Hi, this is Aurora Blockchain Capital and you’re watching Like & Dislike.
I’m Oleg Abelev and this is my co-host, like always, Georgiy Erman.
Georgiy, hi.
Hello, Oleg.
Today we have a new guest and a new project to discuss.
We will discuss all the details of the project, all the advantages and disadvantages
as well as its effect on the market and investors in crypto.
Today we are looking at the ENDO project and right now here with us is Head of Marketing for the project, Vladislav Utushkin.
Vladislav, hi.
Hello.
We are very glad to have you here.
Thank you for inviting me.
Let’s start with the traditional question that we ask all of our guests.
Could you briefly tell us what the ENDO project is about?
It’s very simple. What was blockchain initially created for?
For data verification and storage, right? It’s only now that we have people who can’t tell the difference between crypto and blockchain itself.
Well, blockchain was created way earlier than crypto.
Yes, yes. So, it was about decentralized data storage.
But now someone has to verify the data. So we’ve built a system that allows you to store and verify data.
Getting rid of paper and moving everything to digital space is only a small part of the project.
So, we’ve written a blockchain protocol that verifies the data.
And if we talk about how this project is unique, what would you say differentiates it from the others?
Well, we’ve made it. The others haven’t.
So you’re the only ones in the market? Or does seem like it to you?
No we aren’t.
But while everyone is making landing pages and doing ICOs, we – initially being an IT business – we doubled down on engineering, we understood that it could be done.
I sometimes laugh at white papers which I read because they make a lot of claims the majority of which can’t be executed.
That’s just nonsense.
What about your target audience? Who is it for?
As we will be getting into more depth, you will realize that our target audience is people in general.
So, people.
Absolutely everyone.
You, for example.
You have your passport, your driving license and other paper documents.
You start your life with a document, your birth certificate, and you leave the world with a document as well.
Let me ask you this then.
What’s your attitude towards this idea – and it has been voiced multiple times – that we need to steer away from paper and make a uniform ID.
Brilliant.
An ID that would have everything in it.
Brilliant. This is exactly what we are doing. Well, we actually have made all of it.
So the government will soon knock at your door and be like “Hey guys”
Maybe. But we’re not crypto anarchists, we are not...
So you are ready to sell all of it if the offer is good?
Not necessarily. We are about creating an open source. It will be open to anyone.
Is there an interest from different countries already?
Yes, Monaco shows a lot of interest.
Is it real interest or is it just words for now?
Well, we are only testing. We are visiting the country a lot.
Monaco is really small and it’s easy to make everything work there. We can test and move on.
Let me make a joke here.
It’s strange that Vatican hadn’t shown interest even before Monaco did.
Yes. Wouldn’t be bad though.
Vlad, do you know anything about Telegram Passport?
Sure. More than just anything. We do have a personal agenda here right now.
They are doing, how do I say it, a tender…
Telegram?
… yes. They already have things that are worked out.
So do we, and I feel like there is a real chance of us being partners.
So, you want…
I’ve already been given Pavel Durov’s phone number, for one thing. Let’s see where it will go from there.
You’ve been given Durov’s phone number… This is really interesting.
Yes, I think we should stop rolling here.
Yes, definitely. Okay, I got it.
Do you want to integrate your project into theirs or vice versa?
They don’t have anything.
Well, you can wait and they will.
We already have something. What do you think will be easier?
Why were you given Durov’s number? To make…
When I learned this information – and I don’t have any limits in my head, when I learn something from a source, I move in that direction – I realized that we could be of use for Telegram.
Have you already presented an offer to them?
We have created two apps in our blockchain, in our web-protocol, to show that it’s possible to create them there.
One is ENDO Document, which is about digital documents and their verification. The other is ENDO KYC.
So you went in this direction as well.
Of course. If you have verified documents, why not go into KYC.
What do we have now? You enter Binance – you need KYC. You enter Kraken – you need KYC. And the market is really fast, time is precious.
So you want…
… and if there is an app that already has verified documents, it’s just like this “login through Facebook” button.
But there we face some risk, because if in the past there were a lot of different KYCs and there was danger of data being stolen – it would be a long process because of the number of places.
