, very often, them little
[Simon:] You do, you do you do....
[Sandra:] Right. Simon... let's get on, you see that turtle? Give that to Robert, that's for Donna... so give them both to Robert but the adventure game's for Donna. There's your crisps. And that's yours as well.
[Alex:] Can I bring one? Can I can I bring?
[Simon:] Can you zip up?
[Alex:] No! Mum
[Sandra:] Yes?
[Alex:] Can I... can I bring one for Robert for when he comes out?...
[Sandra:] Erm
[Alex:] Can't I just bring one for him then?
[Sandra:] No, well
[Simon:] He'll have one, he'll have a turtle when he comes in....
[Sandra:] Have to give you your mum's
[Simon:] Yeah
[Sandra:] Now I need four pounds and so how am I gonna get four pounds out of a ten pound note?...
[Alex:] Simon!... [whingeing] Mum can I give one to Robert when he comes out of school?... Mum can I give one to Robert when he comes out of school []?
[Sandra:] Well not really no cos you... Simon can take them now
[Alex:] [whingeing] No can you just... []
[Sandra:] Oh don't put that whingeing tone on....
[Simon:] Okay. Do you wanna play it one go? And I'll be my two turtles and you be yours. The rock and roll ones....
[Alex:] Yeah we have to be two rock and roll ones each....
[Simon:] Yeah, I'll be that one.... You can have him you can have him.... And only a monkey.
[Alex:] I know.
[Simon:] And which two, which three? Right two
[Alex:] No I want them two.
[Simon:] No, no,th it doesn't count, that one doesn't. You want these three look.
[Alex:] Them two don't count do they?
[Simon:] No....
[Alex:] I know, I'll go from the... I know, let's start from the bottom....
[Simon:] One of those
[Alex:] [shouting] No let's start [] from the bottom....
[Simon:] No no, we'll just do the... right. Er if you, you can have... do you want a go like that? Right there and you want that one... that one... that one, the one under that one,... and you have and I have those two... these two... and you... and I have these two... and this one.... Oh let me work this out.
[Alex:] Yeah. Cos we can't do it. Right. We'd better start from the top.... Well I want them so I've got that one so I need that one now to go with it....
[Simon:] What?
[Sandra:] How many have you had then?
[Simon:] Three....
[Sandra:] How many altogether?
[Simon:] Er I dunno.
[Alex:] Mum, mum
[Sandra:] There's stacks of them in there.
[Alex:] I just want... trousers.
[Sandra:] Ooh goodness I'm not man's trousers.
[Alex:] Mum, do you know this one's trousers
[Simon:] No it's just they look like jeans.
[Sandra:] Oh right, oh he jus oh goodness they're soft but they ca not, they're rough rough
[Alex:] They're like jeans.
[Sandra:] And the rest of him's shiny and looks smooth doesn't it? Cos I thought of them as rough but
[Alex:] I know, oh. I wish we didn't have so many turtles so I can work it out better.
[Sandra:] let me see where I am
[Alex:] What?
[Sandra:] I'm just trying to sort out some papers here. They've got to go this morning.
[Alex:] Right. Simon, you've got Slash haven't you?... Simon you've got Slash... Simon do you know, Simon, you've got Slash haven't you?
[Simon:] Yeah, yeah, yeah! And I'm trying to...... but I'm trying to but I, but a person Mr Alex won't let him.
[Sandra:] Is that you?... Are you Mr Alex?...
[Alex:] Simon! Think we have to cut that bit off
[Simon:] No we won't.
[Alex:] Well cos it
[Simon:] We need it.
[Alex:] it's my piece.
[Simon:] We need it.
[Alex:] It's my piece.
[Simon:] We need it Alex when we... dad won't let us
[Alex:] I think I might have... that piece. piece cutting off here, I cut, do them out on the outsides first and then I'll go booooooooooo
[Sandra:] Right lads we're going out in five minutes, I don't know if you need to go to the toilet Alex?
[Alex:] there.
[Sandra:] Well you can do that you, well ten more, ten more minutes but do you need to go to the toilet before you go to school... Alex?
[Simon:] No.
[Sandra:] You went yesterday, do you need to go?... Okay.
[Alex:] No no.... Simon, we have to see which one we want.... You haven't got all the turtles here.
[Simon:] I've got all the rock and roll ones and the ones that we got yesterday....
[Alex:] Well we got the rock and roll ones... first... well they have, them two have to go together in a certain place cos them are all the rock and roll ones and them are not.... They're in a certain place.
[Simon:] Do you think he looks like that?
[Alex:] Yeah
[Simon:] like that....
[Alex:] Yeah because
[Simon:] We found out last night that he, you know them things that you lift up?
[Alex:] Yeah.
[Simon:] Th them funny things?
[Alex:] Them?
[Simon:] No... them things that you lift up, the metal things
[Alex:] Will you show
[Simon:] with the round ends...
[Alex:] Will you, will you w will you show me?
[Simon:] Right, like this. They look a bit like them wheels. You hold them like that. You hold them in the middle like that so you, it's strong....
[Alex:] Yeah.
[Simon:] Well it says on the back of the thing you take these off and use that, use them as that thing his hands....
[Alex:] Okay
[Simon:] No not we can't... we ca we can't do it, I tried it last night. Can't do it now....
[Alex:] Did you play with my turtles last night?
[Simon:] Yeah.
[Alex:] I know, I'll have my turtles now and you your turtles.
[Simon:] Swap him for him? Yeah?
[Alex:] Yeah.
[Simon:] No
[Alex:] No swap...
[Simon:] I said no. the best out of all the rock and roll turtles isn't it?...
[Alex:] No which one do you think out of yours... things?... out of yours? Him... or him, or him do you think?
[Simon:] I'll swap him if you want....
[Alex:] Yeah, yeah... no it's not!...
[Simon:] Okay.
[Alex:] Just said no swaps but
[Simon:] I know.
[Alex:] if I can swap back
[Simon:] Yeah that was alright I w I didn't tell you the truth when we said that, sorry!... You can't change.
[Alex:] I know
[Simon:] You can't change back now
[Alex:] I can.
[Simon:] You can't.
[Alex:] I'll do Pete's face.
[Simon:] [cough] I know where his leg is.
[Alex:] Where?
[Simon:] Upstairs.
[Alex:] In the box?...
[Garry:] [phonecall starts] We won't get it till next year.
[Sandra:] We've just got Fantasia haven't we?
[Garry:] We've just we've just got the rel release of Fantasia on video over here.... So... Ah.... I've se... Yeah, I've seen lo loads of things about looking into it and I, there was definitely [LAUGHTER] more than one shots []... you know and er... yeah, absolutely. Anyway look I'd better go.... Right... Right I'll er, I'll get this er, I'm just busy with, with school at the moment but I'll, I'll get the er whatsit off to you, the er... tt erm Beatles Monthly which I've got waiting here and I'll. Nice to talk to you Don... say hi to Debbie for us.... Okay thanks very much indeed... okay, bye [phonecall ends].... Oh!.... Quick.
[Sandra:] Are you prepared?
[Garry:] round the head with this....
[speaker007:] No we went in and erm... it was about er three or four minutes before we actually started and he just gave us this paper and he put sets of questions to the different types of differentiation
[speaker023:] Yeah
[Sandra:] and to each set they'd be any thing up to ten sub set questions, so er he says do what you can in er the hour, well it's not an hour, but it's fifty minutes
[speaker023:] not really no once you get every body in and you get started
[Sandra:] yeah and, and you look at the clock at five too, five too and that's it
[speaker023:] and you think you might of done and you're still stopping
[Sandra:] so we set off going and I thought well the first ones were, didn't ask for a proof of doing it, just asked to do it
[speaker023:] to do it, yeah
[Sandra:] so I started working through them, but without referring back to the notes that you know what some of them
[speaker023:] yeah, yeah
[Sandra:] differentiated to
[speaker023:] mm, mm
[Sandra:] so you really have to remember what some of them change into
[speaker023:] yeah yeah, like some of them
[Sandra:] you can, you
[speaker023:] like it ain't it?
[Sandra:] you can work out the mathematical ones
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] but the trigonometry ones you have to know what they turn into... I got some things, a couple of them I was... getting stuck on what I supposed to put and then I actually go too far on some 'em, I, I make them again you know
[speaker023:] yeah, yeah
[Sandra:] any way he's coming round
[speaker023:] you've not much proof you can prove them
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] huh, summat like that
[Sandra:] well you can get so far, but then I work the brackets out and you don't always have to work the brackets out
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] you leave them as a full
[speaker023:] themselves, yeah
[Sandra:] erm set of numbers, erm any way he was coming round and I just kept saying well I'm stuck a minute, he says why, I says it doesn't look right... he says well why doesn't it look right?, he said well why doesn't it look right?, I said look if I say it doesn't look right that's all I know, it just doesn't look right
[speaker023:] you daren't say that you don't understand any thing he says you've got to explain
[Sandra:] no I'd done it
[speaker023:] why you don't under
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] and you don't always know
[Sandra:] but I'd done it you see
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] but the answer didn't look right
[speaker023:] look right, yeah
[Sandra:] to the question
[speaker023:] so you couldn't
[Sandra:] well he's going through it and he said well it looks alright to me and I say well it doesn't look as if it's connected, any way I won, I could see why then it didn't look connected
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] erm, with because it was, erm... as the denominator and not an numerator one it was, it was one over
[speaker023:] but it was alright?
[Sandra:] so it was right any way subsequent to that he gave us one which... it was awkward working it out and then he gave us one over the same
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] I said I'm not working all that out again
[speaker023:] no just
[Sandra:] I just
[speaker023:] go over and do it all again do ya
[Sandra:] and then do a different rule
[speaker023:] yeah, yeah
[Sandra:] so he said yeah but there's another way you do it, I said well what's the point in doing it again, I've just done it one, he said well yes there's two ways of doing it
[speaker023:] he wants to see you doing it the other way as well
[Sandra:] no he didn't no
[speaker023:] no oh
[Sandra:] any way I got to the last one and it was... two combinations combined together, so you've got two separate combinations to do and then you're to put those two together in with a different rule
[speaker023:] do you know how I feel now, I said if she ain't saying yeah I'm gonna what you told me
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] you know what he said the first time we went into sociology [LAUGHTER] I mean [] I feel a bit like you must of felt then
[Sandra:] well I came out and I actually just finished them
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] I just did the last one, the next, the, the, the next to the last one erm, I said er, I can't remember what the differentiation of it is, he said you wouldn't you haven't done it, I said no we'd started to
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] I said I know it's an inverse, well he said if you know it's an inverse you're half way there
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] so he said well what's an inverse and an inverse?, I said it's back to the original
[speaker023:] back to what it is then, yeah
[Sandra:] he said that's all you need to know... so he actually showed me how to work it back
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] but I said look it's Wednesday lunch time, I haven't woke up yet, I don't wake up to Friday night
[speaker023:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] you know I'm still struggling [] and we were having a laugh, but the others who had him last term, said he was brilliant, because he actually combines work individually
[speaker023:] individually, yeah
[Sandra:] rather than works just going through it and hoping you all keep up
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] and we were saying last year we could of done with having him for a bit
[speaker023:] so er how's Jean coping with this alright?
[Sandra:] she was getting through them, they were just slower
[speaker023:] mm, mm
[Sandra:] but she was getting there, her and Bren were er conferring you see... I'd sort of gone through what I'd done and every now and again she'd say well I've done this and I'd say well it's right.
[speaker023:] Are her and Bren still in the, more or less the same boat, they kind of just, mustering through as it were?
[Sandra:] I think Jean's got more about her than Bren
[speaker023:] than Bren
[Sandra:] yes
[speaker023:] sort of, but neither of them are taking it on are they next year?
[Sandra:] yeah, well Bren is
[speaker023:] yeah, I don't think, is Jean, I got the impression like she wasn't, I don't know
[Sandra:] I think originally
[speaker023:] she'd done Russian studies and management or something
[Sandra:] originally she was going to do it, but there's a new one come in and she's decided to go on this management, managements and it's the new one
[speaker023:] that's right yeah
[Sandra:] it doesn't start till next year does it?
[speaker023:] mm, till the, the trial
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] it's a lot ain't they?
[Sandra:] somebody else I know er
[speaker023:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] somebody else's applied for it as well
[speaker023:] Dan's going for it he thinks
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] he, he isn't, he's a bit, up in the air I think at the moment, he doesn't know what he wants to do I don't think
[Sandra:] I mean I keep on saying if I found I couldn't do the maths I'd ditched I wouldn't go on
[speaker023:] but if, if if you could, the first year
[Sandra:] but I think, I think if I did flunk out on the maths side
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] I would look probably for another course
[speaker023:] he did strike me like how I'd feel about this because it's I mean it's, yes it's difficult, but yes I've got to do it and if I don't do it this, you'll have to do it again, so I thought well he took to me I'm the one that's going to get me through, not them
[Sandra:] I mean fortunately doing the maths
[speaker023:] it's the sort of thing you notice when you complain you might as well do
[Sandra:] yeah doing, doing the maths you see I don't have to do another science next year
[speaker023:] that's right, yeah
[Sandra:] cos it's already there
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] I don't know what, do you have any thing that you have to put in place if you don't do
[speaker023:] I know what you mean, you mean if you take maths under principle you're gonna have subsidized principle maths
[Sandra:] well you, you've only got to get to subsid science
[speaker023:] mm, mm that gives you subsid science
[Sandra:] yeah, so why would you have to do another one next year?
[speaker023:] you won't have to do another science next year will you?
[Sandra:] you've got to do another subsid
[speaker023:] maybe so, I don't know, I thought you only needed two subsids, unless a subsid in summat you take to doesn't count, but that that would never be what, what
[Sandra:] you see I've got two subsids now literally the transfer
[speaker023:] I don't really now
[Sandra:] and the subsid, sociology
[speaker023:] yes
[Sandra:] I work, er unless they say next year just
[speaker023:] you transfer most wasn't it?
[Sandra:] well yes cos
[speaker023:] to transfer you
[Sandra:] the only thing I wondered is if next year that you've got to do a subsidiary, and if you've not got a science you must do science
[speaker023:] not against another subsid I must admit
[Sandra:] no
[speaker023:] so specializing in that, you know, rather
[Sandra:] well the thing is in the end for all the subsidiaries that you pass it counts on the
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] final award...
[speaker023:] I mean I, this year if I get me physics and me, and me I wouldn't mind doing another one next year, but my choice, whatever I fancy at that time
[Sandra:] mm
[speaker023:] you know, like the biology I you know the biology's gonna be hard, I can tell that the maths gonna be hard, but I think I've got more of an interest in biology than physics, I mean I, I don't know if Jean's done any any biology
[Sandra:] I don't know
[speaker023:] you know I mean I've looked through the parasitology books I've got about two of 'em it's all cestodes and lima luminaries and and worse the jargon in biology
[Sandra:] it's, in biology what got me, when I did it, it's, it's, yeah
[speaker023:] the Latin names and most of the time
[Sandra:] the dictionary words that you have to remember
[speaker023:] mm, I mean I'm okay cos I've done my
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] although I haven't done particulary parasitology I know some of 'em, I've done bits of 'em, but like if you've never done biology it must be the same feeling again
[Sandra:] mm
[speaker023:] that you had in sociology that I
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] still get in the physics
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] you know you just still bewildered because you don't understand, I mean like I go to this night class and apparently I, I learn from it, but in actual fact I don't, I come out I get eight out of ten, nine out of ten, or ten out of ten and I haven't got a clue what it's about
[Sandra:] no
[speaker023:] and that, that to me is just a waste of time, no I mean I'm wasting their time and mine so
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] I'll have to get down to it...
