>>Dr. Marko Grunhagen:
Before we get started
we welcome all of you guys
here, our EIU students,
our EIU faculty, staff. My name
is Dr. Marko Grunhagen. I'm the
Lumpkin distinguished professor
of entrepreneurship and also the
director of our new
Entrepreneurship Center here at
EIU. The Entrepreneurship
Center, as you may know, is
named the SEED Center, which
stands for Sustainable
Entrepreneurship through
Education and Development. In
short, we're trying to plant the
seed to grow entrepreneurship in
this area. Tonight's event is
held during entrepreneurship
week, the week of celebration of
the entrepreneurial spirit at
EIU, which we have held for 6
years now and we're very proud
to host 2 hallmark events this
week. These events allow us to
showcase the expertise and the
contributions of the study of
entrepreneurial adventures
contribute to the local, the
regional, and even the global
economy. This is the sixth year
that we're also operating our
minor in entrepreneurship which
is a campus wide minor housed in
the school of business. Over 70
students across the EIU campus
have already chosen to declare
entrepreneurship as their minor
and I know that many of them are
here with us tonight. As part of
this year's entrepreneurship
week on Thursday there will be
a panel of 5 experts offering
different expert perspectives on
the ins and outs of franchise.
The panelists include the
vice president of franchise
operations of Midas
International and the assistant
attorney general of the state of
Illinois. The panel will be held
in this room on Thursday at 5
pm. So, same time, same place,
and you guys are all more than
welcome to come. Tonight's event
features Mr. Bob Kehoe who is
the guy over here on the left.
He is the CEO of Leverage
Marketing, an online marketing
company. He is also an alum of
EIU School of Business and he
also played football here at
EIU. Go panthers. He will
discuss his journey in
developing his company and how
he was able to become successful
as an entrepreneur. Our speaker
tonight has graciously agreed to
answer questions at the end of
his talk and we will pass
microphones around to facilitate
questions from the audience. So
once we're ready to take
questions look out for the
microphones. Also a quick
reminder, if you have not swiped
your panther cards when you came
inside the auditorium please do
so as you leave so we record who
has actually been here. Ok. So
with that, I'm very proud
tonight to introduce
to you Mr. Bob Kehoe.
Let's give him a warm welcome.
[Clapping]
>>Bob Kehoe: 
I appreciate that.
Hi, quick question, does anyone
know the answer to this?
Why join a Navy when you can
be pirate? Who said it?
>>Male Speaker: 
Steve Jobs.
>>Bob Kehoe: 
Steve Jobs said it.
He turned out to be a hell
of pirate didn't he?
Steve Jobs was. I'm
going to say this
right now, but I'm no Steve Jobs
but I'm a hell of a pirate too.
We're going to take a look right
now when I go through this I'm
going to show you really just
where I went from Charleston,
Illinois all the way to where I
am now. I figured I'd just show
you the journey I've been
through to get where I am today.
But I really never had a job
before in my life. I've had 1 in
my adult career and so we're
going to take a look at some of
that. So here's me back in 1993.
I actually had a class in this
room, I sat back there in the
very last row. It's kind of
weird being back here and seeing
it. But I met my wife here in
1990, as I like to introduce her
as my current wife. So I met her
back then and here's me with my
[jar] head and standing on the
field back when it was grass. So
it's really cool being back at
Eastern. I've got to be honest,
this is the first time I've been
back in 23 years. I haven't been
back in Charleston and it looks
the same, a little bit different
but hasn't really changed very
much. So I wanted to discuss
today just my life as a pirate.
I've been through a lot as an
entrepreneur. One thing I want
to tell you as an entrepreneur,
if you think you want to be
entrepreneur you probably
shouldn't be. You've got to know
you want to be an entrepreneur.
It's hard. I've been tossed
around by violent economic
cycles, by rapidly changing
technologies, I've ridden
businesses up to the top and
down to the very bottom and then
back up to the top again. So as
I go through this I want to show
you guys maybe take a look and
listen to what I'm saying. Try
to identify some of the traits
that you're going to need to be
an entrepreneur. I can tell you
right now you can figure out if
you have "it" or not, if you
have "it" that's great, but if
you don't have the stomach for
it it's not a great place to be.
I've seen a lot of businesses
fail. Guys who thought they
should be entrepreneurs and just
failed because they didn't have
the right temperament for it,
they didn't have the right
tolerant for the things you're
going to experience as an
entrepreneur. The number 1 thing
you're going to experience with
entrepreneur is risk, and you've
got to love risk. It'll be like
a golfer where you're standing
over a putt that's worth a lot
of money, you need to sink that
putt without being nervous. It's
one of those things where you're
either born with it I think.
It's really hard to develop into
an entrepreneur. You kind of see
those traits. What I do isn't
for everybody I can guarantee
that. So company number 1, I
call it the necessity
entrepreneur. I got out of
college and I floated, I was
just lost. When I went back to
Chicago, I'm from the Northwest
side of Chicago, I got back up
there and I graduated here with
a degree in business and I also
was a teaching certificate. And
so when I went up back to
Chicago and I had no interest in
going to work for some blue-chip
company. Everyone there, all my
family, friends, "Oh you've got
a degree now. You're going to go
work for a business and do
business-ey things." I didn't
even know what that meant to
tell you the truth. I really had
no interest in doing that. So
what I did do was I figured out
that to run a job, to run a
business from something I did
during in college. So I need to
make money, I was 23 years old,
I had zero interest in the
corporate path, I turned a
college job into a business. We
invented a new way to set steel
high beams in houses, more on
that in a second. It was
dangerous and insane work.
Nobody had ever done it before
like we did it, and we were
looking for excitement and we
enjoyed the risk. The guys I
partnered with, they all enjoyed
the risk as well, and not only
the physical risk but the
financial risk as well. We put
money on it. Basically all the
money we had, we put into it. So
just real quick I'll tell you
what it was. These are steel
high beams that go across the
basement. So if you have a house
with a basement in it there are
steel high beams that run
through the middle of it, right?