And if everything will be stored in one place, it becomes much more tempting.
Speaking of which, how is your security?
It is great. This is blockchain after all. If you do everything correctly, data isn’t stored in blockchain itself. It’s all hash.
Go and try to figure it all out. It is all in the initial place, at a document keeper’s. And it’s not us.
If passports are given by Passport Office, this is where passports are kept. We only have hash.
Let me put this question another way then.
From the moment a person presses that button, as you say, and until it gets to your storage in the form of hash, is it possible to intercept it? Is there such a risk?
Well, look. There’s a joke that everything can be broken. You can break anything.
There were attempts to break Ether and weaknesses were found, same goes for Bitcoin blockchain.
Anything can be broken. The important thing is to keep making progress.
I’m just saying all of this to understand if you pay attention to the matter of security.
Of course. And we plan to have rewards for white hats, as they are called, in our community.
These will be people who will work on security and, subsequently, earn our tokens.
So this will be like a bountry program for hackers?
Yes.
This is just like how the US government is working with hackers who have tried to break into their systems.
In fact, every large company is working that way. Google etc.
I have a question about tokens. You don’t have an ICO. How are your tokens bought? How can they be bought now?
There’s our website.
I don’t remember if it’s in open access or not, but there are personal accounts where you can buy tokens. And when people want to buy, we sell.
Let’s say I want…
We sell to organizations. We are trying to implement the system and now we are testing.
And, of course, we transfer tokens to them so that they can interact.
 
And how much is a token?
I don’t remember.
Well, is it more than a dollar?
I don’t think so.
From reading your White Paper I understood that it is more of a utility token, right?
100%, yes. Now we even have documented definitions for Utilities and Securities, and there are a lot of people debating that, but there are jurisdictions where it’s already settled. Ours is a utility token for sure.
And where is your project based jurisdiction wise?
Oh, there’s a whole system. It’s both Gibraltar and Singapore.
Gibraltar is widely considered to be a dump, if we don’t sugarcoat it, but they have a cool document.
A license for working precisely with personal data and blockchain. They already have a standart for it.
And Singapore?
Singapore is just very transparent. There’s a good connection with MAS, which is basically the SEC in ASIA.
Okay, regulation.
In the future, we have plans – Yan, our CEO, is in New York now – to start a dialog with the SEC.
Everyone is saying that they are interacting somehow with the SEC, but I don’t know a single ICO, in Russia at least, that’s making progress there.
And we are starting to move in this direction. We have big plans, being a protocol and a blockchain.
Vlad, do you not want to do ICO because you have enough funding or you just don’t believe in it?
It’s not that I don’t believe in it. The market has changed.
I have a background with preparing project for ICOs. I’m a marketer and I know how the whole story goes.
First of all, we do have money for the project and its development. There may not be enough for future expansion but we may just cover the development part if we really tighten our belts.
Yes.
We are currently thinking. I am balancing all the advantages and disadvantages. Despite having been personally involved in it, I’ve marked ICOs as lame.
Lame.
Yes, you know, “Oh so you have an ICO”. You have an ICO, raise money and then launder it really quickly.
Sounds true.
I want to work with businesses. We already have a working product in sight.
I want to work with companies and they are really careful about it. We will weigh everything carefully.
Most likely, we are going to finish the platform, sell tokens needed to work on it.
And speaking about investments, do you lean more towards VCs or…?
Not at all. We do have a number of great offers from VCs
Are you taking them?
No.
Why not?
Because, well… The reason why I started understanding ICOs really well is because I have experience working with VCs.
VCs are sharks. They enter your business with very clear goals. ICO in itself is a tool to avoid these sharks. There are offers that imply giving up 60% of equity.
Yes, this is not an option.
And there’s one more advantage to ICOs. I’ve talked to someone
I don’t remember who, but I think even Klimenko has spoken about it – Klimenko has a project that he’s going to make.
And he said that he could go for an ICO – just imagine, with the kind of network he has – and when the funds would come their appetites would be much smaller because of the size of the thing by then.
Okay, let me ask you this. If you don’t do ICOs…
I’m thinking about it.
… how are you planning to earn money?