[Sandra:] I don't... I don't know that I'd fancy doing, I mean I did like biology, but I don't think I'd specifically want to do the biology at the level that they're doing it up there, cos it's too much of a jump from what I've ever done before
[speaker023:] yes I think any thing at that level must be, you know, when you think well sociology yeah, nice, interesting, sociology at university level
[Sandra:] no it isn't though because it's
[speaker023:] again
[Sandra:] a tendency to be based on what you can read and what you understand of today's social problems, I mean every thing we've had so far apart from the industrial revolution and the history behind it
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] is being about today sociological problems
[speaker023:] yes yeah
[Sandra:] I mean like we've had er woman
[speaker023:] not too bad
[Sandra:] woman and children of the third world, well that's of today's problem, what about they show you how it was created, it's a problem of today
[speaker023:] yeah, yeah, yeah
[Sandra:] we had this day state ethnicity and racism, it was all about gypsies
[speaker023:] state technicity?
[Sandra:] state, it's three separate groups, state ethnicity and nationalism
[speaker023:] oh right yeah
[Sandra:] and they did it on gypsies
[speaker023:] did you, oh they, there and gypsies probably
[Sandra:] I don't know
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] that didn't crop up, what was
[speaker023:] they
[Sandra:] cropping up was erm... that they've got a very definite code of what is internal to them and what is external to them, it starts off what belongs in the camp and what belongs out of the camp
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] and outsiders you are not gypsies don't belong in the camp
[speaker023:] so the feeling of the gypsies to what to us is probably equally antagonistic as most people's attitude to gypsies
[Sandra:] then it's what belongs in the trailer as to what belongs out
[speaker023:] I felt sorry for the gypsies you know in Cross Street not Cross Street, they were on the festivals car park, you know the whole thing and I mean then he kicked them off didn't he, so they moved up to Cross Street so in a way it's their own fault, they could of let them stay there, I mean every body wants to be settled somewhere like Christmas as well don't they I suppose
[Sandra:] mm
[speaker023:] I felt sorry for 'em
[Sandra:] but, they, the way... the way they were, they got the, actually the... the woman, she's a girl, she's a doctor of sociology she's, she's barely out of her twenties she's not
[speaker023:] who?
[Sandra:] Sharon
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] absolutely brilliant lecturer she really was, she, she's on the antipology's staff
[speaker023:] seems to me though at that age you've got freshness and initiative
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] you know what I mean they haven't gone stagnate
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] and stale and bored with the job
[Sandra:] she
[speaker023:] still got the real interest there
[Sandra:] gave a lecture and all she came in with was some notes written out on some full scape paper and some papers for the over head projector
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] but she just... bowled over
[speaker023:] I think enthusiasm does go over
[Sandra:] and
[speaker023:] doesn't it?
[Sandra:] the hour had gone and we could of stayed probably another half an hour without realizing that the hour had come
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] and gone... and then we went to the tutorial and I'm afraid Harry just, phew, it's just like wind up session, you know you feel as if you want to cut, to get it going
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] but erm... he was on about certain aspects that he picked up from her, but having been in gypsy caravans round here, as when they were on Line Brook you see we were always at Line Brook for one reason or another
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] and they do have different standards, but I say they are different classes of the gy
[speaker023:] yeah, yeah
[Sandra:] the true gypsies are clean, it's the, what we call the tinkers, just the travellers that pop on a site and move on
[speaker023:] yeah yeah
[Sandra:] do a quick kill on the tarmac and see what goes on in the town and then they move on
[speaker023:] redefine rubbish and move on yeah
[Sandra:] but there used to be a caravan down here, I'm not joking the value of stuff that was in it, was unbelievable and it was so clean and every thing had a place and it was all mirrored inside, cos he liked the mirrors and, or glass work, oh it was beautiful
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] stuck in the middle of that dumpy site
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] but the site was... they did their own down fall with the first ones that went on it, cos they ripped out all the water pipes and the toilets and the, they, they literally decimated the site so the Council said oh they're not doing it again
[speaker023:] any more, yeah me sister was saying that this, cos she lives opposite
[Sandra:] the thousand of pounds
[speaker023:] er
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] so of course they're against it
[Sandra:] they threw it all in the brook
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] so they refused to do it up, well the result was over the years the pot holes down to the sites got bigger and they're so far off the road from
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] Brook Lane, but... well what you couldn't see you didn't know about, we used to take the cars down there it was nightmare and when you got down there, there was always the dogs roaming around and
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] but there was some nice people
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] but there was some rough ones
[speaker023:] yeah, I thought it's worth
[Sandra:] but I mean when you start looking at what the topics are in sociology, there's nothing really...
[speaker023:] tha that you haven't got some
[Sandra:] if you've got a ma if you've got a mature mind
[speaker023:] and another thing, yeah
[Sandra:] I would think for some of the younger ones who haven't seen or read a lot in the papers of where, what's going on
[speaker023:] we said that last year to our Neville and found it very boring
[Sandra:] it might be very difficult and it could be
[speaker023:] mm, mm
[Sandra:] boring, but when you've got that experience of, you've seen these things occur
[speaker023:] well when they start talking about how hard done two women are
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] and how easy men have it, you know what I mean, a little bit of you saying oh yeah, yeah, yeah that happened to me I know it could
[Sandra:] well I mean we had one girl didn't know what she was going about, but, you know, women don't have all the work to do in the house and her dad helps at weekends and I said well who made the decision in the first place to do what
[speaker023:] after the weekend [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] well we help with the dinner, but I said who was it that decided what you're having and got the ingredients together and had decided
[speaker023:] and the fact you're going to help her with the dinner, huh
[Sandra:] and she kept on about, but we help, I said but who do you help?
[speaker023:] she can't identify though with a woman that's kind of been mild and had kids
[Sandra:] and, er well I did say er are you married?, no, will you be having any children?, definitely not, I said well unless you're prepared to... take on the responsibility
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] of a home and a family that a woman has with children, you've got no right to criticise
[speaker023:] no, no
[Sandra:] oh we had quite a heated argument about it
[speaker023:] you can only learn I think from your, from your experience and yet it's something every body has to go through
[Sandra:] personal experience, yeah
[speaker023:] isn't it that? that
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] breaking away and realizing just how, you know how mucky a house is
[Sandra:] so it is so easy when you're only helping on a side line because you're not doing any of the thought processing
[speaker023:] you probably think you put a lot into, yeah, it's the remind as well I think like the constant remind of you were the one that takes responsibility for birthdays and for Christmas presents
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] and for writing letters and
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] you know maybe helping neighbours and
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] like things I suppose men don't think of
[Sandra:] I sat there and
[speaker023:] not because they can't
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] but because they've never been taught, you know taught to do that sort of thing
[Sandra:] I sat there last night I actually I'm on the way to the post office cos I got the erm form back for claiming for Christmas holidays
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] and they're asking erm for a copy of the grant
[speaker023:] again [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] again which they've had haven't they?, for how many weeks in the year do you actually attend cos I said that you don't get grant for the holidays and it stipulates the term
[speaker023:] you don't get it for Easter
[Sandra:] you don't get it
[speaker023:] you get so much for Easter, don't you, but none for the summer, they give you twenty odd quid for Easter and twenty odd quid for Christmas
[Sandra:] well with the dependents allowance you get so much with it
[speaker023:] yeah, yeah
[Sandra:] but apparently you see the terms are split up and you actually don't get any thing when you're not in on
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] the terms, well the grant form shows what the terms are
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] so I said well it cost us just so many weeks though, I've put it in again, I've, I'm sending it back today in the hope that they will come up with a decision in the next week, cos usually once they've got the information they'll write back say within ten days yes or no
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] but erm
[speaker023:] I'm thinking about this thing, new what sort of representative sample, where they get the whole thing random, I think they just go and knock at doors, take out every so many names off the list
[Sandra:] must be
[speaker023:] of so many men and so many women, of today
[Sandra:] er I think
[speaker023:] er a class difference
[Sandra:] I think she's got a quota
[speaker023:] mm, mm
[speaker008:] ...
[speaker023:] so many of each type or
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] each age, age group or whatever
[Sandra:] give a fair representation
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] oh well this P C F A er Trish
[speaker023:] maybe us
[Sandra:] er the, the woman who I meet up at you know who works in the coffee shop she was there
[speaker023:] oh yeah she was there
[Sandra:] she's
[speaker023:] oh they've got some stuff there
[Sandra:] blimey she said meeting you here, well she sat chatting to Emma all night
[speaker023:] I haven't seen her for ages
[Sandra:] they were laughing and giggling up the corner... and er, I mean I did go just to let them know that although I did say I wouldn't come to every meeting I was quite prepared to still do
[speaker023:] mm, mm
[Sandra:] what I could
[speaker023:] did Joe come with you
[Sandra:] oh he would
[speaker023:] because he didn't wanna stay in or
[Sandra:] he wants, cos he wants to go every where I go
[speaker023:] to see what you're doing, what you're up to
[Sandra:] to see what's going on
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] and I said well your be bored, no I won't, and about half past eight, which I thought well we should be finishing by now, he said well aren't we going?... I said well we will be going and it finally finished at nine o'clock, erm, the... the topics under discussion are all really relevant...
[speaker023:] mm, mm
[Sandra:] but they sort of get carried away slightly
[speaker023:] yeah you all follow
[Sandra:] and chit chat gets going some where else
[speaker023:] yeah and then you go in with that conversation instead of the one you should of
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] but er, they've got to get a new mini bus apparently, there in two years, which we new and er... because like every thing else, it's funded by the school not the authorities
[speaker023:] mm, mm
[Sandra:] but
[speaker023:] well have they got to get rid of staff or not?, cos the school that Gary's at now they had like an emergency meeting on Monday
[Sandra:] mm
[speaker023:] it was supposed to be a normal meeting but he changed it to talk about the cuts you know the on saving education, he said that I supposed to get the six teachers, he said I'm gonna get rid of five he said and if I possible can I'm going to make it four, that gotta remember those of you who are on protected salaries erm you again the pay and a half other members of staff and he said he wanted voluntary redundancies and early retirements where possible, you know, and also he hadn't supposed to tell for a month so this will come out later in the year and he says I'm telling you know he says because the next twenty eight days, it's an extra twenty eight days to go and have a look for another job
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] if you want to, but Gary's pretty sure that he won't be one of 'em
[Sandra:] he hopes but then
[speaker023:] well that's the problem
[Sandra:] if nobody
[speaker023:] thing is though if it did happen
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] at least were, were covered
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] you know, but I mean at the moment I keep, he's coming home some nights and, you know it like, he'll come home and say I had a really good morning the kids were great, but as for the afternoon, and like he said when you're teaching you're only as good as your last lesson, you know
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] so I thought he, he's changing things he's saying well I don't think this is suitable and I don't think my way of tackling this is suitable because he's used to dealing with different kids, although they're a similar age, they're not very motivated or mighty but they're more motivated than these kids, but he says like he'll turned back towards the black board and he'll be writing and they're shouting abuse at him, F ing and blinding and he says it makes me so angry because I don't know the voices well enough to know who's saying it
[Sandra:] mm
[speaker023:] you know, it is just so frustrating, you know and er some of these kids he said and the language they use, one girl came in, she hadn't been in for three or four days, he hadn't met her and he said hello you must be such and such er fuck you [LAUGHTER] you know, I mean, he'd never even met the girl before, he said it's very you know distressful and demoralizing
[Sandra:] mm
[speaker023:] but he seems to be mustering through any way
[Sandra:] no telling cos
[speaker023:] cos he's got to really more than you can
[Sandra:] tell him to watch To Sir With Love
[speaker023:] oh dear
[Sandra:] and then
[speaker023:] oh it, er, yeah
[Sandra:] because he had exactly the same problems when he moved in
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] and he's attitude was in the end well if you don't want the education as it comes, we'll teach you the education that you want and the first thing was
[speaker023:] well
[Sandra:] was to respect each other and that
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] was my essay, I wrote in to the education was that, the top and bottom of personal discipline
[speaker023:] mm, mm
[Sandra:] was the self respect for you and a respect for others
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] and the discipline is only there out of respect
[speaker023:] hanging out the window shouting abuse at one another coming up the corridors
[Sandra:] yeah, yeah
[speaker023:] don't
[Sandra:] but the thing is I was reading this erm, I was reading another book on this erm
[speaker023:] you haven't read another book Sandra, that's two books, goodness
[Sandra:] I've not got through them all, I was just reading selective pieces
[speaker023:] bits, yeah
[Sandra:] the trouble with this is it's an American book so it's a bit, I call it biased, erm on erm the betrayal of children on, on the way that they're not in childhood for very long and it blames literacy, that the more the literate the child becomes
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] the earlier the literacy developed
[speaker023:] will become a
[Sandra:] the sooner they become independent
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] and this idea of childhood being up until sixteen, eighteen years of age, was only
[speaker023:] shows at nine now aren't they
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] you know shows at
[Sandra:] would develop only after the sixteen century
[speaker023:] mm, mm, yes, yeah
[Sandra:] in the middle ages
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] children were grown up when they were eight and nine because they were working
[speaker023:] that's right, cos of the more responsible than they are now
[Sandra:] it's only changed with the, the revolutions that said that
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] children were not allowed to be employed for different lengths of times and social change
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] change the way that we thought children ought to be and educa
[speaker023:] it is education isn't it, they arrange them in a class
[Sandra:] yes and it's the education that is made children literate early on in life
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] and it's the literacy that just de made them into child adults
[speaker023:] like the it's, it's industrialization it's education
[Sandra:] mm
[speaker023:] it's capitalism
[Sandra:] one, one of the
[speaker023:] got to be
[Sandra:] one of the criticisms that has come out on this one book was that... because the, these child adults are skilled and put into education, they maybe still illiterate, but they are street wise, they are literate of the street
[speaker023:] oh right I think, I think I was gonna say not non
[Sandra:] and, yeah
[speaker023:] literate, but less literate
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] kids are, aren't they?
[Sandra:] but they don't want education
[speaker023:] that's what I think any way mm
[Sandra:] because education changes their social standing, takes them off the street... and then they're not at the level that they were, young adults, they're children again
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] and they don't want it
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] but when they actually get into which country, I mean, this, one of these books as I say it was only published in nineteen eighty eight and statistics in it are as recent
[speaker023:] mm, mm
[Sandra:] as it was published, she does make allowances, she says some of the statistics I upgraded at the publication of the book
[speaker023:] yeah yeah
[Sandra:] so there were nineteen eighty eight's statistics, some were the year before
[speaker023:] mm, I was gonna say the stuff that gave us last year it's was nineteen eight, eight, eighty nine
[Sandra:] yeah, but when
[speaker023:] only about two years behind the
[Sandra:] when, when you looked at which country had problems with education with children
[speaker023:] Britain, America yeah
[Sandra:] well we were considered to be fortunate that we didn't, we only had a small percentage that we had a problem with
[speaker023:] yeah...
