Hello my name's Joe O'Sullivan and I'm
a sole practitioner O'Sullivan family
law and I specialize
in helping people break up as nicely and
amicably as possible,
and to that end, I am a specialist
mediator
and I work with other lawyers rather
than against them,
so the aim is to work in a team with
family consultants,
financial advisors, pension experts etc,
anyone we need,
including parenting experts
to help the family really
separate the best way they can. Sometimes,
I'm not the best person to help them.
So there are some questions that would
have been asked had this panel gone
ahead
but for the Covid 19 outbreak
and, I'm in lockdown
my lockdown hair- I don't think it's too
bad,
but um yeah.
Here we go. So questions, highlights.
What are the highlights for me in my
practice well,
I think the highlight is in particular
being able to work the way I want to,
saying no to court work. I do do court
work.
Inevitably, I'm the respondent on cases,
but
ultimately I am not the aggressor if you
like,
I'm, I turn away most people who contact
me,
because I think there are people out
there who like doing that kind of work
I don't particularly. I love being my own
boss:
I work when I want to how I want to and
that
really suits clients as well as me.
I never have to write a memo, I never
have to justify myself
I can try things out, some things work
and sometimes
they don't. I've
been really grateful to my fellow
practitioners in Brighton
who over time we've really built up
something special here.
I would say I've been helped
spearhead that,
of course I would but it's not possible
remember to collaborate on your own
so I've had lots of help from everyone
else
And I remember when I very first set up
this self practitioners
practice the barrister said to me
well
you could do anything you like, you know
what I've taken at his word
challenges, well, what the challenge is
for me
um, I think probably because all the
responsibility
rests with me. sometimes I find that
difficult.
I don't think it's any different
actually when you're in a firm,
it's just that when you're in a film
with lots of other people, you can
say to someone can you do in this case
I'm really finding it tough
instead I rely on the other solicitors
that I work
with to talk to, to help me. I have
family law supervision which, if you've
never heard of it, is akin to the kind of
supervision that social workers would
get
(as a mediator I get supervision
as well) but rather unusually,
family lawyers and other lawyers don't
get this kind of assistance, and
that leaves people feeling
very much on their own,
possibly unsupported in even in a group,
even in a
team environment. So my family supervisor
helps me reflect on
my cases reflect on what went well and
what didn't, and also in terms of
mentoring me and
how I might move forward with my career.
So I think it's a challenge to do those
things on your own
which is why I'm glad, so glad I reached
out for help.
And also I think the challenge has been
to do something novel,
I think when I first started the
practice,
telling everybody what I wanted to do
you know some other
practitioners you know found it amusing,
really didn't think I'd be able to make
a living
and when they stopped laughing at me, um
they became a little bit um
antagonistic towards me um but over time
now I would say there's just actually
really loads of goodwill
even amongst those practitioners who
really thought I was completely bonkers.
Um and I think um,
those days of hostility were were
short-numbered,
but nevertheless, it was difficult. Another
question that might have been asked is
why
I chose my particular path. Well I did a
traditional
training contract so I sat in with my
principal and listened to
the three different principles, so I did
a seat in crime because initially I
wanted to be
a criminal lawyer, um I did a seat in
immigration and asylum
law and ended up actually running that
department. I was a bit older as a mature
student when I came to
study for a degree so I was already in
my late 20s by the time I
ended up as a trainees listener
and I um, I did family law.
Now much as I loved the criminal work
and I loved my criminal clients they
were all
delightful, um I just didn't think I had
the stamina to
work all day in court, to see clients
for what was left of it in the afternoon
and then very often work all night
as a duty solicitor at the police
station.
I thought I really didn't have it in me
to do that.
I was very taken with my family work
I was hooked if you like straight away.
I just found everyone's stories really
compelling and really interesting
and also the reward of seeing people
really as
wrecks really when they first came to see
me,
and then magically by the end of the
process
really they were on the road to recovery
and their lives were improving in all
sorts of ways.