Integration
Will it be commission or…?
We will create a block to integrate into businesses. One way or another, every blockchain has to do this.
Look at Universa. Currently they don’t have a blockchain, well, they do have something and are testing it, but they don’t have anything.
Well, RACIB says that they do.
Well, you know. Have you even seen their presentation?
Yes.
So, how are they going about it? They are analyzing case studies. They say they will do digital documents, they will do this, they will do that.
In any case, they will go through it. And we already have this background. We are initially an IT company. We know how to do this. We’ve made a blockchain.
We’ve made a private blockchain. Now we are integrating and we have enough computing power for it.
Okay, all this is very nice, all your perspectives and saying that you will be able to raise money without ICOs.
Enough about the upside. Let’s speak about challenges. I’m sure you have some problems ad there are some challenges with the project that make you angry and won’t disappear. What do you have here?
Well, lack of money. Every conference, it seems like money is there. The market has gone crazy.
As soon as people hear “blockchain” they lose their minds and want $20000 for you to participate.
Oh, the organizers.
So you go to a conference to tell people about your product.
You want to tell them that here it is, it exists, you are interested in expanding your developers’ community. And they demand $20000.
To enter?
Yes. And maybe the attitude towards $20000 among the ICO guys changed and they don’t think of it as substantial but it’s a lot for a business.
Have you thought of organizing conferences yourself?
We’ve started moving towards it.
What we did is we went to Japan, we walked around the places where players hang out, we spent day and night near Roger Ver’s office, got his attention.
You know, it’s like this. We’ve told him about the project.
Did he show interest?
Yes, he did. And now we interact closely with him.
We begin the second part of Like & Dislike, where we our guest more detailed questions about the project. And Grigoriy is ready to begin.
Yes, I would like to learn more about the token, just out of personal interest. Are you going to enter any stock exchange?
The SEC tells us you’re not supposed to talk about it beforehand, but yes, of course we are. You issue a token and you want to enter an exchange.
Why? Let me explain. For a platform to work you don’t need a token to be in an exchange. You can issue the token and just sell it to a specific organization and it will work.
But there’s a catch. If we go into a public token sale, not an ICO, but a token sale, we will have to go to an exchange. And you will attract investors.
And there are two clusters of investors – there are three actually but I divide them into two – the first one is people who just want X out of your token.
They don’t care about what you have under the hood. If you look at a lot of projects nowadays, you will see that there are a lot of Xs but there is nothing of substance.
And there never will be. It will never even reach the capitalization that it has because even if a project like this is launched it will never meet the expectations. This is a little bit of a bloating.
That’s why if we go with a public token sale we naturally will go to an exchange. And there is a strategy for that.
I have two strategies in mind: one for the scenario where we go there and one for where we don’t. I even know what my exchange strategy will be.
Is it a secret?
What, my strategy?
Yes.
Well, I don’t really want to share it.
Because someone might use it?
Yes, yes. Well, I have a different approach. Everyone just wants to go straight to the top stock exchanges.
I will just go step by step with it. Again, this is if we go with a public token sale.
And a private token sale is already happening, right?
Yes, that’s right.
Are you satisfied with the results so far?
Let’s say that we are not pushing anything. We speak to those who are interested and show how everything works.
Now we have people who, let’s say, sympathize. People who believe in the project, who see development, and they help.
If it’s not a secret, how much sympathy have you received money wise so far?
Well, somewhere in the range of $2 mil.
Is there a minimal threshold?
Yes, I think it’s 5 Ether.
Can you elaborate on the token itself? Aside from bringing it to an exchange in case of a public sale, what is E-token’s function?
In your white paper you mention it.
ENDO token, yes.
Well, I used a shortening.
So, what’s the role, the function of the token in the project?
It’s pretty exciting. Let’s say, I’m an entity and you’re an entity and we need to exchange documents. It’s sort of a digital paperwork.
So I set a price for the document in the system, for example 0.6 ENDO. You then say that you’re ready to take the document…
Are you setting prices just based on what you want?
… for 0.6 ENDO. The organization itself sets a desired price. I have documents and I can charge X for them.