[Sandra:] but America's rising child population who were becoming street wise and illiterate
[speaker023:] mm, mm
[Sandra:] and out of education, but countries like Italy were all ready were a bit like South America
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] they had street children... and they have the leather sweat shops, most of the children from eight, nine
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] work in he leather shops making all these cheap leather bags and purses
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] and belts that you've got on the market
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] and they're earning approximately twenty five pound a week
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] and they're saying well why go to school, because if I go I give up that income, half goes to mum
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] who they only see when they care to go home
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] and the rest of it is spent on erm... arcade machines
[speaker023:] yeah, yeah
[Sandra:] and fast food
[speaker023:] plus what will they get out the educational system any way
[Sandra:] well apparently the education system in Italy is so... poor
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] it's been destroyed, the buildings that they use have got no equipment, they've
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] got no desk and chairs they're actually using
[speaker023:] so they're probably better off in the sweat shop any way
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] so why bother
[Sandra:] they're actually using old ware houses in places
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] and old industrial buildings that they've just taken over and when there's a crisis in the housing, the state takes over the schools and uses them as refugee centres
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] so, I mean, one school turned out to be an old factory and it was of six floors and it had one of these like industrial lifts, you know, the open caged lifts
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] so the staff use that and the children had to go up six flights of stairs
[speaker023:] yes, yeah
[Sandra:] and it was in a back ally way and
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] the people who were going round these different countries
[speaker023:] that, that'll be here sooner
[Sandra:] if we follow on the same way
[speaker023:] governments the same yeah
[Sandra:] erm, I think probably because our education system... developed more so with the industrial change
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] and we were geared more to... progress in the education system where the industrial change in the other countries didn't happen at the same time and that they needed now a younger ag a younger age group to keep the, the industrial system going
[speaker023:] mm, mm
[Sandra:] that their education system's failing
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] but, I mean ours is heading the same way with this rebellious education
[speaker023:] all the things that's like and ours, I say with ours they're cutting back and cutting back all the time until I mean it's under funded now, it's under staffed already, thirty seven, thirty eight in the class, so what do they do now, they want to save seven million on education
[Sandra:] I must admit that, that
[speaker023:] and more teachers going that's an even bigger crisis
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] and yet they've got to implement
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] the national curriculum to all these stats tests
[Sandra:] yeah,do
[speaker023:] do you know I mean and
[Sandra:] there was a paragraph erm
[speaker023:] there's not in a day
[Sandra:] a paragraph at the end of one of the chapters and, I can't remember the exact words but in, what it meant was that for the parents who do restrain the children from what they watch
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] where they go, and that the education they receive, they are part and parcel of it
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] Chris said one of the biggest failings was that parents did not... take part in the education of the children, this is where it fell down, that, once the education was seen as a government thing that
[speaker023:] take control of the best as the parent, that's not
[Sandra:] they'd taken control from the parent, and the parents quite readily gave that control to the state, they no longer had parental control
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] so when they wanted to, to, to have a discipline in the home, they couldn't have it, because they didn't take part in the education and then
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] time that the education was put back to the parents to enforce both
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] part of their early literacy
[speaker023:] but if you do try to the education you'll conflicting whatever they're teaching up there aren't you?, and then ya
[Sandra:] the end cha, the end of the chapter said that if parents were to re-take on the role of educating and disciplining children within the home
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] to what they watched, the times that they were in
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] and that they took more erm... more emphasis on the way their lives developed
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] they might seen from the child's point of view as interfering parents, but in the long term
[speaker023:] this is what's er all about power and power though
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] isn't it
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] and the government
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] give you the impression that you've got a parents child, you've got a parents right
[Sandra:] but they've said that in the end
[speaker023:] it doesn't mean a thing
[Sandra:] that those children would be the ones that survive
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] the social revolution from education back to illiteracy
[speaker023:] mm... now
[Sandra:] cos they said it was all to do with social status
[speaker023:] yes, well you know actually you say that because like here I, I do, I mean I, I got all these books for Alex and I want to help him and I want him to have an advantage, but I don't want it to cause problems at school
[Sandra:] mm
[speaker023:] because he can read the first two books, now how they'll do it with him, he'll have to just look at the pictures and he'll go back to square one, and I've had him actually writing his words, doing letter formation, A, B, C, D
[Sandra:] yeah, but some books, in the books, in the book shop for sale doing that
[speaker023:] I'll have a look, but I've had him doing actual words, like first words er, you know erm, Ben and large and in and out and just the, the easy words and Luke and his own name, so he is already got the idea that when you write a letter you can't just write any letter, you've got to make letters say something either as erm, as an alphabet or in the form of words, so of course she says to, would you all like to write me a sentence, well he's already passed that stage, he thinks himself well I can't write a sentence, what he knows as a sentence consists of words that make sense, so they're all sitting there going a N, N, N, Q, R, S, N, T, T, and they're saying a sentence like I went to the shops with my nanny, well Alex has already passed that stage, he knows that that isn't sensible, so he must of turned to her and he said, I can't write like that, my mummy will shout at me
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] you know she told me about it, she says I think I must mention it and I said okay I won't do it any more and she said oh please do it, we need you to do it she said especially the letter formation, she says what just try and encourage him to write any old letters, just to make sure that he can form them without copying them
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] you with me?, cos I'm having him going over my words, but I felt really guilty about that, because I, the thought that he was frightened of me shouting at him and yet I think it's to do with passing over of all authority, I've been teaching him, I'm the one that does the words, not her
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] now he's got to transfer that authority, I don't think it's any more or less than that
[Sandra:] no
[speaker023:] you know what I mean, but the fact that I have been helping him has already conflicted and he hasn't been in school a week, you know, and then eventually when they get those books out and he'll say oh I know that one, that says Luke
[Sandra:] mm
[speaker023:] then again think what, what the hell is she gonna do with him and yet I keep saying to myself I shouldn't do it and then another bit of me saying why shouldn't I do it, why shouldn't I have to
[Sandra:] because every bit of encouragement you
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] give him now
[speaker023:] the younger I think, yeah
[Sandra:] it's got to pay off, because he won't be struggling at the end of this year to be trying to read and write, he will of achieved that
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] and when the learning process of new material comes along, he's not still struggling on learning how to read and write
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] because you see the one's who still can't read properly have
[speaker023:] you see when they get to eleven
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] and they can't remember
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] they don't seem clever boys
[Sandra:] yeah, they have difficulty then picking up new material
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] because they can only accept what's given verbally, they can't read for themselves... oh I don't know
[speaker023:] no stopping him [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] but... I mean I, like I said, I volunteered to go and help with this, I ain't heard back from him yet
[speaker023:] no
[Sandra:] but that was the whole purpose to sort of volunteering on that, because I know that
[speaker023:] mm, would like, I think Chesterton at high school up at the swimming baths he's classed, it's nearly up to temperature
[Sandra:] oh cheers
[speaker023:] because the one it's so, don't go
[Sandra:] no, but, I mean our can read and he could read when he left the first class, he did really well
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] he's perception of early words...
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] I mean he grasped what the word, he grasped the way she taught him and he soon learnt to read and he could retain those words
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] I don't say he retains as much now
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] but reading
[speaker023:] I mean the thing is their own
[Sandra:] he, with last night somebody had, had erm birthday that, sort of his to be, group, she's, her daughter is forty odd, but she still helps out down at the school
[speaker023:] yes
[Sandra:] and er, they sent her er bouquet and a card for her birthday, she was seventy, and she wrote a letter back and she passed it around for every body to read, and... there was, in her writing, which was very clear
[speaker023:] yes
[Sandra:] and in it was the word appreciation, now, he'd probably seen the word before, but he didn't know the word
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] but he worked through and he managed to get out that it said appreciation
[speaker023:] yeah, yeah
[Sandra:] now, now I know if me sister's lad had got that
[speaker023:] he would have to
[Sandra:] he would have, he wouldn't be able to do it
[speaker023:] yeah, yeah
[Sandra:] and he would be only able to pick out a lot of the basic words, he could probably pick out the beginning of appreciation
[speaker023:] mm, yes
[Sandra:] but then he'd probably guess the rest of it where
[speaker023:] yes
[Sandra:] as John stopped guessing the rest of it, he now works out what it says
[speaker023:] yeah, yeah
[Sandra:] so I'm, I mean they do say that his reading ability he's, he's
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] up to standard
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] he's
[speaker023:] see he was not as pretty good as the other, I wouldn't like to say whether he could really turn up the application
[Sandra:] his writing yeah
[speaker023:] or something
[Sandra:] his writing's like mine
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] and I bear no... responsibility for it
[speaker023:] responsibility [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] but I did go into her and I said look, he's got my sympathy
[speaker023:] got my writing [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] he is just like me he's brain is going too fast for the pencil
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] and he has to write it down, so you have to get it
[speaker023:] well if he gets it right
[Sandra:] however it comes
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] and because he's going so fast
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] he's writing gets faster than he can do it neat
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] so he j, now he does make an effort in some of his books and, I mean they say write small, I mean on one page if he wrote any smaller I need a ma
[speaker023:] yeah, yes
[Sandra:] I need it under a microscope, it's so, and I said John you can't write that small, but she said write small and I said but, that is ridiculous
[speaker023:] small, yeah, it, yeah
[Sandra:] and
[speaker023:] see that's what they said, oh you're writing too big
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] keep it small so before you know, you know, it's usually like you know
[Sandra:] and they don't actually, yeah
[speaker023:] you need a microscope don't you to see it
[Sandra:] they're not actually printing, as soon as they can form the words, they join them
[speaker023:] well I was, I was get, I was just about to mention that
[Sandra:] I didn't like that
[speaker023:] you don't think it's right
[Sandra:] no
[speaker023:] I don't think it's right, my niece Sue doesn't think it's right, they're doing it in school, it's part of the national curriculum, as soon as they can form the letters now, they join them, I said I go to King university and I don't join up my letters
[Sandra:] no
[speaker023:] and you know it isn't stopping me
[Sandra:] why, why is the necessity though to accept joined writing
[speaker023:] it's back again to the old fashioned set, I mean I think nothing looks so untidy as to joined writing
[Sandra:] Howard... he, he joins them in so many varied ways
[speaker023:] mm, well, yeah
[Sandra:] it's not uniformed for the whole sentence
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] the same letters joined together
[speaker023:] once you get a bad habit and it slows your writing down as well
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] I've noticed how Simon's like that
[Sandra:] if he was to print
[speaker023:] very disjointed
[Sandra:] and then just joined those that were easy to join together and building it up that way, but he's doing curls on the bottom of G's and
[speaker023:] right and X like that?
[Sandra:] yeah, and
[speaker023:] I think it's ludicrous, it's old fashion isn't it?, he doesn't even real, what we used to call real writing
[Sandra:] no it isn't even proper joined up writing
[speaker023:] it's fancy isn't it?
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] it's like the, cos I keep saying if you must do those F's you do it at school I said, but do not do them for me, I said if you do I do not want to see them, but again you've got a conflict there between home and school
[Sandra:] well I think, I think his writing's
[speaker023:] and it must reflect on children
[Sandra:] got to be standardized, that it's legible, to teach them all to write as an individual allows them this
[speaker023:] that isn't, well that isn't given 'em individuality is it?
[Sandra:] well in the sense that they can all adopt their own way of joining words together
[speaker023:] if he lets 'em do that, but they're not are they?, you know, you've got to do your F like that, only like you say write letters and then, you know, join 'em, or you know join 'em as you write them
[Sandra:] but he's, he's aren't jo, our John's aren't uniform
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] he's squiggle
[speaker023:] one thing about Simon's I mean he's
[Sandra:] his join up in so many varied ways
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] like a G they will join up in exactly the same way next time he does it, even to the same letter
[speaker023:] I'm with you yeah, see Sam's got some learning, when he comes to spellings to me, again I would, I would print... yeah, he only scrawled that down last night, he says I've got some spellings on sports mum, I said do you know any of 'em?, he said no, I said when's you test?, he says Friday, well I gotta book on all sports and then I read it because sports and you think hockey's one of them, oh yeah, racket, which is spelt wrong I've had to, I think it's got a U in, but again I mean sometimes, I mean I'm a good speller, I don't know about you, but I look at them sometimes and I have to go and get the dictionary have to check em
[Sandra:] mm
[speaker023:] you can see how he spelt croquet
[Sandra:] mm
[speaker023:] I think it is C R O U Q U E T.
[Sandra:] it is, mm
[speaker023:] but it's like you see, he gives them spellings and he puts perhaps three or four wrong in twenty and they're supposed to come home and check 'em, meanwhile he leaves them on the board for a whole week, which I think I've told you before
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] now when I don't get them till Wednesday night or Thursday night, I've got no chance of helping him really
[Sandra:] no
[speaker023:] actually I think he'll be alright with most of 'em, the problem he'll have is wi with racket and croquet, the, the others I think he'll be okay on it
[Sandra:] if he let's join in the K, you, your lad had the same problem as I with John.
[speaker023:] mm, mm.
[Sandra:] If you're going to teach joined up writing, there is a way of writing a K with a little loop that you can join up
[speaker023:] that's right, yeah, yeah
[Sandra:] but they are ending up draw, actually doing literally a capital K and then just joining it up, which is not
[speaker023:] and then joining it, well yeah yeah
[Sandra:] joined writing
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] they're effectively having to re-write the word
[speaker023:] yes
[Sandra:] instead of it flowing
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] if, I said, I said to John
[speaker023:] you see them with A's, they tend to do the A and then they join it at the top
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] I mean, and that's how Mr does it
[Sandra:] Mr said, it's not
[speaker023:] well can't we parents do something about this?, I mean were
[Sandra:] well this
[speaker023:] supposed to have parent power aren't we?
[Sandra:] well we had a parents' meeting on Monday night, but I didn't realize there was one
[speaker023:] the trouble is though when you have these meetings you go and people say well I don't agree with this and I don't agree with that and somebody says well this isn't the matter for the P T A this is a matter for the governors and then when you try and, like Gary I'll go and approach with the governors, surely this isn't a matter for the governors, this really ought to be, you know, the, the P, of the P T A
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] or they
[Sandra:] but I mean I can see that for he's got, he's doing exactly the same, literally a capital K in the middle of joined writing
[speaker023:] mm, yeah
[Sandra:] if you're going to join a K... you, you, you should, I mean joined writing to me should be a soften version
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] it should be a flowing version and to do a capital K like that is not exactly join
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] I don't think I even join up some, I mean there's lots of words I do
[speaker023:] I don't think you can join up every letter cos when I've
[Sandra:] you can't
[speaker023:] tried to do joined writing, apparently we are supposed to do that as teachers, actually said gotta put their primary on primary education, it says sit down and write a poem in joined up writing and look at your own writing and before you try to teach it to children make sure that you know
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] what your look, same with your letter forage, I think mostly we were taught letter formation, which we haven't been for a few years now
[Sandra:] mm
[speaker023:] all of a sudden were going back on, on to it, aren't they?, so when I was my eldest he was, he was
[Sandra:] I mean I
[speaker023:] writing properly and
[Sandra:] but somebody like our John who's
[speaker023:] take my hand
[Sandra:] been doing joined writing since he was nine
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] and it's, it's better than it was, but it still doesn't have
[speaker023:] but he's two years older than our Simon isn't he, our Simon's only nine now
[Sandra:] he doesn't have to it
[speaker023:] mm, you saying that at least the future, you doing it, do it uniform
[Sandra:] yeah, if you, follow
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] the same rules, don't just say to them well, I know they must give them they give
[speaker023:] Sandra you got time to sit, sit and do it with him, like I tried to do with Simon or
[Sandra:] he won't do it he won't work at home
[speaker023:] that's right
[Sandra:] he said at the end of the day I've had enough
[speaker023:] had enough, yeah
[Sandra:] and I, I mean that's another objection... he's going to go
[speaker023:] why do you send him to school and then have to do school's work?