And so we figured out is that,
when we were in college what we
did was on summer breaks we'd
get a crane and set the crane up
and jump down a hole and we set
these big 6-800 pound beams up,
right? And so we'd need a crane
company out there to do it. Well
what me and my buddies figured
out was we could actually do
that by hand by using a series
of leverage and muscles to get
those into place without using a
crane. What actually took the
longest was setting up the
crane. So what we did was we
went out and we started doing
this. And how we tested it was
we went out at night and found
houses that had the steel drop
next to it and we practiced. We
took a few trial runs. I'm sure
the carpenter showed up the next
day wondering why the steel was
set. But we tried to go ahead
and we figured out how to drop
it down to our shoulders and
bring it up to a latter, up to a
column, and then brace it off.
And those things are huge, but
with leverage you can do it, ok?
So what we did was went up to
the steel companies and said,
"Hey steel company we can set up
those steel high beams for half
the price and we can do 3 or 4
times more houses than a crane
can do." They thought we were
crazy, which we really were
pretty crazy for doing this. And
they said, the way we got them
to do it we said, "Well we're
going to this next steel company
down the road, either you sign
up for it here or we're going to
the next guy and we're not
coming back here." So we got 1
guy to go ahead and agree and
give us a whole weeks worth of
work and we got it done in 2
days. So when I was doing this
job we were making about $3,000
a week each doing it. By the
time we were rolling, we were
making $3,000 a day and that was
a ton of money at the time.
We're making 3 grand a day and
it was a lot of fun, but it was
dangerous, it was hard work.
When I started out I was 6 foot
3, by the time I was done I was
probably about 6 foot 1 from
being smashed down by steel. But
it was dangerous, insane work. I
knew I wasn't going to do it
forever and that time did come.
By the time I was done with it,
so this regular pirate's life
again, it meant moving on from
this. And moving on from
something where you're making a
lot of money doing, it's a hard
thing to do. But I knew that's
not what I wanted to do,
especially the physical,
demanding our version of it was
extreme. [Unclear dialogue]
Housing boom started to wobble a
little bit. And then we looked
at it, if we stay in it for too
long in something it's called
the golden handcuffs, right?
Golden handcuffs means, you're
stuck, because your bills start
to rise, you buy a house, you
have kids, all these things
happen and you got to start
making a certain amount of
money. The problem with that is
you can't just all of a sudden
go backwards and make no money
when you've got all these bills.
I knew that time was coming. And
again, this is '94/'95, what
also happened at that time? The
web was just starting to come
around, right? The Internet was
here. Now we take it granted
obviously, but back then it was
cool. And I was just jacked
about it, I was into it, I'll
tell you a little bit more about
that. When I was new and while I
was doing this, that night I was
going to Northwestern's
University College because I was
taking programming classes. So I
would show up at Northwestern's
University College in a
programming class learning C, C
equals [unclear dialogue]. And
I'm going there and I show up in
my Carhartts and my boots
looking sunburned in December
and I'm there with a bunch of
kids who look like they're
extras from the Walking Dead
because they haven't been
outside in months. And so I
didn't care about that though
but I was there learning it. I
knew I had an interest in
computers, I had an interest in
technology. I had my first
computer in 1981, it was a
TRS-80 and when I was here I had
a 386 when I was here, that's
kind of funny now. Actually it
just out in Palo Alto at Google.
I went to the computer museum
and the computers that we used
when we were in school are in
the museum, but it was pretty
cool at the time. [Unclear
dialogue]. Oh, by the way, these
next couple of slides are an
example of why my marketing
department doesn't allow me to
do PowerPoint. I break every
rule in PowerPoint. But I
started plotting a new course,
what I was taking a look at was
that I knew I needed to get out
of construction and I had a
teaching certificate. So what I
decided to do was I decided to
go back and teach high school,
which was pretty insane. So I
went and I sold the trucks we
had. At the time when I left we
had 3 trucks going out everyday,
6 days a week, 10 hours a day,
setting steel. The amount of
money that we were making was
ridiculous and it took me a lot
of years after that to get back
to that same level of income.
But being 23, 24 years old
living in Chicago I spent it
all. Every last penny of it, I
spent it all, and then some. I
probably owned some people money
too by the time I was done. But
we were young kids just making
too much money at the time. So
plotting a new course, I go in
and I find out from a buddy of
mine that [unclear dialogue]
played football in college
[unclear dialogue] working at a
place called Gordon tech High
School and we tells me about an
opening at the school. And it
was basically to develop a
computer curriculum to the
business department at
Gordon Tech High School. I
said, "This sounds great. It's
almost like being an
entrepreneur, it's kind of cool.
I can be my own boss, nobodies
ever done it before. This sounds
pretty neat." So I sign on as a
teacher. I was excited to sign
on as a teacher until I saw the
contract. The contract is
$23,000 a year to teach high
school. And so I wound up
teaching summer school, night
school, coached 2 sports, and I
wound up making $36,000 that
year coming from making well
over 6 figures as a construction
guy. But I knew the construction
thing wasn't going to last. So
again, this is why I started
company number 2. Company number
2 I called it the Computer
Tutor. So I'm teaching, I'm
coaching, I'm doing all of these
different things, and my wife
and I had our first child in '97
and so I needed money, I needed
money quick. And so out of
necessity I started this and I
call it entrepreneurship with a
safety net. Basically what that
is, is I had a job that I was
being paid to do but I started a
company and basically what I did
was I went around and trained
people how to use their
computers, how to fix their
computers. I did everything
related to a computer I could
get my hands on, and it was
really all done through
referrals. And so I still had
a steady check, I capitalized
them in a growing interest in
Internet. In any business you
want to start you find [unclear
dialogue]. If there's a need
you have to fill it. Fill it in
a different way, do something
different, do it differently
than somebody else did it, and
make some money doing it.
And the business grew
through referrals as I
said, and I had a steady
supply of cheap labor.
The steady supply of
cheap labor was kind of blown
out of necessity which was--oh
this is the actual business
card, I found it and check out
that web address
[http://home.earthlink.net/pillk
ehoe], how about that for a
memorable address, right? Bob
Kehoe, here's what I did; I was
trained on most popular
applications on Windows '95, the
Internet, Office '97 and
previous versions,
troubleshooting, software
installation. That's my business
card right there. It was cool.
Back then that was cutting edge
stuff. I was basically Geek
Squad before Geek Squad was
around. I mean that's what it
was, it was Geek Squad before,
right? That's their business
motto, that's what they do.