You might notice I moved slightly
there, because my dog was yelling,
it's very annoying. That's working from
home for you. Anyway so what advice would
I give someone
starting out is perhaps another question
I might have been asked,
what would I do? Well I would get as much
work experience
in as many different environments as
possible, even if you've
absolutely no intention of being an
in-house lawyer
go and find out what it's like. For
example I really wanted to be a criminal
lawyer but
once I tried the other things I
preferred I preferred family work
and also any experience you're
getting
is really going to assist you in your
future career because
you'll be working with people you don't
know,
you'll be doing everything possible,
even sitting in with clients is
incredibly fruitful.
I think I'd also (if it's hard to get
work experience) you could
you could try just taking someone out
for coffee just if there's someone you
admire, you like their work
or even if they they're someone who
picks up the phone to you
just see if they'll take go out for
coffee with you ask for help with your
cv for example,
and just really pick their brain. People
generally are happy to do that kind of
thing.
But don't forget there are other avenues
as well, so perhaps
sit in the magistrates courts. 
Certainly,
I don't know how things will be after
Covid-19
but sit-in with
family courts at every level, the
supreme court, there are all sorts of ways
you can get involved and really find out
more about the law.
Remember there are other areas of the law
that people perhaps don't think of.
People have got to write the laws, they've got
to draft them. If you love drafting, if
you love detail,
that's somewhere else to go. There's more
to this gig than just being a solicitor.
Another question for you.
Ooh. I've thought something else.
If you're just starting out I think
being relentless is the key. Really
if you can get yourself some sort of
mentor, they can help you really tailor your experience to
what you want to do.
So I was lucky I had a mentor and
I told her what area of law I wanted to
do, that I wanted to work
in a community practice, that I wanted to
do legal aid (in the days when there was
legal aid),
and essentially she said well
go and do work experience at the CAB
this was in Reading in Berkshire
and I worked there for six weeks, and the
the manager there just thought I was
amazing (because I was a mature student I
was used to working hard).
It was the first time I'd ever worked in
an office, it was quite an eye-opener for
me,
and she recommended me to the senior
partner managing partner of the local
community practice,
and that's how I ultimately got my
training contract.
I wouldn't have known any of that if
someone hadn't pointed the way.
Ask for help people are often very
willing and generous
with their time and experience. And I
think also if I was
starting out, I would combine the law or
the practice of it
with some kind of computer I.T
knowledge, I think I would probably learn
to program.
I think I would be at the cutting edge
if I could of artificial intelligence.
I think the way forward is
really I think clients will be
doing more online, doing more for
themselves, and not instructing real
people like me,
my days are numbered. I'm hoping that
being in the room with people, or on Zoom
at the moment,
will keep me going until retirement,
but I think
(and I'm going to stick my neck out here)
I think really the interface between the
people
and the computer is where it will be at.
What skills do I think (another question I might have been asked),
what skills do I think
are needed for my role. Well I think
I've really learned to listen, though
I've done lots of chatting here, I think
listening is absolutely vital.
And learning that I don't have all
the answers, my clients often know a lot
more about what's good for them and
their families
than I do you know case law be
damned.
I think you need to be really
organized, I think you need to be able to
prioritize
your time. I think you need to see the
funny side...you know
life's hard your clients generally
speaking,
unless they're buying a house or there's
something nice happening,
and they don't really want to instruct
you so you've got to
you know, see the funny side sometimes.
Another question, something I
wish I'd known sooner. That
Everything will be all right. That hard
work pays off,
that we're all just people making our
way, and sometimes things work out and
sometimes they don't.
You can write a hundred application
applications and only one of them
successful, keep going. Just keep going.
I think also I would have faith,
I think
when I first started out working in this
novel way,
sometimes it was difficult to keep going
because no one else was following me.
And I think about my time again I'd
just go "well this is the way I'm doing
it
it works that's what I'm going to do".
I think also the things to remember,
I think also if I had a top couple of
top tips, it would be to remember to
thank people,
and thank people for their time,
thank people for little things they do
for you,
bit of thanks goes a long way. Anyway.
that's me, Jo O'Sullivan, O'Sullivan family
law. Best wishes to you all!
 