[Sandra:] no, no, I'd rather him
[speaker023:] give them the responsibility
[Sandra:] I'd rather him come home with half an hours work
[speaker023:] we've had this up there yeah
[Sandra:] because if he comes in from school he knows he's got half an hours work
[speaker023:] something productive from school yeah, yeah
[Sandra:] you at least can keep up with what he's doing because you can see
[speaker023:] that's right, yeah
[Sandra:] what he's doing
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] otherwise you've only got two open days when you
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] can go and, alright you can go in and tell him right
[speaker023:] the more you tell them, the more they left you know, even when you say to them what did you do at school?, then what did you do?, oh nothing much it was
[Sandra:] but if he comes in with some work, you can keep on the check of the standard that they're up to
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] without having to keep going up to school, cos if you say to them oh well I'm coming to see, oh what you coming for?
[speaker023:] well that's what education's all about isn't it?, completely blocking the parents out
[Sandra:] plus at the end of the day when he comes in, you've at least got the chance to say right, you've got your homework to do, switch every thing off,sw put all these machines away and
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] do your homework
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] but now they haven't got any thing to do because their curriculum says
[speaker023:] even when you go in though too, I mean you say, well it's, it's voluntary homework
[Sandra:] it's voluntary, if they say to them
[speaker023:] can't you go and say I volunteer that my son has [LAUGHTER] homework []
[Sandra:] no
[speaker023:] [LAUGHTER] every night []
[Sandra:] if, if, if he says I've done it in class and I don't want to finish it off at home, that's fair enough, but what's gonna happen when he gets to secondary level and he's got this idea that if he doesn't finish it in class, that's it, he doesn't do it, he won't finish learning the topic
[speaker023:] mm, well we've been told this with Simon, you know needs to get to standard with them, with maths in particularly, before he goes up to secondary level... you know because
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] secondary builds on what you've learnt in primary it's like maths only, int it?
[Sandra:] mm
[speaker023:] it builds on what you've learnt before
[Sandra:] but I honestly
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] do not feel that to say at eight, nine years of age, you see the little one's bring reading books home
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] because they've got to keep that reading going
[speaker023:] I know Simon never brings reading
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] books, I have to go in and say
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] can he have a reading book, well he's on level thirteen, he's doing well, but
[Sandra:] well, I always do it through the infants, they bring home reading books
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] and then it stops, they can bring a book home, but
[speaker023:] but it's choice
[Sandra:] it's choice again, they read in class
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] and they keep their reading books from the li their library... going at the pace they want to go at
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] and they don't have to bring them home, well John's got books at home, but it's like every thing else, he's too busy with the games machines and the television to be bothered to get a book out
[speaker023:] why don't you borrow theirs?, I've got, I've said that an all, all along they're actually good, should let your John have a look at these, some parts of it are boring, or some parts are really nice like the electric grade and, you know the fireworks
[Sandra:] oh yeah
[speaker023:] over there the show case and every thing
[Sandra:] yeah he might like that
[speaker023:] you know you can always fast forward it till it gets it right, but you've got all the characters coming round you know in all these cars and all
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] lite up and every thing
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] and there's bits of sea world on it... I'm just trying to think, erm and little bits of M G M Studios, and stuff like that... well erm
[Sandra:] I mean we went, we were last night, so, I mean he actually videoed er Battlestar Galaticca
[speaker023:] yeah you said yesterday
[Sandra:] so what had, so what had we got on this morning
[speaker023:] Battlestar Galaticca
[Sandra:] but briar to that we've got this game show, you know, a bit like er Blind Date and I mean I can't stand them any way, and I'm thinking I haven't got the patience in the morning when I've got dinners to put up and I've got them to get going
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] to spend every minute of that hour arguing
[speaker023:] well, yeah, yeah
[Sandra:] but I, I'd never get them done, and I mean I'd fed Matthew and I shouted down and I said look you'll have to come and get him dressed cos I've got dinners to put up yet
[speaker023:] yeah
[Sandra:] and it took me as long to put the dinners up and clean the shoes and I thought well he's swimming, so I got his togs and put 'em in his bag and
[speaker023:] mm
[Sandra:] it wasn't until we got to school, he says, guess what I've forgotten?, I says what's that?, me swimming stuff, well I said that's your fault, I said you
[speaker023:] I think there is a point at which you do have to
[Sandra:] yeah
[speaker023:] respond to it, I tend to do things like that
[Sandra:] I said I'm sorry, but you've had all...
[speaker007:] And also because... there's usually a waiting list to get on.
[speaker024:] Oh God! Yeah! Yeah. Sure there is.
[Sandra:] But er, the woman who used to run it er, I mean, I don't know whether she's still there, Doreen. She used to still be there. And then er, there was another woman occasionally. Erm... but I think she's stopped, I don't know whether Doreen still does it or whether retired from it.
[speaker024:] Oh! Mm.
[Sandra:] But er... I mean, these went to her. They didn't go to playgroup sessions, but they just went the mums and toddler session.
[speaker024:] Oh! Oh I see!
[Sandra:] See the mums and toddlers
[speaker024:] It's different sessions.
[Sandra:] you stayed with them.
[speaker024:] Oh! I see.
[Sandra:] Mums and toddlers you stayed... and you supervise your own child.
[speaker024:] Oh no! I wasn't thinking about that, I was thinking about the playgroup downstairs.
[Sandra:] Well, there is playgroup where you leave them.
[speaker024:] I know, cos I used to take, er take Freddie up there er, when he used to he does
[speaker010:] Ah!
[Sandra:] Oh!
[speaker024:] swimming now.
[speaker010:] It's there you are you just put your finger in there a
[speaker024:] But
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker010:] couple of times.
[speaker024:] he used to go that
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] play, when his mum had this... thing in the
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] and then the rest er, you know, but... most of it's.
[speaker010:] Cor! This is.
[Sandra:] Oh!
[speaker024:] She says she was supposed to be bring the money. She says, she says it's, she gets one thing and... and
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] And they keep saying, why? She says well you'll. They get it, you know. Takes on it all she does
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] really. I mean, there's, he's only.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] You know, just talking to him now... he's obviously getting back at her. And they always said, we always say this... should get he all? He's gonna get nothing!
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] And er
[speaker010:] . Do you wanna get out? Can you fasten that?
[speaker024:] I don't know. And we've got new
[speaker010:] He did then.
[speaker024:] About catalogue... thing.
[Sandra:] We haven't heard yet.
[speaker024:] Oh haven't you?
[Sandra:] No. Cos we presume he's still got to come.
[speaker024:] Oh!
[Sandra:] Cos they said, you know, sort of Christmas time.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And his mum rang up... er, and he hadn't been, but he hadn't come as yet so er... What you doing? Er
[speaker007:] Oh! John!
[Sandra:] She's er
[speaker007:] Nan, cartoons
[Sandra:] she's out to lunch.
[speaker007:] just come on!
[speaker024:] Yeah okay. There's been such a lot of faff about so Is that up?
[speaker010:] It's been broken.
[speaker024:] Oh has she?
[speaker010:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Well, the doctor said it was that.
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Erm... because erm... she started Wednesday but they're living at Stanborough
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And, she didn't, she wasn't too bad
[speaker024:] But then it
[Sandra:] the bones are broken right... down her hand. And on the Monday morning... my dad rang the doctors and he sent her a prescription... and on the Thursday he had to call him out.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And... she coughed that much... she pulled all the... muscles in her ribs. And he said she'd done more damage with coughing than she had anything
[speaker024:] Yes.
[Sandra:] else.
[speaker024:] Yeah. Yeah. She got
[Sandra:] She had another prescription... and... it was nearly three weeks and she still, now, I mean this is like... Five weeks... she's still got like a residual
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] cough.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And rubbish... oh she was, I mean she never got out of bad for a week!
[speaker024:] Oh no.
[Sandra:] My dad, well in fact, we, we were laughing at my dad because we said, we said, it shut her up [LAUGHTER] for a bit! Cos, he says I'm []... I mean I will, she looks after him all the time
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] but with her being ill it, she says it gave him another sense of duty that
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] he had to look after her.
[speaker024:] Look after her, yes.
[Sandra:] And he forgot all his own problems for the
[speaker024:] Oh yeah!
[Sandra:] week!
[speaker024:] Well you do don't you?
[Sandra:] Yeah!
[speaker024:] Yeah. Yeah.
[Sandra:] And we had to laugh, he said, well can you be ill a bit longer because he, er, he cooked her something to eat and he feeds her and so when I rang up... I never got her on th, I never spoke to her for a week! She couldn't talk.
[speaker024:] Couldn't she?
[Sandra:] She said she couldn't even get out of bed, she couldn't do anything.
[speaker010:] Twenty five!
[Sandra:] He just had to look after her all the time.
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] But, like, you know, he says... the way it struck her... one minute, you know, she just... a mild cold... and... next minute, he said the next she's so bad!
[speaker024:] Mm!
[Sandra:] She couldn't get out of bed nor nothing.
[speaker010:] What the heck is this?
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] It really took hold in a few hours.
[speaker024:] Mm. Well I've heard
[Sandra:] But she
[speaker024:] the, flu, I mean, you hear a lot of people
[speaker010:] Mum!
[speaker024:] say... Ooh! You know they've had flu
[speaker010:] You know you said to dad but
[speaker024:] but they haven't really, they just had bad colds. I mean I've
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] never had the flu
[speaker010:] Shall we race?
[speaker024:] but I've seen
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] what flu can do to people.
[Sandra:] If you ca
[speaker024:] If you get flu it's really bad!
[speaker010:] Mum, it's come off.
[Sandra:] Usually you don't get a
[speaker024:] Terrible!
[Sandra:] cold, following a cold with flu, what you
[speaker024:] No.
[Sandra:] tend to get with flu is more... aches and pains in your
[speaker024:] Aches and pains
[Sandra:] joints
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] very bad head
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and get fever
[speaker010:] I want that!
[Sandra:] but when you get a co, like you call flu, it's usually just a head cold.
[speaker024:] It is. It is. I've never had flu. But I I don't get many colds and it
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] comes out, comes out at New Year's Day, I was at home then and it... erm... going to come back New Year's Day
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] and then er... they said, oh no I'll let, let us take you through the erm Conway Tunnel the new
[Sandra:] Oh yeah!
[speaker024:] tunnel, you know, so I've been through there
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] and... I started that day with this cold
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] and... it's not like me.
[Sandra:] I one, I once had the flu
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and I knew I've had it. I did it lasted about
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] three days. Felt foul!
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I felt really
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] as if it's as if you've been anaesthetized!
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Cos everything aches and
[speaker024:] It
[Sandra:] everything's a dead weight and... because you can't, if you move your head it's, it's that much
[speaker024:] Much
[Sandra:] and all your joints ache.
[speaker024:] Mm!
[Sandra:] And the trouble is with not moving that thingummy builds up and then you get this very bad cough down your chest.
[speaker024:] Yes. Yeah.
[Sandra:] But erm... oh!
[speaker024:] Like this cold with me, it's like in my nose and in my
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] head, that was all. You know, I didn't even have a headache. But, I've
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker024:] taken it worse.
[Sandra:] Well I've had pleurisy.
[speaker024:] Anyway, my sister's bought me this... thing to go round my neck. Because you know
[Sandra:] Mm!
[speaker024:] I've got to go and get the. But she comes
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker024:] on Monday with it. Coalite, you know, erm
[Sandra:] Mhm.
[speaker024:] just got it round, you know like they had
[speaker010:] Yeah?
[speaker024:] er, my orthopaedic pillows
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker024:] one of those, only just a round one to go... round your neck. And it... it like warms your neck up. Cos I tried one of. But this is smashing!
[Sandra:] Oh! It's like a little neck rest for when you're sitting
[speaker024:] Yes!
[Sandra:] in the chair.
[speaker024:] Yes! Yes!
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] Yes!
[Sandra:] My mum's got one.
[speaker024:] Oh! Then
[Sandra:] It's like.
[speaker024:] Oh! Yeah, but I thought, sounded as if they only did tho, those that you blow up and this isn't, you can put it in, in the wash or anything.
[Sandra:] Oh right!
[speaker024:] To wash.
[Sandra:] Oh yeah!
[speaker024:] He got it on the market. It's the same, same thing
[Sandra:] What, made of like foam?
[speaker024:] Erm... well I don't know what it's made of... inside. Er,... soft stuff, I don't know.
[Sandra:] Oh!
[speaker024:] Yeah. It's great!
[Sandra:] Cos my mum bought one for my dad
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] because when they go on coach trips
[speaker024:] Well that's right.
[Sandra:] you can't sleep properly in them.
[speaker024:] Do you know, when I went, last one, with the club... I thought I'm not going again! I was bad for over a week with my neck! Anyway, they bought me this... you know... and er... and, she said you'll be able to go on your... trips.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] We've had a bring and buy today at the club.
[Sandra:] Oh have you?
[speaker024:] I've been there since... before one! Rita come and... pick me up, you know, stuff, and er... you know, we did alright.
[Sandra:] There'll be a Beetle drive... erm... end of February I think.
[speaker024:] Oh are you? Yeah.
[Sandra:] Erm... we owned a little and just thought I'd ask the party see how many things that cropped up as a result
[speaker007:] John!
[Sandra:] of this... er, you know, this... if anybody had had any complaints
[speaker024:] Complaints, yeah.
[Sandra:] or anybody thought something didn't work right... and erm... Julie's started organizing a plan day again
[speaker024:] And plans, of course she did, yeah.
[Sandra:] Yeah. Cos she's having some sent this year.
[speaker024:] Oh is she?
[Sandra:] from Central Ford
[speaker024:] Probably would be better.
[Sandra:] Well... she said she didn't mind having at home... but... erm... Terry said... there was too much for them all
[speaker024:] Yes.
[Sandra:] to be honest... the mess it must have left her! And she was worried about getting the stuff up there, and I said
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] well... there's Jenny's car, there's
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] my car
[speaker024:] Mm mm.
[Sandra:] and even if I can't take it up on the day, I could probably take it up the night before.
[speaker024:] Mm. Mm.
[Sandra:] And I don't think anybody'll mind the night before.
[speaker024:] No.
[Sandra:] And put plenty of newspapers down.
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Well, I'm not too sure. I might find that by then... my days have altered and I will be on the Thursday.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] At the moment I'm going to have it increased and it is for the, from Friday now.
[speaker024:] Oh are yo... oh
[Sandra:] So... when
[speaker024:] what at the University?
[Sandra:] Yeah. But
[speaker024:] How
[Sandra:] er
[speaker024:] I didn't know you didn't go on a Thursday.