If someone wants to receive them, they have to pay me X. Organizations regulate it themselves. It depends on how valuable they think their documents are.
And what’s the main source of income from the project? Is it commissions from each transaction?
Yes, firstly it’s commissions from transactions.
Excuse me, but is it a set percentage for each transaction or does it depend on the number of documents, type of documents?
The number of documents, type of documents, type of transactions etc.
Could you give us one idea of a sum?
Well, now we’re only testing. We will have to first understand it ourselves. It will depend on how we are going to project our own scalability.
I have to understand the costs. How much I need for my team to have food on the table, for development and many other things, so everything will be polished.
And the polishing will begin when we are not just in testing, but when we are live, when the first wave passes and we ourselves understand what we’ve created.
Right now we don’t even fully understand the possibilities. We have new ideas every day. Every day we see new people who create new apps on our platform.
For example, there was a person who came to us with a prototype that was called Price of Your Word.
We ask him to tell us more and he goes “Imagine that we’ve made a deal with you but it isn’t a smart contract. It’s just an audio recording of my promising something to you and you agreeing to it.
I then confirm it through Face ID and Touch ID, it goes through ENDO protocol and bounces to public blockchain. That’s the kind of a deal we’ve made”.
You need to mind what you say then.
Yes. And my whole perception of ENDO changes. It has come to me that ENDO is a protocol that handles…
Your brown.
Exactly. This is verification of any data.
Quite a technology.
Yes. Any data. You do something wrong – it will let you know. And everything is transparent.
What about API? What are your plans for that and what is it like now?
Right now we have a 2-level API.
Why two, by the way, could you speak about that?
1 level is, well… We have web-interface, not everyone is used to dealing with the command line.
So we have web-interface and you have to connect to it as well. This is what 1 level is for.
If you want to dig deeper you need a 2-level API. And then, speaking about our system…
There is public blockchain where there’s only data verification. All the personal data is stored in private blockchains. We thought that it was an ideal pair.
Initially we made a public blockchain where documents were verified and stuff. But there was a situation with one organization that deals with employment history booklets in Russia.
They asked us where the data would be stored and if it was the US.
Are you talking about the Retirement Fund?
Yes. So we thought “let’s create a private blockchain encrypted in accordance with all modern technologies accepted by a Russian organization”.
And then we talked to a usual business, described that beauty of a private blockchain and got “what are you even talking about?”.
So we had to do the following. An entity has a server with stored documents, be it Google Docs or Yandex Disks.
There is an API that we can use to synchronize with all of these sources. And now a document, after being issued, goes there and is verified there, and the info about verification goes to public blockchain.
And now there is a verified document in their space.
Let me ask you this. Speaking about your decision, are you in any way trying to connect with the government on this?
Because on this path you’re going you need lobbyists and such
Truth be told, we don’t need anyone. When you are doing a thing and it’s long called for, – it’s basically pain, because I myself changed my passport 4 times and it’s tiring – and there are a lot of case studies for this.
You can drink and drive in Moscow and keep your driver’s license – because they don’t take it away – and go to France the next day and rent a car there. Data is really hard to manage.
Once again, we are not crypto anarchists and we aren’t against governments, just to be clear. We are pro working with governments.
And this is exactly my question. Is there any interaction now?
No. No interaction. We visit different events but there’s only talk. Everyone just beats around the bush.
Something is happening but nothing is happening. We are applying a different strategy. We go to businesses, we go to people.
When businesses and people come to us, we will work everything out and the government will come itself. There are a ton of examples.
Even speaking of Telegram, you tell me to partner up with Telegram and now they will have ENDO KYC. You log in to Telegram, go to KYC and go through verification.
Vladislav, I think that there will come a time when the government… It’s the main beneficiary of it. The more control it has the happier it is.
Basically, in your pursuit of not only monetization wise but also from the standpoint of helping society, which are good intentions that also can be bad, you are helping the government a great deal.
You are placing people under a dome for the government to… you’re making the dome.
Well, the dome has existed for a long time already.
Well, you are, let’s say…
We are just cleaning it up
Yes, cleaning it up.
Right now anyone can mess with my dome and change the status of my documents and it will be hard for me to restore them.