Anyways, so there I am, the
Computer Tutor. And so I was
training, I was coaching,
teaching, doing all this stuff,
and working my butt off. You
think showing your mom
Instagram or Facebook, Pintrest,
any of those is hard, try
showing a middle-aged business
guy back in '95 about Excel and
he's coming from a typewriter
and doing ledgers by hand, that
was brutal. Anyways, so I start
finding out that a lot of
computers are broken, right?
Because there was nobody that
knew, they thought that
installing software was hard.
You didn't just go ahead and
click a button and the app
installs. You had to know some
[unclear dialogue], you had to
know some stuff about computers,
right? I love that my [patriots]
are all shaking, "Yep, yep,
yep." So you had to know some
stuff. Anyways, the computers
break and so I'm getting this
business coming to me, and I
don't have time, but I'm still
taking it on. Never stop sales,
that's another rule in
entrepreneurship, you never stop
sales; always continue to make
money because you never know
when it's going to go away.
Figure out somebody who can do
the work for you and I did. I
had 4 students who were
brilliant. These kids were so
far ahead of the other kids in
school that I couldn't teach to
them. They were in my general
computer class and they were
just [sigh]. And so what did I
do? I said, "I got this cheap
labor right here. Who are going
to learn from computers." Right?
They're going to learn from the
systems I'm bringing in. So I
had this great operation going.
I'm bringing all of these
computers in; the kids in class
are fixing them, right? I did
this for about 6 months and I
learned a very very important
thing about myself at that
moment when the principal came
in and shut my operation down. I
learned that I am 100%
unemployable. I cannot have a
job, I can never work for
somebody because there is an
arbitrary rule that he thought
was something that needed to be
enforced. In my mind I was like,
"No, these kids are working on
systems now that--" And I'm poor
teacher at your school and these
kids are working on systems that
there is no way they'll ever see
again, right? And so I was
proven to be right by the way
because 4 of those kids wound up
in the IT field, 1 of them owns
a large IT consulting firm in
downtown Chicago. So I was
proven right. And so the
principal shuts my operation
down and summer is coming up
that year. Alright, so summer is
coming up and I take a risk. And
the risk is always going to be
guaranteed money versus money
that you may make because you're
good at what you do, right? I
took the bet and I said, "You
know what? I'm going to live on
the Computer Tutor money for
this summer and I'm going to see
if I can make this thing go."
And so I started doubling down,
I'm going out marketing, putting
my product out there. I soon
start making more money doing
that than I was teaching. And so
I was making more money doing
Computer Tutor than I was
teaching and then what happens
is this. This is it, man, this
is the big break. And so what
happened is I use to have this
habit of going to all the hotdog
stands in the neighborhood. I'd
put my flyers out there,
somebody would read my flyer and
maybe call, maybe not. I'll
never forget this day, I'm
driving back home from somewhere
and all I want to do is get home
and I pass this place called
Harpo's at the time, now it's
called Doghouse. That's the
actual place. And I'm driving by
it and I get probably a mile
down and I'm like, "You know
what? Screw it. I'm going to go
back and put some flyers in
there." I did a U-turn and came
back around and I dropped off my
flyers, Computer Tutor, at the
hotdog stand. All of a sudden a
few weeks later I get a call
from a fellow named Gabe
Caporale. That's him on the
right. He uses that picture on
his website still, he's about 20
years older than that though.
That's Gabe and Gabe Caporale
called me up and he had this
Italian accent and he's says--I
won't try to do an Italian
accent but he said, "Hey, do you
know anything about this web
crap?" I'm like, "Yeah, I know
some stuff about it, what do you
need?" He says, "Come in and
work with my agents. I know
they've got a lot of computers
that need to be fixed and I need
all this help." And he became my
first regular customer. And I'll
never forget, I thought "Man," I
was addicted from that moment
on. I was hooked on bringing in
new customers that would pay me
continuous revenue to do some
work. I wasn't addicted to the
work part, I didn't like that,
but I loved the selling part of
it. I loved doing the deal. I
loved making stuff happen. And I
knew that moment there I had
something, I was digging it and
I was there. I was in his
office. I was working with his
agents. And then I get this
great idea, this is '97, and I
get this idea, "Hey man, you
need a website." He's like,
"Whoa, what do I need a website
for?" "So people can see your
listings." Now, this is 8
years before Zillow, 8,10 years
maybe, 8, 9 years before Zillow.
Everybody knows Zillow, right? I
knew it even before it was an
idea, I mean this was early on.
And I said, "Hey, listen, let's
put your listings online. I'll
build you a website." So I start
making him a website. He agrees,
he funds it, he gives me some
money to do it. I start building
it. I'm doing it myself. I'm
building an html, I've got a
data base going for the
listings. My idea was to have
the admins of the company enter
the listings in, publish them to
the web on his website, and
hopefully consumers will come
look just like they do now but
this is '97 when it was unheard
of to do. So I started building
this website and I start
thinking, "Man, I'm a genius.
This is great. I'm going to make
a million dollars building
websites for real-estate
brokerages and I'm going to have
employment with their listings
online." Another flyer changes
the course of my direction. All
of a sudden I get this flyer, I
found out later Gabe had a habit
of picking up flyers and he
would buy a lot of stuff. But
Gabe hands me this flyer and
it's for this company called
Birdview Internet Propers.
Whoa, he's got something cool,
Birdview Internet Propers. So I
look at the flyer and it says
they could do everything I could
do plus more. They had it
figured out where they wrote
software that automatically
accessed the multiple listing
services, where all the state
brokers put their listings.
Automatically accessed [unclear
dialogue], sent the listings
out, put them on a webpage,
right? And this is unheard of at
the time. And I get fired and
I'm like, "Oh, I can't do that.