[Sandra:] Well I do
[speaker024:] I asked you if you had time, your car there but
[Sandra:] See, I did go last week
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] on Thursday
[speaker024:] Oh!
[Sandra:] but I don't got there.
[speaker024:] Oh! Oh I see.
[Sandra:] I'm only part-time, part-time there.
[speaker024:] Oh are you?
[Sandra:] It's less than part-time.
[speaker024:] Well I didn't kno a, erm... gonna say? Are you going in from Ma... Manchester.
[Sandra:] Well, that's what, I mean
[speaker024:] That's when you're going out with me isn't it? Yeah.
[Sandra:] Er... I mean, all I want... Win, is something to do for four years... than sit at home being a housewife... and hang yourself as well!
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I tried for a job. The answer I tend to get off a lot of places is that... I have to wait for twelve years
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and... we don't, we don't think that you could do the job. I know I could do the job, but
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] you can't persuade people you can do it.
[speaker024:] Oh no! No.
[Sandra:] And working these odd nights in a care, a nursing home, the pay's not good enough to keep a family on.
[speaker024:] Oh no! It's not enough.
[Sandra:] So... if I'm going to think long term I've got to got to work
[speaker024:] Mm mm.
[Sandra:] then I need to be able to get a... a job... that will pay sufficient.
[speaker024:] Yeah. Yeah.
[Sandra:] But, you only have to earn a little bit and you lose your benefit. So, you'll be ending up on the breadline worse than ever
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] for what? Thought as well, I've never had the chance to go, I'd like to go
[speaker024:] Mm. Mm.
[Sandra:] realistically I would like a job... if I could get one... and I'm feeling... very pessimistic about getting one, because the chances of getting a job at my age, when there's youngsters coming around
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] it's not going to be easy but if
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] if there were any jobs I would be quite happy to take part- time.
[speaker024:] Time, yeah. Yeah.
[Sandra:] And I really need a job that
[speaker024:] Can supply
[Sandra:] I need, I need to have to... to give, I know how we feel but... he's getting older
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Matthew's getting, you need a, more physical looking after
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and long term... when the holidays come round he... takes a lot of looking after! So we really... we one of us to be here to look after him in that sense, one of us gets paid
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] to look after him, but in the school holidays, you know, it takes two of you to and mind him, because
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] you need time off in the day... when you're physically resting to him.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] But if there's only one of you
[speaker024:] I thought, I dunno
[Sandra:] you can't do it!
[speaker024:] I mean, I don't know how yo... er ca, cos I I funny neck, you know
[Sandra:] Well you couldn't though, but bearing in mind
[speaker024:] with my neck
[Sandra:] and we are so much younger
[speaker024:] Younger, that's
[Sandra:] and physically we've got no ailments that are preventing
[speaker024:] That's right.
[Sandra:] us from doing it.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] But he's even becoming a complete, in the holidays when I've got the housework to do and meals to cook, and him to look after... if there's another pair of hands that can take him out for an hour
[speaker024:] Mm. Mm.
[Sandra:] and leave you free to do a job, because... you may think... I mean, believe it or I've turned this room inside out today!
[speaker024:] Mm mm.
[Sandra:] It doesn't take him two minutes before
[speaker024:] Oh I know!
[Sandra:] I don't care about the mess
[speaker024:] [LAUGHTER] I mean, yeah I know. least of your worries
[Sandra:] Oh!
[speaker024:] and say get everything out and toys you
[Sandra:] Yeah!
[speaker024:] know, and what I say. I mean once I've cleared up, you know, when she's gone and and don't mind seeing
[Sandra:] I I don't mind this.
[speaker024:] No.
[Sandra:] I have this room, I've all
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] the cushions, all
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] the dining chairs, I've had everything out... at least I haven't cleaned the windows but, I was half way through, well I was almost finished, I'd just just done the stairs though... and Bernie came! And... I thought well... it's clean
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] I'm not
[speaker024:] Mm mm.
[Sandra:] bothered.
[speaker024:] No, that's it.
[Sandra:] But
[speaker024:] That's it. You can't with
[Sandra:] When he's here
[speaker024:] children you just
[Sandra:] I couldn't, I couldn't start doing it now!
[speaker024:] No. How could you?
[Sandra:] And I have cleaned round him, but you know, as quick as I pick them up and throw them in the corner, he gets them out again.
[speaker024:] Yeah. Yeah.
[Sandra:] And then with all these, I mean
[speaker024:] He's bound to.
[Sandra:] it's, there's ne, there's a never a
[speaker024:] No, not at all.
[Sandra:] there's never a time when there's... flung all over half the time!
[speaker024:] Yeah. Yeah.
[Sandra:] Er
[speaker024:] I just don't know how you cope?
[Sandra:] Well I mean I'm, I've got an easy time at the moment because I'm on today. I only up to seven hours in a... fortnight. That's all I want. Yeah.
[speaker024:] Is that a
[Sandra:] Six hours a week.
[speaker024:] at home?
[Sandra:] No it's here.
[speaker024:] It's here. Oh I know!
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] Oh! I didn't realise that!
[Sandra:] Six hours a week. And you go and
[speaker024:] And you always there... a... away on holiday?
[Sandra:] See a
[speaker024:] Because we always say oh... no Sandra there's nothing, you can't there
[Sandra:] Well that well that was last term. Everybody in the first term is in in the morning.
[speaker024:] Oh!
[Sandra:] Four mornings a week, it was compulsory. And it isn't compulsory this term, if you're doing education. And er
[speaker024:] Oh!
[Sandra:] I'm doing education so I'm not in in the morning.
[speaker024:] Oh that's why you ta, can take them to school then is it?
[Sandra:] Well I was taking them anyway.
[speaker024:] I know you were, anyway, it
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] goes till eleven didn't it? Just
[Sandra:] Erm
[speaker024:] after eleven was it? Ten
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] or eleven wasn't it?
[Sandra:] The o, the only thing I'm doing now... is the subjects that I want to do
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] on the degree course
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] but, it's education. And... literally, I got, but I was... got so little on... I felt that if I didn't do some extra
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Me, I... I mean, I've done... I've done no work today because... [LAUGHTER]... I went out to... collect some stuff of a friend this morning... and by the time I came in it was quarter past ten and I'd gone out at ten to nine so I'd missed the schools
[speaker024:] Schools, mm.
[Sandra:] and I'd told Pat I'd go to and sing
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and I've not come back till twelve! I've I've done some dinner, we've cleaned up... and Bernard's turned up, have you done any work yet? I mean, this is me, I'm quite capable... and I make i
[speaker024:] And have you gotta go in the morning?
[Sandra:] No, I don't go up till tomorrow afternoon.
[speaker024:] Oh! Tomorrow afternoon, rather, yes.
[Sandra:] Well, I've got... fre, I've got bills to pay down town.
[speaker024:] Do they have to go every day?
[Sandra:] No.
[speaker024:] So you haven't, not every day then?
[Sandra:] I go, two hours on a Monday
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Two hours on a Tuesday, one on a Wednesday... and one on a Friday.
[speaker024:] That's it. Fri, that's it, you see it's all... well it's been like thought int it? You gotta go
[Sandra:] Well what I
[speaker024:] four times.
[Sandra:] what I've actually done
[speaker024:] to get that six hours in.
[Sandra:] is I've taken on another... short course.
[speaker024:] Mm..
[Sandra:] Not, because I need to take it on, but
[speaker024:] No.
[Sandra:] when I looked at it... I wanted to do it. It's only a
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] four week course, but he's running it for two hours for two weeks.
[speaker024:] Oh!
[Sandra:] Instead of one hour for four weeks he's
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] doing two hours for two weeks.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And it looks so interesting!
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And I wanted to do it. And I... tried to get on it at the beginning of the week but he told me it was fully booked.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Well I left my number... so
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] that, any cancellation she'd ring me up. Well I'd already spoken to the man who was running the course, the lecturer and he told me I could go on it, but his secretary said it was booked.
[speaker024:] Oh!
[Sandra:] I mustn't have been out of that office half an hour and I'd, she'd rung here and left a message to say I could go on it.
[speaker024:] Oh!
[Sandra:] And there were two more people in front of me that was waiting to go on... the course.
[speaker024:] The course, yeah.
[Sandra:] Any road, erm... when I went back to see her she said... of the ones who came and asked to go on it, we've accepted you, but no more. But, if I hadn't have gone on Monday
[speaker024:] Monday
[Sandra:] I wouldn't have got on.
[speaker024:] Wouldn't have got in. No.
[Sandra:] And we only went
[speaker024:] No.
[Sandra:] we went back Friday for exams
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and then we went back in on Monday.
[speaker024:] Oh you're doing well aren't you with your exams, so Mary
[Sandra:] Well
[speaker024:] tells me?
[Sandra:] Yeah, I've had erm
[speaker024:] Cos I keep as,a ask Mary you know, when I
[Sandra:] I've had
[speaker024:] see her.
[Sandra:] four... four points... I've got three on the B's
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and I got one on the C's. Well C's count but it's the bottom pass.
[speaker024:] Yes, I know.
[Sandra:] Erm... and it's quite, you know... and it's a subject I've never done before
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and the woman who took the course she did say... had she had done the reading work... it
[speaker010:] Mm.
[Sandra:] wouldn't have been the reading that we were given, because she said the brief in the... erm... th the work that we've had to read
[speaker024:] Mm. Mm.
[Sandra:] was far too... erm... advanced... for people who had never done the subject before. She said, I don't care whether you are at university, there are certain areas that... you need to know a lot more background before you can do it at this level.
[speaker024:] Yes. Mm.
[Sandra:] And, the reading lists were unbelievable! And we couldn't get half the books out the library because other courses had taken them, we
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] had ever such a job getting them! I mean, I know, one, one essay I had to write... erm... wa was erm... literally what constituted a person as far as philosophy?
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] I mean, you know what makes a person up, you know, heads
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] arms, legs, bodies
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] but, what makes ea up a person in the mind?
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And... the other subject, that we had an essay on... oh! I know which one! Co could a person survive, can a, can a person, and he put person in inverted commas, not for the... the physical body, but to be the person inside the body
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] could they survive their own death? And if you, if you had... a religious knowledge
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] that dead, there is a life hereafter
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] then the answer has to be yes.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] But you have to show how you believe... that the person in you survives their own death.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Well... I mean, I could have said it in about ten words, yes I believe they can because, but that didn't answer the question, you had to do... between fi... er
[speaker024:] So many words, words?
[Sandra:] a thousand and fifteen hundred words.
[speaker024:] Words, yeah.
[Sandra:] And I'm not, oh Win!
[speaker024:] I've not thought of any kind of death. [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] And I got myself... you've got use other... philosophers
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] erm... work, to prove your... theory.
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Well, I got myself all tied up between the... the who said what and me which said where and
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and I found it really
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] difficult
[speaker024:] Mm. I know!
[Sandra:] to put it into words.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Well, I must admit I got about the bottom mark. And then... she's written nearly as much in red ink on the back [LAUGHTER] as I've written it on black ink on []
[speaker024:] Black ink.
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] the front []!
[speaker024:] Mm.
[speaker010:] Has he gone out?
[Sandra:] And er... she erm... she said, I know what you wanted to say... and I appreciate that you find it difficult to put it into words
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and the biggest tragedy... is that I know you know what you want to say
[speaker024:] Say. Mm.
[Sandra:] but I can't mark you on what you've not put.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] In the class see... actual oral... erm... knowledge, I could talk with any of them and put my point a, and I could come up with ideas... couldn't put it down in
[speaker024:] Down
[Sandra:] writing.
[speaker024:] Yeah. Mm.
[Sandra:] So she put a few ideas on the back and said when you do the next one... try following these ideas... of organizing the different... parts of the essay. Erm... there were two at the end... discuss the works of either Descartes or... oh, can't think of the other one! And, the other one was erm... are the attributes of... [tut]! Ooh! Er, are there special attributes or personal attributes only found in humans? What it's asking, and it's a... most ambiguous question, I mean, I think the question was
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] didn't make sense! It... did machines... are machines people don't you think? Like computers.
[speaker024:] Oh yeah. Yeah.
[Sandra:] Are we producing machines that now have brains and minds that think? Well, the answer to that is, no.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] I mean if if I'm put on a ladder with a television set then forget it, because
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I'm no... you know
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] but... I sat down and we hadn't actually done the lecture... well I couldn't do this other one because... I didn't understand this
[speaker024:] No.
[Sandra:] er... reading... and I ha, I couldn't hold of enough of the material in the time I'd got to write the essay... so I wouldn't have studied enough, so I did this one on machines, and I got hold of two good books. And they were really interesting to read! Compared to what we've had to read. So I wrote this essay
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and... she put on the back of this one... she was thankful that at least I'd managed this time to get the mark in the area where it should have been in the first
[speaker024:] To be in there.
[Sandra:] place.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And, I mean, she was a brilliant... woman for lecturing
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] this subject!
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And it was just a pity that... the material she was given... or told us to read, she said was too advanced for us.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] But when you go in on a subject like philosophy, to jump in at that level... how adjusted you are... it's difficult if you've not got any academic background to suddenly come in and have to start doing it. I mean, psychology was as bad!
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I found that difficult!
[speaker024:] Mm. My nephew got on A in... philosophy!
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker024:] And he, he says erm... he didn't really study that much because he was going, like, he was erm... doing languages... and er... because they... they were, moaned at him for not keeping up cos of this project, quite a few of them, you know
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] and he took philosophy and got A in it!
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] He does er... supply teaching. He, he
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] went over to Australia now, he went to America and... like, went to Australia now!
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker024:] Because supply teaching he finds it... pays better than
[Sandra:] I suppose it's... it's a better rate of pay but
[speaker024:] It pays... it pays better.
[Sandra:] It's if you're on enough books... to be able to get supply for every day, if you don't mind just flitting around.
[speaker024:] Yeah. Yeah.
[Sandra:] Er, if you get known as a good supply teacher you'll get the work to... to begin with, you might only get an odd day. [door bell]
[speaker024:] He, he was thrilled because he he got er, his name on the board so the head
[Sandra:] Oh!
[speaker024:] of two subjects
[Sandra:] Come on John! Mummy's here!
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Go get your shoes.
[speaker024:] Oh!
[Sandra:] Go get your shoes!
[speaker024:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] We're hiding mummy! Ah! Oh!
[speaker024:] [LAUGHTER] Oh []!
[Sandra:] John!
[speaker007:] Alright then, bye! One down
[speaker024:] One. Mm. What time is the other one gone?
[Sandra:] He'll say, my mum says I have to be home for seven. He's been here since... what? Twenty to four.
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I always wonder when he ac
[speaker024:] I dunno, I don't know what the time is?
[Sandra:] Do you want
[speaker024:] Mm?
[Sandra:] not so bad, it must have knocked the telly on.
[speaker024:] Oh I see now!, the power? Oh
[Sandra:] No.
[speaker024:] no, did he... he, he dropped something down was it
[Sandra:] Well it's twenty five to five.
[speaker024:] Twenty five to five?
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] Yes. I must be going.
[Sandra:] Except this Matthew. Looks like... somebody should er
[speaker024:] Oh it, well... has he dropped something down there? I heard something drop but what would it be?