What is a document? A signature and a stamp? You can put a stamp on your document anywhere for 500 rubles. A signature is worthless.
Paper documents are dated. Let’s take Vehicle Certificates of Title. It’s a joke.
In your White Paper you claim that there are two data storages – a centralized one and a decentralized one.
t’s all clear about the decentralized one, but why centralized?
As I’ve mentioned, this is for certain organizations. They can use a centralized storage.
Let’s say I’m an organization and I’m used to storing my data on servers. I’m very welcome to do that. Only now you have your documents verified in a blockchain.
We know that there’s an API that you can sync our system with a regular 1C. Imagine this: I have a large company, a lot of offices and in each office I have an accountant.
And what they do is they put false data on accounting date. The data I want to see. The biggest problem in business is not when people steal from you.
It might be, but in business it isn’t. In business the problem is receiving wrong information after someone stole something.
And a wrong decision that came after it. As a result, your company goes in a whole other direction. Now they will have a centralized system.
And what is it? Dropbox, Google Disc?
Dropbox, Google Disc, a server, a reliable computer that they have etc. And now no accountant can manipulate the data. They make a transaction and it’s there.
Is Icloud there?
We haven’t worked with Icloud but if it joins it will be great. Icloud has tons of data.
Exactly my point. That’s why I’m asking.
They have fingerprints and everything.
As for stealing, in your white paper you state that one of your goals is to prevent fraudsters from mixing up info.
Could you elaborate on what it means and how exactly you are going to do that?
Okay, mixing up info.
Yes, what are we talking about here?
Let’s say there’s a document. You can change its status without effort. Sometimes it’s hard to manage them.
But when it’s all public, I dare you to try. So here I have…
I’m sorry, so by mixing up you mean changing the status of a document?
Yes, the status.
Basically any forgery.
Yes, any forgery.
Deleting documents and stuff.
After all, ENDO protocol is not just documents. There is a case study about bags. There is a famous manufacturer and they are #1 in being counterfeit.
The market is huge. And when a bag came into a store, the managers would rip off IDs, send them to China, then receive 500 similar bags with documents and sell them.
ENDO can help with that, too. There’s an app that can deal with this.
When we speak about forgery, we are not only speaking about audio, as your colleague suggested to you, and visual content.
I’ve just remembered about art and antiques.
Exactly, right on point.
This is very interesting. Right now only experts can tell the difference between an authentic Van Gogh and a fake. And even the expert can have a hidden agenda.
Exactly.
Have you looked into this sector?
Yes, we are still tracking it very closely. We even have an idea, more than an idea actually, and next week we will already have something.
There’s a thing called ENDO Legacy, an app. We ourselves don’t want to keep making apps; right now we do it just to show the possibilities.
So, you will outsource.
Yes, we will search for developers.
Do you trust them?
Well, why not.
They are going to use API, so.
You can’t really do harm. The protocol is ours and we are in charge of data exchange. They can’t really touch us.
Yes, so you haven’t finished. Legacy.
So, let’s say I have pain. I have a piece of art, even a bag. There is a company making them and they have these vintage bags, 200 years old.
And there’s an expert who says that this bad is authentic. Please. I can come to that expert, pay him more money and he will say that it’s fake.
And this is authentic.
And here is an authentic one. More about art, I spoke to some people when I was in France.
I spoke to one true collector and he said that he had some authentic pieces fake copies of which they have in museums.
Well, yes, this is not new. And all this is very delicate.
You can’t trust anyone. In a decentralized…
Vladislav, this is what I’m driving at.
When we speak about blockchain – and here we are talking about that and not crypto – blockchain is about eliminating middle people.
Who can we call experts today?
No one.
Go to Stariy Arbat. The pawnshops there evaluate your rings and jewelry and etc.
What are these pawnshops? Intermediaries. Who are experts? Same thing. So it’s my understanding that blockchain is about getting rid of them.
Yes, exactly. Even in our market..
And every pawnshop starts coughing right now
There are plenty of experts, although… Well, it’s time we made everything more transparent.
Some people say it’s not good. But you have to be able to track carefully. I already have ideas on how to make it even better.
And how do you solve the problem of some classic works dating more than 1000 back?