I'm in trouble. My businesses
suck." So I could have done 1 of
2 things at that moment, 1; I
had Gabe's trust right? I could
have said, "Gabe, this is the
stupidest thing ever, you don't
want to do that. You want to
deal with me, keep paying me
money." Or 2, I could have said,
"I'm going to call these guys
and see what they're up to." And
when I called those guys it was
1 guy, right? And he was a
brilliant, brilliant guy. More
on that in a second. Ok, so I
called him, Gabe signs up, and
then I wound up meeting-- this
is the slide, this is the one
where my marketing department
would go, "Ah, stop"-- Anyway,
birdview.com. I met a guy
named Bedros Bedrosian, see
there's me [unclear dialogue]
don't I? Look at that, if there
is a face that needs a goatee
it's that one. It's the extra
chin [unclear dialogue], I had a
hairline and everything. I think
that's 1 of 10 times in my life
I've worn a tie. So this is me
the Computer Tutor, here's
Bedros Bedrosian. Bedros
Bedrosian ended up being my
partner for the next 17 years
and is still my partner today. I
called him over and this goes
into the bucket of partner with
good people, partner with the
right people, people who will
compliment your skills. Don't
have a partner if you don't have
to, but if you have a partner
have one that's going to
compliment your skills. He's one
of the best people I've ever
met. He's a brilliant visionary
and he complimented me because
he could build and do and I
could sell. And that's when I
realized that I was good at
selling. I wasn't great. I mean
if you put me in a room with
another coder I was a terrible
coder compared to them. I could
muddle through a little bit,
like somebody who could barely
speak Spanish and tries to speak
Spanish, I was that guy but with
coding. Bedros was brilliant,
brilliant programmer. He's a
[unclear dialogue] from
Northwestern University. Just a
smart, smart guy. Anyways, so I
meet Bedros and I said to Bedros
June 24, 1998, I remember it
like it was yesterday, I said,
"Listen, why doesn't Computer
Tutor become your sales arm?
Right? I'll be your sales arm
and you go ahead and rebuild
it." So I get 2 months, right? I
got 2 months and I almost forgot
that I had to go back to school
and teach. I was under contract.
And I start selling and he says,
"Yeah, that's great, let's do
it." And I go out and he had, at
the time, 3 customers. By the
time it was 2 months over it we
had 15 customers and I sold them
all. At that moment we knew we
had something. We knew, we knew
we had something good going on
and it was exciting at the time.
We were passionate about the
web. We were passionate about
the Internet. That's something
you really have to understand is
that if you're going to be an
entrepreneur, whatever you're
selling, whatever you're doing
you have to have passion because
there are going to be times
where you're going to get kicked
and the passion is the only
thing that's going to keep you
going. The excitement, the
knowing that you're right.
Entrepreneurs know that they are
right. Entrepreneurs know that
they're right and nobody can
tell them they're wrong. Now,
that's also detriment sometimes,
but when I'm right I know it,
you're not going to knock me off
that position. And that's
exactly what Bedros and I were
like with the web. Bedros
Bedrosian, I've never been able
to say his name 1 time. Bedros,
what? Bedros. So this is Bedros
and what came out of this
here--oh and I decided to not go
back and teach and it cost me
10% of my contract to not go
back. So I had to pay them 10%
of it to get out of the
contract. That's $23,000, the
only time I was glad I didn't
make that much money. So we
wrote a check and I'll never
forget the vice principal's,
that I gave the check to, words,
"What are you going to do when
this Internet fad thing is
over?" You laughed at him, he
didn't know. Birdview.com and
that was the actual logo from
back then and that was the logo
in 1998. It's kind of silly
looking now, but back then that
was cutting edge. So we had a
unique concept, give us your
real-estate listings and the
product got huge. And so I
talked a little bit about
Birdview. So that was us
growing. Still on this whole
pirate thing right now. So we're
down there [unclear dialogue],
the residential real-estate
market was exploding. We had a
unique product it was absolutely
unique. Nobody at that time was
doing what we were doing. And a
100% bootstrap company. Let me
tell you 2 quick things, 1 is I
went up to California one time
with a one way ticket, a hotel
room, a car, and 1 suit, and
that's all I had. And I went out
there and to get back I had to
sell enough to get a plane
ticket home. And I lasted 18
days out there driving from, if
anyone knows Southern
California, San Luis Obispo to
the Mexican boarder. Every night
I had to get back to Anaheim
because that's where my hotel
was. And so when you start
talking about a boot strapped
company you're talking about
living like that. I went to
Boston one time and I stayed
there for 3 days with 10 dollars
in my pocket. I would go and eat
office donuts and I would go to
happy hour and I would grab a
cup and pretend I was a
customer. It was an empty cup
because I didn't have money to
buy a drink, and I would eat the
happy hour food. And I had the 1
suit and I had the 1 suit for 3
years and it was a mess. I still
have it. That's what a start up
life is like. A start up life,
and I have hundreds of stories
like this. Sleeping in Sea Tech
airport Seattle, sleeping in
the car. I mean if you're
going to be an entrepreneur
don't get in it for the money.
If you get into it being an
entrepreneur don't do it for the
money. The money will come if
you do it right. If you do it
right the money will show up, I
can guarantee that, ok? But if
you're going in because you want
to get rich, you want to be the
next Zuckerberg, you want to be
the next Sirgey or you want to
be the next Paul Allen, any of
those guys, yeah that's not how
it works. Those guys didn't get
into it for the money, they got
into it because they were
passionate about something. We
were [at advantage] because the
Internet was growing at that
time. We not only had to sell
the idea of the Internet, we
also had to sell the idea of our
product. They didn't believe
that the Internet was going to
be anything. It's hard to say
that now in front of you, but
they really did not believe the
Internet was going to change the
way business is done. We knew it
was. We knew it was. We knew we
had something good. We had a
need to fill. This is our first
year revenue, after it was all
said and done we made a half
million dollars. Man, that was
exciting, we did a victory lap.
Now, we were not being paid
though. We were paying ourselves
just enough to pay the bills at
our house, our homes. My partner
was living in his parents house
in the bedroom. He's 2 years
younger than me. I was married,
had a kid, and had just bought a
house, and my wife would be
home. My wife was the woman that
would go to the grocery store
and have to put things back
because there wasn't enough on
the debit card. But that's the
other thing, if you get married
and you do become an
entrepreneur make sure it's
somebody that that's got your
back. Make sure it's someone
that's a partner, team because
you put your spouse or your
significant other through hell
if you're an entrepreneur at
the boot strap stage . And it
really was, it was a lot of fun
and I look back on it and
romanticize it sometimes, but
if I put myself back
in those moments of
actually doing it,
it was brutal.
