NERMEEN SHAIKH: Well, let’s go to President
Trump’s comments also on Tuesday at the
General Assembly, when he slammed the Iran
nuclear deal.
PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: The Iran deal was
one of the worst and most one-sided transactions
the United States has ever entered into.
Frankly, that deal is an embarrassment to
the United States, and I don’t think you’ve
heard the last of it.
Believe me.
It is time for the entire world to join us
in demanding that Iran’s government end
its pursuit of death and destruction.
It is time for the regime to free all Americans
and citizens of other nations that they have
unjustly detained.
And above all, Iran’s government must stop
supporting terrorists, begin serving its own
people and respect the sovereign rights of
its neighbors.
NERMEEN SHAIKH: So that’s Trump speaking
on Tuesday, saying that the Iran nuclear deal
is an embarrassment to the United States.
AMY GOODMAN: And NBC is reporting that he
is going to decertify.
JEFFREY SACHS: The last time we had this kind
of rhetoric was George W. Bush with the axis
of evil.
It was immediately followed by the Iraq War,
which was the most disastrous single step
of American military action and, quote, "diplomacy,"
or anti-diplomacy, in modern times.
So this is a setup, again, for war, for conflict.
And it is extraordinarily ignorant and dangerous.
Iran is in compliance with the agreement that
was reached.
That’s—
AMY GOODMAN: Rex Tillerson has said that.
JEFFREY SACHS: He has said that.
And it’s an agreement that is reached not
just with the United States, but with the
U.K., with France, with Russia, with China,
with Germany, with all of the permanent members
of the Security Council.
It’s endorsed by the world.
And, of course, this is Trump in this kind
of bizarre sense of grievance, arrogance and
ignorance that absolutely is a prelude to
conflict.
AMY GOODMAN: And now Iran is saying that they
may start enriching uranium.
JEFFREY SACHS: Iran is, of course—
AMY GOODMAN: Responding to President Trump.
JEFFREY SACHS: —bewildered.
But after the deal was made, Iran had elections,
and the moderate president, Hassan Rouhani,
was re-elected, despite opposition from hardliners.
And the U.S. response is to provoke.
Now, why is this happening?
Because two U.S. allies—Israel and Saudi
Arabia—are luring our ignorant president
into this kind of vehemence.
This is Israeli and Saudi policy, Saudis because
of the Sunni-Shia conflict and battle for
regional power, Israel because of its own
narrow concerns.
And all the United States is doing, Trump
is doing, is being lured into this and making
the U.S. unsafe and making the world unsafe.
It’s shocking.
AMY GOODMAN: In fact, one of his first meetings
on Monday was with Netanyahu, the Israeli
prime minister—Trump’s.
JEFFREY SACHS: Netanyahu is a threat, absolutely,
and is a provocation and is gunning for war
with Iran, and has been for years.
And Trump is playing into his hand.
NERMEEN SHAIKH: But as you say—you said
that, you know, Trump is an ignorant president
who’s being drawn into this by Saudi Arabia
and Israel, so let’s assume that that’s
true.
You’ve also criticized Congress for ceding
authority to this imperial presidency.
And your assumption is, which is probably
correct, that if Rex Tillerson and other members
of his administration dealing with foreign
policy continue to work with him, then that’s
an implicit acknowledgment that they side
with whatever it is that he’s saying.
So, within the U.S. government, Congress or
the executive, there’s no limit on what
Trump can do.
What you’re suggesting is no one will stand
in the way of whatever it is that Trump intends
to do, whether it’s to go to war or whatever
it is that he decides.
JEFFREY SACHS: I believe the American people
who do not want war—and we need to avoid
war—need to speak out right now, because
I believe these are the drumbeats of war.
We’ve heard them many times before.
Our government absolutely is war-oriented.
We have a deep security state which believes
in overthrowing other countries.
We have a secret army called the CIA, which
is engaged in covert wars all over the world.
And we have a president who is openly provocative,
openly gunning for war, it seems, with these
two countries and heaven knows how many more.
AMY GOODMAN: You’ve been writing about Afghanistan.
JEFFREY SACHS: Well, Afghanistan has been
in the U.S. gun sights since 1979.
We know that the CIA went into a secret war
in Afghanistan back in 1979 to try to lure
the Soviet Union.
And the Soviet Union said, "We’re going
into Afghanistan in part because there’s
destabilization by the CIA."
Everybody laughed, "Oh, look at the Soviet
propaganda and conspiracy."
It was absolutely true, revealed by U.S. authorities
decades later.
Since then, that country has been in constant
war.
We have profoundly destabilized it.
We invaded in 2001.
Trump has said during the campaign—it was
one of the few glimmers of sanity, rationality—said
we shouldn’t be in there.
But, of course, once he got into the Oval
Office, the generals assembled.
He’s surrounded by generals, remember—his
chief of staff, his national security adviser,
his secretary of defense.
Those are civilian positions in American tradition.
They’re all generals.
And they’re telling him, "You expand the
military reach in Afghanistan."
We also found out that they had been lying
about how many American military were actually
in Afghanistan for years, keeping the number
lower than the truth by various tricks of
rotations and accounting and the timing.
So, we don’t even know what really goes
on with our secret wars.
But Trump is absolutely not stopping any of
it.