Well, you will still have to go from some opinion. Let’s take even ENDO. The data is verified.
But who is verifying it? Issuers. People who have their say in the matter.
And the world just needs to choose a company that knows for certain that something is good.
It’s all good and well, but what if the issuer died 500 years ago? And again we face intermediaries.
Yes here we have intermediaries. Here’s a question…
We face them only once and that’s it.
So is there a possibility of an information source being compromised?
Of course.
So the blockchain will have false data. Let’s go back to…
When I create a piece from scratch, let’s say I’m an artist. We even have a story like that.
Let’s say I make good shoes and I don’t want anyone else to make them. I create an app and verify a shoe. If I see someone else…
So, anyone who wants to buy a shoe can scan it through MyENDO, ENDO wallet, and see that it’s really a shoe from this shoemaker and it’s verified. Same here. It’s possible because the manufacturer herself put it into the base.
Okay, this is understandable.
As for the antiques market, there’s something to think about. You still have to rely on someone’s opinion.
Let’s go back to Telegram. In your opinion, what are the chances of you verifying information in Telegram Passport? Will you be working with Telegram in any way?
You know, walk and ye shall reach.
I understand that.
This is all pretty words. But as for chances, I know that there’s nothing in the market.
Okay. So, you already have a product.
We’ve just visited New York and IBM is all loud about it. “We’ve done this, we’ve done that”.
And have they?
No, nothing. Okay, they’ve made a video, that they have.
So, emotions aside, the fact is that you have all the chances?
Absolutely, all the chances.
Okay… Let me go and buy some tokens.
You do that and I will ask a couple of questions to finish this second part. The first question is short and interesting.
I’ve studied your White Paper carefully but haven’t found any financials, e.g. road maps, numbers, what are the costs for what etc. Why?
I’ve thought for a long time about whether I should put it there. The financial model. I mentioned it briefly at the beginning.
Until we go to testing, until we have an understanding… for example, if we fail at public sale we won’t have the money to scale big time.
So, I’m sorry, I want to sum it up. The public sale will happen and – by the way, when is it happening?
If I decide that it is going to happen, well, not just me but the team will decide that we do a token sale, we will make it happen before the end of July.
So after the sale you will edit your White Paper, add something to it?
Right now we need to write a Tech Paper and make a financial model. So, after we’ve finished the public sale, we will make our…
Wait, don’t buy the tokens just yet. Wait until the financial model is there. And the last question…
If Georgiy doesn’t buy our tokens, there will probably be no model.
So it’s like that, huh?
I personally have already decided 20 minutes ago.
Well, the model is clear.
So, the last question of the second part. In your White Paper you say that token owners can hold them in exchange for some rewards.
Can you talk about this? The types of these rewards? Maybe some numbers even?
Well. Do you remember when I talked about the stock exchange strategy? There are a lot of nuances thought of there for the users to benefit from holding the tokens etc.
Right now people often say “God damn it, I invested in this ICO and everything crashed, everything’s lost”. And when you ask them about what they did after they had bought tokens, they say that they sold them while in a pump.
So I answer that they are accountable for this. They do everything to make it difficult for a project. When you buy a token, take a breath; let people make progress, give people time.
There’s a saying “All the shit will surface when the snow melts”. And every project comes in your sight during a year after ICO.
Is there life after ICO? There is. If you look at any project now, you will see its specific moves. Come to an office. If the project is open… Come to us even.
Yes, so, coming back to holding and rewards.
Right now we are developing this. The team doesn’t have a clear picture of this.
So it’s planned?
Yes, we are doing it. Why do you need to hold? It needs to be rewarding for people, so that they don’t get rid of it with its first rise in price.
People create chaos themselves. They dump it and…
Okay, got it. To wrap this section up, I’d like to just put a remark here. I was talking to my friend the other day, he works at one of the largest investment banks of the world, in New York, and he works at a trading desk.
So we are talking, and I know that the US market has been on the rise lately, and I ask him “Can I invest personally?”.
The answer was that it was very difficult, but the interesting part is even if you can – after you’ve passed all the filters – if you act on your own account but use your company’s resources, you can’t sell a purchased asset earlier than 2-3 months since the purchase.