Now, [unclear dialogue] man
this is where it got fun. We
went from a half million
dollars, revenue peaks at 7
million, we're cruising. Man,
investors came on board, we had
a half million dollars. A guy
wrote us a check for a half a
million bucks. It's beautiful.
We thought we were the kings. We
were the kings of the industry,
right? We rebranded to Birdview
Technologies. We were growing a
business while running a
company. And I can tell you
right now growing a business is
way more fun than running a
company. Running a company is
not for me, no. I like growing
businesses. Our product sold in
34 states. I did over a million
miles in the air during that
time. I was in airplanes all the
time. I'm still on airplanes all
the time. I've had 4 flights in
the last 3 weeks. So you will
travel if you're an
entrepreneur. If you like to
travel, you like to be in
airplanes, hotels, all that
stuff, there you go. Our
platforms are enormous by this
point. It was elaborate,
multiple racks, huge. There were
63,000 customers on it and it
was an immense product and we
were trending up at the time. We
were on a roll. And staying in
the best hotels in the country,
5 star restaurants, the best of
everything you could possibly
have. We would go to dinner and
it wasn't weird for us to spend
10 grand on a dinner. That's
where we were at that point and
everybody in the real-estate
industry was at that point.
Then.. Boom. That's not a big
enough boom.. BOOM. It blew up
and I mean did it blow up. The
global real estate, we were 97%
of revenue was tied to the
residential state market. 97%.
October 2007, that was the
beginning of the end for me.
Man, it was a terrible day. I
walked in and I looked at our
network traffic and our network
traffic disappeared. We were a 6
month leading indicator on the
real-estate market meaning that
in 6 months we would look at
traffic 6 months later we would
see a spike in home buyer home
selling activity, right? And I
looked at our network in October
2007 the traffic was gone. There
was none and I called my partner
and said, "Dude, sell, sell,
we're screwed." Really, I mean
that was it. So we reduced the
work force. My best friend who
was my director of business
development played football with
Mr. [Unclear name] and I
[unclear dialogue] I had to fire
him. I had to fire my brother. I
had to fire a lot of people. It
was tough and I had the stomach
for it because I am an
entrepreneur, but I learned more
about how to manage a company on
the way down than I did managing
a company on the way up. And the
way up is easy because everybody
loves you and you're doing
victory laps and everybody
thinks you're the greatest guy
in the world. Managing a company
on the way down, that's when
you're tested. I abandoned ship
on February 2012--more on that
in a second. We sold the company
for 1.5 million dollars. Any
math majors in here? 20 million
is a lot less than 1.5 isn't it?
Significantly less. We had an
offer in 2006 for 20 million
right before the crash. Ouch,
that one still stings. I've had
a lot of bad things hit me in
business and usually it's just
like "whatever, move on," this
is one that still stings. We had
20 million and you know the
funny part is nobody, the board
of directors, none of the
investors, none of the people in
the company voted to sell. When
the vote came aboard they said,
"You guys are cruising, man.
You're at 7 million now you'll
be at 14 million in 3 years.
We're going to sell that sucker
for 50 million." Oops. So we
dumped it, basically, for 1.5
million. We didn't rich on that
because we had investors, we had
to split all that money. We had
enough, I mean we had a little
bit of money in our pocket, but
not excitedly, not ["I'm done"]
money. So, what happens?
Alright, so undercover boss
happens. So in 2010 we purchased
a company called Leverage
Marketing. Leverage Marketing,
we bought this company in 2010.
I had nothing to do with it. I
wanted a software company, the
owners wanted to buy a marketing
company, I lost, they bought a
marketing company, so I pouted
and went home. That's about what
happened. So we used the revenue
from Leverage Marketing to prop
up the real-estate technology
firm. We propped it up basically
and we were bleeding this
company to support our other
company that was bleeding. And
so I really didn't know these
guys I had nothing to do with
them. They were down in Austin,
Texas and I didn't have 1
meeting with them, didn't talk
with them, they didn't know who
I was. So in February 2012 we
get the idea that we're going to
sell. We're going to sell
Birdview, and I said, "You know
what I've got to get out of
here." I had to get out because
I didn't want to sign a
non-compete in the sale of the
company, which meant that if you
sold to another company in that
industry I couldn't work in that
industry for awhile. So I
transferred my employment down
here. And the cover story was
that I was the sales rep at
Birdview who needed a job now
that we were selling. The
reason I did this is two fold,
one, I didn't want to be the
owner of the company because if
you go in as the owner you get a
whole level of expectations
differently than if you were
just an employee, and two, I
wasn't committed yet. I just
needed something to do and truth
be told, I needed some money
because we lost hard cash. We
probably lost about 3 million.
So I needed a job and it was
some pretty tough times. So I
needed to figure out-- I had to
go down there [and take stock
with that]. So I went on as a
sales rep and they didn't know
who I was and so I had to go to
sales meetings. I went old
school, I went [cold colony], I
went back to my roots of
selling, and I started actually
selling. I wound up in 5 months
becoming the top sales guy in
the company, I was all proud of
myself. And I hated the sales
manager, I hated him and I was
his boss I owned the company but
he didn't know. And every Friday
he would make me go in a meeting
using old school sales tacits.
Useful sales tactic is all about
helping people buy, you don't
sell anymore. You can't sell.
People don't get sold to. If
they want to buy something you
help them buy it, right? And you
show them why it's a good thing
to buy. You don't--"Oh you do
this, you do this, you do this,"
you just don't force. You can't
force people to buy. But he was
one of these old school sales
guys and I just couldn't stand
the guy. Anyway, that's a little
side note there. But anyway, so
I figured out when I was down
there we had a good company. It
was a good core group of people,
but it was just messed up. We
had a leadership problem and the
products sucked. The way they
were selling them was terrible.
And so I watched it for a while.
And so in June when [unclear
dialogue] was trying to sell the
company I went to the sales
meeting and he started talking
and doing the same stupid stuff
he's always been doing and I
said, "Just shut up. Just stop."
And he goes, "What? What are you
talking about?" I said, "I've
got to tell you the truth, I'm
actually one of the owners of
the company." And he was pissed.
He didn't know what to do. He
called my partner Bedros and
Bedros said, "Yeah, he's one of
the owners. Listen to him now."