[Sandra:] No erm, I couldn't get this to
[speaker024:] There's nothing down there he could have done.
[Sandra:] No, I couldn't get the television on earlier so I'm thinking he
[speaker024:] Oh! I see.
[Sandra:] he sort of must have switched it off and switched it back on.
[speaker024:] Oh! Oh!
[Sandra:] But you have to use the box.
[speaker024:] Mm. Oh I know. Having trouble with my on off erm
[Sandra:] Are you?
[speaker024:] I'm waiting for them to... well they're going to fix it soon. You know, it seems everything round now goes wrong! Oh yes, he's been round there for the... new. Oh! Now it rains underneath and... oh er... the switch is gone and I'm waiting... cos they're a shop, I think they've never been down, while they're waiting for the rep to come. You see, so he has to just... plug it into the wall.
[Sandra:] Mhm.
[speaker024:] You know. And I'll have to find another
[Sandra:] Oh!
[speaker024:] another, yeah. In the... it's only just till the rep comes he said, when I saw her last week she said like... you know, he hadn't been if he
[Sandra:] No.
[speaker024:] Oh I usually watch telly as you
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] know. I'm not gonna
[Sandra:] Well when the kids
[speaker024:] leave it then
[Sandra:] when the kids are in here, I don't get to watch any of my programmes. But they've
[speaker024:] Lovely!
[Sandra:] gone upstairs to play on the computer so er
[speaker024:] Mm. Well erm... oh oh oh! Tony up there, he's had meningitis you know, at risk he said. And she was saying, I don't really believe, it was quite... quite sort of used to have a beeper on him
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] that's so so that he breathes... properly.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] Now he's been taken ill with this so, she hopes that he don't and get behind you know... but it's the head in it? And
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] er
[Sandra:] I mean I'm quite happy up there, you know... even if at the end I don't get to end... I mean I'd like to get to
[speaker024:] Has long does that go for?
[Sandra:] It's four years!
[speaker024:] It's four years?
[Sandra:] I mean
[speaker024:] I could have had it...
[Sandra:] I might
[speaker024:] It's
[Sandra:] Well
[speaker024:] four years?
[Sandra:] Yeah, because this first year is an induction year.
[speaker024:] Oh!
[Sandra:] If you haven't got a qualif
[speaker024:] I was gonna say because Peter... is with the three year
[Sandra:] Yeah, it is three years
[speaker024:] And then, because he went in er, he didn't want, he, he wanted... er go as a teacher
[Sandra:] He did another
[speaker024:] he did
[Sandra:] year.
[speaker024:] another twelve months a, well he passed, that's right, so he did four.
[Sandra:] You ca, you can do, it can master five, because you can do this... er, if you haven't got the A levels
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] you need to this first year... and it gets you up to that level
[speaker024:] I see. Oh yeah. Well
[Sandra:] right?
[speaker024:] you did O levels, yes.
[Sandra:] Then you do the three years
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] degree
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] then you do the teaching certificate which
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] is another, so it could be five.
[speaker024:] I know that's how, how he did the
[Sandra:] Right?
[speaker024:] four. Yes?
[Sandra:] But, what you can do at is the teaching certificate with the degree... which is what I'm doing.
[speaker024:] oh I see! Ah!
[Sandra:] So his final year he does teaching
[speaker024:] Yeah, for four years.
[Sandra:] I'm doing it through the four years of the course.
[speaker024:] Mm. Mm.
[Sandra:] If you go on
[speaker024:] Oh yeah.
[Sandra:] the foundation U,yo you've got the option to start the teaching certificate in the first year.
[speaker024:] Oh I see.
[Sandra:] So, where he's done the extra year at the end... if I do this extra year at the beginning I can start the teaching certificate.
[speaker024:] Yeah! He decided right at the end he wanted teaching. And he
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] stayed on, he he... passed something in exam or something and
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] he stayed on.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] And then after that... erm, he said well, well he can... please himself and I suppose he he erm, well I think er, year. So many of them from Uni they these children in America... and erm
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker024:] schooling, you know... erm... people there that erm... got money
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] and they've got the children in, you know, these.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] and so many of them now... they go, er to erm
[Sandra:] Mhm.
[speaker024:] America.
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker024:] And er... it was all paid for, you know... and it's for three months, and then... they're getting six weeks off I think... and he went to do some fishing down in Canada and all that. But, for three months he never had... you know, seven days a week like, you know.
[Sandra:] Mm mm.
[speaker024:] And er, since then he come back, he got a job... his name was on the board, he said, oh it's lovely seeing your name on the board, the head, er, and in two subjects! You know? He just gave it up like that and he went to Australia! He's, he's never married, he's twen, twenty eight. He's
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker024:] No he isn't, he's twenty nine. Er, let me think, Catherine's twenty six, he isn't, he's damn well thirty! Catherine's twenty six
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] Yeah, he must be... thirty. And erm... now he's a supply teacher in... now he's got a band or something, I dunno. No.
[Sandra:] Do your own thing while you can.
[speaker024:] Just doesn't want to go back to, he likes Australia as well!... And he liked Canada better than America.
[Sandra:] Mm mm.
[speaker024:] And erm... well he just wants to enjoy himself I think.
[Sandra:] A girl who I go with, she's been teaching as well and her husband's already in the hope that when she finishes they're going to emigrate to America to.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Because... like she said, here... he's been made redundant once, and he stands another chance of just starting
[speaker024:] Yeah!
[Sandra:] another school and he's
[speaker024:] Terrible!
[Sandra:] all set for it again!
[speaker024:] Terrible! Terrible! It's going to be around again they've only got so many people.
[Sandra:] Yeah. I mean, I'm sort of looking realistically that after four years that the education system changes
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] there won't be enough jobs.
[speaker024:] Mm mm.
[Sandra:] But... I'll have done something for four years. I won't
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] have been sitting here
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] doing part-time work
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] feeling as if I'm not using the resources I've got.
[speaker024:] That's it.
[Sandra:] And I get annoyed!
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And I know, I suppose people said oh, well, why put yourself through it? But, you know, I thoroughly enjoy it!
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] I really do!
[speaker024:] I was going to say, if you enjoy it... why not?
[Sandra:] I e, enjoy the process of of
[speaker024:] Why not?
[Sandra:] finding things out.
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Some of it I find... a bit er... a bit too obvious but in the same way... erm... on, on the sociology side, I get a bit angry because I see what society does to people.
[speaker024:] People. That's right.
[Sandra:] And theoretically, it sounds wonderful!
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And it doesn't work like that.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] You know
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] if it worked like they... say things work... it would all be nice for everybody, and it isn't.
[speaker024:] Mhm. It isn't, no. Yeah.
[Sandra:] So, I do get a bit ac, I mean,th there's, there's one young girl in the class... and, we were on about women's role in society... and going on about third world woman, but even western woman have their position, you know, she does the housework
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] the shopping and the cooking... and... the sa, she made a remark,abo, and I said well it's always the same even if you go out to work it's still your job
[speaker024:] Job, yeah.
[Sandra:] and she said... well my mother goes out to work, but we help. And I said, well what do you mean, you help? She said well we all help on the weekends, even my dad helps, I said, but... who actually makes the decisions about what you do, what you eat, what you buy
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] how you cook it, when you have it, who actually runs the house? Well we all, I said no! One of you actually runs... the finances, the shopping
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] the decisions to be made, who's responsibility is, cos you just said, we help, you don't make those decisions, your mum
[speaker024:] No.
[Sandra:] still takes on the responsibility there!
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] And, at the end of a we, when I put it back into the, the conversation
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] it was... well, erm... I do my bit. I said, well your mum's been out to work five days a week and you just help
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] you know, you should do it
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] if that's... not her role, but you've given her that role.
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] But she
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] likes to do it! I said, how do you know she likes to do it? Does anybody ever say to her, well I'll do it
[speaker024:] Oh I know!
[Sandra:] instead?
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] I said, are you married? She said no. I said, well are you likely to be? She said, well yes but I'm not having any kids, I said probably that's a good thing, but... I said... she was so selfish in her attitude!
[speaker024:] Yeah, that's it.
[Sandra:] She would help so that was all it needed!
[speaker024:] Mm. Mm.
[Sandra:] I said the onus on the woman in the house... to think, to plan, to prepare... it's her!
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] There are a few men that do it
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] but by and large, most men say, oh well the wife all the time.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] And if it's not right, then it's... well it's your fault!
[speaker024:] Fault.
[Sandra:] And in a lot of marriages the wife's total responsibility and if it wasn't done she is the one responsible.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] This is how a lot of them fall the by the wayside because
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] husbands think their fault is they've no money, when... in all accounts... he's probably had more to spend on his luxuries than she's had on food.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] But if you just can't manage it's her fault!
[speaker024:] Fault.
[Sandra:] Not the rising prices and things. And it was this young girl's attitude! I was amazed! And I said well I, all I'm saying, I was really angry!
[speaker024:] Mm mm.
[Sandra:] I was getting so with her! Because I said, you're another woman!
[speaker024:] You're a selfish.
[Sandra:] You don't even
[speaker024:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] understand the first principles of what being a woman is, if that's what
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] you think!
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Well there were other married ones... in the group
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] and there was another with a child
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] And she said to her afterwards [] she said... oh! I could have gone mad, you know, but... the tragedy is that during the courses a lot of them... and I expect that the best time to learn is when you're young and you're more receptive.
[speaker024:] Well yes! That's right.
[Sandra:] But they've no experiences a lot of
[speaker024:] No.
[Sandra:] them
[speaker024:] No. No.
[Sandra:] and they're not appreciating how difficult it is for some of them families to send them there.
[speaker024:] Oh!
[Sandra:] And a lot of them do waste that time.
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Did ex, even went to so that the.
[speaker024:] Did they?
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker024:] Some of them
[Sandra:] Three years term. Er, the following year's term.
[speaker024:] They come
[Sandra:] And asked why, well I know why she didn't turn into the morning lectures... well I don't get up usually, till half eleven, twelve o'clock.
[speaker024:] Oh!
[Sandra:] I said, what do you mean? She said, I'm not an early riser. I said, but you've got to get up to get to the
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] lectures. I can't, she says. I says well... you can if you set the alarm the clock!
[speaker024:] Mm.
[Sandra:] Oh! She says, I can't get up early! I said
[speaker024:] Good grief!
[Sandra:] there are a lot of people
[speaker024:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] in this place who have got up and done a day's work before they've come here! I said I, even I've got up and got children up and off to school. I said, I've got my own responsibility, that's mine, I said, but you're only responsibility is to be in that lecture for ten o'clock. You've only got to roll out of bed
[speaker024:] Good grief!
[Sandra:] walk across the road!
[speaker024:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] She said, I don't like getting up before half eleven, twelve o'clock!
[speaker024:] Ah! Oh!. [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] And, I said and you're being supported... to stay here! She said, everybody's helping. I said, and this is what you're doing Anna? You're not turning up?
[speaker007:] Every time I co, I put my face to the window they go, oh no, he's back again! [LAUGHTER]... So I erm
[Sandra:] You started before I am.
[speaker025:] I know I am. I can't help it if I'm handsome! [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Ooh! Your vain as well aren't you?
[speaker025:] [LAUGHTER]... Well just, I am, I a, I mean, I ain't bothered anyhow! I'll... my dad went in there he said... do you mean, do they take your? He said erm... he said you can take it out can't you? I said, I don't want to. Oh then I'll change my mind, he said wanna leave work here like. He said, oh you're modest are we? I said, yeah! Said... he said well you could you take it er, and scare your friends? I said, it's okay well we've got a instead and I went.
[Sandra:] How long you been going up the Rainbow Centre?
[speaker025:] Erm... I er, I don't go every day, I go every Thursday like. Er, well I don't go weekly like
[Sandra:] No. Ooh!
[speaker025:] I just go on a Thursday, but I don't go week you see? Cos er... I, like I should, really I wouldn't have bothered going today. I'd have gone the next Thursday after like. Cos, today was really a waste of my time cos there's only half that do you see. But, if I'd gone next Thursday there'd be e... English, and then it'd be a a job for them if they
[Sandra:] If they're hard.
[speaker025:] they're hard, yeah like and my, my my dad wouldn't take. I ju, it, you see I'll, I work until the end nearly eleven o'clock in the day to yo, to work start work today like on the art. So I start straightaway you know.
[Sandra:] So how long you been going up the Rainbow Centre?
[speaker025:] Can't think in the arts, in the art bit so I just... I just go in for a coffee as well, yeah. So it'll be. All the women say... they can't wait to get rid of me! I say you can't, you love me really don't you? Say... oh yeah, we love you, yeah! But we got rid of you! [LAUGHTER]... Things like that, you know.
[Sandra:] I mean, you can get on with people like that that you've never met before you co, to get on at college exactly the same.... And yet you can actually
[speaker025:] I ju, it's... you see I I would have
[speaker026:] Are they jam?
[speaker025:] until the end
[speaker010:] What?
[speaker025:] nearly... eleven o'clock
[Sandra:] I think he's taken yours on there.
[speaker025:] Got to start work at
[speaker010:] He has! You can take these.
[speaker025:] And I started straightaway, you know, like
[speaker010:] No,!
[speaker025:] I can't think in the art, in the art thing cos I like to... I'd just finished my coffee as well and
[Sandra:] You've got to repeat everything on the board is he?
[speaker010:] Yeah.
[speaker025:] All the women say... they can't wait to get rid of me! I say, you can't, you love me really don't you? Say, oh yeah! We love you, yeah! But we got rid of you! [LAUGHTER]... Things like that, you know.
[speaker010:] Is that my colouring?
[speaker025:] We're just joking.
[Sandra:] Well if you can get on with people like that that you've never met before you can, you'd get on at college it's just the same.
[speaker026:] Yeah, so if you can't find one I'll use the one what I was gonna do.
[Sandra:] So that erm
[speaker026:] Over there.
[Sandra:] Do you want a cup of tea then?
[speaker010:] Right down
[speaker026:] What? Yeah.
[Sandra:] Has Ian taken yours on then?
[speaker010:] He has. You can take these?
[Sandra:] And I think that you'd have to have
[speaker026:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] another word after that. Go on, off you go then!
[speaker026:] Ah er, yeah I've just thought of one.
[Sandra:] Make your own up.... It's not fair if I help is it Matthew? You've got this.
[speaker025:] Yeah, but looking at college... like... I've come from school like, and I never liked it at school.
[Sandra:] Different
[speaker025:] I mean that
[Sandra:] entirely different set up! It i... don't look at it as school
[speaker010:] Is that my
[Sandra:] college is adult education, and the fact that you're all adults... the relationship between you and the lecturers is not the same between you and teachers. In a class, where you were at school, they told you what to do.
[speaker025:] Well maybe it's because I look at it as a school like that's
[Sandra:] You shouldn't!
[speaker025:] it. Well I just got this thing, you know, about
[Sandra:] You shouldn't.
[speaker025:] something
[Sandra:] But... you've got an adult
[speaker025:] there.
[Sandra:] relationship between you and the lecturer. And it's up to you to learn what they're telling you. If you don't learn, at school they'd give you detention and lines and punish you for not doing it, if you don't do it at college it'll be your mistake and your fault
[speaker025:] I learn alright.
[Sandra:] but you'll learn because you want to and not because you're made to, and there's a difference.