This is great.
And after this answer – and you can hear this only from the inside, because the terms are different in different banks. Now I understand why the US market has been rising for the last 2-3 years.
I’m saying all this because you speak about dumping tokens. Hypothetically, if blockchain had this feature where if could reject you trying to sell a token before, say, 2-3 months after the initial purchase pass…
Will you implement it?
… maybe it will lead to market growth.
I’m planning to, yes. I want to discuss it with the community when it’s all set. We will ask PR about their take on it.
Maybe we will do it. I see that the market needs it. People say that ICOs are nonsense and everyone dumps.
This is the 3rd part of Like & Dislike and here we ask blitz questions: a short question and a short answer.
First question: are you in the green yet?
Of course not.
When are you planning to? Do you have a vision for when it will happen?
Somewhere next year. This is easy, when it comes to us. It’s easy to execute, let’s say. A lot of people need what we do. Everybody needs it.
In 2-3 years, will you sell your project or is it yours to stay?
It will stay ours. This is why we’re doing it. If we wanted to sell, we would’ve sold it before launch.
Just as an idea. We would’ve just sold it to a fund and got cash and felt great.
If there’s an irresistible offer, let’s say, Durov comes and offers to buy?
No, no. This is the whole Idea. We want to be in the thick. This is our creation and we want it.
Let me ask a different question. What about selling a piece? Make it a kind of consortium?
If we go for a public token sale, we will have to ask for opinions of those who believed in us from the start. We will go from there.
But I don’t see anything bad in selling a piece. The only thing is for that piece not to have controlling voice. This will be a problem.
VCs are not unwanted because they ask too much but because they take over. And after that they start interfering with what the initial ideologists do: “This is ineffective”, “this is bad”.
But look at who makes breakthroughs. Crazy people. Ideologists.
What do you spend the main portion of the money on?
Development. This consumes everything. We just didn’t go for the path of least resistance.
We hired specific people. All of our programmers are mathematicians and…
How much is marketing? Is anything spent there?
Well, first of all, I have all the marketing here. I don’t work with agencies and don’t trust them.
So, if we try and count?
Marketing is practically nonexistent now.
Are you planning to change it?
We make the website ourselves, we write articles ourselves – we have copywriters – we design ourselves.
Are you planning to up the spending?
If we decide to go with public token sale – and we will have an understanding within this week – then marketing will get a serious pump.
If we look at the market, there’s competition. You say that they haven’t done anything but oh well.
How are you sure that your project will have success and be at the top?
It’s not that they haven’t done anything. It’s not that everyone is bad and I’m here on a white horse. It’s just we’re making something global.
We are making a protocol. And if you are our so-called competitor – and it’s not like this, I’ve looked into it and I saw someone dealing with documents, other things – we are making a versatile protocol capable of many things.
That’s basically the rules of exchange between these structures. If you are into that as well, come and let’s do it together. If someone stronger appears in the market we will be the first ones to come and offer to do it together.
So what is your confidence based on?
We are just attending conferences; we are talking to CEOs and asking them specific questions. Showing them what we have.
And they have nothing.
For now nothing, yes.
When will the beta be out?
Well, everything is ready for it now.
Is it connected with your decision about public token sale?
Yes, it is.
So, in the next few weeks?
Well, yes, if we make that decision. It’s all a marketing thing. I don’t know if I can talk about this but let this be an exclusive for you.
We need to take it step by step. We will make it public and let people throw some shit to hit the fan. And we will…
And you will sort it all out.
Yea, throw it into competition.
We will sort it all out inside, polish something.
The competition will get some.
Yes, and then we will present it to people. Right now you can be anyone in the market with any reputation or project. But then this project yields strange fruit.
So the only thing left is for us to wish you luck and success and, of course, wish you to make that decision which will be crucial for the future of the project.
Once again, this was Head of Marketing for ENDO Vladislav Utushkin with the ENDO project. Thank you very much.
Thank you for having me.
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This concludes this video, I’m Oleg Abelev, I was joined by my co-host Georgiy Erman. Thank you, Georgiy
Thank you, Oleg.
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