And so I still wasn't committed
to it, but I saw that we had
this group of people down there
that I really liked. What the
problem was that we had too many
C players around my A players,
right? And you can't build a
company with C players. And so
what I wound up doing is I
suggested a management buyout in
the company, meaning that we had
a holding company that owned
these companies, and I suggested
that we buy it back from the
share holders. So we bought the
company back in January 1, 2013.
And let's see what I have here,
company number 4. [Unclear
dialogue] shrunk the company
down from 25 employees down to 5
employees. In the meantime while
I was doing that I was also
dumping customers because there
were customers that just didn't
fit our motto. They were paying
us but it just didn't fit with
what we wanted to build and who
we wanted to be as a company.
And so I almost crashed it
though and my partners were not
happy. And I told them "I'm
right. I'm right. I'm doing it
right. What I'm doing is right.
Just listen to me. Please listen
to me." And this was my first
time in the big chair. Bedros
was the CEO of the last company
and I was the vice president of
sales, this time I became the
CEO and they were just second
guessing every decision I made
but I fended them off. And what
wound up happening was around
May I thought for sure I was
going to have to go back and eat
crow and say "Maybe I screwed
up. Sorry I lost all the money
again." But in June 2014 I don't
what happened but all of a
sudden everything that I had
been doing worked. It all worked
and we wound up picking up the
largest customer in the history
of our company. And we picked up
another one after that and
another one after that. And all
the things that we had put into
place worked out for us. It was
nothing short of amazing because
I thought for sure at that
moment in May I thought I was
going to have to make that call.
And that would have been a fire
sale trying to sell that to
recoup some of our money back
and it didn't happen and the
share holders loved it, so
that's cool. Alright, so there
are 4 companies really in there
and the only real job that I had
during this whole time was a
high school teacher. But even
while I was a high school
teacher I was still looking to
be an entrepreneur. The reality
of it is I'm an entrepreneur.
I'll never lpay first base for
the cubs. I'll never be the
dictator of a small Central
American country. I'll never
walk on Mars. There are a lot of
things I'll never do. One thing
that I am and will always be is
an entrepreneur. That's
something that I am proud of,
something that I enjoy doing. I
work really really hard for a
certain amount of time so I live
a way certain people aren't
willing to live so I could live
like I live like most people
don't get to. There's another
way to say that without sounding
a little cocky but it's true. I
was 23. Don't let anyone tell
you that you're too young to
start a business. Don't listen
to it, it doesn't matter. You
don't need to have experience,
it's not that hard to start one.
It's hard to execute, hard to
build/sell your product, hard to
do a lot of things. It's hard
for a business like ours,
there's paper work you need to
fill out. Don't spend the year
looking at your logo or figuring
out what the perfect font on
your business card is. Get
started. Opportunity is often
disguised as hard work and a lot
of people walk over opportunity.
It's hard and hard work is the
state of entrepreneurship. If it
was easy everyone would do it,
right? There's nothing wrong
with going in and getting a job
at a company and doing that. I
don't want to make it sound like
that's a bad thing. Some of the
richest guys I know are guys
that work at companies, they're
not entrepreneurs. A lot of rich
entrepreneurs too. Don't worry
too much if you don't know what
you're doing, you're smart to
figure out. The unknowns, don't
be afraid of the unknowns. Don't
be afraid to take risks. Try
something that nobody else had
tried. I was just out at Google
and they just started this thing
called Google Lume. Google Lume
is when they float a balloon
60,000 feet in the air and they
beam a Wi-Fi signal down to
Earth and they pull a 40 megabit
signal, almost the same speed as
LTE. And when they went to go
make these balloons they didn't
hire balloon makers, they hired
seamstresses, all these people
that have never made a balloon.
They knew that the balloon
people, they knew one way of
making balloons and everything
else didn't work. So they went
and hired all these people. When
they first started they tried
out trash bags and they tried
all these different ways. Google
is the kind of company that
that's how they do things. So
they ended up giving them a very
small budget and said, "Try to
figure this out," right? And so
don't be afraid to try something
nobody else has tried before.
Pick good partners, bad partners
will kill you, and I know, I've
had a few it's a nightmare. You
can't just make money you have
to manage money. I learned that
the hard way. I have a fantastic
CFO now. The CFO actually runs
my personal finances too. He
gives me an allowance because he
knows I'm a goof. I like to
spend money, it's fun, so I've
got to make sure I don't spend
it all. But I say, "Ok, that's
my allowance? I'm spending it."
There's no problem that a
company has that can't be solved
by more revenue. More revenue
solves everything. I haven't had
a business yet that in any
problem I had where, "Hey, I've
got more money? I can fix that."
No money? Oh that's real hard.
You've got to get real creative
then. Don't worry about
decisions you make, go left go
right, it doesn't matter. Keep
moving forward, that's it. You
make a decision and you go
right, take a left, don't just
stop in the middle, ok? If you
stop in the middle you're going
to get run over. There's no
doubt in my mind that in no
matter what decision it is it's
a decision. Fail fast forward.
Fail fast forward. I've got that
sign on my wall in my office
down in Austin, Texas that says,
"Fail fast forward." And once
you make a decision if you
determine that decision is bad,
that's fine, learn from it,
don't get stuck in it, and move
on. I wasted a million dollars
one year in 2008, wasted a
million dollars on a complete
software rebuild. I tried to do
it in India, I'll never do it
again is what that stands for.
And so it was a million dollars
sent over there, we got sent
back the same crappy code in a
different language with all the
same bugs written into it. We
did a horrible job managing it.
We did a horrible job inspecting
it out. But we stayed in it 6 to
8 months too long and it cost us
a million bucks. Learn and move
on. Again, make mistakes but
move on. Hire people that
compliment your skills. Doers,
bridgers, and visionaries.
Doers, got to have them.