[speaker025:] Yeah, but sometimes you, I go, got... I told dad about this lad, got this this lad, he's crazy and that keeps, keeps... erm... joking and everything, running around acting a right fool like yo, and that! I mean, I'm scared of anything up, they'll be some conflict and you do get these kind of people in college as well it frightens me
[Sandra:] You wouldn't get them at night college, because people who go to night school go because they want to learn, and if there's any... you've got running around as you call it, will be thrown out! Cos lecturers at night cos they're not compelled. People aren't made to go to college at night, people go because they want to. If you muck about in the class the lecturers have got every right to send you off the course.
[speaker025:] But er, this guy, he's crazy! Erm... I got blamed, I think that I was er, doing his... like if you taking his er... what do you call them
[Sandra:] When you come out of there... I mean, if you do like we... when I've ever gone I take my shampoo with me... and you can have a shower and wash your hair, get the chlorine off you... and they do sell... er, chips upstairs and they're not very expensive. You can have cup of soup out the machine for about twenty pence.
[speaker025:] That's sounds as if it's pretty cheap.
[Sandra:] And I mean, if you set a list to do something for a day Yeah. I mean, by the time you'd set off walking you could set off at eleven and walk there till twelve... go in there till two... then you
[speaker025:] Have you ever been to the pictures in that po, in erm... oh what do you call the?
[Sandra:] In Festival Park. Yeah, we went
[speaker025:] Oh, how much is it to get the pictures, I mean
[Sandra:] If you go... at the six o'clock showing, Monday to Friday... it's two pound ten pence for you.
[speaker025:] Yeah? That's, that's cheaper than the one,th the one up, about
[Sandra:] What
[speaker025:] two pounds fifty up there.
[Sandra:] No. If you go the six it's gone up, it's two po, it's gone up to two twenty hasn't it? It was always cheaper. But if you go... any other showing or on a weekend... it's three pound eighty.
[speaker025:] Well it's it's it's it's much more expensive up in the... you know the Hanley one?
[Sandra:] The Cannon was always cheaper.
[speaker025:] That's, that's expensive.
[Sandra:] But, if you go at the six o'clock showing here... it's two pound ten pence for you.
[speaker025:] That's, it's about two pounds fifty at erm, for me to get into the
[Sandra:] It was
[speaker025:] Hanley one.
[Sandra:] No. It was two pound, and one eighty on the six o'clock showing. But it's just gone up to two pound twenty.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] But, I mean, it's nice at the Festival Park one,i it
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] but go for the six o'clock showing... cos it's two pound ten pence.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I mean, that's alright, but when you think you're spending two pound ten pence and then, if you come out and you want a drink
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and you
[speaker010:] Mum!
[speaker025:] And you want.
[speaker010:] Is this a word? S O E?
[Sandra:] Sorry, what? Er erm
[speaker010:] Mum is this a word?
[speaker025:] What?
[Sandra:] No, hang on! S O E?
[speaker010:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] No, you want S O W, S O
[speaker010:] S O
[Sandra:] S O W
[speaker010:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] What else have you got?
[speaker010:] No I haven't got that.
[Sandra:] What el, well well show me what else have you got and I'll tell you what you've got.... Sot is a word. S O T.... Erm... there are erm... it's, I mean I, we don't go very often, but over the Christmas holidays
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] er, we actually went up to see erm
[speaker010:] Mum! Is Sot a word?
[Sandra:] Yeah. Just said it is. We went to see one that was twelve only.
[speaker010:] Anthony says it isn't a word!
[Sandra:] Tell him to look in the dictionary.
[speaker010:] S O P?
[Sandra:] Z O P! I said S O T!
[speaker025:] Yeah, well that's a Z John!
[speaker010:] I said Z.
[Sandra:] You said S.
[speaker010:] Said Z!
[Sandra:] You said S! Erm... cos one of the kids wanted to watch a twelve, and I got him in.... But it was too... th the, the language on it wasn't, it wasn't bad language but it
[speaker025:] No.
[Sandra:] was difficult for them to understand because
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] it was more mature language. But then we went to see Suburban Commando.
[speaker025:] Oh! Oh that's good
[Sandra:] Hulk Hogan.
[speaker025:] that is! With erm
[Sandra:] Oh it was fantastic!
[speaker025:] with erm
[Sandra:] It's hilarious!
[speaker025:] Er... I like
[Sandra:] And it
[speaker025:] it when they go up to camp
[Sandra:] Well we have W W F wrestling on here you know.
[speaker025:] Course you can. Yeah.
[Sandra:] This is what John's always.
[speaker025:] And er
[Sandra:] But... erm... I said I'd take, we went to see another one as well, erm... oh that... Cu erm... I'll tell you what i, what we went... Curly Sue we went to see.
[speaker025:] Oh! Cur, oh I keep thinking of going to see that one. Yeah, just a
[Sandra:] That, that's funny, but... I think for you... Suburban Commando would have been better.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] It's still on. But it's only on now... er... weekends. And the cheap showing... is twenty past eleven in the morning on a Saturday.
[speaker025:] Don't care!
[Sandra:] Erm... what's on at Cannon. It isn't on there, it's finished. But that really was, it was funny!
[speaker025:] Mm. Er, ha, that was good when she said, says er... he said okay,yo, take the bag then.
[Sandra:] Hot Shots, we went to see that was it.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] But
[speaker025:] Hot Shots.
[Sandra:] the, the, the ha, the humour is too adult for th, these to understand.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] They said twelve, but I think really... for the humour alone they needed to be about fifteen or sixteen because they didn't understand it.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] We went to see... Suburban Commando [phone rings] and then went to see Curly Sue.
[speaker025:] Right.
[Sandra:] [phonecall starts] Hello. Hello!... I thought it might be. You've just interrupted my thinking session here! [LAUGHTER]... Ooh I know, but it's staying off so you'll realise why! [LAUGHTER]... Yes, I'll be in the morning.... No. I will go out at half past two, well, twenty past two I shall go out... and I won't be back till half past six.... I mean, if you come before ten.... Alright. I'll get back in from the kids ou, you know, literally, a minute past nine, so... yeah. Okay then. Bye! [phonecall ends]... Er, I mean, I don't go... not because I don't enjoy the pictures but I think that it's got to be something really special.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] But over the Christmas holidays I was prepared to take them. I didn't fancy Hot Shots, but I took them.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I fancied Suburban Commando, and that really is funny! And then I took
[speaker025:] I love ca, some comedy
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker025:] like! I like
[Sandra:] and then we went to see the Curly Sue
[speaker025:] a good laugh.
[Sandra:] no it's brilliant! It really
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] is funny! But if you were going and choosing a pa, a film, I'd have said you'd have preferred the Hulk Hogan one.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] But er
[speaker025:] I would do, yeah, I like that one that's
[Sandra:] I mean, this one doesn't look bad does it?
[speaker025:] Dunno. What's it called?
[Sandra:] Frankie and Johnny.... See the cheap showing on this is five to six.
[speaker025:] Have you ever watched erm... Home Alone?
[Sandra:] On video.
[speaker025:] That's good that Home Alone!
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker025:] He's really cruel to those two bank robbers, they're gonna rob the house like! 'kin hell! [LAUGHTER] that erm on video like, video
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker025:] it's brilliant! Really cruel to those guys.... Ah! And his mother's up in the plane and she... she says erm... I'm sure we've forgotten something!
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER] Forgotten something []!
[speaker025:] And she's looking in her purse and everything and... suddenly she goes... I know what it is! It's our son! Then she. And... and then, er the, the uncle... what what comes up and he said, well I think I've, erm... what did he say now, I've forgotten? He er... forgot my comb or summat... and something like that, he said I've forgotten my comb and we might be going out.
[Sandra:] I mean, some films I think they're pathetic in... so much that the story
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] line is very poor!
[speaker025:] Yes.
[Sandra:] And they try and do it with a lot of gimmickry and
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] the way they do the filming.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] And, if the story line isn't very good, I don't care what they with effects... the film doesn't work.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] But that Suburban Commando
[speaker025:] Ah! That was good-un that! I'd like that.
[Sandra:] it was absolutely brilliant!
[speaker025:] I haven't watched it, but I'd love to watch it if ever I
[Sandra:] Yeah, it's brilliant!
[speaker025:] And I watched er, some of their clips coming on the T V like.
[Sandra:] Yeah. I was just looking but there's no wrestling on... telly at the mom, it's foot... er
[speaker025:] Ei either football or
[Sandra:] African football, Cameroons and Zaire.
[speaker025:] [LAUGHTER] Fucking hell []!
[Sandra:] Er... I mean... it is, I I like watching it morning when the skiing's on.
[speaker025:] Yeah.... I don't mind the er... some wrestling though. Oh, I like a good laugh!
[speaker010:] [cough]
[Sandra:] Oh! No bother.
[speaker025:] No.
[Sandra:] No.... I like the winter sports, you know,th the skiing and all that that I watch. We watched Crewe play Liverpool live on here you know, last week.
[speaker025:] You can watch a lot on this er, Sky T V
[Sandra:] Oh!
[speaker025:] now can't you?
[Sandra:] Some of it's a load of rubbish!
[speaker025:] And I could keep watching it
[Sandra:] Bit like this
[speaker025:] over and over again.
[Sandra:] Sky sports, football!
[speaker025:] Ah.
[Sandra:] I mean, you're going to Africa.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I'll have to go for a little walk.
[speaker007:] And it's alright but yo... I mean there's British football
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] drives you daft!
[speaker025:] Some, yeah.
[Sandra:] But when you've been, Italian, German, French, and [LAUGHTER] now you have the African league [], you know, and you think... there must be more too it than this! Some other channels aren't bad
[speaker025:] Oh yeah.
[Sandra:] but er... see this is er, and this is Africa but, I mean... it's on all the time int
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] it?
[speaker025:] Yeah. Getting all this
[Sandra:] These are... foreign language ones, you can't get them in English.
[speaker025:] Oh yeah. [LAUGHTER]... You'll have to sit there with a book and you can
[Sandra:] That's an advert. Cos that's another sports channel.... This is all advertising. This is actually one of the... fas, most fascinating programmes that comes on cos you get all these... just look what we can do here, you know, and... all American adverts.
[speaker025:] that
[Sandra:] And
[speaker025:] cos they're really bad for that!
[Sandra:] one advert can last an hour!
[speaker025:] Ridiculous! An hour?
[Sandra:] Yeah!
[speaker010:] Mum, is yeal a word?
[Sandra:] Eh?
[speaker010:] ... What? Is yeal
[Sandra:] You just
[speaker010:] Y E A L?
[Sandra:] No.
[speaker025:] So you mean, it goes on all the way through with just adverts all
[speaker010:] Yee?
[speaker025:] day or
[speaker010:] Yee? Yee?
[Sandra:] No.
[speaker025:] Does it do adverts on any of the others?
[speaker010:] Mum!
[speaker025:] Or don't they do adverts?
[speaker010:] Does it count if it's in the dictionary.
[Sandra:] It's got to be in the dictionary for it to count.... This is er... bit like Blind Date.
[speaker025:] Oh.
[Sandra:] This is those blokes used to live up here.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] He's a stunt man.
[speaker025:] Is he?
[Sandra:] Mm!
[speaker025:] 'kin hell!... Yeah, but these are single... single ladies.
[Sandra:] He was on er... he was on, he he was a D J on the radio. Bruno
[speaker025:] Si
[Sandra:] Brookes.
[speaker025:] and single.
[Sandra:] Mm!
[speaker025:] He's he's on Radio One.
[Sandra:] I think it mi, might have been Radio Stoke, I'm not sure but... I think it
[speaker025:] He's on Radio One
[Sandra:] I think, I think
[speaker025:] just now.
[Sandra:] it was Radio Stoke he was on.... He wa, he er, he was on ra, he was on... was it Radio One or Radio Two? But, he was on... he started on... local radio.
[speaker025:] He's been a bouncer I think.
[Sandra:] Oh I don't know.
[speaker025:] build, cos he's a bouncer
[speaker007:] [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] Do you find that entertaining?
[speaker025:] No. Ah well I, yeah I watch. I'll watch it, you know... ju just, just watch it you know. Just.... Like you say, it's just a laugh as well. [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] I don't like him.
[speaker025:] Oh I dunno. It doesn't, it doesn't affect me like my dad says it should. Some people, it doesn't affect some people like. Like to laugh, me.
[Sandra:] Unemployment up again! There you are, you look.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] So much for er... Conservative's idea of bringing down er
[speaker025:] Have you watched the Addams Family? On there,
[Sandra:] But it
[speaker025:] I've turned it down.
[Sandra:] when it was on television as the Munsters
[speaker025:] Oh well, it's still like that.
[Sandra:] years ago and it's still on now, you get it on Sky, the Munster.
[speaker025:] Yeah, the new Munsters
[Sandra:] Yeah but
[speaker025:] the new and the old Munsters
[Sandra:] but the Addams Family's no different.
[speaker025:] No.
[Sandra:] It's just the same and I didn't find
[speaker025:] No.
[Sandra:] that entertaining.
[speaker025:] Really I... I I just go out mainly, I'm not, not cos I don't, I just, I go out because... there's nothing else to do and it's boring being stuck in on your own all the time! And talking to yourself. I find myself, talking to myself! [LAUGHTER]... Which is crazy anyway, so I'd rather go out and be crazy watching a film.
[speaker010:] Mum! Is G I D a word? G I D?
[Sandra:] Gid?
[speaker010:] Well that's, that's in
[Sandra:] What did you get that?
[speaker010:] Because I saw this... there... that's... harpist is a word.
[Sandra:] You can have harp.
[speaker010:] And put
[Sandra:] No, it doesn't have an E on the end. Are you looking
[speaker010:] E there.
[Sandra:] No. No it doesn't, it's a musical instrument.
[speaker025:] I was watching erm... Hawaii Five O yesterday. Hawaii Fi, the old Hawaii Five O. Steve McGarrat and er... and what's his name, er... something be... Da Danna. Book him Danna! He couldn't say that this time cos he was i, he was erm, the guy in hospital. He's the one that, somebody tried to assassinate him or someone... tried to kill him off.
[Sandra:] I must admit, er there are some good television programmes now, but they're... a lot of rubbish in compared to the
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] story lines that you, you used to get on some of the
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] old series.
[speaker025:] Oh.
[Sandra:] It seems that... they make so many now that they don't have the same
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] quality of
[speaker025:] That's it.
[Sandra:] er entertainment in them.
[speaker025:] Yeah. All we got now is adverts... television is a
[Sandra:] Well the ads are a lot better sometimes than the programmes!
[speaker025:] Yeah.... I used to watch erm... tt, oh erm... Hawaii Five O every Saturday or Friday. I mean, it used to be on a Friday, then it used to be on a Saturday, only sometimes like... I used to watch it. I used to sit there [singing] Da da da da da []... [LAUGHTER] good fun []! You know, it was a great laugh like! Now you just... and sit there watch it now. [LAUGHTER]... I just thought I'd watch for the, you know... I think it's on every erm... it's on every da, ways you know... Hawaii Five O is... showing the old things again. I used to like the Invisible Man as well. He could vanish into thin air.
[Sandra:] Yes! I used to like that.
[speaker025:] Oh. I used to like it when he takes his head off! [LAUGHTER]...
