text: panasonic VCR tbc + external tbc - any use ? - VideoHelp Forum
  1st Aug 2007 02:01 #1
  I have a vcr with a full frame TBC. Is there any use to further add an external AVT-8710/TBC-1000 TBC to further improve quality ?
  1st Aug 2007 02:14 #2
  My understanding is no. The function of a TBC is to corerect timing and frame issues, which your full-frame in-built TBC already does. If you are looking to spend money, look at a video processor instead - something that cab sharpen, denoise and fix the colour on the way through.
  1st Aug 2007 04:35 #3
  thanks, can you please suggest a few video processor models ?
  1st Aug 2007 05:13 #4
  You should probably start your reading here : https://forum.videohelp.com/topic239205.html
  2nd Aug 2007 11:51 #5
  I don't think the HS1000 has a frame syncronizer, an extental TBC/sync will have. Doesn't the AVT-8710 has a basic proc amp? I can answer that now thanks to google, yes
  colour, contrast, ...
  Have you got any frame grabs using your HS1000. Especially compared to a JVC digipure model (I can compare with my own setup then) I have the HS860 which is a very late SVHS with TBC. I like it but the only other one I would consider is the HS1000 (or maybe the FS200) but I don't think they have the same NR filtering as the HS860??
  I have an ext TBC (VMX 410 -video mixer) its odd sync options help stop vertical rolling, but the panasonic seems very good at horizonal movement.
  Have you found the auto tracking any good.
  5th Aug 2007 23:35 #6
  As far as I can tell from what I have read on this & many other forums:
  6th Aug 2007 11:33 #7
  That's interesting. I definatly agree with JVC-soft and Panasonic-sharp bit. The 'better colours' bit I'm not sure of I've found JVC seems to have a slight chroma gain (not a bad thing at all) and an old Toshiba I have also showed a chroma gain. I actually was looking through an 80's early 90's VCR repair book in a local library (must have escaped a few book culls) and on Toshiba it actually pointed to the fact that they introducted this slight colour boost technology.
  Not had the JVC digipure long enough to be certain, but on poor tapes it's gone blue screen nuts in parts, where the Panasonic has struggled on. Pan horizonal movement ok but its the vertical that it can't deal with. (not 100% scientific test results)
  I'm going to email panasonic again to find out if it's a full frame or 1/2frame(field) TBC, they won't answer though!
  N.B. from what I can see Thomson must be the UK ver. of RCA
  6th Aug 2007 11:36 #8
  VCRs seem sensitive to bad tapes but bring out fine details that can't be seen with other VCRs.
  7th Aug 2007 07:37 #9
  Just out of interest you say its full frame, do you know that for certain. Is there anyway of testing this? I say this as I've read in a few sources that the US model Pan 1980 is full frame and the Pan 1970 was half frame. The UK version of the 1980 was likely the FS200 but the HS1000 came out afew years after this and is clearly a different machine. I've often found FS200 and HS1000 used together by semi-pro users which would suggest their similarity. It seems likely Pan would have reused the same TBC circuits once developed but can't be certain.
  9th Aug 2007 00:03 #10
  I read somewhere that JVC has a full-frame TBC.
  9th Aug 2007 02:09 #11
  Blue screen can be turned off on the JVC.
  10th Aug 2007 08:49 #12
  Abbymat-PM'ed
  Yep those dates look right,
  960 was 2000 followed by 860 in 2001, they where cheaper but £450/£350 was as much as they could expect to charge when they'd already switched to DVD recorders.
  They where probably the last, but as you likely know, you have to be careful which of the Panasonics you get as only a few have a TBC.
  To me it looks like these late models the '3DNR' is different to the 'noise reduction' feature on earlier models, it is also possible to change picture controls (soft/sharp..) without the NR cutting out as in earlier models.
  10th Aug 2007 09:58 #13
  My 2004 S-VHS Panasonic has TBC and 3DNR. Both are individually switchable and it gives a very clean output. It is the NV-HS930 - has jog/shuttle, S-VHS in and out and is the last top consumer dack from Panasonic. It has a better picture than my NV-HS1000 on rough tapes due to ths buffer memory.
  Barely anything is said in the manual about these 'advanced' functions so I do not know whether it is a 2MB or 4MB memory.
  It cost £350 new.
  15th Aug 2007 08:29 #14
  That's a new model on me. Looked at the manual and it's the HS960, but yours has added feature to control rec. sound levels, which is a handy feature. I think you have to have memory for a TBC as it saves the frame/field/no. of lines before sending them out corrected, so all tbc VCR's have some. Correct me if I'm wrong.
  If the HS1000 is full frame then these models like your HS930, the HS960 and my HS860 must be full frame too. It would make sense for panasonic to reuse by then old technology and possibly add to it. I believe that the 3DNR has a very positive effect on the chroma noise and grain. I only wish the picture controls had more variety than sharp/auto/soft as really bad tapes may improve if further softened.