Bridgers are the people that
talk to the visionaries and
translate. Visionaries, you
don't need as many of those but
you need them, right? There are
doers, bridgers, and visionaries
in any company. Doers are worth
their weight in gold. My
employees down in Austin, Texas
get paid a lot of money. My
oldest employee is 29 years
old. I have employees that make
well over 6 figures at that
young of age because they're
doers and they're brilliant and
they're awesome and I wouldn't
do it without them. I'm really
good at hiring smart people. You
cannot build an A plus company
with C minus employees. Get rid
of the C's as quickly as you
can. Redeploy them into the work
force, ok? If you have somebody
that's worked for you, as you
become an entrepreneur, as you
get somebody that's worked for
you, redeploy them into the work
force the minute you find out if
they're a C player. You're not a
government organization you have
to get rid of people if they're
no good. But on the other side,
if they're good reward them. And
it goes back to pigs get fed
hogs get slaughtered. Don't be
greedy, pay your people. Unless
you're a funded company work
from revenue backwards. Funded,
the game changes once you're
funded. It must be a great idea
for an app and it all of a
sudden blows up and all that
stuff and you get funding, it's
different. Even if you are a
funded company, priority number
1, generate revenue or else the
company dies. Know when to get
out. Start up, growth, maturity,
decline. Know when to get out. I
could have used that lesson.
When you get offered 20 million
bucks, know when to get out. We
were hitting the decline and I
didn't know it. The decline was
precipitated by something we
didn't control. That was the
thing that killed us. We had no
control over the global
real-estate collapse. That's the
life cycle of a business right
there. Every business is going
to go through that. There's one
in there right now for modern
companies, which is called
reinvention where you reinvent
the company and totally change
it which is what I did with
Leverage. Leverage was
reinvented. The only thing that
is the same about Leverage now
from what it was when we bought
it is the name and that's it,
everything else is completely
different. Be ok with starting
over, in fact, prepare for it. I
was 43 when my company died,
right? I'm 46 now, I was 43 when
that company died, I was ready
to start over. Guess what? I'm
ready to start over again. Bring
it. Who wants to blow up on me?
I'll do another business, and
I'll do another business, and
I'll do another business,
whatever. Until they drag me off
the field I'm going to keep
starting businesses. I'll never
retire. I have no interest in
retiring. Why would you retire
if you love what you do, right?
Don't let perfect get in the way
of good enough. Keep moving and
improving. Perfect gets in the
way, people get in the way.
Perfect drives me nuts when
people want to get something
perfect instead of launching it.
Launch it, figure out what's
broken, come back and fix it.
That's the Microsoft motto.
That's how they figured out all
their bugs. Someone runs the
software, they report the bugs,
they fix it. That's their motto,
they've done it for years. Be a
pirate. That's it, man. Be a
pirate. If you want to be an
entrepreneur be a pirate.
That's it, thanks guys.
[Clapping]
>>Dr. Marko Grunhagen: 
We're going to take questions.
We have a couple microphones
up here. Questions? Anybody?
>>Male Speaker: 
So what do you do
to see employees and figure
out who are A employees?
>>Bob Kehoe: 
What do you do?
Well it's pretty
simple when you're
a B-to-B company
and your job is
to deliver a product. So for us
we're a digital search agency.
We manage about 20 million
dollars a year and search money
for big companies all over the
country. And so [around that]
meaning that they're looking for
return on investment, they're
looking for whatever the
business goal was that we agreed
to do, right? So you put people
in charge of certain pieces
whether it be paid search,
[organic] search, content
writing, design development,
whatever it is someone is going
to do the piece. You know pretty
quickly. You know who identifies
them very quickly? The other
employees and the other
employees will let you know very
quickly. My company is a little
bit different than a company you
may think of. We don't have
office hours. We don't have sick
time, paid time off. We don't
have a dress code, none of that.
We have 1 rule at our company;
get the job done or you're
fired. And they know it and they
love it because they go and get
their dry cleaning during the
day, it's not like they've got
to be there at any certain time.
But I think that's the
[economy]. Like I said, most of
my employees are younger. The
old man at my company is 29
years old. I found that people
in this generation, your age
kind of want that life, right?
But it comes with a lot of
responsibility. I mean you will
get fired pretty quickly if you
don't produce. Being able to
produce is very transparent the
way I look at it [unclear
dialogue]. And to our credit we
haven't, in the last 3 years,
had to let anybody go. When I
took over it was so bad,
everyone was getting fired. "I
don't know what we'd do around
here without you but tomorrow
we'll find out," that's
how I let them go.
They identify themselves
really quick though.
>>Male Speaker: 
How much is,
going back to the
construction company--
>>Bob Kehoe: 
Ah! My man. Construction.
>>Male Speaker:
--Now I want to do
construction, I'm just
wondering how did
you all get your
start up money?
>>Bob Kehoe: 
We didn't.
We bought a truck that
probably cost us about
$1,000. It was all
beat up it was
terrible. We grew through
revenue. When we got paid we
tried to get our job money in
advanced. We were charging at
the time $100 a beam, crane
companies were charging $200 a
beam. We would set 25, 30, 40
beams a day. The crane company
would set 10, 15 beams a day. So
for us was as soon as we got
that money, the problem that we
had though was we were 23, 24
years old, we're knuckle heads.
We would go back to the tavern,
there were a couple taverns
people in Chicago would call
them, we would go to the bar and
we'd put the money on the bar
and we would split it 3 ways. We
would walk out with a big stack
cash of money. That was our
money management back then.
Knuckleheads are what we were.
But yeah that was it, we took a
little slice of it. What
happened was when we got a
little bigger, Phil, one of the
guys, moms is an accountant, and
she started taking the money
over. And then we were able to
invest in tools and equipment
and everything else. So yeah,
you grow through revenue when
you got no money. Try to get
someone to pay to do
what you're doing.
>>Male Speaker: 
You mentioned that
people you work with are
doers, bridgers, and
visionaries. So my question for
you is what qualities do you
look for when you hire and how
do you encourage employee
development in your company?
>>Bob Kehoe: 
Good question.
I look for students. Students
who look for-- they run into a
problem and they don't go "Oh,
can't figure it out." If they
run into a problem they're
looking for a better way of
doing something and they're
thinking. Let's put it this way,
I wouldn't be hired at Leverage.
I would not make it through the
hiring process at Leverage
because I'm a salesman and we're
not hiring sales people. That's
it, that's what I do, I sell,
but I look for people
that--there are 2 sides to my
company, 1 is the math side,
which is the paid search
analyst, they're looking at data
basically. The last guy I hired
in paid search has a Masters in
econ from Baylor and he's an
econ guy. We're about a mile and
a half from the University of
Texas. We're a [unclear
dialogue] so we see a lot of
kids from there. The other side
is all journalists, writers, and
content people. And so right now
the people that are in demand in
my world are the people that can
write. If you can write
creatively and you're a writer I
could use you all day long. If
you're really really good at
math, but not just like math
only, they've got to be a little
creative with math. There's an
element of creativity because
you are hosting [unclear
dialogue] big actions, so I'll
leave it at that. But it's econ
guys, writers right now
that's what I'm looking for.