[Sandra:] He'd take his bandages off.
[speaker025:] Oh I've been wa, well I've watched all of them, right, but they've made so many of those from er... really old ones to the very new one. Oh.
[speaker010:] Mum. Is G, er G O D a word? G O D?
[Sandra:] Well it's God isn't it? But you can have it with a small letter.
[speaker010:] G. G.
[Sandra:] Yeah, God.
[speaker010:] No, I mean... a J.
[Sandra:] J?
[speaker010:] O D.
[Sandra:] Jog? Yeah, to jog.
[speaker010:] No! J O E?
[Sandra:] No. No, you'd need to put a Y on the end, a joey, it's a sa baby kangaroo.
[speaker010:] I Keep getting those... letter words. No, is zog a word? Z O G?
[Sandra:] So wha
[speaker010:] Is Z O G a word?
[Sandra:] Oh, Z O is.
[speaker010:] Z O?
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker010:] I know, but I need this one.
[Sandra:] What have you put, Z O O, or just Z O?
[speaker010:] Z O.
[Sandra:] Well you could put another O on the end and make it zoo.
[speaker010:] Yeah, but it's got an E... at the top of it. In there.
[Sandra:] Oh well you can't then.
[speaker010:] See... he's trying to get me.
[Sandra:] See there's a word there, wax. And in fact, waxers, one who waxes... or waxes.
[speaker010:] Yeah.... I'm going here.
[Sandra:] Oh! I don't like seeing that. This is mine, this is the side I like.... It's live at eight o'clock in the morning. Because the Europea er, well the European clock is an hour behind us
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] so it's actually nine o'clock and they start.
[speaker025:] 'kin hell!
[Sandra:] And
[speaker025:] Ni nine o'clock in their
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker025:] like? Yeah.
[Sandra:] And... it's been coming from Austria this week
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] and it's been er... oh it's absolutely fantastic, I think!
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] But... I wouldn't have the nerve to do what they're doing.
[speaker025:] 'kin hell! [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] But the exhilaration of watching them come down.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] And sometimes they've got... one that comes on a test run with a camera strapped onto them and you come
[speaker025:] I bet that's nice!
[Sandra:] Oh! I mean they come at... they come over a hundred miles an hour on some of these runs!
[speaker025:] I know, and I hate it when they go... straight up over the hills like and they
[Sandra:] Mm!
[speaker025:] do a... a somersault straight over and come back down.
[Sandra:] But I mean, look at the scenery
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] though!
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] I mean... you see all these mountains and... I mean it just looks that beautiful and
[speaker025:] Yeah,
[Sandra:] er clear. I mean, there's no... smog a, and there's no cloud or smoke anywhere is there?
[speaker025:] Yeah. It's ice isn't it, ice underneath that snow innit?
[Sandra:] Well it'll be packed ice you know, with them coming down it so much. Yeah.... I don't like tennis either.
[speaker025:] I love tennis.
[Sandra:] Do, who was it was on here yesterday, erm... the one that throws temper tantrums?
[speaker025:] ... [LAUGHTER] It's blinking []!
[Sandra:] Oh well all you've got to do... it's in erm
[speaker025:] Can you pick what you want to? Yeah?
[speaker010:] No! I say whether you can go and then... I've put it in there. [talking from other room] Anthony got all the words and put them in and there's this one and he's got all the good.
[speaker025:] I'm getting to like this. So it picks it up when you just do anything?
[Sandra:] Yeah. It's got seven different audio channels and you pick up languages on them.
[speaker025:] Yeah?
[Sandra:] Three comes out in British.
[speaker025:] Typical! Pick all these
[Sandra:] Mm. Two hundred and fifty pound that was.
[speaker025:] 'kin hell! Expensive! You got a lot though. [LAUGHTER]
[Sandra:] I wouldn't have bought it, but it was brought as a Christmas present
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] for the kids... because there's a little man out there... who's the only one in the family who didn't have it. I wouldn't buy it. And then I said well... I will buy it as a joint sort of joint family Christmas present
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] because he went on so much... and then it was bought for him. So
[speaker025:] But er... I said it's nice, something like that though.
[Sandra:] Yeah. Harry and I like it for the... the sports, like the
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] skiing, the round up of the sports. And you get some
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] entertaining unusual sports that come on, but also, there's a news programme on, twenty four hour news. They mix in
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] a sports round up every now and again, and then you get the American C B S news comes on.
[speaker025:] Oh.
[Sandra:] And you'll get world news.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] But if you come on when it's the British news... you tend to get... a, a more in-depth programme, it lasts longer
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] you get more than just the highlights of the news.
[speaker025:] So, yeah....
[Sandra:] Who's that?
[speaker007:] No! Women don't like being huffed and puffed at!
[speaker025:] No, I, no I don't. I don't get huff, I don't. Shame they huff and puff at me, oh I don't like it!
[Sandra:] No.
[speaker025:] They, they don't like it when you stand and laugh and... you know, joke with them and that. Joke about it and all that, they don't like it then. Is it er... you know... only little girls like I mean, crumbs!
[speaker010:] Yeah!... I've got one.
[speaker025:] And when you talk sensibly to them and that... you know, about ja, that... and too old for you like that, something like that... I, I get really erm... you know, really... erm... when they erm... they, they start to laugh but you're not quite funny and that. So all I do, you gotta jo, joke about it all that.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker025:] So it makes it erm... in fact, it does upset them sometimes, you know, we, you know like the other way around... they can't stand it when you... you know, when you can er... hate it like that. If you don't take it, you know, if you can't take the joke they give you, they just... they get really upset about it. Oh.
[Sandra:] [yawning] Ho [].
[speaker007:] She's crazy! Driving me mad! Then she erm... she told me a lie this time as well! I erm, did something to her friend like erm... you know, this lad she's supposed to be going with, I dunno what she's doing with him or anything. And I'm not bothered if she's, cos she, he's er, she's he's, she's going out with him or anything. Just if she'll, you know, just if she could be friends with me still, you know, and that? But erm... anyway, she told a lie to me this time. See she, she came around cos erm... I've been up to her, her friends place to... and give him a bit of a telling off like and that... and erm... she came to John's house... and I said, why are calling? I said... you only come round to see me cos, you know, cos I al I always wanted to come round and see you so... and she won't. And she says, I haven't come round to see you actually! I've come round to see John. This is like her, ex-husband like. And I said okay. Well I'm just joking by saying... you've come round to see me haven't you? And that, and sh, and she goes, no I've only come round to see John cos of his birthday you see. So er... I thought a... alright then, so I... I went off like... and I just heard erm... and said, I went up to see her mother like and, I told her mother about it, like and that... and erm... her mother says different now, that she came round to see me at the time to tell, to give me a telling off like... over her friend. So I mean, John was right, she did come to see me that time. And
[Sandra:] Ah! But she didn't want you to know about this.
[speaker025:] Yeah. And another thing, she didn't have to do... well her mother's erm... her mother-in-law seems a bit erm bad tempered with her, like, she's... is that she didn't have to tell John, her ex-husband that... there's anything the matter like... and and, and that's when she... she, all she wants to do is get him against me. She's trying to make me and him enemies. Cos me and him are good friends, like. He likes me and, and I like him, he's... we've both got things in, in common, like.
[Sandra:] She's probably jealous then of your relationship with him.
[speaker025:] Might be, yeah. She could be. I dunno.
[Sandra:] I mean, if she had a marriage with him and she had the relationship and now you're a good friend to him, and you're a friend to her, she's probably very jealous of the fact that you're
[speaker025:] Mm.
[Sandra:] friends with her ex-husband.
[speaker025:] Yeah. Well, could be. I thought of that. I, things keep going through my head every time... my head's like it got this little... what do you call it in, one of those erm... like a live wire, just keeps going up and down and all the time. I'm trying to work out why she's mad all the time, why she's... she's down on everything. And I can't understand her, I can't keep up with her! You know? I mean, I mean, you know, John, you should see him he's happy! Every time I go to see him, like, he's happy as anything like. He's a good guy! Okay, he's a... I think, then again, sometimes I think why she left him is because the way his, his house is, you see. Cos the way he has his house... it's like er been a... okay he's off... er, I know it may sound nasty what I say about him, but he's alright, he's a good guy like, his house is a bit of a... upside down place, like
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker025:] it's only cos he's had it done up and that. And erm... her place is... oh, it's just really lovely inside, everything! You know, really warm, the fire's on, everything and... and nice and cosy and everything like. And, and I think... is it that because she left him? I was trying to think of all these things like she's done like. I dunno, I'm just, I give up on her anyway! I haven't seen her for... two weeks now. [LAUGHTER]... [LAUGHTER] Trying to pack up seeing her now []! It's like er er... but now I've heard her telling this lie again, I mean, oh, I'm thinking of going and seeing her again.
[Sandra:] Asking her what's she doing it for?
[speaker025:] Yeah, why, why. I dunno... I can't understand it though!
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker025:] I mean, why didn't she tell me the truth, I can understand you know, I could, you know, I could perha... if she'd just tell me the truth you know... tell me why she's u, what she's up to and that. Why does she have to tell me lies like, I mean... what's she trying to hide... you know? It's like she's got some... big thing going... like, got some big drugs thing going, like, and she's trying to hide! Some big thing, you know. And there's nothing to it, I mean... crumbs!
[Sandra:] Probably just her own
[speaker025:] Oh.
[Sandra:] personal problems that she... she knows that if she loses her temper with you she won't really offend you. Perhaps
[speaker025:] Well that
[Sandra:] that's a good thing that you are a friend to her, that you'll take her... tempers and you'll still come back. And the fact that she can... lose her temper with you
[speaker025:] Mm.
[Sandra:] you, you are just... at the end of... the line, and you take it off her so you take the pressure off her. She probably thinks a lot more about you for being able to
[speaker025:] Yes.
[Sandra:] take that pressure from her.
[speaker025:] I know. I always feel, I always feel, what do you call it, for punishment though?
[Sandra:] You're masochist?
[speaker025:] Yeah, I'm maso
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker025:] [LAUGHTER] Thank you []!
[Sandra:] [LAUGHTER]
[speaker025:] I think she could be truthful.
[Sandra:] Keep going back for more and more.
[speaker025:] True. Yeah. And er
[Sandra:] Sound a bit more like you're Nightmare on Elm Street!
[speaker025:] True, yeah! Blinking,e every time I walk into that place. Nobody comes to see you! You know, once... when I was in Wembley like, another thing that I've... noticed that changed in our place... at Wembley, like... every time I used to go in there, all, well, when I used to be in there, like, all the lads would be in the office with her like... talking to her, and laughing and smiling and... and she used to be at the desk smiling and everything... and now, when I walk in there now... it's only me like on a Saturday, and it's only her like... nobody else is in there with her, she's al, she always... she's got, I think what's happened is she got too deep into her work... that she's... she just seems to take all her work now... and that.
[Sandra:] Cos she doesn't have any relationships with the other
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] people that were there.
[speaker025:] Yeah. So erm... and here's another thing as well, she says erm... I said... why don't you pack this job in like? And you know, you know, I feel li, I feel like she's... she's a nice woman like, you know, I say, why don't you pack the job in? She says, I can't now I've gotta keep my family. And, and that, cos tha, cos she hasn't got her husband anymore, her husband's got a good job like, getting well into, something like and... he's got, got loads of money! He's got really lovely car and everything, and... and that, got nice house and... and er... anyway she's... she says I can't. Says I've gotta keep my family now cos she's keeping her, er... daughter in what do you call it, and her son like, every time he comes up. And... and when she had er... well... like she says, I can't now. But I, I don't understand, now she can't... but if she went back to her husband... he's got money, I mean, he can look after her as
[Sandra:] Yeah, but
[speaker025:] well.
[Sandra:] going back to him just cos he's got money, if she doesn't love him any more and she can't live with him because of the relationship.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] You can't compromise your feelings just because of the money.
[speaker025:] Yeah. But I mean... it's not just that, she's killing herself for the job like! Sa, she... her eyes are getting blacker every time and she... she just seems to be in her books all the time, and everything now. I mean, she doesn't stop work, she never stops work! She goes on and on and on!
[Sandra:] Well when you're being paid for doing a job that's the price you pay if you want to keep in work.
[speaker025:] Well I wouldn't do that. I don't think I could do that.
[Sandra:] Well you'd have to i
[speaker025:] It'd kill me!
[Sandra:] If you've got responsibilities of a family and you've got to keep them, then, as a mother she knows she's got her children to look
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] after. She'll stay there even if she doesn't like it because she's got to provide for them. That's a responsibility you take on with a family.
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] Or even if she doesn't like, and as much as she says, well she doesn't like it... she can't give it up until they're old enough not
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] to be a responsibility to her.
[speaker025:] Yeah, well I think it's through her job she's left her husband like. Her husband was the one who got her the job as well! And I mean, well she's married and everything, and kids.
[Sandra:] I could understand that in, I could understand that he's
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] probably left her because of the job in that sense
[speaker025:] He didn't leave
[Sandra:] because
[speaker025:] her, she
[Sandra:] she
[speaker025:] left him.
[Sandra:] well
[speaker025:] He le, I think he left
[Sandra:] but probably
[speaker025:] her because
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker025:] she couldn't... she just didn't smile every time like, she was... it's like, I think it's something to do with, sounds like it's something to do with the parents maybe. Something like, you don't know, I just, I ge, all these things like, keep just coming into your head all
[Sandra:] Mind you, the relationships between
[speaker025:] the time.
[Sandra:] the man and a wife... you'd never know what the problem was because the relationships that will be private to them.
[speaker025:] Yeah I know. Well I don't know
[Sandra:] But they'd let you
[speaker025:] well I know that.
[Sandra:] they'd never let you into that.
[speaker025:] I know. Well to that, I just
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker025:] I keep everything to myself. But it, it just seems funny, you know! The way she treats me, now. Cos I'm a bit like John, like... happy, you know... I'll laugh every time like and... he'll have a joke and that... and erm... John's happy, and he'll laugh. And he's into heavy metal and... and we, we both seem to have things in common like... and she do doesn't like me and she doesn't erm... you know, she seems the same with me as as she is with John. And this other guy she's going with now... he doesn't smile, nothing! He, I I used to hi to him, like... he used to work at Wembley as well and I used to go, obviously we were walking, coming out of the place like, and I'd say... I'd go, hi there! And he'd go, and he'd just... just walk on like! Ignore me!
[Sandra:] Mm.
[speaker025:] He wouldn't smile, nothing!
[Sandra:] No.
[speaker025:] Seems down all the time.
[Sandra:] They're probably both very happy in their misery together. [LAUGHTER]
[speaker025:] Well I dunno. Could be. You know... I wish I was, I could be happy in misery.
[Sandra:] Mm! Mm!
[speaker025:] You know. But I can't, me, I mean, I've gotta be happy cos a... it's the only thing today, is happy.
[Sandra:] Yeah.
[speaker025:] Or die sad and I'd hate that! You know, I couldn't put up with that, I mean
[Sandra:] You're better off being happy. You're
[speaker025:] Yeah.
[Sandra:] happy on the outside it... and you show you're happy on the outside you'll invariably be happy on the inside. And it's that where it counts.
[speaker025:] Yeah. And I... I like being happy. I mean