>>Male Speaker: 
And my next question
for you is what
was your biggest
interpersonal challenge
growing as an entrepreneur
and how did you over come it?
>>Bob Kehoe: 
I care too much.
No. I get those in
my job interviews.
I'll say, "What's your
biggest fault?" "I
care too much. I work too hard."
Interpersonal challenge? You
know, doing along with having a
balance in life. A balance of
life meaning that you spend time
with your family. You're at the
soccer games, and you're at the
graduation parties, you're at
the awards events, or you show
up at the shows, and you spend
time with your wife and kids,
and you're actually a dad
instead of this guy that works
all the time. I've worked really
really hard to have a balance in
life because I work out of my
house. I've never worked in an
office. I live in northern
Virginia and my office for my
first company is in Chicago,
this company is in Austin,
Texas. I own another company I
didn't talk about but it's in
Boston. There are no employees
there, it just makes money.
Yeah, that's it. That's the
biggest interpersonal challenge
is having a balance when you're
doing all of this so that you're
not one of those guys that's on
the road a lot. Now earlier when
my kids were little like little
babies I was on the
road all the time,
but they were too little
to know I was gone.
>>Male Speaker: 
Thank you.
>>Female Speaker:
Ok, I know you said
to be a successful
entrepreneur you
have to find a need and fulfill
it. So, since you've been from
like 4 different businesses you
said, did you do research to
find what [unclear dialogue] or
was it just personal experience?
>>Bob Kehoe: 
No, no.
I was never a research
guy. I mean I respected
research after the fact.
I mean those guys
are--those guys that do research
in business they're brilliant,
they're awesome, you need them.
You need them after the fact.
Going into stuff I was just
jumping in and I think that's
kind of a risk taker mentality
that I have, which is like if I
see a cliff I'm going to jump
off it and hope I land on
something soft.
Non-entrepreneurs are not going
to jump off that cliff. They're
going to check first to see if
something's soft down there. I
mean I'm going "Woo" here we go.
And so no, we didn't do a lot of
research going into any of the
businesses. It all came down to
I knew I could sell the product,
I knew there was a need, and I
found a group of people who
wanted to buy it, and I knew
there would be more of those
people that wanted to buy it. So
nah, not a lot of time I spent
on research. Not that
it's a bad thing,
it just didn't work for us.
>>Male Speaker: 
So you had
mentioned early on that this
business [that failed you]
would start another
business. Now
would there be like a different
field? Like first you start
construction, then computers,
and then finance.
>>Bob Kehoe: 
No, no idea.
>>Male Speaker: 
Or did you just pull
something out of a hat saying,
"I'm going to try this"?
>>Bob Kehoe: 
Good [data base].
Just like I said with
the flyer and hot dog
stand. Put a flyer at the hotdog
stand and next thing I know I'm
with a real-estate company. I'm
with the real-estate company and
the next thing you know I'm
meeting my partner for the next
17 years. So something always
happens that's the motto.
Something is going to happen.
But you don't know what, you
don't know when, you can't
control everything. Something
is going to happen, and I've
kind of trusted this. I'm not
afraid of hard work so when that
opportunity is there to present
itself it will present itself as
hard work. We were getting at
Leverage, where I work, 15 hours
a day for 3 years straight. I
almost killed myself I mean it
was brutal. I would say Leverage
was my hardest because I had a
quick turn around on a company
where I had to turn it around
from death to thriving and I'd
say that was the moment, the
biggest toll on me. I
mean Birdview was always
just fun. So I don't
know, I have no idea
what will be next.
>>Male Speaker: 
So whatever is
next you will just jump
in without research or
anything? You'd just jump in?
>>Bob Kehoe: 
There would be
sales involved. There would be
some opportunity to sell
something that we were good at
delivering. That would really be
it. That would be an
opportunity. It would be
opportunity based,
which is always,
is or how it has been
the last 4 times.
>>Male Speaker:
With your college
degree, where would you be if
you didn't have your college
degree? Would you have
went down your same path?
>>Bob Kehoe: 
I would be a
cop in Chicago or a fireman.
A cop or fireman in
Chicago, yeah. I have a lot of
buddies that I went to high
school with, I'll never forget
it, they showed up at my house
sophomore year in college one
summer and they all showed up
and said, "Let's go." I was
like, "Where are we going?"
"We're going to take a cop test.
We're going to take the fireman
test." And I went back upstairs
and I'll never forget there was
this old beat up suburban he had
[unclear dialogue] my stuff
because everyone was in Chicago,
right? Going to take the cop
test, going to take the fireman
test. And I went back upstairs,
something happened, I don't know
what it was but I said, "You
know what, I don't want to be a
cop. I'm going to keep going
back to school and get my
degree." And I'll tell you
what kept getting me that degree
was working that job setting up
the steel and the crane in the
summer time was the fact that I
didn't want to do that and I
knew I had to get a degree. I'll
tell you right now I won't look
at anybody in my company without
a degree. It's a filter and I
know a lot of business owners, a
lot of business owners that are
friends of mine and they're CEOs
and presidents of companies. I
can guarantee the easiest way
for us to get rid of-- and for
us it's efficiency, there's a
whole stack of people that want
a job with us, guess which ones
will get wiped off our desk
right away? No degree. You may
be great, you may be awesome,
right? You might be the greatest
guy I know. Now as far as being
an entrepreneur, can you start a
business without a degree? Sure.
Sure. Yeah. I don't know, I
think that you need a little
time and it's a great place.
You learn a lot. I learned a lot
of business when I was here
that's for sure. So I would
definitely get a degree. Plus
you proved that you started
something and finished it. I've
got a question real quick, show
from raise of hand, how many of
you think you have what it takes
to be an entrepreneur? Get it up
there. Cool. Cool. Well come on
in, the water is fine. We good?
Jeff promised me a
steak tonight, so.
Alright guys, thanks a lot.
[Clapping] 
